Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[aminorex]

Cyrus R. Vance

The guy I compared to Hitler, yes.

they are going to try to ... regulate the shit out of it is so that they can maintain their monopoly on the money laundering business.  

Close enough, yeah.  But try is an illusion.  There is no try.  There is only fail.

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[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[Adrian-x]

Just got home, not gonna bother catching up with the last 30 pages of probable nonsense,

But I just watched the first segment of the first panel today, and sorry for the serious but I'd like if some of you could offer an opinion on the following.

Cyrus R. Vance, the very first person to speak, chooses to start with a case of money laundering, of course. Money laundering is the catch phrase and it's designed to put a negative image on bitcoin. They will repeat it again and again when asked about bitcoin.

The interesting thing is that they were laundering fiat dollars acquired from the theft of credit card information, using western express. This crime can't even happen with bitcoin. There is no credit card information to steal in the first place.

I think the reason they are going to try to vilify bitcoin and try to regulate the shit out of it so that they can maintain their monopoly on the money laundering business.  


What do you think?

the hearing made me feel like the US was going for a minimalist approach to regulation, the chairman seemed very pro bitcoin.... I don't think they are going to regulate the shit out of it. they keep saying that they want to have enough regulation to feel comfortable and at the same time not stifle bitcoin's potential. If i was a conspiracy theorist i'd say bitcoin is the new illuminati money, and government agents are in on it. but i'm not going to go there.

"We're always going to choose to squelch money launderers...even if it prevents 1,000 flowers from blooming"

implies entrepreneurs are not welcome, NY doesn’t care if you are unemployed and innovate, they just want to make sure you follow the letter of the law.  

[aminorex]

Virtual currency is another catch phrase that they want to embed in the subconscious. Virtual currency is very different from crypto currency.

+999  hit this hard people.  Never ever let anyone put virtual currency and crypto currency in the same class.  If they try to call it virtual currency, make them beg for mercy.  Sneer and cajole and ridicule.  One thing they cannot survive is mockery, because it subverts the illusion of competence and legitimacy.  Virtual currency is play money.  Cryptographic currency is backed by logic itself, more secure than any army.

[JorgeStolfi]

the chairman seemed very pro bitcoin...

Unfortunately the chairman of a public hearing is not there to take a decision, he is just the show's host.  His mission is only to introduce the speakers and put them at ease.

The decisions, if any, will be taken by legislators and other government officials in coming months; and they will probably pay more attention to the opinion of bankers and other big investors, than to those given at the hearings...

[Adrian-x]

Virtual currency is another catch phrase that they want to embed in the subconscious. Virtual currency is very different from crypto currency.

+999  hit this hard people.  Never ever let anyone put virtual currency and crypto currency in the same class.  If they try to call it virtual currency, make them beg for mercy.  Sneer and cajole and ridicule.  One thing they cannot survive is mockery, because it subverts the illusion of competence and legitimacy.  Virtual currency is play money.  Cryptographic currency is backed by logic itself, more secure than any army.

Some think it is trivial, but it is not, “virtual” applies to fiat in a bank, not to cryptocurrencies.

[Adrian-x]

no...

like i said i could not afford to lose very much at all.

and i sodl alot in the 20's .....

you and me both.

[shmadz]

the chairman seemed very pro bitcoin...

Unfortunately the chairman of a public hearing is not there to take a decision, he is just the show's host.  His mission is only to introduce the speakers and put them at ease.

The decisions, if any, will be taken by legislators and other government officials in coming months; and they will probably pay more attention to the opinion of bankers and other big investors, than to those given at the hearings...

One thing I think bears and bulls can agree on is that bitcoin is definitely not dull.

Remember that old Chinese curse? "May you live in interesting times."

Lately, it kinda seems like we've been cursed...

[shmadz]

no...

like i said i could not afford to lose very much at all.

and i sodl alot in the 20's .....

you and me both.

you and me threeth. I pulled my csv's from virtex and ran them through a spreadsheet after the 266 bump, my average sell price was $17 dollars. I'm sure my average price has gone up a bit since then, but sometimes it sickens me to think how many of these things I let slip through my fingers.

[arklan]

no...

like i said i could not afford to lose very much at all.

and i sodl alot in the 20's .....

you and me both.

you and me threeth. I pulled my csv's from virtex and ran them through a spreadsheet after the 266 bump, my average sell price was $17 dollars. I'm sure my average price has gone up a bit since then, but sometimes it sickens me to think how many of these things I let slip through my fingers.

Right there with you guys. June 2012 I had about 20 coin... By the time of the April rise I had almost none. Did it again with the latest rise. I had a few coin from selling some stuff in summer, used it on general expenses, groceries, etc... Nothing left now except the little I mine.

[spooderman]

Virtual currency is another catch phrase that they want to embed in the subconscious. Virtual currency is very different from crypto currency.

+999  hit this hard people.  Never ever let anyone put virtual currency and crypto currency in the same class.  If they try to call it virtual currency, make them beg for mercy.  Sneer and cajole and ridicule.  One thing they cannot survive is mockery, because it subverts the illusion of competence and legitimacy.  Virtual currency is play money.  Cryptographic currency is backed by logic itself, more secure than any army.

+graham's number

[pjviitas]

no...

like i said i could not afford to lose very much at all.

and i sodl alot in the 20's .....

you and me both.

you and me threeth. I pulled my csv's from virtex and ran them through a spreadsheet after the 266 bump, my average sell price was $17 dollars. I'm sure my average price has gone up a bit since then, but sometimes it sickens me to think how many of these things I let slip through my fingers.

Right there with you guys. June 2012 I had about 20 coin... By the time of the April rise I had almost none. Did it again with the latest rise. I had a few coin from selling some stuff in summer, used it on general expenses, groceries, etc... Nothing left now except the little I mine.

Is there a thread somewhere dedicated to these kinds of stories?

[arklan]

no...

like i said i could not afford to lose very much at all.

and i sodl alot in the 20's .....

you and me both.

you and me threeth. I pulled my csv's from virtex and ran them through a spreadsheet after the 266 bump, my average sell price was $17 dollars. I'm sure my average price has gone up a bit since then, but sometimes it sickens me to think how many of these things I let slip through my fingers.

Right there with you guys. June 2012 I had about 20 coin... By the time of the April rise I had almost none. Did it again with the latest rise. I had a few coin from selling some stuff in summer, used it on general expenses, groceries, etc... Nothing left now except the little I mine.

Is there a thread somewhere dedicated to these kinds of stories?

I hope not... Too painful...

[adamstgBit]

ok back on topic



 

[shmadz]

Is there a thread somewhere dedicated to these kinds of stories?

so in other news, at 40:00 in Panel 1 Day 2 the law guy starting going off about silk road. I don't know where to find a written record of his testimony, but I'll paraphrase.

"The volume was staggering"
"several thousand vendors"
"hundreds of kg of illegal drugs"
"well over 100,000 buyers"
"launder hundreds of millions of dollars"

So obviously, these are the guys we are trying to catch, because they undermine the operations of the mafia bosses.



HSBC

"HSBC was found to have laundered over $670 billion over the course of four years, and this makes BitInstant's total amount pale in comparison. HSBC was eventually fined $1.9 billion in an arranged agreement, which equates to 3/100% of the total amount laundered through their institution."

These are the bosses. You wanna play the game, you gotta play by their rules... until bitcoin.


oh yeah, CCMF
 

[JorgeStolfi]

Daily volumes of BTC trade to/from USD and other national currencies (in kBTC):


               !    Mon !   Tue !   Wed !   Thu !    Fri !    Sat !    Sun !    Mon !    Tue !   Wed !                     
  EXCHANGE     !  01/20 ! 01/21 ! 01/22 ! 01/23 !  01/24 !  01/25 !  01/26 !  01/27 !  01/28 ! 01/29 ! Currencies considered

  Bitstamp     |   6.97 |  7.67 |  8.31 |  7.40 |  15.78 |   8.70 |   9.70 |  25.19 |  20.04 |  7.04 | USD                 
  BTC-e        |  10.29 |  5.67 | 22.32 |  8.53 |  15.27 |   9.34 |  10.38 |  21.02 |  16.82 |  6.53 | USD,EUR,RUR         
  MtGOX        |  12.10 |  7.25 |  5.51 |  2.23 |   7.38 |   9.52 |  16.11 |  10.02 |  11.82 |  7.21 | USD,EUR,GBP,AUD,JPY 
  BitFinEx     |   5.46 |  2.89 |  2.97 |  2.83 |  10.99 |   4.62 |   7.88 |  15.63 |  13.62 |  3.87 | USD                 
  Bitcoin.DE   |   0.39 |  0.45 |  0.69 |  0.42 |   0.52 |   0.30 |   0.34 |   0.60 |   0.49 |  0.33 | EUR                 
  Kraken       |   0.19 |  0.24 |  0.25 |  0.19 |   0.46 |   0.19 |   0.24 |   0.63 |   0.54 |  0.24 | EUR                 
  CaVirtEx     |   0.22 |  0.23 |  0.15 |  0.17 |   0.41 |   0.33 |   0.10 |   0.40 |   0.22 |  0.21 | CAD                 
  CampBX       |   0.10 |  0.09 |  0.05 |  0.08 |   0.13 |   0.04 |   0.05 |   0.13 |   0.20 |  0.07 | USD                 
  Crypto-Trade |   0.01 |  0.01 |   .   |  0.01 |   0.01 |    .   |    .   |    .   |   0.01 |   .   | USD                 

  SUBTOTAL     |  35.73 | 24.50 | 40.25 | 21.86 |  50.95 |  33.04 |  44.80 |  73.62 |  63.76 | 25.50 |                     

  Huobi        |  71.78 | 40.55 | 25.81 | 25.67 |  89.25 |  58.16 |  91.31 |  63.13 |  92.88 | 32.14 | CNY                 
  OKCoin       |  21.00 | 17.31 | 15.88 | 16.50 |  34.01 |  26.33 |  31.40 |  35.41 |  52.37 | 29.11 | CNY                 
  BTC-China    |   3.44 |  2.07 |  1.62 |  2.01 |   6.82 |   3.04 |   5.55 |   4.43 |   6.45 |  1.94 | CNY                 

  SUBTOTAL     |  96.22 | 59.93 | 43.31 | 44.18 | 130.08 |  87.53 | 128.26 | 102.97 | 151.70 | 63.19 |                     

  TOTAL        | 131.95 | 84.43 | 83.56 | 66.04 | 181.03 | 120.57 | 173.06 | 176.59 | 215.46 | 88.69 |                     



All numbers were collected by hand from the site http://bitcoinwisdom.com. Beware of possible errors.

For each exchange, the numbers include only the trade volume to/from the currencies listed in the rightmost column. The BTC-e volumes now include retroactively also exchanges to EUR and RUR (together about 1 kBTC/day or less).  Trade between BTC and other cryptocoins, such as LiteCoin, is NOT included.

Coinbase volume is not available, neither at Bitcoinwisdom nor at Bitcoincharts, but they are said to use Bitstamp for currency conversion.

Dates on the header line are UTC. Specifically, "01/15" means "from 01/15 00:00:00 UTC to 01/15 23:59:59 UTC". (Beware that Bitcoinwisdom uses your local time, so the date may appear to be off by 1 day.  For example, if you are 2 hours west of Greenwich, it may show "01/14 22:00" when the UTC time is "01/15 00:00".)

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[surfer43]

You guys are drumming this thing called CCMF into my head.

This is what bears will reply with 

[seleme]

BTC CHina apparently restored direct bank deposits:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1wipty/btc_china_enabling_direct_deposits/

One of Winlewoss brothers confirmed it's a real.

[shmadz]

Ok, I hate to pollute this thread with non-meme filled posts, but if I don't blurt this shit out, I probably won't remember it in the morning.

At 60:50 law guy #1 starts going off about how identity theft is their biggest issue.

Let me paraphrase

"Let's be clear, cyber crime, identity theft, are an international crime wave."

These guys don't even understand that bitcoin kills identity theft outright.

*edit*
60:13 for the start of the question
60:40 for the start of the answer (note the obvious amusement of the female panelist - I think I kinda like her attitude)