Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[traincarswreck]

Large blocks = Gold
Segregated Witness = Fiat

Asia wants gold.
USA wants to print money.

nope changing bitcoins block size via politicalbattle destroys its gold like property. Bitcoin cash is not digital gold and will not be viewed by the markets as such

[micalith]

Haha, i am unable to get the 5 required by hitbtc (probably new policy) . How on earth will we get 20 confirms, unless you know a BCC miner personally, even in that situation if the blocks are not being mined properly, it could be days before my BCC / BCH hits them!

https://news.bitcoin.com/the-trading-center-in-hk-where-they-mined-most-of-the-bitcoin-cash-blocks/

according to this the main mining power for bch has already left the building with no intention of returning.

Oh, shit, my free moneeeeeey

foolish naive journalism. According to https://www.reddit.com/r/btc/comments/6r33fz/difficulty_adjustment_triggered_at_0940_utc/dl24nbj/, it's actually part of the plan to slow down BCH mining for a few hours, so that their difficulty level can adjust down as far as possible.

[jbreher]

We're learning ... the difference between price and value is.

Mid-lesson. The hard way.

[JimboToronto]

Good morning after, Bitcoinland.

I see we're still going sideways... currently $2725USD (Bitcoinaverage). Not bad, considering the fact that we all just got gifted an equal number of altcoin (BCH) tokens.

While some people may have felt secure in exposing their private keys/seeds to the internet to sell their BCash in the original rush, I'm happy to keep both my bitcoins and BCH tokens safe in my cold wallets, for now.

I don't think the drama is done quite yet. Let's at least wait until segwit is fully activated.

I have bitcoin in paper wallets, if I want to set up new paper wallets is there a better way to move them than...

Paper wallet-----blockchain.info----paper wallet

Trezor or other hardware wallet?
_______

I also agree we need a new poll.

[Ibian]

Are hitbtc reliable? Their UX does not inspire much confidence! How about ViaBTC? Anyone has any experience with them?

i haven't heard great things about hitbtc. viabtc have been around for long enough.

i sent some to viabtc with the expectation of not getting anything back. i'd do the same for hitbtc.

anyway maybe there'll never  be another block in which case there's nothing to worry about.

Wait for kraken and send your coins there with full confidence in getting them back instead.

[bitserve]

Are hitbtc reliable? Their UX does not inspire much confidence! How about ViaBTC? Anyone has any experience with them?

i haven't heard great things about hitbtc. viabtc have been around for long enough.

i sent some to viabtc with the expectation of not getting anything back. i'd do the same for hitbtc.

anyway maybe there'll never  be another block in which case there's nothing to worry about.

Wait for kraken and send your coins there with full confidence in getting them back instead.

Well I have already withdraw back to my Ledger the BTC I got for selling a couple of BCH on HitBTC that arrived in the last mined block. So I couldn't be happier. Unfortunately it was only a test transaction and that's all I could trade atm.

Now they are requesting 5 confirmations before crediting the BCH (I only needed *1*).

[steelboy]

Good morning after, Bitcoinland.

I see we're still going sideways... currently $2725USD (Bitcoinaverage). Not bad, considering the fact that we all just got gifted an equal number of altcoin (BCH) tokens.

While some people may have felt secure in exposing their private keys/seeds to the internet to sell their BCash in the original rush, I'm happy to keep both my bitcoins and BCH tokens safe in my cold wallets, for now.

I don't think the drama is done quite yet. Let's at least wait until segwit is fully activated.

I have bitcoin in paper wallets, if I want to set up new paper wallets is there a better way to move them than...

Paper wallet-----blockchain.info----paper wallet

Trezor or other hardware wallet?
_______

I also agree we need a new poll.

Exactly what I'm doing.

It looks like I'm not going to win the ATH priza today annoyingly, on the plus side though, BCH has made me a hell of a lot better off. 

[bitserve]

Large blocks = Gold
Segregated Witness = Fiat

Asia wants gold.
USA wants to print money.

changing bitcoins block size via politicalbattle destroys its gold like property.

So you're admitting segwit destroys bitcoins gold-like properties.

When 100% of hashpower and most actors and participants have agreed that Bitcoin have to have Segwit, then that's Bitcoin and if it doesn't have Segwit, it isn't Bitcoin. If, tomorrow, almost everybody agrees to have bigger blocks, then that will be Bitcoin and smaller blocks won't.

How is that so hard to understand?

[RewFrew]

We're learning ... the difference between price and value is.

Mid-lesson. The hard way.

Can you both elaborate please.

I Wanna learn too.

[bitserve]

This Shitcoin Cash experiment teaches that Bitcoin should have a difficulty adjustment enhacement. It might prove usefull in the future.

[d_eddie]

The controlled max supply claim to fame is now obliterated. There are more than 21,000,000 tokens.

The whole premise of Bitcoin is being undermined and people are A-Okay with it, fools that they are.

The premise is max 21M tokens per chain (per coin). This is a new chain, or a new coin if you like. No violation. Value doesn't spread out magically from one chain to the next. When half of BTC holders will have exchanged their BTC for BCH, then it will be a 50/50 split. Until then, you need fresh money to add value to the new chain. I think this is quite intuitive from a macroscopic, detached point of view.

[podyx]

I need a BCC wallet so I can send them to exchange first atleast

Sweep all your BTC into another wallet you control, then download coinomi wallet for Android to send all your BCC to exchange of your choice (hitbtc or bittrex are good options)

Does coinomi wallet works with BCC?

[Ibian]

I need a BCC wallet so I can send them to exchange first atleast

Sweep all your BTC into another wallet you control, then download coinomi wallet for Android to send all your BCC to exchange of your choice (hitbtc or bittrex are good options)

Does coinomi wallet works with BCC?

https://coinomi.freshdesk.com/support/solutions/articles/29000013381-btc-bch-fork-how-to-collect-your-free-bch-coins

[d_eddie]

This Shitcoin Cash experiment teaches that Bitcoin should have a difficulty adjustment enhacement. It might prove usefull in the future.

It might be dangerous, too. It would make it quicker, then easier to orchestrate a 51% attack by swinging the difficulty wildly, progressively retiring miners from BTC and then coming back on full force at attack time. This could be prepared and deployed when the hashrate is dropping for other reasons (some other problem on the BTC network).

[podyx]

Alright great

[bitserve]

Large blocks = Gold
Segregated Witness = Fiat

Asia wants gold.
USA wants to print money.

changing bitcoins block size via politicalbattle destroys its gold like property.

So you're admitting segwit destroys bitcoins gold-like properties.

When 100% of hashpower and most actors and participants have agreed that Bitcoin have to have Segwit, then that's Bitcoin and if it doesn't have Segwit, it isn't Bitcoin. If, tomorrow, almost everybody agrees to have bigger blocks, then that will be Bitcoin and smaller blocks won't.

How is that so hard to understand?

That's a good explanation. But what happens if 51% of hashpower want bigger blocks but Core Developers refuse?

51% would be an attack. In fact that how it is defined: "The 51% attack". Consensus is somewhere around 95%. No consensus? No change.

It is undeniable that we have had the utmost consensus on the segwit issue, so: It is Bitcoin.

Miners have power, Core does too, Exchanges too, other major players and users/participants too... If almost everybody except core agree on something then you can be sure Core will be unable to avoid it.

[Ibian]

Large blocks = Gold
Segregated Witness = Fiat

Asia wants gold.
USA wants to print money.

changing bitcoins block size via politicalbattle destroys its gold like property.

So you're admitting segwit destroys bitcoins gold-like properties.

When 100% of hashpower and most actors and participants have agreed that Bitcoin have to have Segwit, then that's Bitcoin and if it doesn't have Segwit, it isn't Bitcoin. If, tomorrow, almost everybody agrees to have bigger blocks, then that will be Bitcoin and smaller blocks won't.

How is that so hard to understand?

That's a good explanation. But what happens if 51% of hashpower want bigger blocks but Core Developers refuse?

Then they are obviously not very core to the whole bitcoin ecosystem.

[mestar]

When half of BTC holders will have exchanged their BTC for BCH, then it will be a 50/50 split. Until then, you need fresh money to add value to the new chain. I think this is quite intuitive from a macroscopic, detached point of view.

Sounds like you are saying that there is currently something other than the 50/50 split.

Can you elaborate more on "half of BTC holders will have exchanged their BTC for BCH"?   

[d_eddie]

That's a good explanation. But what happens if 51% of hashpower want bigger blocks but Core Developers refuse?

The way I see it - oversimplified without a doubt:

The miners are employees. You pay them mining rewards and transaction fees to run the system the way you want it to be run. ("Please, tidy up the kitchen, will you? Ah, good, here's money for your good service. Thanks.")

The day they start having different objectives and incentives, what happens is

"Please, tidy up the kitchen, will you?" (Abide by my rules and I'll take your blocks for good.)

"No, I'm going to do the bedroom. The kitches is a remnant from an era when people used to cook for themselves. Now it's catering all over. Bedroom." (I make the rules, I'm the miner.)

"I won't pay you for the bedroom." (I won't accept your blocks as valid.)

"Do bedroom. Do bedroom." (Fork.)

[d_eddie]

When half of BTC holders will have exchanged their BTC for BCH, then it will be a 50/50 split. Until then, you need fresh money to add value to the new chain. I think this is quite intuitive from a macroscopic, detached point of view.

Sounds like you are saying that there is currently something other than the 50/50 split.

Can you elaborate more on "half of BTC holders will have exchanged their BTC for BCH"?   

When I say 50/50, I mean value wise. So I actually meant "half of the BTCs have been traded for BCH".
At the moment, the number of extant BTC=BCH.
But the value? They can say 500$/BCH all they want, but as long as I won't (or can't!) get 500$ for each of my BCH, it's just talk. Words are wind.