Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[Arriemoller]

Russia had given assurances that if Ukraine gave back its nuclear weapons, its territorial integrity would be guaranteed.

According to the same treaty Russia and US have given assurances that Ukraine will be neutral. In 2014 Ukraine lost its neutrality. One of the first decrees of the Kiev's junta was to apply for NATO membership.

AFAIK, NATO is not accepting new member states which are at war or have part of their territory occupied. 

Correct, neither Ukraine nor Georgia will become members any time soon, Russia will make sure that never happens by keeping low scale border conflicts going for ever.

[Arriemoller]

I'm so hungry for a burger right now.

[bitcoinPsycho]

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/el-salvador-imf-nayib-bukele-central-american-b2004625.html


El Salvador angrily rejects IMF call to drop Bitcoin use

Treasury Minister Alejandro Zelaya angrily said that “no international organization is going to make us do anything, anything at all.”

[goldkingcoiner]

Talking about bloodshed is Russian propaganda. Nothing was happening in Crimea, Russia simply didn't like that their naval base might not be welcomed anymore, and saw an opportunity to take over some more land, as if it needed it.

If you have no idea, just say so. I will gladly educate you what would have happened, had Russia not taken Crimea:


The U.S. in its part, financed the Maidan coup as well as other "democracy building programs" with 5.1 billion USD since 1991. Crimea was about to be taken over by the illegitimate regime of Poroshenko. After a drawn-out slaughter of its citizens, it would have lost its autonomous status after which Porky would have given permission to the U.S. for a Black Sea base.

What happened instead?: The Crimean Governor arranged with Russian officials to hold a referendum and put  the reunification with Russia to a vote in such a way, that Ukraine and the US could not interfere. The people voted to join Russia.

Was this legal? Yes.
Did it break international agreements? Yes. But since when has the US or any other world power ever honored their agreements?

Edit:

For anyone who hasn't heard the leaked phone call with Victoria Nuland meddling in Ukraine affairs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L2XNN0Yt6D8

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[fillippone]

Not to piss of JJG I won't bury this link in my threads, but I will post it here:





Direct link

[savetherainforest]

Not to piss of JJG I won't bury this link in my threads, but I will post it here:





Direct link

PISS AWAY on JJG !!!


As I said before, BTCiTcoin and some other 2-3 crypto WILL BE LOCKED IN A VAULT !!! ... and never used directly, but only rarely. It will be used as a side-app for fools that believe banks will empower those apps with the actual coins. But it will be a thing like physical gold backing fiat, meaning that who knows if the bank actually owns what they say, they could show fake wallets.      

[Biodom]

Some stats for context, 67% population of Crimea were ethnic Russians, 80% of population spoke Russian as their primary language, and naturally this is how they voted, Yanukovych (blue) was the pro Russian president that ended up winning

Current military conflict is in the two regions that voted 91% and 93% for pro Russian president.

So Hm: based on the voting patterns one could make a pretty reasonable assumption that the area of "land" just above Ukraine, to the right of Poland, and below Lit/Latvia/Estonia would probably be pretty highly "Pro someone other than Russia". Would Russia be ok in ceding that territory in exchange for the areas that voted Russian in the Ukraine?

After all it is geography....

That area is Belarus, headed by Lukashenko, lol
Belarus is independent, but closely aligned with Putin.
I doubt any land "exchange" would occur there.

[suchmoon]

~

You missed a few tiny details, such as Crimea being a part of Ukraine at the time (thus they wouldn't "take over"), complete lack of sense or purpose for the supposed slaughtering, and the referendum being preceded by Russian occupation/annexation. It was not "legal" in any resonable sense of that word, but Russian autocrats typically aren't concerned with pesky details like sovereignty of other countries so what can you expect.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[goldkingcoiner]

~

1. The Russians were leasing the naval base in Crimea, so they were allowed to be there. legally. There was no occupation.
2. Crimea historically never truly belonged to Ukraine. Especially since the Crimea handover was unconstitutional.
3. If you're going to go as far back as the USSR to point fingers, then you might as well go further and tell me about the crimes of Ivan The Terrible and pin that on modern Russia as well.

As I already mentioned, the Russians were already there. What did you expect them to do? Sit back or retreat while the temporary government in Kiev would decide to use army and aviation to restore control against Pro-Russian Separatists the same way as they did in Donbass area? Or was that not what you would refer to as "bloodshed"?

The Russians decided to protect their own people. And to give them a choice. The Crimeans made their choice. After a coup d'etat the constitution validity is suspended so the referendum was a valid expression of public opinion. And if you think they are now all keeping quiet about their true thoughts because they fear Putin, then you are mistaken. Im not hearing anyone complaining. The Uyghurs in China had their mouths sown shut by the CCP. Yet we heard a lot of brave Uyghurs complaining about how they were being treated, despite being threatened with death and camps.

You seem to have swallowed the western propoganda of Putin being Hitler reincarnated, hook line and sinker.

Here is a video you should look into, if you want to inform yourself: Why is Ukraine the West's Fault? Featuring John Mearsheimer
 

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[suchmoon]

As I already mentioned, the Russians were already there. What did you expect them to do? Sit back or retreat while the temporary government in Kiev would decide to use army and aviation to restore control the same way as they did in Donbass area? Or was that not what you would refer to as "bloodshed"?

Restore control from what? Both Crimea and Donbass were part of Ukraine. There wouldn't have been anything to "restore" if Russia didn't invade.

I bet you didn't apply the same contrived logic to e.g. Chechnya.

The Russians decided to protect their own people.

So what's next, Brighton Beach? Every country has minorities and many have majority-minority areas and can still manage to respect each other's sovereignty, except Russia.

[JayJuanGee]

Not to piss of JJG I won't bury this link in my threads, but I will post it here:





Direct link

I am not sure for what reason that you consider such a piece to be irritating to me.  It seems to be quite a bit on point in this thread with regards to what a lot of us so called "maxis" tend to argue - that it is best to attempt to understand bitcoin first before branching out into other various kinds of shitcoins or "crypto" related projects... and surely there are so many instances when investors (whether retail or institutions) seem to jump straight into the "crypto" space and think that they understand the space and have not spent very much time specifically studying and understanding bitcoin first.  

Maybe there is a question of how many hours do you need to understand bitcoin?  Shitcoiners might have spent 10 hours and believe that they are experts, and many bitcoiners have spent thousands of hours and consider that they are still just scratching the surface of understanding.. and some areas in which they have no clue in understanding.

It's likely true that I don't really agree with some of their suggestions to potentially consider getting into shitcoins (or projects) after having had gotten some grasp on bitcoin, yet really that would not be so much of any kind of objection that I would have when they are suggesting to understand bitcoin first (in order to attempt to put those various other shitcoin projects into some kind of perspective)... .. so yeah, we need not get into that portion in this thread, but it does not hurt to come at the issue from that direction - and well could be the case that by the time you understand bitcoin, you may well find very little reason to diversify much if at all beyond it (except maybe some relatively small portion of your assets such as 10% of all crypto would be in shitcoins ... but for sure a slippery slope if your shitcoin choices were to end up outperforming bitcoin.. at least in the short term and then a kind of dilemma whether to continue with investing into such shitcoins.. and if perhaps some dilemma might increase with the passage of time.. and for sure guys will come out differently in such weighings - even while we would not need to elaborate upon those matters in this thread because it just ends up inviting shitcoin pumping rather than trying to stay focused, somewhat)..

Oh now we can go back to discussing historical versus present dynamics of Russia, Ukraine and Crimea.....

[Biodom]

^ gawd, you are right, can someone branch russia/ukraine into another thread, please?
this is starting to dominate.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[shahzadafzal]

HOT: Fidelity says #Bitcoin is a superior form of money.

Bitcoin is fundamentally different from any other digital asset. No other digital asset is likely to improve upon bitcoin as a monetary good because bitcoin is the most (relative to other digital assets) secure, decentralized, sound digital money and any “improvement” will necessarily face tradeoffs.

https://www.fidelitydigitalassets.com/bin-public/060_www_fidelity_com/documents/FDAS/bitcoin-first.pdf

[goldkingcoiner]

~

You are completely ignoring the inner conflict which sparked a civil war in Ukraine. You seem to think this all happened AFTER Russia "invaded". The newly installed Ukraine government would have definitely attacked the Pro-Russian Separatists in Crimea, had it not been annexed. And exactly that would have led to a great loss of life in Crimea. If you don't believe thats what would have happened, then you do not really understand the conflict.

You think you're helping by provoking more wars with your attempt to force your own specific brand of "democracy" on other countries? Hows Afghanistan doing? Or any of the 39 sovereign nations after the US invaded them? Lets ask Iraq on their thoughts on the matter.

Or maybe you want to talk about a more Crimea-relatable invasion? Invading Panama because it was "necessary to safeguard the lives of U.S. citizens in Panama" also "coincidentally" worked out in America's favor (aka helping America become the big daddy of the oceans). What a coincidence! See, when the west invades, its "different". Right?

What did NATO do except provoke a war in Georgia and then leave them to their own devices? Where were the American heros? Where was NATO and their ambiguous promises? All they did was instigate war and then let them burn.

As I see it, Russia is fighting to protect its influence while America fights to spread its influence. Hard to say which has the moral high ground.  I would say both are wrong. But Russia's hand is being forced, is the main difference.

Russia is going to protect its influence and will lash out if you keep forcing it into a corner.

edit:

out of respect for the WO, I am going to let this be my last political post on Ukraine. Either you get what Im talking about or you never played CIV 4. Don't @ me.

[JayJuanGee]

HOT: Fidelity says #Bitcoin is a superior form of money.

Bitcoin is fundamentally different from any other digital asset. No other digital asset is likely to improve upon bitcoin as a monetary good because bitcoin is the most (relative to other digital assets) secure, decentralized, sound digital money and any “improvement” will necessarily face tradeoffs.

https://www.fidelitydigitalassets.com/bin-public/060_www_fidelity_com/documents/FDAS/bitcoin-first.pdf

seems like I read that somewhere.. but I just can't place it.

[Arriemoller]

I just sold a chunk, for reasons.
So now, of course, the price is bound to go up, mark my words.