Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[empowering]

now i thinking about suicide! (no joke)

You should NOT put yourself in such a financial situation...   so try to learn from this in order to help yourself to better deal with these kinds of  situations in the future.
   
People had already said, in this thread, that investors should NOT put themselves in such situations.

You can always sell, lose less.  Still something left over.  Just go back to work tomorrow and start over.

Or just hold and see what happens next.... and if it does not work out... start over

[adamstgBit]

I blame the forty thieves for the decline ...they come stole all our cheaps Bitcoins and err stuff. (forty thieves-1001 Nights? you with me?)

Talking of which, it looks like a phoenix rising....  of course... there is a high probablility that the stock will decline a fair bit after the IPO and the dust has settled, but at its current projected marketcap after the IPO tomorrow ... they will be bigger than Amazon bigger than Ebay!

and they are not Bitcoin friendly   ..... YET.

Howevas... we may see some short order profit taking from the IPO and some monies returning home to mumma Bitcoin.

no bites ? no nibbles? 

what IPO?

[empowering]

I blame the forty thieves for the decline ...they come stole all our cheaps Bitcoins and err stuff. (forty thieves-1001 Nights? you with me?)

Talking of which, it looks like a phoenix rising....  of course... there is a high probablility that the stock will decline a fair bit after the IPO and the dust has settled, but at its current projected marketcap after the IPO tomorrow ... they will be bigger than Amazon bigger than Ebay!

and they are not Bitcoin friendly   ..... YET.

Howevas... we may see some short order profit taking from the IPO and some monies returning home to mumma Bitcoin.

no bites ? no nibbles? 

what IPO?

Google Forty Thieves and 1001 Nights and it will give you a clue? 

[lyth0s]

The Alibaba IPO is tomorrow. Probably some people pulling money out of bitcoin in order to participate in purchasing a chunk of the IPO shares. I mentioned this a few pages back.

[empowering]

The Alibaba IPO is tomorrow. Probably some people pulling money out of bitcoin in order to participate in purchasing a chunk of the IPO shares. I mentioned this a few pages back.

Boom http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/sep/18/alibaba-investor-ipo-sell-shares-lockup-flotation

Quote
"The disclosure, first reported by the Wall Street Journal, is just one more complication ahead of what looks set to be the biggest stock market floatation of all time on Friday.

Alibaba set the price of its shares on Thursday at $68, the top end of its planned range, and is expected to raise up to $22bn (£13.5bn). At $68 a share, the company is valued at $167.6bn – bigger than Amazon and more than double the value of eBay. Some analysts have speculated the company could be valued at more than $200bn once it goes public of the New York Stock Exchange, making the company almost more valuable than the combined value of Amazon and eBay, the two companies it is most often compared to."

Seems quite feasible that this would attract the attention of speculators...  them forty thieves done stole our Bitcoinz 

[Argwai96]

my first bid on btc-e is @135$

edit: and then all the way to 99$

What a fantasy!!!!


You better put some BTC sell orders in the $3,000 price range, too, just in case it goes quickly the other way.   

Have you ever traded on BTCE? In February, I caught coins from $140 - $270 (my lowest bids were at $140). In the last cascade, I caught coins from $320 - $360. It's not fantasy at all. BTCE is very thinly traded and extremely easy to manipulate. They will (or someone will) run stops and we could easily cascade down there, given a little push.

[adamstgBit]

The Alibaba IPO is tomorrow. Probably some people pulling money out of bitcoin in order to participate in purchasing a chunk of the IPO shares. I mentioned this a few pages back.

Boom http://www.theguardian.com/business/2014/sep/18/alibaba-investor-ipo-sell-shares-lockup-flotation

Quote
"The disclosure, first reported by the Wall Street Journal, is just one more complication ahead of what looks set to be the biggest stock market floatation of all time on Friday.

Alibaba set the price of its shares on Thursday at $68, the top end of its planned range, and is expected to raise up to $22bn (£13.5bn). At $68 a share, the company is valued at $167.6bn – bigger than Amazon and more than double the value of eBay. Some analysts have speculated the company could be valued at more than $200bn once it goes public of the New York Stock Exchange, making the company almost more valuable than the combined value of Amazon and eBay, the two companies it is most often compared to."

Seems quite feasible that this would attract the attention of speculators... 

oh ya poeple were talking about this the other day or other week.

well thats explains it.

[abercrombie]

The Alibaba IPO is tomorrow. Probably some people pulling money out of bitcoin in order to participate in purchasing a chunk of the IPO shares. I mentioned this a few pages back.

sayz Bitcoin drop due to Alibaba IPO.

http://bitcoinmagazine.com/16481/bitcoin-price-dropped-today/

did tell a friend a few days ago i'd convert a few paper wallets to get the IPO.

[samsonn25]

my first bid on btc-e is @135$

edit: and then all the way to 99$

What a fantasy!!!!


You better put some BTC sell orders in the $3,000 price range, too, just in case it goes quickly the other way.   

Have you ever traded on BTCE? In February, I caught coins from $140 - $270 (my lowest bids were at $140). In the last cascade, I caught coins from $320 - $360. It's not fantasy at all. BTCE is very thinly traded and extremely easy to manipulate. They will (or someone will) run stops and we could easily cascade down there, given a little push.

Yes.   This is true

[empowering]

Yeah... it seems to make sense for a possible explanation... speculators holding off until the last minute to take some funds and push them into the Alibaba P&D...  so... question is... how much will come back to mumma Bitcoin and how soon?

Seems like win win, force market down with sell off, walk away with x amount of cash (and a BTC sold figure) profit from Alibaba pump, take profit and either
pop some in the hole in the water fund, or buy back same amount of BTC (at a now lower price) OR buy back even more BTC at a lower price.

[adamstgBit]

my first bid on btc-e is @135$

edit: and then all the way to 99$

What a fantasy!!!!


You better put some BTC sell orders in the $3,000 price range, too, just in case it goes quickly the other way.   

Have you ever traded on BTCE? In February, I caught coins from $140 - $270 (my lowest bids were at $140). In the last cascade, I caught coins from $320 - $360. It's not fantasy at all. BTCE is very thinly traded and extremely easy to manipulate. They will (or someone will) run stops and we could easily cascade down there, given a little push.

Yes.   This is true

happend once.

[DieJohnny]

Bitcoin is not diving because of Alibaba, it is diving because we are above the true transaction value of Bitcoin, we will go down until we are at or close to the transactional value of bitcoin, then up when speculation drives the price again.

[MoreFun]

Yeah... it seems to make sense for a possible explanation... speculators holding off until the last minute to take some funds and push them into the Alibaba P&D...  so... question is... how much will come back to mumma Bitcoin and how soon?

Seems like win win, force market down with sell off, walk away with x amount of cash (and a BTC sold figure) profit from Alibaba pump, take profit and either
pop some in the hole in the water fund, or buy back same amount of BTC (at a now lower price) OR buy back even more BTC at a lower price.

You don't sell Bitcoins 1 day before IPO and also IPO is not for small guys. Bullshit mostly this as a reason, this was purely momentum triggered after nice work done the same way as many times before from the same wall-bear. But could still be some guys selling for IPO, but nothing spectacular.

[empowering]

Bitcoin is not diving because of Alibaba, it is diving because we are above the true transaction value of Bitcoin, we will go down until we are at or close to the transactional value of bitcoin, then up when speculation drives the price again.

meh... the Alibaba scenario is perfectly viable... the timing is too much.. only hours to go until the biggest IPO in history... seems plausible enough to me, well as plausible as your opinion that BTC is below its transaction value...maybe more plausible because

[empowering]

-timing

[empowering]

Yeah... it seems to make sense for a possible explanation... speculators holding off until the last minute to take some funds and push them into the Alibaba P&D...  so... question is... how much will come back to mumma Bitcoin and how soon?

Seems like win win, force market down with sell off, walk away with x amount of cash (and a BTC sold figure) profit from Alibaba pump, take profit and either
pop some in the hole in the water fund, or buy back same amount of BTC (at a now lower price) OR buy back even more BTC at a lower price.

You don't sell Bitcoins 1 day before IPO and also IPO is not for small guys. Bullshit mostly this as a reason, this was purely momentum triggered after nice work done the same way as many times before from the same wall-bear. But could still be some guys selling for IPO, but nothing spectacular.

Why not? sell BTC 1 day before the IPO, if you feel that BTC could go up a few more dollars? (or down? fair enough)

Also, many BTC speculators are .... well speculators... and the biggest IPO of all time is enough to draw in speculators, large and small... as long as they are active in trading in general, I can perfectly see traders taking the risk...  it is more than plausible imo..

[adamstgBit]

Bitcoin is not diving because of Alibaba, it is diving because we are above the true transaction value of Bitcoin, we will go down until we are at or close to the transactional value of bitcoin, then up when speculation drives the price again.

meh... the Alibaba scenario is perfectly viable... the timing is too much.. only hours to go until the biggest IPO in history... seems plausible enough to me, well as plausible as your opinion that BTC is below its transaction value...maybe more plausible because

he saying it will keep going down untill price = transaction value.

[JayJuanGee]

What would be dead is the inflated expectations of a few overzealous people. That's all.

So it's greedy if a bitcoiner buys a bitcoin sometime, ANYTIME in 2014, and expects it to more or less retain it's value? Should no one have bought any bitcoins AT ALL in 2014 and held them?

Honestly answer the question.  2014 is nearly over, it's been 10 months.

Maybe not greedy but naive? Bitcoin went up x100 in 2013. Do you expect this to just maintain its value without major corrections?

If you want to retain value short to mid term at least, then Bitcoin is not the asset to do that. Bitcoin is an asset to look for high growth, and with that growth comes the cost of RISK.

Sticky please. First post everyone should read who enters this forum.

This is what frustrates me about the constant touting of bitcoin as a "store of value." Ask anyone who bought in during 2014 how that's working out for them.

Now go ask the same question to those who bought in 2012/2013 and come back in a few years.

Is that what a "store of value" is? Buy today, lose more than 1/2 the value in several months, and then hope we have a bubble that goes 10x my initial buy-in a few years later? Is that a "store of value"?

scarsbergholden:  You seem to be exaggerating a little bit and playing ignorant.  I believe that store of value merely means that by the time you cash out, the asset is worth at least the same and potentially more than it was worth when you purchased it.   Surely, with storage of value, you would probably like it to hold at least the value of relatively stable storage of value mechanisms... maybe expecting some appreciation of value between 3 to 5% per year. Of course, if it gains greater value than otherwise stable value storage vehicles, then that would be icing on the cake.

Then we disagree on the definition of a store of value. While Wikipedia is shite, I think it has this sentence right -- "The point of any store of value is intrinsic risk management due to an inherent stable demand for the underlying asset."

To act as if bitcoin can serve this role would be to play ignorant. Bitcoin is in its infancy. I'm not denying the potential, but I don't think we have the price history and historic demand to feel confident as a store of value at all.

Using stores of value is a way to manage your risk. Buying bitcoin is, on the other hand, a very risky investment. That doesn't mean we can't go to the moon. But the point still stands.

The point also still stands that I explained my point of view, so the fact that you consider BTC to NOT be a good store of value is your perspective and your way of treating it  (actually you seem to be completely denying that it can be used or even considered to be a store of value, which seems a bit extreme from my point of view); however, even if you want to have a narrow definition regarding what is or what is NOT a store of value that does NOT mean that others may NOT have means to incorporate BTC in to their total store of value package... as I already explained in my earlier post.... and I find NO need for you to attempt to denigrate others for having a different perspective from you.

[twiifm]

Yeah... it seems to make sense for a possible explanation... speculators holding off until the last minute to take some funds and push them into the Alibaba P&D...  so... question is... how much will come back to mumma Bitcoin and how soon?

Seems like win win, force market down with sell off, walk away with x amount of cash (and a BTC sold figure) profit from Alibaba pump, take profit and either
pop some in the hole in the water fund, or buy back same amount of BTC (at a now lower price) OR buy back even more BTC at a lower price.

You don't sell Bitcoins 1 day before IPO and also IPO is not for small guys. Bullshit mostly this as a reason, this was purely momentum triggered after nice work done the same way as many times before from the same wall-bear. But could still be some guys selling for IPO, but nothing spectacular.

Why not? sell BTC 1 day before the IPO, if you feel that BTC could go up a few more dollars? (or down? fair enough)

Also, many BTC speculators are .... well speculators... and the biggest IPO of all time is enough to draw in speculators, large and small... as long as they are active in trading in general, I can perfectly see traders taking the risk...  it is more than plausible imo..

Most rational people would rather own shares of Alibaba than Bitcoins.  At least Alibaba has fundamentals

[JayJuanGee]

anything the requires peoples selflessness, to succeed ( if we all hold it will go up ) is doomed to fail. bitcoin will drive that point home. prepare yourselves for new bottom guys. technicals have been broken

Bitcoin is DOOOOOOMMMMMEED!!!!!!!


CUT YOUR LOOSE!!!!!!!!!!!!

naw drank the kool aid ....going down for the count.. I still see a world wide use for bitcoin..it will climb back to some level as long as it offers legitimate use outside of banks and cc and finance checks etc esp overseas...( I know some very happy ukrainans who got their $$$ out of the country due to BTC etc ...

but prob if  btc does tank big it will take quite a bit to get it back up in price with all the press/media fud to sell advertising etc

so ...delusion another way to get bitcoin

I agree with you... I am buying and hodling my BTC.. and accumulating...

But I love that chant....   especially b/c it is ambiguous...


CUT YOUR LOOSE!!!!!!!!!!!!