Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[criptix]

they never hacked into his computers, and whether or not they can follow them on the blockchain is irrelevant.

Perhaps I am mis-remembering about the hacking.  But, from day 0, the police can buy stuff on the site, pay in bitcoins, and follow them on the blockchain.  That tracing could reveal if there were other wallets beyond those that that they seized (~30'000 on the server and ~150'000 on his laptop).  

It's a good thing for law enforcement that no one ever invented a tumbler, or any other method to hide bitcoins eh

If the cops had any brains they would set up a dozen fake tumbling services, with unbeatable fees and spiffy interfaces; and quietly close or co-opt the legitimate ones.  But fortunately they are nowhere as smart as the typical users of such services.

i doubt that would be legal, atleast in germany im pretty sure that the the police are not be able to do stuff like this by law.

(i mean from buying on SR or etc. to setting up tumbling services)

[jonoiv]

they never hacked into his computers, and whether or not they can follow them on the blockchain is irrelevant.

Perhaps I am mis-remembering about the hacking.  But, from day 0, the police can buy stuff on the site, pay in bitcoins, and follow them on the blockchain.  That tracing could reveal if there were other wallets beyond those that that they seized (~30'000 on the server and ~150'000 on his laptop). 

It's a good thing for law enforcement that no one ever invented a tumbler, or any other method to hide bitcoins eh

If the cops had any brains they would set up a dozen fake tumbling services, with unbeatable fees and spiffy interfaces; and quietly close or co-opt the legitimate ones.  But fortunately they are nowhere as smart as the typical users of such services.

i doubt that would be legal, atleast in germany im pretty sure that the the police are not be able to do stuff like this by law.

If you are talking about SR.  I thought they had a built in tumbler.

[600watt]

they never hacked into his computers, and whether or not they can follow them on the blockchain is irrelevant.

Perhaps I am mis-remembering about the hacking.  But, from day 0, the police can buy stuff on the site, pay in bitcoins, and follow them on the blockchain.  That tracing could reveal if there were other wallets beyond those that that they seized (~30'000 on the server and ~150'000 on his laptop).  

It's a good thing for law enforcement that no one ever invented a tumbler, or any other method to hide bitcoins eh

If the cops had any brains they would set up a dozen fake tumbling services, with unbeatable fees and spiffy interfaces; and quietly close or co-opt the legitimate ones.  But fortunately they are nowhere as smart as the typical users of such services.

i doubt that would be legal, atleast in germany im pretty sure that the the police are not be able to do stuff like this by law.

(i mean from buying on SR or etc. to setting up tumbling services)

i don´t know why on earth people would believe germen law enforcement would not act as mindblowing unlawful/unconstitutional/undemocratic as any other law enforcement body in the world. german government employes morally "better" people/less corrupt than the rest of the world ? i doubt that.

german citizens more naive than the rest of the world in regard to what expect from their government ? hmm... could be true.

[NotLambchop]

...The point is, coin tracking is the least of the concerns for LE.
...

Seems like a great ready-made exercise to train baby feds and keep them in practice

[criptix]

not saying germany is perfect, but regarding laws and security we are in the top 3-5, only the scandinavian nations have it better

[MrPiggles]

not saying germany is perfect, but regarding laws and security we are in the top 3-5, only the scandinavian nations have it better

I've heard German prisons are pretty rough though

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[oda.krell]

...The point is, coin tracking is the least of the concerns for LE.
...

Seems like a great ready-made exercise to train baby feds and keep them in practice

Maybe. Or part of an up-to-date CS curriculum.

Just saying, worrying about coin tracking misses the point that customers handed much more complete information on a silver platter to authorities, with no way of knowing how that data was handled internally. If in doubt, I'd get the coins I plan to use on a market like this OTC, paid in cash.

[JorgeStolfi]

i doubt that would be legal, atleast in germany im pretty sure that the the police are not be able to do stuff like this by law.  (i mean from buying on SR or etc. to setting up tumbling services)

Not even with a warrant?

Since 9/11, it seems that the US intelligence and law enforcement agencies have legal authorization to do anything to anyone, anywhere.  But, even before 9/11, I believe that they could legally plant cameras, hack computers, or infiltrate criminal organizations, if they got a judge's authorization to do so.

Law enforcement was inside Silk Road 2.0 almost since the beginning.

If the German police cannot legally place a trap order on a German drug-selling site, or set up a fake tumbling site in a laptop over a desk in a building in German soil, they can give a call to an Italian or French colleague and have him do that favor for them.

[NotLambchop]

Looks like the first draft of the bitcoin protocol:

Fake.  The true original was the very essence of elegance:



Introduction of "supernodes":

[JorgeStolfi]

Maybe. Or part of an up-to-date CS curriculum.

Actually, not long ago I was assigned to a "Computers & Ssociety" course for our CS majors (1 lecture per week, no homework or exams).  Police snooping vs privacy was one of the topics.  Wikileaks and Manning were still on the news; Snowden saga was just unraveling, or had not started yet.

The field has changed a lot since then, unfortunately for the worse.  With the spread of centralized services like Facebook and cloud computing, people are much more indifferent to unrestricted snooping by unaccountable agencies, to censorship under the excuse of copyright enforcement, and other "classical" Computers&Society issues.

Bitcoin may be partly responsible for that.  Many activists who could be campaigning for better government practices and rights-oriented laws seem to have given up the fight, trusting that all those problems will disappear once bitcoin takes over the world and governments just shrivel away.

[podyx]

About to break out:

[MrPiggles]

i doubt that would be legal, atleast in germany im pretty sure that the the police are not be able to do stuff like this by law.  (i mean from buying on SR or etc. to setting up tumbling services)

Not even with a warrant?

Since 9/11, it seems that the US intelligence and law enforcement agencies have legal authorization to do anything to anyone, anywhere.  But, even before 9/11, I believe that they could legally plant cameras, hack computers, or infiltrate criminal organizations, if they got a judge's authorization to do so.

Law enforcement was inside Silk Road 2.0 almost since the beginning.

If the German police cannot legally place a trap order on a German drug-selling site, or set up a fake tumbling site in a laptop over a desk in a building in German soil, they can give a call to an Italian or French colleague and have him do that favor for them.

They were inside SR2 from its very inception. Anyone with any sense (look through my post history) warned repeatedly that SR2 was either a scam or a honeypot.

And you're somewhat right here (for a change) the US can do nearly whatever it wants, it's truly a police state.

In the EU however they still respect their own laws, SWIM had a case fall apart because one EU countries police acted contrary to another EU states laws. So simply asking the French or Italians to get involved wouldn't work in most of western Europe.

In Eastern Europe of course you'd just bribe your way out of it anyway, much like in South America or Asia, or in fact the entire world apart from North America or Western Europe.

[ChartBuddy]

Explanation

[oda.krell]

Bitcoin may be partly responsible for that.  Many activists who could be campaigning for better government practices and rights-oriented laws seem to have given up the fight, trusting that all those problems will disappear once bitcoin takes over the world and governments just shrivel away.

Accurate for a subset of Bitcoin beliebers, but count me out of it, and quite a few others as well. I don't want governments to just "shrivel away", but I also don't believe overly much in toothless activism. The algorithmic solution to (near) global (near) unrestricted communication was the Internet. The algorithmic solution to global, frictionless bartering and asset tracking could be crypto, or so we hope. You'll note a common theme here, maybe: the technology gives the capacity to do X without asking first if some authority permits X to happen. If X happens to be illegal, it becomes a question whether it'll be found out, and possibly prosecuted. Ask for permission, then do it, is the old way. Do it without asking, but possibly face consequences is the newer alternative. Get rid of the consequences is an even stronger demand, and not everyone in Bitcoin is behind it.

[spooderman]

Hope today closes green. We haven't had 5 green days in a row since June.

[magicmexican]

I am very interested what will happen with the 1week macD. Will it becomes green and still fail to rally, just like 6 months ago? Or will it actually be legit and 6xx range will become possible once again.

[JimboToronto]

Hope today closes green. We haven't had 5 green days in a row since June.

You read my mind about the 5 green days in a row but didn't we just do it Nov.8-12?

I'm glad I missed yesterday. It must have been a bear trollfest, yet we still ended up green.

[NotLambchop]

...
I'm glad I missed yesterday. It must have been a bear trollfest, yet we still ended up green.

You were here, grampa.  You just forgot.

[YogoH]

will bitcoin be 10k tomorrow?