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Author Topic: MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]  (Read 879740 times)
BitPaulo
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February 07, 2014, 09:29:11 AM
 #3501

Just received my 2BTC back into my Mt Gox account. I tried to withdraw them 3 days ago... Let's see what will happen on Monday.
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February 07, 2014, 09:44:13 AM
 #3502


FYI, this is very concerning. Didnt realize it, but checked mtgox market depth and it's true. There already seem to be a slow run on the bank with mtgox.

Not to create panic, but i suggest anyone with money/bitcoin in mtgox to get it out for safekeeping. Right now people are still walking towards the exit, you dont want to wait until it becomes a stampede.  It's pretty obvious at this rate, the bitcoins will be drained out due to mtgox inability to withdraw funds, and now even majority bitcoin withdraw is getting delayed.

I work in the financial industry for a long time, this is no different than a run on a fund, you dont want to be the last one in it trying to get out, always be the first. Yes it may not come to that, but why take the risk by leaving your bitcoins in mtgox?

I have converted the remaining balance in mtgox to bitcoin and submitted the withdraw request to get all of it out.

repost....

i will say again, whatever you believe about mtgox and unicorns, there is no reason, absolutely NONE, to leave your fiat or bitcoins in mtgox.

All risk, no reward.

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February 07, 2014, 09:46:19 AM
 #3503


FYI, this is very concerning. Didnt realize it, but checked mtgox market depth and it's true. There already seem to be a slow run on the bank with mtgox.

Not to create panic, but i suggest anyone with money/bitcoin in mtgox to get it out for safekeeping. Right now people are still walking towards the exit, you dont want to wait until it becomes a stampede.  It's pretty obvious at this rate, the bitcoins will be drained out due to mtgox inability to withdraw funds, and now even majority bitcoin withdraw is getting delayed.

I work in the financial industry for a long time, this is no different than a run on a fund, you dont want to be the last one in it trying to get out, always be the first. Yes it may not come to that, but why take the risk by leaving your bitcoins in mtgox?

I have converted the remaining balance in mtgox to bitcoin and submitted the withdraw request to get all of it out.

repost....

i will say again, whatever you believe about mtgox and unicorns, there is no reason, absolutely NONE, to leave your fiat or bitcoins in mtgox.

All risk, no reward.

Thanks, great idea, great advice, Cpt. Obvious!

Oh wait... isn't the problem in the first place that people HAVE TO leave their fiat/btc @ mtgox, because they CAN NOT do a withdrawal?
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February 07, 2014, 09:53:03 AM
 #3504

Quote
Tokyo - JAPAN - February 07, 2014

Dear MtGox Customers,

During our efforts to resolve the issue being encountered by some bitcoin withdrawals it was determined that the increase in withdrawal traffic is hindering our efforts on a technical level. As to get a better look at the process the system needs to be in a static state.

In order for our team to resolve the withdrawal issue it is necessary to temporarily pause all withdrawal traffic to obtain a clear technical view of the current processes.

We apologize for the extremely short notice, but as of now all bitcoin withdrawals will be paused, and withdrawals in the queue will returned to your MtGox wallet and can be re-intiated once the issue is resolved. Customers can still use the trading platform as usual.

Our team will be working hard through the weekend and will provide an update on Monday, February 10, 2014 (JST).

Again, we apologize for the inconvenience, and ask for your continued patience and support while we work to resolve this issue.

Best regards,

The MtGox Team

This is very good news in my opinion. Finally they stop the ongoing pilling-up of errors, stop the flood of errors coming in and also the flood of requests such as mine like "please refund my stucked bitcoins to my mtgox wallet" and by stopping these floods, they can actually deal with the problem/s.

So to me, this looks reliable and I hope for the best for all of Gox users and Gox themselves.

Good luck guys,

Ah - what a load of crap PR release.

"by some bitcoin withdrawals"

Lulz yeah it may be some but but current count is STILL 4159
Half an hour ago it was ... 4153 ... man they are really chewing into that backlog ... oh wait, it went up 6 Tongue

It's been going on for 2 months or more and they suddenly realise - oh shit stop everything and fix it? ...

Edit: reading it a second time ... yeah they want you to have your withdrawn coins back, and have nothing else to do but trade them so they make more trade fees ....... all weekend ...

+1 yup they make money on every trade. More trades by customers with locked fiat and BTC in their system....the better for MTGOX.

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February 07, 2014, 09:57:14 AM
 #3505

This reminds me of when PirateAt40 said he would get funds to his customers the following Monday after announcing his business BTCS&T was shutting down.

This whole "update you on Monday" thing seems fishy. So they straggle to get things done for at least two weeks. Now it is the weekend and they are just going to go silent for two more days and claim Monday will have more information.

Don't hold your breath. Remember what happened when they first stopped USD wires in June 2013....

All the signs are there people.

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February 07, 2014, 10:01:15 AM
 #3506

This reminds me of when PirateAt40 said he would get funds to his customers the following Monday after announcing his business BTCS&T was shutting down.

This whole "update you on Monday" thing seems fishy. So they straggle to get things done for at least two weeks. Now it is the weekend and they are just going to go silent for two more days and claim Monday will have more information.

Don't hold your breath. Remember what happened when they first stopped USD wires in June 2013....

All the signs are there people.

Remember what happened when they first stopped USD wires in June 2013....


What happened?
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February 07, 2014, 10:03:06 AM
 #3507

Just received my 2BTC back into my Mt Gox account. I tried to withdraw them 3 days ago... Let's see what will happen on Monday.

Sweet. I just got mine back. At least something is happening. But I expect it all to break down again on Sunday. Huge BTC withdrawal once they get things fixed.

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February 07, 2014, 10:10:35 AM
 #3508

This reminds me of when PirateAt40 said he would get funds to his customers the following Monday after announcing his business BTCS&T was shutting down.

This whole "update you on Monday" thing seems fishy. So they straggle to get things done for at least two weeks. Now it is the weekend and they are just going to go silent for two more days and claim Monday will have more information.

Don't hold your breath. Remember what happened when they first stopped USD wires in June 2013....

All the signs are there people.

Remember what happened when they first stopped USD wires in June 2013....


What happened?

They never resumed even though it was claimed that it was TEMPORARY....9 months later....still nothing working on USD wires.

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February 07, 2014, 10:51:30 AM
 #3509

Can someone on this thread explain to me why anyone, ANYONE, would have traded at Gox in the last 6 months when there are others exchanges that are cheaper, faster, more secure and actually do WITHDRAWALS?

I can't for the life of me understand why any of you have coins or fiat there. Unless you are brand new to the bitcoin world and somehow figured out how to get verified and deposit there while somehow missing any of the literally thousands of posts on why that would be a bad idea, then I just don't understand what you people are doing.

because i had my money on there the last year you sanctimonious prick and got my last 1100 usd stuck there . I hope that clears it up for you douchebag.
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February 07, 2014, 10:58:42 AM
 #3510

after reviewing the bellow analysis, i felt more assured now this is just technical glitch not insolvency, load up your gun guys, buy at the dip:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1x93tf/some_irc_chatter_about_what_is_going_on_at_mtgox/

The question is obviously whether gox is insolvent or just has technical problems.
Why would mt gox have technical problems for more than a month and other exchanges dont? They guy in the IRC chat asked "how come other exchanges didn't wind up with these problems?" but didnt get an answer (i didnt see any).
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February 07, 2014, 11:21:14 AM
 #3511


I do hope they aren't scamming as I still have coins there, and I also can't see how it's in their interest - being the most recognised exchange, if not the largest one, should be such an easy gig - keep everything working and people just give you their money. There is so much more money to be made doing that than running off with everything, and with less difficulty / risk.


"The most recognised exchange, if not the largest one" ?? What are you talking about?


edit: amazing to watch - gox halts btc withdrawals and gox/stamp spread vanishes completely.

Amazing???
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February 07, 2014, 11:28:34 AM
 #3512

Interesting read:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1x9gue/my_protest_at_mtgox_offices_5_to_7th_february/

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February 07, 2014, 11:34:06 AM
 #3513

Has anyone had a JPY withdrawal processed recently? I still have two stuck on "confirmed" from 14 and 15 January.
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February 07, 2014, 11:37:01 AM
 #3514

Has anyone had a JPY withdrawal processed recently? I still have two stuck on "confirmed" from 14 and 15 January.

which bank?
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February 07, 2014, 11:41:04 AM
 #3515

I wish I went long "Mt.Gox Stuck Transaction Outputs" at 30000, I'd have doubled my money and more! Too bad I didn't find out what exchange it's listed on in time. It's still rallying and it still looks bullish but I personally tend to start thinking about shorting after 50%+ moves. Graph here: http://coinsight.org/mtgox.html

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February 07, 2014, 11:47:13 AM
 #3516

Has anyone had a JPY withdrawal processed recently? I still have two stuck on "confirmed" from 14 and 15 January.

which bank?


Japan Post

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February 07, 2014, 11:49:36 AM
 #3517

Has anyone had a JPY withdrawal processed recently? I still have two stuck on "confirmed" from 14 and 15 January.


Stuck since the 29th (UFJ)
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February 07, 2014, 11:57:08 AM
 #3518

Has anyone had a JPY withdrawal processed recently? I still have two stuck on "confirmed" from 14 and 15 January.

which bank?


Japan Post



i had two stuck on "confirmed" from 12 and 14 January, Citibank, then i canceled them and the support told me that Citibank is not accepting transfers from BTC exchanges anymore.
Then i tried to withdraw my JPY using JapaNet Bank Account. But withdrawal now is stuck in confirmed from 28 January. That's all
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February 07, 2014, 12:12:50 PM
 #3519

The only explanation,  i've read so far that really makes sence:

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/1x93tf/some_irc_chatter_about_what_is_going_on_at_mtgox/

Quote
[–]nullc 14 Punkte 3 Stunden zuvor
Because the quotes are irreparably messed up I'll write up a long form explanation:
Some background: MtGox runs custom wallet software.
This is a reasonable and common practice for a service of its size and nature.
Getting a wallet implementing right isn't easy as there is very little room for error, much like the rest of the Bitcoin system.
Some have criticized their use of custom software here but it is a reasonable and common practice for a service of its size and nature. The reference client's wallet is basically suitable for small scale single party use. I would not recommend something like MtGox use the reference node wallet, at least not without a healthy layer of abstraction on top of it— relieving it of duties harder than key management and chain monitoring— or otherwise improving it greatly.
(For that matter, MtGox's wallet software has caused them fewer concerning problems than some other companies. (E.g. some have completely re-implemented the Bitcoin protocol, incorrectly, and exposed it to the outside world and suffered numerous local blockchain rejecting glitches). Though its certainly taken Gox a fair amount of time to sort things out.)
I first heard people reporting stuck transactions back in ~September. I looked into it and determined that Mtgox was spending immature coins. Freshly generated Bitcoins (from mining) can not be spend until they are at least 100 blocks deep in the blockchain. This prevents the funds from vanishing forever if the chain reorgs. I pinged magicaltux and after a couple tries got ahold of him. I think they also wasted some time on dead ends trying to resolve this before the actual nature of the problem was brought to their attention, e.g. raising their transaction fees with a mistaken belief that their fees weren't high enough.
Mtgox wasn't tracking if the coins were freshly generated or what their height was in their software. Including this data would apparently be a non-trivial change, and for high risk finance software even a trivial change takes a lot of work. I suggested a workaround (basically, just try to spend the oldest coins), and as far as I know they implemented it and it was effective.
They continued to have problems with stuck transactions after, and further analysis revealed that they were producing transactions with excessively padded signatures. A minor tangent is required here:
There is a design flaw in the Bitcoin protocol where its possible for a third party to take a valid transaction of yours and mutate it in a way which leaves it valid and functionally identical but with a different transaction ID. This greatly complicates writing correct wallet software, and it can be used abusively to invalidate long chains of unconfirmed transactions that depend on the non-mutant transaction (since transactions refer to each other by txid).
This issue arises from several sources, one of them being OpenSSL's willingness to accept and make sense of signatures with invalid encodings. A normal ECDSA signature encodes two large integers, the encoding isn't constant length— if there are leading zeros you are supposed to drop them.
It's easy to write software that assumes the signature will be a constant length and then leave extra leading zeros in them.
In order to eventually remove this malleability flaw we've been gradually tightening the rules that govern what transactions nodes in the network will consider valid when they relay them or mine them. In Bitcoin 0.8— after months of work chasing down software authors to get them to fix their bugs transactions with these invalid encodings were no longer relayed.
This caused some problems for a few things.. For example bc.i's iphone app— BC.i itself had been fixed long before but they couldn't update the Iphone app without fear of triggering another review by Apple. Eventually this was just worked around on the server side by mutating the transactions produced by the iphone wallets. (And is moot now, I guess!).
MtGox also had problems with occasionally producing invalid signatures. This would normally be a simple fix. E.g. here is an example where I fixed this type of issue in some python wallet code I've never used (but saw a lot of people were copying): https://github.com/jgarzik/python-bitcoinlib/commit/4c64603ab60b0fa23c51090b3112be2f163aeeac
But as I said before, in high value systems like Mtgox, even simple fixes aren't simple and it took them quite some time to deploy a fix. However, I believe that it is actually fixed now.
My current understanding and inference is that the remaining issues are because while MtGox was producing transactions of the bad form that the network won't relay anymore— some people decided to help out by 'fixing' these transactions like BC.i did for iphone users— making the signatures normal and broadcasting them. Of course, the new transactions— while functionally identical— have different TXIDs.
The difference here is that the MtGox wallet software appears to have not handled this case gracefully at all, and apparently simply wouldn't notice transactions that it "didn't make" spending its own coins.
As a result the Mtgox wallet believed some coins were available for spending which really had already been spent and it began double spending those inputs. This may have interacted particularly poorly with the earlier workaround I mentioned— trying to always use the oldest available coins— if they did implement that workaround.
Worse, some of this may have resulted in users getting paid multiple times and could have been intentionally triggered with that end in mind if someone helpfully fixed some transactions and then noticed they got paid twice. (I think this is unlikely to have caused large losses, before people run off worrying about that, both because of the reuse of the oldest inputs and because of the hot wallet/cold wallet split).
At this point they likely have an accounting mess to clean up— figuring out who did and didn't get paid now with none of the txids matching. Cleaning that up will be somewhat tricky E.g. say there were three payments of MtGox coins to 1Apple in the block chain... and three users that attempted to pay 1Apple, and MtGox's records thinks that only one went through.. etc. So software will have to be written that matches up transactions with their mutants in order to figure out what went where.
I am not personally concerned— at least not by any of the details here. MtGox's slow speed at resolving these sorts of issues and poor communications are not terribly inspiring. They seem to be horribly short staffed— but competent and trustworthy people in this space may be hard to find: The regulatory morass of that business is sure to make many steer clear.
The claims that the delays indicate insolvency strike me as just hysteria: the technical background doesn't support this conclusion, and there may be a bit of opportunism at play from people who want to manipulate the market too. Don't get me wrong: I have not seen their books: Gox may well have financial problems— though with their income its hard for me to see how— but if any problems like that exist they're not being indicated here.
Of course, none of this suggests anyone should be happy with the service MtGox has been providing, but our anger should at least be well informed.
Zarathustra
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February 07, 2014, 12:18:09 PM
 #3520

Where is the sturle?
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