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Author Topic: MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]  (Read 878059 times)
PolymorphicAssasin
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January 18, 2014, 08:04:05 PM
 #2801

1) Date: 2013-11-28
2) Date: 2013-12-01
3) Date: 2013-12-03
4) Date: 2013-12-05
5) Date: 2013-12-07

All transfers in USD between $800/850 and have not arrived yet.  I submitted a support request asking for the status of my transfers on January 3rd, and finally retrieved a reply on January 17th (Yes, 2 weeks to get a form letter response).  The reply was a form letter that basically said 'After reviewing your account we can confirm that you are verified.'  Which I knew, and isn't what I asked for. 

I don't care the reason; be it incompetence, insolvency, or government actions, this is no way to run a legitimate business.   If they are having this many issues processing USD withdrawals, there should be communication to their users of such difficulty.  You shouldn't have to come to a 3rd party run message board to find a hacked-up transcript of an IRC chat log to get real answers.  If they can publish the limits and problems in IRC, they can put them on the home page, or in the UI when users attempt USD withdrawals.

I'm getting all my assets out of there as quickly as possible.  It's a shame to see such a pillar of early Bitcoinia fall so far.
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January 18, 2014, 08:43:52 PM
 #2802

Withdrawal delays are a sign the company does not keep segregated accounts of customer deposits. I have a wealth of experience with that kind of stuff from online gambling sites.

I have seen the same pattern over and over with registered and rubberstamp licensed companys. When withdrawal delays become unreasonable long and endemic its a clear sign that the company is short on funds and has spent customer deposits.

In every case that Iam aware off all the companys have eventually closed down and customers left stranded with no way to recover anything. Once a company goes down that route they rely on new deposits to pay out old debts. Its a vicious cycle that wont end well.

How could they have run out of money? They should be making enough on their transaction charges to cover all their running costs and make a strong profit.
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January 18, 2014, 09:30:12 PM
 #2803

1) Date: 2013-11-28
2) Date: 2013-12-01
3) Date: 2013-12-03
4) Date: 2013-12-05
5) Date: 2013-12-07

All transfers in USD between $800/850 and have not arrived yet.  I submitted a support request asking for the status of my transfers on January 3rd, and finally retrieved a reply on January 17th (Yes, 2 weeks to get a form letter response).  The reply was a form letter that basically said 'After reviewing your account we can confirm that you are verified.'  Which I knew, and isn't what I asked for. 

I don't care the reason; be it incompetence, insolvency, or government actions, this is no way to run a legitimate business.   If they are having this many issues processing USD withdrawals, there should be communication to their users of such difficulty.  You shouldn't have to come to a 3rd party run message board to find a hacked-up transcript of an IRC chat log to get real answers.  If they can publish the limits and problems in IRC, they can put them on the home page, or in the UI when users attempt USD withdrawals.

I'm getting all my assets out of there as quickly as possible.  It's a shame to see such a pillar of early Bitcoinia fall so far.

Oh but if they did that all of the newb customers starting to use their exchange would turn away in an instant.

They have to keep up the charade that everything at MTGOX is peachy-keen.  Grin

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January 19, 2014, 09:30:16 AM
 #2804

Not just USD that is issue it seems, I'm having an issue with two recent separate Yen withdrawal requests. Both 'confirmed' in Gox account history, but about two weeks passed and not hit my bank ( a japanese domestic bank ). I do have a verified account. No response to my several support queries so far.

Luckily the two withdrawals were only a BTC each, bad but not end of the world. All my other BTC since withdrawn to the safety of my offline wallet, until I see those two BTC worth of yen hit my bank account.

There is some notice on the Gox site about japanese domestic transfers delayed due to end of year holiday period, maybe it took a few extra days over that period, but there aren't delays in the general banking system, ( I've made other non Gox transfers ok ), any delay is at Gox end as far as I can see.

Saigō Takamori : ( 1828 – 1877) was one of the most influential samurai in Japanese history. He has been dubbed the last true samurai.
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January 19, 2014, 09:33:53 AM
 #2805

observe

tips    1APp826DqjJBdsAeqpEstx6Q8hD4urac8a
cozytrade
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January 19, 2014, 10:40:50 AM
 #2806

Not just USD that is issue it seems, I'm having an issue with two recent separate Yen withdrawal requests. Both 'confirmed' in Gox account history, but about two weeks passed and not hit my bank ( a japanese domestic bank ).

Two weeks is in line with my recent transaction for JPY. It is not in line with standard Japanese domestic fund transfer protocol though. Definitely that is issue of the bank of MtGox. Don't know what is like for their bank's internal transaction, at Japan Net BANK or Mizuho.


saigo
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January 19, 2014, 10:43:42 AM
 #2807

Not just USD that is issue it seems, I'm having an issue with two recent separate Yen withdrawal requests. Both 'confirmed' in Gox account history, but about two weeks passed and not hit my bank ( a japanese domestic bank ).

Two weeks is in line with my recent transaction for JPY. It is not in line with standard Japanese domestic fund transfer protocol though. Definitely that is issue of the bank of MtGox. Don't know what is like for their bank's internal transaction, at Japan Net BANK or Mizuho.




Hope it comes through this week then. Will repost to this thread if/when it does Smiley

Saigō Takamori : ( 1828 – 1877) was one of the most influential samurai in Japanese history. He has been dubbed the last true samurai.
cozytrade
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January 19, 2014, 10:46:23 AM
 #2808

How could they have run out of money? They should be making enough on their transaction charges to cover all their running costs and make a strong profit.

Their financial statement is undisclosed and no comments from their banks. Although they might make enough commission but they are dominated in BTC. We don't know the cash/BTC flow and if we assume the volume of withdrawal of fiat exceeds that of deposit, they could have sufficient BTC but insufficient fiat. Of course they could convert their principal BTC to fiat but it makes their situation worse.

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January 19, 2014, 01:45:32 PM
 #2809

American in Japan here. I'll post my experience/commentary in case it helps anyone.

Withdrawal on Sunday the 5th 2014 to a JNB acct here in Japan, for a six-figure yen amount. Mt.Gox said it was a holiday until the 6th but Japan Net Bank is only closed for three days, through the second. I can only assume they refer to other banks (if they were being honest). Of course I had heard about some problems with their withdrawals. Assuming they are honest, what they were saying made some sense. There is a long New Years Holiday here.

The withdrawal changed from pending to confirmed the next day. I thought this would mean a fast processing. JNB is supposed to be automatic. Anyway when Wednesday rolled around and nothing happened, I asked about it in an already open support request, and additionally created a NEW request about the withdrawal times.

Cut this all short, the new request was never responded to. The old request was responded to, but very shiftily. I was told at one point "it looks like your withdrawal went through" when it ... hadn't. In fact the status still read "confirmed" so that was bull on some level or another. That freaked me out. Why would they say that? I'm still puzzled over that because either the women DIDNT know that and said she did, or she was given wrong information, but either way my account status was misrepresented. At minimum, MtGox has RIDICULOUSLY sloppy customer service. It would be laughable except that I know many people here aren't laughing, because its not fun when your money is on the line.

I DID get my money. It read "processed" on the 15th and 7:35AM the next morning bam, in the account. My experience with JNB itself has been nothing but extremely snappy. Its essentially a purely-online bank account, very un-Japanese and by that standard, far less bureacratic and much more efficient. I suppose that goes without saying for a bank, but I guess when things concerning Mt. Gox are concerned I have gotten paranoid.

Looking back though, I was mostly paranoid because of reading stories from forum threads like this one. Though the wait was ridiculous (yes, I know there are many worse, but my situation is different than yours), I had to admit their excuse is semi-valid (regarding the holiday, there was also a three-day weekend the Sat-Mon following that). The wait time, the lack of detailed information regarding the withdrawal process, its all totally unacceptable for a company that wants to be legitimate.

Okay, now I'll inject my opinion even though this thread seems to have become a lot of insult-hurling. I'm not an expert in anything, but no need to call me a moron either.

Mt. Gox is sketchy. It seems reasonable to assume that Mark is willing to burn the whole thing to ground and walk away with some fat pockets. Given their trading volume and fees, they make a nice boatload of cash every day. They should have hired 40 more customer service reps. I have opened 6 support tickets and gotten only 4 different support rep names (if those are real). They supposedly have 4 floors of the Medio Bldg in Shinjuku, but I'm not sure about the number of employees. On the Tibanne website they are hiring coders but not CS reps. So, Mark may be a crap CEO sitting on a goldmine. I saw a couple of his tweets and I wasn't impressed.

Japan is a good place for a sketchy business to be. Don't get me wrong, if he breaks the law, they'll probably do something about it. But bitcoin is new, he hasn't been charged with anything yet, and Japan isn't the kind of place that changes laws very soon. Nor are they above exploitation for a profit; their involvement in Myanmar is public knowledge for instance. I could speculate that some of that Iranian oil that managed to find its way out of Iran during the heavy sanction last year may have had the help of bitcoins. Not that that's related to Mt Gox per se, but after the tsunami/Fukushima meltdown, I thought gas prices would soar since they shut off all nuclear power. Actually they were suspiciously low all of last year. Anyway thats just speculation really though I wouldn't put it past this country. I like Japan, I live here, but there is no Christian moralization here, and its been interesting for me to live here and every once in a while take notice of things like Myanmar. Or you could watch the documentary Girl Model. Or The Cove. I'm not sermonizing ya'll, just telling it like it is. If you wanna run a sketchy business that runs in the gray area of law, this is a damn good place to do it. Bitcoin isn't in the news here (okay I've seen a blurb or two, but compare that to say CNNMoney), no one knows about Mark, or really cares. In Japan, if you are into something sketchy like bitcoins and get burned, its your own fault for not being a regular salaryman "like the rest of us."

If you have pending USD withdrawals, I offer my heartfelt sympathy. I'd be raging. I was raging myself for a while there. But to be clear, I only made my withdrawal because I have a Japanese bank account. DONT TRY TO WITHDRAW FROM MTGOX IN USD. Wtf r u doin? They are processing USD withdrawals BY HAND. I don't know what an intl transfer is like in other countries. Here, its a pain in the ass, I suppose you could get to be a pro at filling those forms out but dudes, there is a nice long form to fill out, the guy at the bank has to fax (yes, fax!!!) a request to another office for an up to date exchange rate (because mtgox has to send jpy into usd for an intl tfer I dont know about where you live, just saying what happens here), then confirm it with you, then more bull, yada yada... I wouldn't be surprised if they have some dude who does this all day. And there may in fact be a daily limit like Mark suggested, wouldn't surprise me at all, this country adores and abides by meaningless rules. DONT WITHDRAW USD.

Lucky for me I live in the country this guy is accountable to, and apparently (according to a tweet of his) he doesn't speak Japanese, which means he is at a serious disadvantage to me, who does. I always wondered if this was a working number or not... http://www.tokyo-cci.or.jp/english/ibo/2353440.htm   Roll Eyes I get the feeling one of you may check up on that. Skype calls are cheap these days.

Anyhow I can register a complaint with the police in his district if I felt I had to, be enough of a pain in his balls (cops are nice here but he'd still be plagued by bureaucracy and suspicion, etc) that obviously my petty cash is better off with me than with him, as far as he is concerned. But honestly, if you really look at it rationally, here is a ridiculously profitable business run by a lucky schmuck who is NOT Zuckerberg. He is just a nerdy computer guy who really needs an HR and CS specialist. Someone who is a known figure, somewhat portly guy... I just don't see him running off with $100 million dollars. Why? Any country that will take him has shitty cuisine. Dude like that will miss himself some Krispy Kreme.

There are a host of other factors involved here. Americans sending in more than $2000 into a US bank account have a SAR report done by their bank. Its mandatory and the bank isn't allowed to tell you they did it, but they DO, gentlemen. Its to prevent money-laundering, which, if you are an honest person, is understandable. However I can only IMAGINE the accounting hell a company like Mt. Gox has become for any number of agencies in DOZENS of countries, haha. The SAR is done by your bank but I wouldn't be too surprised if the American govt has their fist in Mark's ass about all sorts of transactions going on.

tl;dr My domestic transfer was slow in coming but was processed in 8 business days. I wouldn't use Mt. Gox for withdrawals outside of Japan.
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January 19, 2014, 01:59:36 PM
 #2810

I was a bit unclear in that rant, I know. I myself don't know how I feel about Mark, whether he is good or bad. He still has my business, though.

Some questions:

What are people's experiences with other domestic transfers? What are the delays like for other banks? JNB?
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January 19, 2014, 02:35:17 PM
 #2811

Japan is a good place for a sketchy business to be. ...there is no Christian moralization here... In Japan, if you are into something sketchy like bitcoins and get burned, its your own fault for not being a regular salaryman "like the rest of us."

Interesting insights. In fact there are many fraud cases in Japan with or without accusation. They have FTC-like organisation and it works well but not working well for foreign-based companies unfortunately. They don't need religious discipline as they have common sense based on a single race and unique education. Once a foreigner is involved in case, it is not easy to deal with. Anyway, at the moment MtGOX is not breaching the law. Just they have bad service that is it.

It is also curious you mention that bitcoin is not that popular for most people in Japan. They might know negative side of deflating currency.
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January 19, 2014, 03:03:07 PM
 #2812


Please correct the current estimation: Also I'm trying myself for several currencies and banks.

EUR : 4-6 weeks (SEPA via Polish bank)
JPY :  8days (JNB) - 2 weeks (other Japanese banks)

SWIFT Wire transfer is in congestion.
USD : 3 month or more (shorter if you pay 5% extra)
GBP : 3 month or more (better use SEPA conversion)
CAD : 3 month or more (5% extra works as well?)

I realise they impose the limit and interval among requests, I'm not sure if they can handle multiple request across the methods(SEPA, JPY and SWIFT). Has anyone tried?


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January 20, 2014, 06:56:54 AM
 #2813

Interesting insights. In fact there are many fraud cases in Japan with or without accusation.

Olympus. This was a huge scandal- outside of Japan. Whenever I asked Japanese people about it, they didn't say much. It makes them uncomfortable. People prefer to not talk about that kind of stuff. I did not know that there was an Occupy movement here until an American told me, because despite the large numbers attending, the Japanese media (TOTALLY complicit ugh) never said a word about it.

How about staying on topic.
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January 20, 2014, 10:09:13 AM
 #2814

It looks like mtgox is having btc withdrawal issues again. My tx are double spends. How soon can I expect this to be resolved?
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January 20, 2014, 04:31:29 PM
 #2815

It looks like mtgox is having btc withdrawal issues again. My tx are double spends. How soon can I expect this to be resolved?
mostly its take 72 hours then sender can solve this issue I have many time and taking every time 72 hours

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January 20, 2014, 10:07:35 PM
 #2816

i cashed out about 10k USD in mid november which didn't arrive on my bank account yet.

today i sent another message to mtgox support, so let's see.

does anybody know whats the estimated withdrawal time for mid november cashouts ?
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January 20, 2014, 10:09:22 PM
 #2817

You will never get the money via SWIFT. There are people who have withdrawals from June 2013 that have not been paid.

June 2013.
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January 20, 2014, 10:40:15 PM
 #2818

Notice the pattern. First USD withdrawals slowed down and stopped. Then EUR.  Now JPY.  Some days, BTC. This just screams "out of money" and "getting close to the collapse".

Make sure that the Japanese police have the fingerprints of the Mt. Gox management on file.
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January 20, 2014, 11:00:59 PM
 #2819

Notice the pattern. First USD withdrawals slowed down and stopped. Then EUR.  Now JPY.  Some days, BTC. This just screams "out of money" and "getting close to the collapse".
At least for EUR, this is not true. SEPA withdrawals have always taken weeks, long before any sort of SWIFT problems surfaced.
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January 20, 2014, 11:02:49 PM
 #2820

Notice the pattern. First USD withdrawals slowed down and stopped. Then EUR.  Now JPY.  Some days, BTC. This just screams "out of money" and "getting close to the collapse".

Make sure that the Japanese police have the fingerprints of the Mt. Gox management on file.

Exactly, the fact they are claiming that the local JP banks are backlogged is horse shit.   JP banks were humming along fine the day after the holidays.   A few thousand domestic transfers does not bring the JP banking system to a grinding halt.   I'd be weary of keeping any large amounts of money/btc with them from this point out.
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