Why do you believe God exists?

[CacoeCrypto]

Something without consciousness cannot become aware of us.

Enter: Artificial Intelligence

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[Astargath]

Something without consciousness cannot become aware of us.

Enter: Artificial Intelligence

Artificial intelligence is different than a virtual world on your computer. A character in a videogame will never become aware of anything, ever.

[ATMD]

Artificial intelligence is different than a virtual world on your computer. A character in a videogame will never become aware of anything, ever.

Very true.

[af_newbie]

BTW, what 'truth' are you talking about?  The only truth I know is based on objective facts.

Actually the only truth you know is materialism. The objective facts are in dispute.

Materialists such as yourself are often herded into a form of rationalized self-annihilation that is deeply deeply tied to the corruption of modernity BADecker highlighted in his most recent post.

Here is an article that discusses this downward spiral. The portion on willful self-annihilation is particularly relevant.

Old Left-New Left... Modernity-Postmodernity - surface changes masking a constant deep motivation against God
http://charltonteaching.blogspot.com/2018/12/old-left-new-left-modernity.html?m=1

What is the 'truth' I am talking about?

For the purposes of this immediate and specific conversation it is the following.

Materialism is false.

Why are to misdirecting the conversation?  Who said anything about materialism?  I said objective facts.  It is not my problem that our reality is material.

The issue was religion and its interference with the progressive thought, its coercive powers etc.

Under the religious rule, we would not be able to have this conversation as I (and you depending on which religious rule we are talking about) would be hanged in the city square.

Be careful what you wish for.  Get off your Judeo-Christian horse.  It is no different than a Muslim buraq.

[ATMD]

BTW, what 'truth' are you talking about?  The only truth I know is based on objective facts.

Actually the only truth you know is materialism. The objective facts are in dispute.

Materialists such as yourself are often herded into a form of rationalized self-annihilation that is deeply deeply tied to the corruption of modernity BADecker highlighted in his most recent post.

Here is an article that discusses this downward spiral. The portion on willful self-annihilation is particularly relevant.

Old Left-New Left... Modernity-Postmodernity - surface changes masking a constant deep motivation against God
http://charltonteaching.blogspot.com/2018/12/old-left-new-left-modernity.html?m=1

What is the 'truth' I am talking about?

For the purposes of this immediate and specific conversation it is the following.

Materialism is false.

Why are to misdirecting the conversation?  Who said anything about materialism?  I said objective facts.  It is not my problem that our reality is material.

The issue was religion and its interference with the progressive thought, its coercive powers etc.

Under the religious rule, we would not be able to have this conversation as I (and you depending on which religious rule we are talking about) would be hanged in the city square.

Be careful what you wish for.  Get off your Judeo-Christian horse.  It is no different than a Muslim buraq.

In my humble opinion af_newbie, I think that our belief in God is not as important as our morality.
An atheist who acts under the moral principles of the Golden Rule ie. following the guidance of love, compassion, etc. creates a better world than a God-believer who kills others and acts cruelly.

[af_newbie]

BTW, what 'truth' are you talking about?  The only truth I know is based on objective facts.

Actually the only truth you know is materialism. The objective facts are in dispute.

Materialists such as yourself are often herded into a form of rationalized self-annihilation that is deeply deeply tied to the corruption of modernity BADecker highlighted in his most recent post.

Here is an article that discusses this downward spiral. The portion on willful self-annihilation is particularly relevant.

Old Left-New Left... Modernity-Postmodernity - surface changes masking a constant deep motivation against God
http://charltonteaching.blogspot.com/2018/12/old-left-new-left-modernity.html?m=1

What is the 'truth' I am talking about?

For the purposes of this immediate and specific conversation it is the following.

Materialism is false.

Why are to misdirecting the conversation?  Who said anything about materialism?  I said objective facts.  It is not my problem that our reality is material.

The issue was religion and its interference with the progressive thought, its coercive powers etc.

Under the religious rule, we would not be able to have this conversation as I (and you depending on which religious rule we are talking about) would be hanged in the city square.

Be careful what you wish for.  Get off your Judeo-Christian horse.  It is no different than a Muslim buraq.

In my humble opinion af_newbie, I think that our belief in God is not important as our morality.
An atheist who acts under the moral principles of the Golden Rule ie. following the guidance of love, compassion, etc. creates a better world than a God-believer who kills others and acts cruelly.

In the 21st century, we should not be using 6th century CE or 6th century BCE scriptures to justify our morality.  Our morality should come from the humanity that is within us.  We should burn ALL scriptures and move on as critical thinking human beings.

Religion is evil at its core.  A con business that was set up to exploit the gullible.  It does not matter which one, they are all the same.

We don't live in the Bronze Age or in the 6th century. The year is 2018.  Earth is not flat, it is billions of years old, nobody created the universe or life on Earth that we know of, life evolved and continues to evolve.  Anyone who denies these facts is delusional or simply ignorant.

[Yeahpro]

The concept of religion and spirituality is not a single unit.
Atheists are not people who don't believe in the supernatural, but they don't believe in YOUR idea of spirituality. Can them pagans, infidels, or what name other religions have for them.

[ATMD]

To burn all the scriptures would be to limit our freedom to believe whatever we want and read whatever we want though. It would bring us back to the dark age when all the books that were incompatible with the popular paradigm were burnt.

[BADecker]

^^^ The interesting thing about this is, the only reason why religious and science knowledge is as widespread as it is, is from the printing press. If we never had the printing press, the Bible would still be the great book of authority. It simply wouldn't have spread as far as it has by now. Remember, we have found 25,000 ancient copies or parts of copies of the handwritten New Testament from the early A.D. times. No other book is even close. Is it Aristotle writings that are around 900? Plato only has 4 or 5 early copies.

Here is an interesting thought. Why would God allow the printing press to come into existence to spread the Bible around the world? After all, the Bible is by far the most spread-around-the-world book even today. Here might be the reason, Matthew 24:22:

If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.

In other words, God let the printing press come into being so that the Bible would be spread faster. This is bringing the Bible to every corner of the world. We are nearing the completion of one of the last signs that shows that the end is near, that Jesus will return. Matthew 24:14:

And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

If we had no printing press, it would have taken so long for the Bible to be spread around the world, that people would finally fail in faith altogether. God shortened the time by letting the printing press be developed. Soon the whole world will have had the opportunity to find faith in God through the Bible. Then the end will come, Jesus will return. Could be any day, now. But will probably be withing the next 150 years for sure.

[Astargath]

^^^ The interesting thing about this is, the only reason why religious and science knowledge is as widespread as it is, is from the printing press. If we never had the printing press, the Bible would still be the great book of authority. It simply wouldn't have spread as far as it has by now. Remember, we have found 25,000 ancient copies or parts of copies of the handwritten New Testament from the early A.D. times. No other book is even close. Is it Aristotle writings that are around 900? Plato only has 4 or 5 early copies.

Here is an interesting thought. Why would God allow the printing press to come into existence to spread the Bible around the world? After all, the Bible is by far the most spread-around-the-world book even today. Here might be the reason, Matthew 24:22:

If those days had not been cut short, no one would survive, but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.

In other words, God let the printing press come into being so that the Bible would be spread faster. This is bringing the Bible to every corner of the world. We are nearing the completion of one of the last signs that shows that the end is near, that Jesus will return. Matthew 24:14:

And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached in the whole world as a testimony to all nations, and then the end will come.

If we had no printing press, it would have taken so long for the Bible to be spread around the world, that people would finally fail in faith altogether. God shortened the time by letting the printing press be developed. Soon the whole world will have had the opportunity to find faith in God through the Bible. Then the end will come, Jesus will return. Could be any day, now. But will probably be withing the next 150 years for sure.

Because it was totally necessary to waste thousands of years just to eventually allow people to invent the printing press. Your logic is horrible bro. Was there really no better way for god to spread some proof of his existence? Wasting thousands of years was the best he could do? Pathetic.

[af_newbie]

To burn all the scriptures would be to limit our freedom to believe whatever we want and read whatever we want though. It would bring us back to the dark age when all the books that were incompatible with the popular paradigm were burnt.

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

[ATMD]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

[Astargath]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

Yes, most christians are sensible people but they have to ignore big chunks of story in the bible. The bible talks about slavery and rape, even allows it, the bible even allows murder. They have to come up with excuses because they know the bible is wrong so they say things like: ''Oh but that's the old testament'' ''it doesn't count''

[ATMD]

I agree, most Christians are sensible people, and they read the bible, so the bible is not corrupting them.

[BADecker]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

Yes, most christians are sensible people but they have to ignore big chunks of story in the bible. The bible talks about slavery and rape, even allows it, the bible even allows murder. They have to come up with excuses because they know the bible is wrong so they say things like: ''Oh but that's the old testament'' ''it doesn't count''

You almost sound like you haven't heard about what American soldiers do around the world all the time. Or about all the court cases that promote all kinds of things. Or about all the laws in the States; like the ones in all the States that talk about marrying age for boys and girls: https://family.findlaw.com/marriage/state-by-state-marriage-age-of-consent-laws.html. And this stuff is going on today, in the USA. Not way back whenever, when the circumstances and customs of society were way different.

You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day. But they show what is best at the same time. You simply take it all out of context so that you don't have to understand.

You can't receive the best benefit when you leave God out of the equation, or out of your life.

[Astargath]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

Yes, most christians are sensible people but they have to ignore big chunks of story in the bible. The bible talks about slavery and rape, even allows it, the bible even allows murder. They have to come up with excuses because they know the bible is wrong so they say things like: ''Oh but that's the old testament'' ''it doesn't count''

You almost sound like you haven't heard about what American soldiers do around the world all the time. Or about all the court cases that promote all kinds of things. Or about all the laws in the States; like the ones in all the States that talk about marrying age for boys and girls: https://family.findlaw.com/marriage/state-by-state-marriage-age-of-consent-laws.html. And this stuff is going on today, in the USA. Not way back whenever, when the circumstances and customs of society were way different.

You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day. But they show what is best at the same time. You simply take it all out of context so that you don't have to understand.

You can't receive the best benefit when you leave God out of the equation, or out of your life.

''You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day'' Tell that to the slaves and people murdered for picking up sticks on the sabbath lol. I'm sure they would disagree with you.

[BADecker]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

Yes, most christians are sensible people but they have to ignore big chunks of story in the bible. The bible talks about slavery and rape, even allows it, the bible even allows murder. They have to come up with excuses because they know the bible is wrong so they say things like: ''Oh but that's the old testament'' ''it doesn't count''

You almost sound like you haven't heard about what American soldiers do around the world all the time. Or about all the court cases that promote all kinds of things. Or about all the laws in the States; like the ones in all the States that talk about marrying age for boys and girls: https://family.findlaw.com/marriage/state-by-state-marriage-age-of-consent-laws.html. And this stuff is going on today, in the USA. Not way back whenever, when the circumstances and customs of society were way different.

You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day. But they show what is best at the same time. You simply take it all out of context so that you don't have to understand.

You can't receive the best benefit when you leave God out of the equation, or out of your life.

''You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day'' Tell that to the slaves and people murdered for picking up sticks on the sabbath lol. I'm sure they would disagree with you.

Actually, they wouldn't. Why? Because the O.T. teaching made life easier on them.

[Astargath]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

Yes, most christians are sensible people but they have to ignore big chunks of story in the bible. The bible talks about slavery and rape, even allows it, the bible even allows murder. They have to come up with excuses because they know the bible is wrong so they say things like: ''Oh but that's the old testament'' ''it doesn't count''

You almost sound like you haven't heard about what American soldiers do around the world all the time. Or about all the court cases that promote all kinds of things. Or about all the laws in the States; like the ones in all the States that talk about marrying age for boys and girls: https://family.findlaw.com/marriage/state-by-state-marriage-age-of-consent-laws.html. And this stuff is going on today, in the USA. Not way back whenever, when the circumstances and customs of society were way different.

You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day. But they show what is best at the same time. You simply take it all out of context so that you don't have to understand.

You can't receive the best benefit when you leave God out of the equation, or out of your life.

''You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day'' Tell that to the slaves and people murdered for picking up sticks on the sabbath lol. I'm sure they would disagree with you.

Actually, they wouldn't. Why? Because the O.T. teaching made life easier on them.

Someone that is dead cannot have a better life, badecker, study some biology. People murdered definitely did not have an easier life, they had an easier death in any case.

[BADecker]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

Yes, most christians are sensible people but they have to ignore big chunks of story in the bible. The bible talks about slavery and rape, even allows it, the bible even allows murder. They have to come up with excuses because they know the bible is wrong so they say things like: ''Oh but that's the old testament'' ''it doesn't count''

You almost sound like you haven't heard about what American soldiers do around the world all the time. Or about all the court cases that promote all kinds of things. Or about all the laws in the States; like the ones in all the States that talk about marrying age for boys and girls: https://family.findlaw.com/marriage/state-by-state-marriage-age-of-consent-laws.html. And this stuff is going on today, in the USA. Not way back whenever, when the circumstances and customs of society were way different.

You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day. But they show what is best at the same time. You simply take it all out of context so that you don't have to understand.

You can't receive the best benefit when you leave God out of the equation, or out of your life.

''You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day'' Tell that to the slaves and people murdered for picking up sticks on the sabbath lol. I'm sure they would disagree with you.

Actually, they wouldn't. Why? Because the O.T. teaching made life easier on them.

Someone that is dead cannot have a better life, badecker, study some biology. People murdered definitely did not have an easier life, they had an easier death in any case.

That's why the Bible says, "Thou shalt not kill." The word "kill" really means "murder" in modern English. "Kill" is from the old English. So, why are you attempting to act so ignorantly?

[Astargath]

True, but sometimes you need to ban ideologies (communism, socialism, Nazism, fascism, religion) that cause multi-generational societal harm.

Slavery is a bad idea.  So is the Bible.

It does not matter how many times you raped, if you only raped once, you are a rapist.

I am sure the majority of Christians and people from several religious doctrines are against slavery and rape.

Yes, most christians are sensible people but they have to ignore big chunks of story in the bible. The bible talks about slavery and rape, even allows it, the bible even allows murder. They have to come up with excuses because they know the bible is wrong so they say things like: ''Oh but that's the old testament'' ''it doesn't count''

You almost sound like you haven't heard about what American soldiers do around the world all the time. Or about all the court cases that promote all kinds of things. Or about all the laws in the States; like the ones in all the States that talk about marrying age for boys and girls: https://family.findlaw.com/marriage/state-by-state-marriage-age-of-consent-laws.html. And this stuff is going on today, in the USA. Not way back whenever, when the circumstances and customs of society were way different.

You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day. But they show what is best at the same time. You simply take it all out of context so that you don't have to understand.

You can't receive the best benefit when you leave God out of the equation, or out of your life.

''You talk so silly. The general structure of the O.T. was for the best benefit of the people of that day'' Tell that to the slaves and people murdered for picking up sticks on the sabbath lol. I'm sure they would disagree with you.

Actually, they wouldn't. Why? Because the O.T. teaching made life easier on them.

Someone that is dead cannot have a better life, badecker, study some biology. People murdered definitely did not have an easier life, they had an easier death in any case.

That's why the Bible says, "Thou shalt not kill." The word "kill" really means "murder" in modern English. "Kill" is from the old English. So, why are you attempting to act so ignorantly?

It also says god ordered people to kill other people because they were doing things on the sabbath, why are you attempting to ignore this?