[PRE-ANN] Stone - DAG Data-Structured Private Cryptocurrency

[voteformeg]

i like the idea and maybe you are that 1 of 1000 that can work with a little money and make the project a succes , there are , but i 'll wait and read this thread for some more days befor making a donation
 good luck

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[xibeijan]

RaiBlocks can only avoid the Sybil attack by balance-weighting the POS mechanism.  This cannot be done if the balances are hidden using ZKsnarks.  How do you propose to solve this?

One possible solution is having to reveal balance to participate in PoS yourself, or to use snarks to delegate to a chosen voter (which can reveal the sum he'd been delegated but not from which account it came).

Would be nice to let the dev answer, since he's the one raising donations.

[xibeijan]

I donated because the fundamentals are good. A privacy-based DAG coin called Stone. There is really a lot of risks donating at this point (only an idea, anonymous dev, single small thread) so 30% is commensurate in my opinion. Of course, all that matters now is development and product release. There are hundreds of similar threads that have never gone anywhere. Good luck dev! You have my support.

Yes, I also agree 30% is commensurate.  If the developer can elaborate a bit more and show his technical knowledge, then there could be quite a lot of donations sent.

[Malek17]

I donated because the fundamentals are good. A privacy-based DAG coin called Stone. There is really a lot of risks donating at this point (only an idea, anonymous dev, single small thread) so 30% is commensurate in my opinion. Of course, all that matters now is development and product release. There are hundreds of similar threads that have never gone anywhere. Good luck dev! You have my support.

Yes, I also agree 30% is commensurate.  If the developer can elaborate a bit more and show his technical knowledge, then there could be quite a lot of donations sent.

donation for what? anybody can claim he will make new perfect coin and ask for donations then disappear, byteball is a DAG currency made by a genius Dev he never asked for any donations. let have this stone ready then hold 2% of the coin t the Dev same as in Byteball,you can't ask for donation and you have nothing Physically ready yet this called Scam. Scammers are good making the project look perfect but 0% at providing the real project so if you really going to provide stop asking for donations now,provide something first then ask

[cryptohunter]

Donations should use escrow or could be a scam.

This thread reminds me of ZETH actually -

Without escrow 99% will turn out a scam here.

[ZEROtoken]

Donations should use escrow or could be a scam.

This thread reminds me of ZETH actually -

Without escrow 99% will turn out a scam here.

Agreed 100%

[xibeijan]

I don't really care if there's escrow or not.  What I do care about is if dev could spare some time to answer questions and give more technical discussion.

[sotisoti]

Donations should use escrow or could be a scam.

This thread reminds me of ZETH actually -

Without escrow 99% will turn out a scam here.

Yes, I almost fall for ZETH

[Jester.]

RaiBlocks can only avoid the Sybil attack by balance-weighting the POS mechanism.  This cannot be done if the balances are hidden using ZKsnarks.  How do you propose to solve this?

One possible solution is having to reveal balance to participate in PoS yourself, or to use snarks to delegate to a chosen voter (which can reveal the sum he'd been delegated but not from which account it came).

Ah now someone is thinking 

I'm in on this project, reminds me of Elastic, developer raised donations and it turned out to do a x500. High risk high reward.

[Malek17]

I don't really care if there's escrow or not.  What I do care about is if dev could spare some time to answer questions and give more technical discussion.

I am going to create Zbitcoin it will be the perfect coin it’s a combination between bitcoin ether an stone , send some donation and I promise it will be ready as soon as possible will give 50% to donators

[JamesMangan]

Donations should use escrow or could be a scam.

This thread reminds me of ZETH actually -

Without escrow 99% will turn out a scam here.

hahah I remember zeth

[BitMonkey]

RaiBlocks can only avoid the Sybil attack by balance-weighting the POS mechanism.  This cannot be done if the balances are hidden using ZKsnarks.  How do you propose to solve this?

One possible solution is having to reveal balance to participate in PoS yourself, or to use snarks to delegate to a chosen voter (which can reveal the sum he'd been delegated but not from which account it came).

Ah now someone is thinking 

I'm in on this project, reminds me of Elastic, developer raised donations and it turned out to do a x500. High risk high reward.

Yeah, it's not hard to make Rai private if you're willing to lose some of it benefits, mainly the transaction speed. You can't really fit zk-snarks-based private transfers in a single UDP packet, for one. Confirmation times would be worse too. Maybe you'll even have to establish some rewarded masternodes to mangle the transactions and connections.

[xibeijan]

Yeah ZK snark costs something like 30-120sec of 100% CPU before sending.  That will definitely hit the 7,000 txs/sec claim in this post hard.

[ChuckSRQ]

Do 100 Million Supply.

30% for those who donate.

Establish Masternodes.

Establish some benchmark for tithing events. Every X days or transactions or something. You slow decrease the supply reward by 10% or 20%. 

If you do masternodes and have a supply like this that lasts decades. I'll donate.

[Everipedia]

Thanks for your input, the name Stone was derived from RaiStones.

Not all Stones sink  

I think you should go for something with more diffientiation, like RaiSnarks or RAZK.  Orrrr just something unrelated like Nectar?

A fair amount of how XRB works depends on being able to see balances of accounts and their respective chains.  How can delegates vote on whether a anonymous transfer was valid if they cannot see the amounts?

Please let the developer proposing this project answer.

That's correct, however they only realistically need to communicate to each other, not the network as a whole, i will make this work.

RaiBlocks can only avoid the Sybil attack by balance-weighting the POS mechanism.  This cannot be done if the balances are hidden using ZKsnarks.  How do you propose to solve this?

This was literally my first thought as  well. ZK sounds great with a DAG based coin, but there's no way to resolve conflicts for double spends. If he can solve that issue, I would guess that the project would look much less like RaiBlocks and much more like a unique DAG coin that hasn't been seen. You can't use RaiBlock's consensus method if all transactions are private. There has to be a different method that the network reaches consensus on a balance change.

I'm willing to give the OP benefit of the doubt, but would be nice if he at least published a paper or explanation on how this will be built.

[BitMonkey]

Thanks for your input, the name Stone was derived from RaiStones.

Not all Stones sink  

I think you should go for something with more diffientiation, like RaiSnarks or RAZK.  Orrrr just something unrelated like Nectar?

A fair amount of how XRB works depends on being able to see balances of accounts and their respective chains.  How can delegates vote on whether a anonymous transfer was valid if they cannot see the amounts?

Please let the developer proposing this project answer.

That's correct, however they only realistically need to communicate to each other, not the network as a whole, i will make this work.

RaiBlocks can only avoid the Sybil attack by balance-weighting the POS mechanism.  This cannot be done if the balances are hidden using ZKsnarks.  How do you propose to solve this?

This was literally my first thought as  well. ZK sounds great with a DAG based coin, but there's no way to resolve conflicts for double spends. If he can solve that issue, I would guess that the project would look much less like RaiBlocks and much more like a unique DAG coin that hasn't been seen. You can't use RaiBlock's consensus method if all transactions are private. There has to be a different method that the network reaches consensus on a balance change.

I'm willing to give the OP benefit of the doubt, but would be nice if he at least published a paper or explanation on how this will be built.

What's wrong with two more or less obvious possible solutions:
a) zk delegation voting
b) haing transparent and private parts of balance and only being able to participate in consesus with transparent part?
Both of them are big deviation from Rai but more in spirit than in consensus method.

[pinball_wizard]

This is really an ambitious project, wish all the best for you and I'll will check the post for develop. By the way are there some timings in your mind for a roadmap?

[xibeijan]

Thanks for your input, the name Stone was derived from RaiStones.

Not all Stones sink  

I think you should go for something with more diffientiation, like RaiSnarks or RAZK.  Orrrr just something unrelated like Nectar?

A fair amount of how XRB works depends on being able to see balances of accounts and their respective chains.  How can delegates vote on whether a anonymous transfer was valid if they cannot see the amounts?

Please let the developer proposing this project answer.

That's correct, however they only realistically need to communicate to each other, not the network as a whole, i will make this work.

RaiBlocks can only avoid the Sybil attack by balance-weighting the POS mechanism.  This cannot be done if the balances are hidden using ZKsnarks.  How do you propose to solve this?

This was literally my first thought as  well. ZK sounds great with a DAG based coin, but there's no way to resolve conflicts for double spends. If he can solve that issue, I would guess that the project would look much less like RaiBlocks and much more like a unique DAG coin that hasn't been seen. You can't use RaiBlock's consensus method if all transactions are private. There has to be a different method that the network reaches consensus on a balance change.

I'm willing to give the OP benefit of the doubt, but would be nice if he at least published a paper or explanation on how this will be built.

What's wrong with two more or less obvious possible solutions:
a) zk delegation voting
b) haing transparent and private parts of balance and only being able to participate in consesus with transparent part?
Both of them are big deviation from Rai but more in spirit than in consensus method.

Whats wrong with dev answering any questions on his own?

[BitMonkey]

Thanks for your input, the name Stone was derived from RaiStones.

Not all Stones sink  

I think you should go for something with more diffientiation, like RaiSnarks or RAZK.  Orrrr just something unrelated like Nectar?

A fair amount of how XRB works depends on being able to see balances of accounts and their respective chains.  How can delegates vote on whether a anonymous transfer was valid if they cannot see the amounts?

Please let the developer proposing this project answer.

That's correct, however they only realistically need to communicate to each other, not the network as a whole, i will make this work.

RaiBlocks can only avoid the Sybil attack by balance-weighting the POS mechanism.  This cannot be done if the balances are hidden using ZKsnarks.  How do you propose to solve this?

This was literally my first thought as  well. ZK sounds great with a DAG based coin, but there's no way to resolve conflicts for double spends. If he can solve that issue, I would guess that the project would look much less like RaiBlocks and much more like a unique DAG coin that hasn't been seen. You can't use RaiBlock's consensus method if all transactions are private. There has to be a different method that the network reaches consensus on a balance change.

I'm willing to give the OP benefit of the doubt, but would be nice if he at least published a paper or explanation on how this will be built.

What's wrong with two more or less obvious possible solutions:
a) zk delegation voting
b) haing transparent and private parts of balance and only being able to participate in consesus with transparent part?
Both of them are big deviation from Rai but more in spirit than in consensus method.

Whats wrong with dev answering any questions on his own?

I'd like to hear from dev too; it's just there's a number of people who seems to know their tech, I'd like to hear their opinions too. Not on this project but on how it can be done at all.

[zuzuca]

I've been meaning to learn more about DAG protocols and also zkSNARKs, so now I can do both in one place  . Gonna be watching this one.

oo this is gonna be very very interesting. i love the dag development since byteball. i think as a technology is supperior to ethereum.