[NLG] The great Gulden thread

[BioMike]

Follow up from thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1495990.0

I have decided I am going to get this thread locked or deleted because of the false information and accusations against Rijk and the Gulden development team. I originally created this thread to talk about gulden as a investment but it has degenerated into something rather ugly. Please refrain from replying to this thread.

As messy as it looks, I don't agree with you. This thread just shows nicely the psychology around Gulden, which is key in answering the question you set in the first post. I'm not sure to what things you point to about false information, because that's not the same as what some people don't want to hear, Accusations against Rijk and the Gulden team... well, they are grown up enough to defend themselves, no need to nanny them. Did they ask you to intervene, because their egos couldn't stand the free discussion we're having here?

If they would come here and answer questions that people have, we could maybe have a nice conversation here (I think we are all interested in some more in-depth information here). Yet the team decides to hide in their ivory tower because it seems to be afraid for critique.

If this thread closes, another one will start. I'm sure of that.

<edit>I just did that.</edit>

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[BioMike]

This is a non-moderated thread, and I intend to keep it that way. People are free to voice their own opinions and facts, always check those facts yourself.


If you're looking for the thread from the Gulden developers, you can find it here: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1577392


More will follow here, when I see fit.

[leea-1334]

I agree with OP. I fully believe in openness at whatever the cost. Because if someone like me can read all of that and somehow still believe in Gulden, then it means the project has people who actually believe in it. I think for an alt like Gulden to have survived for so long and even rise somehow also shows that small but dedicated teams still can make a lot happen. I may never one day be able to use Gulden the way I would like to (until I access the markets in Europe). But that is a hope I like to keep.

All my coins I intend to hold and use properly. Gulden has what so many alts don't. A community that actually uses it!

[BioMike]

I agree with OP. I fully believe in openness at whatever the cost. Because if someone like me can read all of that and somehow still believe in Gulden, then it means the project has people who actually believe in it. I think for an alt like Gulden to have survived for so long and even rise somehow also shows that small but dedicated teams still can make a lot happen. I may never one day be able to use Gulden the way I would like to (until I access the markets in Europe). But that is a hope I like to keep.

All my coins I intend to hold and use properly. Gulden has what so many alts don't. A community that actually uses it!

I've always been open on that Gulden itself is a good thing. I just don't agree with the current course of the dev team. I have peace with that.

[RichPissman]

Cheers for this new thread!

WE ARE THE RESISTANCE!

[metare]

Thanks to BioMike for opening the new thread.
An openly accessible platform is essential for discussing both positive and negative news.
An approach such as slack, which is more reminiscent of 1984, does not necessarily promote confidence in the product. This is why I definitely prefer this platform here.

[Luuk]

Thanks to BioMike for opening the new thread.
An openly accessible platform is essential for discussing both positive and negative news.
An approach such as slack, which is more reminiscent of 1984, does not necessarily promote confidence in the product. This is why I definitely prefer this platform here.

I don't know Rijk as a person but is he more extreme left or extreme right when it comes to censorship and his viewpoints?

[Coin700018]

I already opened a new one, to continue: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3116357.0

 
For the ones think Gulden is not so great atm can jump to https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=3116386.0 

[BioMike]

Thanks to BioMike for opening the new thread.
An openly accessible platform is essential for discussing both positive and negative news.
An approach such as slack, which is more reminiscent of 1984, does not necessarily promote confidence in the product. This is why I definitely prefer this platform here.

I don't know Rijk as a person but is he more extreme left or extreme right when it comes to censorship and his viewpoints?

Left / right are more economic terms, which he does not give any insight to (and personally, I don't care for that in a crypto). The crypto community was in the past mostly left oriented (in the past, Gulden had an UBI (Universal Basic Income) initiative in the Netherlands), but this has shifted in the years.

[Reallist]

Thanks to BioMike for opening the new thread.
An openly accessible platform is essential for discussing both positive and negative news.
An approach such as slack, which is more reminiscent of 1984, does not necessarily promote confidence in the product. This is why I definitely prefer this platform here.

I don't know Rijk as a person but is he more extreme left or extreme right when it comes to censorship and his viewpoints?

Left / right are more economic terms, which he does not give any insight to (and personally, I don't care for that in a crypto). The crypto community was in the past mostly left oriented (in the past, Gulden had an UBI (Universal Basic Income) initiative in the Netherlands), but this has shifted in the years.

With the rise of nationalism in Europe a lot of people would like a crypto like Gulden that is more right leaning, Rijk comes across as a more centrist/right leaning individual like Geert Wilders.

[metare]

Thanks to BioMike for opening the new thread.
An openly accessible platform is essential for discussing both positive and negative news.
An approach such as slack, which is more reminiscent of 1984, does not necessarily promote confidence in the product. This is why I definitely prefer this platform here.

I don't know Rijk as a person but is he more extreme left or extreme right when it comes to censorship and his viewpoints?

I don't know him either, but appart from the official updates I didn't find open communication or discussions of the Gulden dev-team.
I understand that one wants to focus effort on the development rather than communications but as an open-source project IMHO you shouldn't hide behind closed curtains.
While considering to join the slack channel I saw too many posts about getting banned for a critical point of view and not one who called those out to be false. That's why I got the impression of a 1984 like state in there.

I rather have this thread where you can post your point of view freely if the only cost is that we also see some sarcasm, trolling and sometimes rage-comments. This way it's way more likely that one can build an opinion compared to if there's only whitewashed progaganda around.

[BioMike]

I understand that one wants to focus effort on the development rather than communications but as an open-source project IMHO you shouldn't hide behind closed curtains.

As some of the readers here know, I co-develop a coin as well. Our communication is also lacking, but if someone has valid questions I'm always making a few minutes free to answer them. It's not that difficult.

[DashNLG]

I agree with OP. I fully believe in openness at whatever the cost. Because if someone like me can read all of that and somehow still believe in Gulden, then it means the project has people who actually believe in it. I think for an alt like Gulden to have survived for so long and even rise somehow also shows that small but dedicated teams still can make a lot happen. I may never one day be able to use Gulden the way I would like to (until I access the markets in Europe). But that is a hope I like to keep.

All my coins I intend to hold and use properly. Gulden has what so many alts don't. A community that actually uses it!

I've always been open on that Gulden itself is a good thing. I just don't agree with the current course of the dev team. I have peace with that.

Thanks for opening up a new thread. What course do you think the dev team should take?

[FantoNas]

Follow up from thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1495990.0

I have decided I am going to get this thread locked or deleted because of the false information and accusations against Rijk and the Gulden development team. I originally created this thread to talk about gulden as a investment but it has degenerated into something rather ugly. Please refrain from replying to this thread.

As messy as it looks, I don't agree with you. This thread just shows nicely the psychology around Gulden, which is key in answering the question you set in the first post. I'm not sure to what things you point to about false information, because that's not the same as what some people don't want to hear, Accusations against Rijk and the Gulden team... well, they are grown up enough to defend themselves, no need to nanny them. Did they ask you to intervene, because their egos couldn't stand the free discussion we're having here?

If they would come here and answer questions that people have, we could maybe have a nice conversation here (I think we are all interested in some more in-depth information here). Yet the team decides to hide in their ivory tower because it seems to be afraid for critique.

If this thread closes, another one will start. I'm sure of that.

<edit>I just did that.</edit>

Thanks Biomike for this new thread.
What a stupid move , to close the other one. For a lot of people G is not a good investment because of Rijk , so I do not see any problem to criticize him.

Do you think that TwoRightsMakeARight has good pressure (btc/ltc/g) or bad pressure from Rijk to close the other thread ?

[Reallist]

Follow up from thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=1495990.0

I have decided I am going to get this thread locked or deleted because of the false information and accusations against Rijk and the Gulden development team. I originally created this thread to talk about gulden as a investment but it has degenerated into something rather ugly. Please refrain from replying to this thread.

As messy as it looks, I don't agree with you. This thread just shows nicely the psychology around Gulden, which is key in answering the question you set in the first post. I'm not sure to what things you point to about false information, because that's not the same as what some people don't want to hear, Accusations against Rijk and the Gulden team... well, they are grown up enough to defend themselves, no need to nanny them. Did they ask you to intervene, because their egos couldn't stand the free discussion we're having here?

If they would come here and answer questions that people have, we could maybe have a nice conversation here (I think we are all interested in some more in-depth information here). Yet the team decides to hide in their ivory tower because it seems to be afraid for critique.

If this thread closes, another one will start. I'm sure of that.

<edit>I just did that.</edit>

Thanks Biomike for this new thread.
What a stupid move , to close the other one. For a lot of people G is not a good investment because of Rijk , so I do not see any problem to criticize him.

Do you think that TwoRightsMakeARight has good pressure (btc/ltc/g) or bad pressure from Rijk to close the other thread ?

It's possible he thought that thread was the reason for the price being crushed lately. Protecting his own investment rather then anything to do with Geert Wilders.

[RichPissman]

Thanks Biomike for this new thread.
What a stupid move , to close the other one. For a lot of people G is not a good investment because of Rijk , so I do not see any problem to criticize him.

Do you think that TwoRightsMakeARight has good pressure (btc/ltc/g) or bad pressure from Rijk to close the other thread ?

He never intended to truly ask a question. It was always about drawing attention towards Gulden. And he succeeded massively I might add! It was only when he saw the arguments against became more and more clear and people stopped buying into the lies from the Gulden fanboys he decided to close the thread.

[metare]

I agree with our Dutch Jesus on that. If you go through all TwoRightsMakeARight's posts (which are not many), they are all purely positive about Gulden.
Also who asks such a question and doesn't engage in the discussions that follow?

If he really closed the thread because he feared that the ongoing discussions would hurt the NLG price, I would call that pretty naive. The two big things pushing down the price were the overall price drop in crypto market and the "watch out for some sneak previews to follow!"

I hope RichPissman doesn't mind being labelled Dutch Jesus  

[BigDikBTC]

Thanks Biomike for this new thread.
What a stupid move , to close the other one. For a lot of people G is not a good investment because of Rijk , so I do not see any problem to criticize him.

Do you think that TwoRightsMakeARight has good pressure (btc/ltc/g) or bad pressure from Rijk to close the other thread ?

He never intended to truly ask a question. It was always about drawing attention towards Gulden. And he succeeded massively I might add! It was only when he saw the arguments against became more and more clear and people stopped buying into the lies from the Gulden fanboys he decided to close the thread.

Rijk is one slow ass developer. He should focus on his work before banning slackers.

[FantoNas]

from the official slack :

Job Westerduin [4 h 58]
Goed punt, @Rijk
Hebben we al een forum die alleen over Gulden en de project ervan ?


Rijk [4 h 59]
Geen idee?
Zal ik in ieder geval nooit opzetten, gegarandeerde rotzooi,
Fora zijn podia voor de gekkies uit de samenleving die alleen op internet hun ei kwijt kunnen.
Of: trolls

google translate for the english version :

Job Westerduin [4 h 58]
Good point, @Rijk
Do we already have a forum that only deals with Gulden and its project?

Empire (Rijk) [4 h 59]
No idea?
In any case, I will never set up, guaranteed mess,

Forums are stages for the madmen from society who can only get their eggs on the internet.
Or: trolls

Ho no forum because it's only for troll and madmen !

[metare]

  Am I a madman, a troll or both now? This leads to existential crisis