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Author Topic: [ANN] TagCoin - Multi Token Wallet and Trading Platform  (Read 301243 times)
ny2cafuse
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March 17, 2014, 07:11:46 PM
 #2561

and community -> us!

Exactly, correct.  We are the missing part of the equation right now.  We need more people to mine- simple as that.  But that whole getting people to mine is a catch 22.

-Fuse

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Don007
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March 17, 2014, 07:50:20 PM
 #2562

and community -> us!

Exactly, correct.  We are the missing part of the equation right now.  We need more people to mine- simple as that.  But that whole getting people to mine is a catch 22.

-Fuse

I'm going to join Tagmining.com now. We really need more hashrate indeed. An average of more than 5 hours per round is quite big ;\.


{Curently quite inactive as I'm really busy in my private life. I will get back soon!}

-> Your line here during my inactivity? Feel free to PM <-
vesperwillow
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March 17, 2014, 08:20:27 PM
 #2563

Tagmining is the best pool, mainly because it has the best operator anywhere.

I'd love to mine tag lol. It was fun in the past.

ny2cafuse
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March 17, 2014, 09:32:38 PM
 #2564

Tagmining is the best pool, mainly because it has the best operator anywhere.

I'd love to mine tag lol. It was fun in the past.

Aww, shucks...   Grin


I agree though that if you aren't mining or buying, you're missing a short term opportunity to make so good coin.

-Fuse

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lovecraftian
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March 17, 2014, 09:49:57 PM
Last edit: March 17, 2014, 10:06:01 PM by lovecraftian
 #2565

My subjective viewpoint (I'm not claiming objectivity):

The coins viewed as valuable haven't had major issues. Litecoin in fact is going up despite bitcoin going down. Many altcoins have dropped, but only a few have been truly snowballing, tag is one of them. This is based on some charts and algo's run on the stats comparing it over the past few months.

Litecoin's (very) recent rise is due to adoption by large Chinese exchanges, it's not a good example. The snowballing of tag is just due to a thin market and lots of negativity on the only major forum for it  .. this thread!

Objective viewpoint:
* Still waiting to hear about all these business advancements
* Only public movement on the web end have been broken games

Small businesses generally are incapable of rapidly producing quality software products because they literally do not have the resources (I know I worked for a small specialist software house for 7 years). The game they withdrew is a case in point. They tested it, it seemed to be ok, they released it and it didn't shape up .. what do you do at this point, pretend that it works? (been there too) The better thing to do is pull it and fix it. This is completely normal. As you say "Time will tell." Maybe you should wait a while?

* Public mining hashrate is not indicative of being popular
* Plenty of circumstancial evidence to show the 'wall of orphan blocks' was nefarious, and not a normal part of mining (especially in light of recent admittance of various attacks, and whitepapers on attacks on altcoins)

Low mining hashrate is a product of the debate about orphans that transpired in this thread, there seemed to be some confusion as to what the exact problem was with some people blaming Mark and his team but essentially these was no adequate conclusion.  In fact, as you say, the evidence about orphan blocks was circumstancial. Links to your "admittance of various attacks" (careful with the English language there .. it's fragile) and "whitepapers on attacks on altcoins" would be nice.

* Very clearly an Asian coin, not a general market coin

Not really sure what "asian vs general market coin" even means. So Mark's trying to develop a market in the Phillipines and SE Asia, so that means he has to talk to real businesses in the real world (which takes time) rather than hype his coin on reddit and this webforum so that he that he can offload his premine once the coin's listed on cryptsy. I'm sorry, his strategy is a billlion times more ethical than the majority of cynical pump 'n dumps on this forum. And the weird thing is I know that you think the same, you are clearly a major player here, so I don't understand the negativity.

Markets go up and down, giving the coin a hard time with opinion masquerading as "facts" is not going to help the up bit.

edit : the forum's post editor doesn't seem to like the site's own URL  .. weird
ny2cafuse
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March 17, 2014, 10:18:34 PM
 #2566

* Public mining hashrate is not indicative of being popular
* Plenty of circumstancial evidence to show the 'wall of orphan blocks' was nefarious, and not a normal part of mining (especially in light of recent admittance of various attacks, and whitepapers on attacks on altcoins)

Low mining hashrate is a product of the debate about orphans that transpired in this thread, there seemed to be some confusion as to what the exact problem was with some people blaming Mark and his team but essentially these was no adequate conclusion.  In fact, as you say, the evidence about orphan blocks was circumstancial. Links to your "admittance of various attacks" (careful with the English language there .. it's fragile) and "whitepapers on attacks on altcoins" would be nice.


<tinfoil hat>

You can go back and read all the posts where I mention this, but...

I believe there was direct network node manipulation, specifically targeting pools using time-warp attacks to drive another fork, then drop the fork on a node network, essentially wiping out the blocks with blocks that the attacker mines on a separate chain.  The attack info can be read about here:

http://culubas.blogspot.com/2011/05/timejacking-bitcoin_802.html

If you search for "time-warp" or "time-travel" attacks in this forum, or others, you will find a lot of info pertaining to coins with 1 block difficulty retargeting, something that was introduced a month or so before the major orphan problems, and all have a common element of being done by a user with a considerable amount of hashpower who publicly announces that he is going to "test the chain" after implementation of Kimito's Gravity Well or other basic 1 block retargeting algorithms.  I'm not saying this person is behind what happened to TAG, but it's a possibility considering he showed a lot of interest in the coin when the first major fork happened.

Now while his involvement is theoretically probable(and most certainly genius), I think the main source of the "attacks" were coming out of China.  The volume of trade coming out of China, specifically on BTC38, is substantial.  So either the attacker is in China, or has a way to move coins and money through the Chinese exchanges.

</tinfoil hat>

-Fuse

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vesperwillow
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March 18, 2014, 12:09:53 AM
 #2567

I suppose I should've encapsulated my message with "to those who understand what I'm talking about", as my original responses were to ny2cafuse who is sortof on the understanding of this all. I thought it was evident since I quoted him and wasn't intending to spread fear.

Litecoin's (very) recent rise is due to adoption by large Chinese exchanges, it's not a good example. The snowballing of tag is just due to a thin market and lots of negativity on the only major forum for it  .. this thread!

The market isn't thin. The chinese market is heavy. The well-known market (edit: Cryptsy, ex) is dying because it's not profitable for miners in general as it's being eaten away by ASIC farms in China and undersold on places like BTC38. If the demand ever picks up, it may increase in price. Mark's standpoint has always been he doesn't care about the price of the coin, it's up to the end users to determine price--as such, they are.

Also, litecoin has been on Chinese markets before. I'm talking about its stability lately versus other coins. Only a handful of coins have maintained proportional price stability next to BTC despite market shifts, and LTC is one of them.

Small businesses generally are incapable of rapidly producing quality software products because they literally do not have the resources (I know I worked for a small specialist software house for 7 years). The game they withdrew is a case in point. They tested it, it seemed to be ok, they released it and it didn't shape up .. what do you do at this point, pretend that it works? (been there too) The better thing to do is pull it and fix it. This is completely normal. As you say "Time will tell." Maybe you should wait a while?

I was referring to Mark's business which, a while ago, promised huge updates and superb news and announcements, but so far has only provided some broken beta games. Not knocking his efforts, and I have no doubt they have a lot under wraps.

Low mining hashrate is a product of the debate about orphans that transpired in this thread, there seemed to be some confusion as to what the exact problem was with some people blaming Mark and his team but essentially these was no adequate conclusion.  In fact, as you say, the evidence about orphan blocks was circumstancial. Links to your "admittance of various attacks" (careful with the English language there .. it's fragile) and "whitepapers on attacks on altcoins" would be nice.

I was discussing Public (as in, known through published pools) hashrate vs the Private (non disclosed Chinese pools, as well as Mark's private pool) hashrate, which has nothing to do with the orphans. The orphan issue was well documented, entire series of blocks between certain timeframes turned out orphan--thousands of network confirmations and maturities after they'd been paid out. My pool, ny2cafuse's pool and other pools went bankrupt overnight. Exchanges went negative as well (because once the block is invalidated, everyone tied to it loses as well). This is why several exchanges immediately delisted TAG.

The whitepapers on methods of altcoin attacks are out there. ny2cafuse linked me to one lastnight even (and I believe provided it in his response). I never claimed there was an admitted attack on TAG, simply that there are admitted attacks which have occured to various coins, and that whitepapers do exist. TAG coin has had 2 known attacks early on, and among the pool ops it was presumed to have sustained a 3rd attack resulting in the orphans--despite large hashrate securing the network (estimated 3GH on average).

Not sure what "asian vs general market coin" even means. So Mark's trying to develop a market in the Phillipines and SE Asia, so that means he has to talk to real businesses in the real world (which takes time) rather than hype his coin on reddit and this webforum so that he that he can offload his premine once the coin's listed on cryptsy.

I'm simply talking about the target audience, mining, exchange and end-use group. It's open to the world, but the marketing is focused in the Asian areas right now, and my prediction is it will never leave that group.

I'm sorry, his strategy is a billlion times more ethical than the majority of cynical pump 'n dumps on this forum. And the weird thing is I know that you think the same, you are clearly a major player here, so I don't understand the negativity.

If you think I believe the same thing and think I have some level of background on the matter, why would you question my reasons? Devil's Advocate on that one, I do understand your point. I'm not trying to be negative, I'm just mentioning some things and I've found it best to keep it public/on record.

Markets go up and down, giving the coin a hard time with opinion masquerading as "facts" is not going to help the up bit.

If you re-read this entire thread, the other TAG thread, and look at about 50 pages of documentation elsewhere, you'd understand where we're coming from. Not spreading FUD, just stating what has in fact occured, or is occuring. Have better things to do than go look up source links, if you're really curious, read back. If you're not, that's fine also. Mine away, or better yet, buy it. Cheaper to buy it right now. It'll bottom out soon enough.

I believe it will go up in value at some point IF Mark's launch on the business end does in fact prove successful, though I also am of the informed mind that the coin value will in fact crash more and stay low for awhile before that. Even if based on nothing else, the fact that you can't use it for anything, so people are just dumping it (rather than simply not mining it, which is my personal choice). I'd rather refrain from mining a coin I have no use for, than to mine and dump it just to say "gosh I need to pay my electric usage".

Hopefully this explains the situation better.

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March 18, 2014, 02:36:49 AM
 #2568

I'm mining! On my CPUs and on my Dual Miner, until my GPU rig is finished, and until I get some of those new asics.

tagbond (OP)
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March 18, 2014, 04:52:20 AM
 #2569

Time to give my 2 cents worth here..Smiley

The tagvert games we are experimenting with were giving out too much coin for little return. I am now putting up different types of games which are public, but giving out points for which I can decide to then give out TAG or other prizes for top leaders or something else to be decided on. This is the more conventional approach and in the majority of cases for communities and tagverts this is what most companies will use. Our business model for Tagbond may reflect that as we might introduce a subscription system to use the platform in this way, just like punchtab and other rewards systems.

As for TAG being an Asian coin, well, it's wherever it will be used. If that is in Asia, then great..its a big market and I don't have to worry about the USA rules and regulations for MSBs. The reality is it can be used anywhere but is not being taken up yet. We are building the sites and apps to kickstart the use of TAG, but that takes time. If anyone else wants to build anything on top of our API then I am willing to fund that as an angel investor. Anyone who is complaining about the price should do something about it, maybe get out there and sell the idea to online and offline retailers if you cannot build anything. Has anyone here tried to sell TAG to a retailer that has never heard of cryptocurrency?..It's a hard sell but that will make the difference when it takes hold. That is the time a coin will break free of it's dependence on speculators and the price of BitCoin.

It's correct to say I don't mind what the price is, even if I do own a large chunk. As we start giving out rewards we will base it on a dollar or peso price and buy whatever value of TAG is at that time to give out. So for example in VTC case, we will be giving $5 worth of TAG per $30 subscription per month. So I need to buy $5 worth for that customer on that day. That's the way we are promoting it to retailers as well. However, those retailers probably won't be buying it on cryptsy, they will pay cash for it, and this is an opportunity for any of you holding TAG to get out there and sell it. We will be doing the same thing and hopefully making a profit selling it as well.

Now if you are holding TAG with the aim to increase value on your holding, well.. probably not a good idea on any coin these days, let alone TAG. It's meant to be used as a rewards currency, to be earned and spent, not hoarded. As miners, you want to mine and sell to make a profit. As the price drops, the difficulty drops and you make more TAG...it doesn't really matter to you as a miner unless you are hoarding it.

@ vesperwillow  -There is no launch of any business in particular, there is no magic bullet that I will introduce to force the price up artificially. It will be a steady increase in the use of TAG through lots of different sites and retailers. If you don't have the patience nothing I can do to help - just don't expect us to do ALL the work ... :-)

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March 18, 2014, 05:34:14 AM
 #2570

Now if you are holding TAG with the aim to increase value on your holding, well.. probably not a good idea on any coin these days, let alone TAG. It's meant to be used as a rewards currency, to be earned and spent, not hoarded. As miners, you want to mine and sell to make a profit. As the price drops, the difficulty drops and you make more TAG...it doesn't really matter to you as a miner unless you are hoarding it.

Then it makes sense to take out the PoS? You don't want people hoarding it, don't give them an incentive to hoard it then. It will also help fix any problems it has caused, whether they are perceived or real.

I understand, there might actually be nothing wrong with the PoS code, but completely removing it guarantees that there won't be any issues at all with PoS because it is no longer there.

While it remains there, people will speculate how PoS affects the miners, the network, the orphans, etc.

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March 18, 2014, 07:47:40 AM
 #2571

I thought you might say that, but no plans to take it out at the moment. If someone wants to hold on to them with the long term view of TAG increasing in value, that is up to them..1.5% is not the reason why you keep your money in the bank...at least not for me it isn't. I still use cash form the bank to buy and sell things, so it will be the same for TAG...just need to give people ways to earn and spend their TAG. So, not enough reason to remove PoS

Value in a currency is created by velocity - the faster it is used and transferred around, the more value it has. That is what I want to achieve with TAG. Right now, there are not a lot of ways to move it around, so the value will stagnate untill it starts moving.

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March 18, 2014, 09:49:34 AM
 #2572

Value in a currency is created by velocity - the faster it is used and transferred around, the more value it has. That is what I want to achieve with TAG. Right now, there are not a lot of ways to move it around, so the value will stagnate untill it starts moving.

That is all very interesting Mark from a business plan POV but you haven't exactly explained who is supposed to create this "velocity" ? I'm pretty sure it's not me, a humble miner with about 1000 TAG in my wallet that once was worth 2BTC and is now worth 0.4BTC.  Thank God I've only got 1000 left, did have 6 or 7 times that amount at one stage. 

Taking a stab in the dark, I'm guessing that the person that created and promoted the coin should possibly be interested in creating "velocity".  We are getting close to 6 months since the coin was launched and to be frank, I think a million monkeys with a million keyboards could have created a better website than tagbond. 

Mate, you are either doing this all wrong or hoping to flog it off as a going concern to some sucker.  Either way I'm only out a few hundred dollars, I'll chalk that up as a learning experience.
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March 18, 2014, 01:47:47 PM
 #2573

to mine and sell to make a profit. As the price drops, the difficulty drops and you make more TAG...it doesn't really matter to you as a miner unless you are hoarding it.

Except that isn't the case with tag, and we both know it. Difficulty remains high, sometimes increases with price drops.

@ vesperwillow  -There is no launch of any business in particular, there is no magic bullet that I will introduce to force the price up artificially. It will be a steady increase in the use of TAG through lots of different sites and retailers. If you don't have the patience nothing I can do to help - just don't expect us to do ALL the work ... :-)

I'm not involved in tag in any way, I don't mine it, I don't run a public pool on it right now; I do help people out if they want to mine it. I have plenty of patience, but it's irrelevant as I'm just pointing out facts.

Also I'm not sure why anyone wouldn't expect you guys to do all the work, it's your business model. Not to say that the community can't take part of it, as several of us have at some point.. buuut.. you're sortof the millionaire investor with a team of folks working on the system.

Kinda like expecting Bill Gates to promote Windows 9 or something.. sortof not the beta tester's job.

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March 18, 2014, 05:26:15 PM
 #2574

Tagcoin will feature two pages in the book called Cryptocurrency "The Alt-ernative" the Beginner's Reference

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=483187.new#new


Please donate to the below Tagcoin wallet address in order to help fund this project:

TYKjp2dqVUybyQSRL2VNXN3nquWgsf4LtS

It will have 2 pages similar to this:





If you spot any spelling or grammar errors, these are easily sorted.  I do have a full time job as well as trying to get this project completed too.
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March 20, 2014, 01:42:54 AM
 #2575

@tagbond, bitcoin version 0.9.0 just came out, it's now called bitcoin-core. And, it has Coin Control. Smiley just saying.

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March 20, 2014, 05:16:54 AM
 #2576

Added API to vskype.com for BTC and TAG across multiple currencies - can now integrate that into any app or site.

http://vskype.com/api/tag/usd for example gives:
{
TAG: 1,
USD: 0.29456721,
error: false,
status: 200
}

http://vskype.com/api/btc/usd
{
BTC: 1,
USD: 600.3,
error: false,
status: 200
}

http://vskype.com/api/tag/btc
{
TAG: 1,
BTC: 0.00048933876079885,
error: false,
status: 200
}

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March 20, 2014, 09:10:31 AM
 #2577

Thanks for the update Mark.  Glad you're keeping busy with the REALLY important stuff...........
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March 20, 2014, 10:35:06 AM
Last edit: March 20, 2014, 11:27:52 AM by tagbond
 #2578

@Johndec2 - we need the API for vskype for us and others to display pricing in TAG for our own sites and mobile apps and for others to use in their sites. Also for marketing purposes to keep TAG in people's minds, and a way to promote the idea of TAG is to put out a calculator similar to preev. So yes, it is one of the building blocks needed.

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March 20, 2014, 11:13:17 AM
Last edit: March 21, 2014, 04:10:12 AM by 24Kilo
 #2579

@Johndec2 - we need the API for vskype for us and others to display pricing in TAG for our own sites and mobile apps and for others to use in their sites. Also for marketing purposes to keep TAG in people's minds, and a way to promote the idea of TAG is to put out a calculator similar to preev. So yes, it is one of the building blocks needed.

You sound like an armchair businessman..Lots of disparaging comments, but never really built anything - Perhaps you can give me the benefit of your business expertise?... It sounds like you have had enough of TAG, so why bother commenting and wasting your time? Go try another coin and pick holes somewhere else because all I have heard from you is this kind of snide commenting. You are the kind of guy with a dead end job and stays there all his life, commenting from the sidelines about how things could be made better, but not actually lifting a finger to make it so. Or perhaps I am wrong and you can share your business experiences here - perhaps I can learn from you. If you really want to make a difference, come over to Manila and work with us for a short while and maybe you can make a difference. I could always do with CONSTRUCTIVE criticism, instead of the crap you seem to spout all the time.

And this is how the CEO of a supposedly multi-million dollar venture replies to a biting, yet truthful remark... you launch a blind personal attack?

Since I happen to know John personally... you actually would do well to listen to him since he is a successful businessman with several businesses to his credit and now runs a regional division of a national corporation here in Australia... maybe as a successful businessman he is actually had quite enough of the smoke and mirrors and understands that in the real world where the bank will take your home if you don't run a business successfully, you are exhibiting the classic signs of a failing business grasping at straws to keep the doors open.

You already have a less than stellar record of communicating well with vested interests in your project, so it would be wise to consider how you reply, because John's reply is really a reflection of how you have been replying to all us for the past few months when we have been voicing concerns and questions.

I think you really under estimate the miners and supporters that you have attracted to TAG, I know 4 of the folks here personally, and all of us are successful and aggressive business people who looked at the Tagbond business plan and made the decision to invest our resources into helping you launch TAG. So we all are pretty well acquainted with the running of start-ups and the energy and hard worked need to make them success. We also are experienced enough to know when we are being led down the garden path.

John, like yourself and others here, tend not mince words and do not suffer fools lightly.

Like my son tells some of our employees at times when they start making excuses and trying garner pity for poor performance, 'Caring is a luxury I cannot afford, so just get on with it'.
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March 20, 2014, 11:31:06 AM
 #2580

I deleted the extra comment. I should know better, but I am just fed up with people giving non constructive criticism. I am also blunt and to the point, but doing so on this forum just gets flak, as I knew this would.

Perhaps next time someone gives some advice, they can back it with their own credentials. Knowing the internet and forums, too many many hide behind their online personas, and can fling out comments with no consequence. I listen to people with real business experience, but it just seems there are many online "experts" who can do things better...

as for John, perhaps he can chat to me via skype if he cares enough about TAG. Maybe I can learn something..

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