GBTC Bitcoin Investment Trust Observer

[jl2012]

update

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[FNG]

update

Thanks. I wonder if the dip in btc held could be attributed to people taking control of their own btc. Funny day for such a large drop.

[wachtwoord]

Wow this is not good

[oda.krell]

Wow this is not good

No, it certainly is not. I especially don't like the implications for future GABI and COIN impact.

(I know, they're not the same type of investment vehicle, but I'm not sure either if they're different enough to make a completely different buying behavior likely at the moment).

I remain long-term bullish, but I am also starting to get myself used to the idea that we could be in for a substantially longer bear market, to the order of another year, of no substantial and lasting price increase.

[BitChick]

update

Thanks. I wonder if the dip in btc held could be attributed to people taking control of their own btc. Funny day for such a large drop.

We had a substantial drop in BTC held by Second Market but also a rise in price yesterday?  That is odd.  

[adamstgBit]

update

Thanks. I wonder if the dip in btc held could be attributed to people taking control of their own btc. Funny day for such a large drop.

We had a substantial drop in BTC held by Second Market but also a rise in price yesterday?  That is odd.  

"sophisticated investors"  "getting out b4 its to late"   

unbelievable.

[BitChick]

update

Thanks. I wonder if the dip in btc held could be attributed to people taking control of their own btc. Funny day for such a large drop.

We had a substantial drop in BTC held by Second Market but also a rise in price yesterday?  That is odd.  

"sophisticated investors"  "getting out b4 its to late"   

unbelievable.

I am sure they will regret it later!   

[Bitcopia]

Wow this is not good

It's not good, but SM still holds more BTC than any time before May 2014.

[thezerg]

Wow this is not good

No, it certainly is not. I especially don't like the implications for future GABI and COIN impact.

(I know, they're not the same type of investment vehicle, but I'm not sure either if they're different enough to make a completely different buying behavior likely at the moment).

I remain long-term bullish, but I am also starting to get myself used to the idea that we could be in for a substantially longer bear market, to the order of another year, of no substantial and lasting price increase.

Let's not put too much into one sale.  Could very easily be a single investor taking profits or even just covering his/her initial investment.  Really, the lack of new purchasing is what is worrisome.  However, even that is not a big issue.  The truth is that BTC has always had periods of quiet because most people are momentum investors whether they know the term or not.  And so we should not expect much investment right now...instead we should be looking at merchant adoption and use transaction metrics which still look pretty good.

[adamstgBit]

wasn't SM going to open a new market ( a kind of ETF )  whats happening with that?

[oda.krell]

Wow this is not good

No, it certainly is not. I especially don't like the implications for future GABI and COIN impact.

(I know, they're not the same type of investment vehicle, but I'm not sure either if they're different enough to make a completely different buying behavior likely at the moment).

I remain long-term bullish, but I am also starting to get myself used to the idea that we could be in for a substantially longer bear market, to the order of another year, of no substantial and lasting price increase.

Let's not put too much into one sale.  Could very easily be a single investor taking profits or even just covering his/her initial investment.  Really, the lack of new purchasing is what is worrisome.  However, even that is not a big issue.  The truth is that BTC has always had periods of quiet because most people are momentum investors whether they know the term or not.  And so we should not expect much investment right now...instead we should be looking at merchant adoption and use transaction metrics which still look pretty good.

Completely agree. I'm not suggesting to panic sell either, to be clear. Price stagnation didn't kill Bitcoin in 2012, why would it in 2014.

But what I was trying to say is that, until recently, I placed a lot of hope in the big investment opportunities opening up (soon), and I am somewhat re-assessing what I think of them. They will play a role eventually for major price increase, I'm sure, but it might take longer before we are back in an unquestionable uptrend than most of us expected, and only then do I expect them to be fully used to capacity to drive price even higher.

Hence my remark: I am getting myself used to the idea we could go through a longer period of mostly sideways trading.

[BitAddict]

update

Thanks. I wonder if the dip in btc held could be attributed to people taking control of their own btc. Funny day for such a large drop.

We had a substantial drop in BTC held by Second Market but also a rise in price yesterday?  That is odd.  

"sophisticated investors"  "getting out b4 its to late"  

unbelievable.

They mainly bought over $300 when we reached a new All Time High and bitcoin market turned bullish. It will happen again if bitcoins manage to go over $1,200, but this seems to take longer than we all expected.

Also stock market is not helping at all. With new all time highs, all the new money is going there.

[ensurance982]

Huh, that isn't good at all. But that's just how things go. We don't know if this has been a single investor or multiple ones. They may be cutting their losses or may be re-investing in BTC they actually hold themselves.

[FNG]

Huh, that isn't good at all. But that's just how things go. We don't know if this has been a single investor or multiple ones. They may be cutting their losses or may be re-investing in BTC they actually hold themselves.

They may be withdrawing coins to a personal address.  We don't know

[gog1]

more selling - people giving up on bitcoin?!  or finding another vehicle to invest in it?

[wachtwoord]

Very strange to invest in this fund and then withdraw quickly considering the huge fee both when investing and when withdrawing. Just demonstrates once again that accredited investor doesn't mean shrewd investor

[Pruden]

Very strange to invest in this fund and then withdraw quickly considering the huge fee both when investing and when withdrawing. Just demonstrates once again that accredited investor doesn't mean shrewd investor

I don't know about these "accredited" investors, but it is well known that mutual fund investors get a much smaller return than the average mutual fund. That is, people just can't help but buying high and selling low, chasing the performance of other assets that outperform their current position just when the tide was about to turn in their favour

[wachtwoord]

Very strange to invest in this fund and then withdraw quickly considering the huge fee both when investing and when withdrawing. Just demonstrates once again that accredited investor doesn't mean shrewd investor

I don't know about these "accredited" investors, but it is well known that mutual fund investors get a much smaller return than the average mutual fund. That is, people just can't help but buying high and selling low, chasing the performance of other assets that outperform their current position just when the tide was about to turn in their favour

People can't help buy high sell low sure, but then they add on ridiculous fees. Just buy an index funds for a yearly flat fee of 0.1% then.

[JorgeStolfi]

Very strange to invest in this fund and then withdraw quickly considering the huge fee both when investing and when withdrawing. Just demonstrates once again that accredited investor doesn't mean shrewd investor

Imagine someone who invested in Nov or Jan-Feb at >800$, expecting sizabe gains, and watched instead his investment gradually lose value while being unable to cut his losses because of the 6-month lock-in period.  Or someone who bought in May at 450$, saw it go to 650$, and then drop back to 480$ -- and could not cash the profit, for that reason.

[wachtwoord]

Very strange to invest in this fund and then withdraw quickly considering the huge fee both when investing and when withdrawing. Just demonstrates once again that accredited investor doesn't mean shrewd investor

Imagine someone who invested in Nov or Jan-Feb at >800$, expecting sizabe gains, and watched instead his investment gradually lose value while being unable to cut his losses because of the 6-month lock-in period.  Or someone who bought in May at 450$, saw it go to 650$, and then drop back to 480$ -- and could not cash the profit, for that reason.

If you buy into a fund paying 2% entry and 2% exit fees you're holding onto that investment for 5 years at least (unless there is an explosive increase in price or the underlying asset breaks). If you don't you're very stupid.