NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[wakasaki808]

Can someone perhaps provide rough estimates on number of darkNXT accounts and their total amount?

~250M @ 1000+ accounts.

Edit: U should start from one with almost 50M on it.

Holy crap, that is a LOT. 

holy crap that IS a lot.

You're saying that a quarter of all NXT is permanently out of circulation only a couple of months after it was minted in the Genesis Block?

That sounds, um, kinda serious to me.  I have obviously missed something.  What's the story on this again?  And which account has the 50M in it?
<off to research 64 bit vs. 256 bit in more detail.>

It makes all the available NXT move valuable plus it's a great marketing tool (Sign up and use NXT and possibly unlock an account with money already in it!!).

It's like a gambling game...with no fee

[Come-from-Beyond]

I've asked before in the API thread, but got no answer that I was able to understand:

It is said that an account that has no public key in the BC yet (no outgoing transactions) is more prone to a brute force attack.

Could anyone explan why? I don't get it. My idea is that a brute force attack works like this: dictionary words or random input generates a public and private key pair, the later being the account number. I see no difference in the chances of finding an existing account number, when using this procedure, depending on if the public key is in the bc or not.

To avoid a situation similar to Bitcoin when we don't know if Satoshi lost his keys or just waiting for 1 BTC = 1000000 USD price. In Nxt, if someone doesn't reveal his public key even in 5 years, we can guess that he lost the key (or has balls of steel).

[BitAddict]

I've asked before in the API thread, but got no answer that I was able to understand:

It is said that an account that has no public key in the BC yet (no outgoing transactions) is more prone to a brute force attack.

Could anyone explan why? I don't get it. My idea is that a brute force attack works like this: dictionary words or random input generates a public and private key pair, the later being the account number. I see no difference in the chances of finding an existing account number, when using this procedure, depending on if the public key is in the bc or not.

To avoid a situation similar to Bitcoin when we don't know if Satoshi lost his keys or just waiting for 1 BTC = 1000000 USD price. In Nxt, if someone doesn't reveal his public key even in 5 years, we can guess that he lost the key (or has balls of steel).

Or maybe he just thinks is like bitcoin.

[pinarello]

I've asked before in the API thread, but got no answer that I was able to understand:

It is said that an account that has no public key in the BC yet (no outgoing transactions) is more prone to a brute force attack.

Could anyone explan why? I don't get it. My idea is that a brute force attack works like this: dictionary words or random input generates a public and private key pair, the later being the account number. I see no difference in the chances of finding an existing account number, when using this procedure, depending on if the public key is in the bc or not.

To avoid a situation similar to Bitcoin when we don't know if Satoshi lost his keys or just waiting for 1 BTC = 1000000 USD price. In Nxt, if someone doesn't reveal his public key even in 5 years, we can guess that he lost the key (or has balls of steel).

luckely didnt lost his balls but the keys

Pin

[jl777]

Anyone know how long it takes for NXT to be deposited in the Peercover gateway?

Usually 10 confirmations, they are having a bit of problem with the server not catching up to latest block. It is being looked into. If you see your funds in the blockchain website, then it is just a matter of their server to catch up and then credit your ripple wallet.

Many apologies for delays.

James

[jl777]

May I propose to not use the word darkNXT? It's not a good term in terms of PR and marketing.

Sorry, I'm a science buff and in physics and cosmology right now the big topic is dark matter that can't interact with regular matter.  I'm gonna use darkNXT as my preferred term.  Tho I could be talked into using zombie NXT -  I'm a Walking Dead buff, too.

dark matter has most properties of real matter, we can detect its gravitational force. Maybe someday, technology will advance enough that we can find a way to interact with dark matter.

darkNXT accept no substitutes

James

[nexern]

Yes, anything with NXT but no public key should be totalled.  Maybe the page would list all dark accounts, with the sum at top and below it a list of all the accounts and their balances?

I guess we're going with the term "darkNXT"?  I kinda like hiberNXT or frozeNXT

adding tomorrow, hiberNXT sounds supple. 

[jl777]

So with darkNXT out there has anyone thought already about mining it?

I have some thoughts on how to do this from the technical standpoint but don't really know if it's profitable. Can someone perhaps provide rough estimates on number of darkNXT accounts and their total amount?

~250M @ 1000+ accounts.

Edit: U should start from one with almost 50M on it.

How would you suggest targeting a single acct, vs mining against all accts in parallel?

[jl777]

So with darkNXT out there has anyone thought already about mining it?

I have some thoughts on how to do this from the technical standpoint but don't really know if it's profitable. Can someone perhaps provide rough estimates on number of darkNXT accounts and their total amount?

~250M @ 1000+ accounts.

Edit: U should start from one with almost 50M on it.

Wait a second!
Are you saying 25% of all NXT is darkNXT? Is the ratio of NXT to darkNXT by any chance equal to pi? How did so much become darkNXT?

James

[salsacz]

some people moved their money to new accounts and didn't buy Alias there

[Come-from-Beyond]

Wait a second!
Are you saying 25% of all NXT is darkNXT? Is the ratio of NXT to darkNXT by any chance equal to pi? How did so much become darkNXT?

James

It's just a coincidence

[marcus03]

Yes, anything with NXT but no public key should be totalled.  Maybe the page would list all dark accounts, with the sum at top and below it a list of all the accounts and their balances?

I guess we're going with the term "darkNXT"?  I kinda like hiberNXT or frozeNXT

adding tomorrow, hiberNXT sounds supple. 

I'll call it hiberNXT in my client then. (Though I don't agree with the assumptions being made about what it means when there are no outgoing transactions on an account.)

[S3MKi]

Who knew that Come-From-Beyond had a twin brother called Come-from-Beyiond

you forget his other brother code-from-behind, and half sister, codeine-from-beyond

don't forget Come-from-Beyonce

And, of course, Cum-from-Beyond!

Cum-on-Beyonce is better!

ymmd!))))

[jl777]

Yes, anything with NXT but no public key should be totalled.  Maybe the page would list all dark accounts, with the sum at top and below it a list of all the accounts and their balances?

I guess we're going with the term "darkNXT"?  I kinda like hiberNXT or frozeNXT

adding tomorrow, hiberNXT sounds supple. 

I'll call it hiberNXT in my client then. (Though I don't agree with the assumptions being made about what it means when there are no outgoing transactions on an account.)

When 64bit key space is brute forced offline, it doesn't matter which type of darkNXT it is. All of them will be cracked wide open. Even if someone has a key for a darkNXT acct, if the brute force robot cracks the 64bit code first, it will obtain control of the acct and lock out the original funder of the acct.

People who think they are being safer by never going online are doing the exact opposite. We really need to tell people about this. Currently tens of millions of dollars is up for grabs. My understanding is that bitcoin terahash asics can do part of the offline decoding, but the curve25... doesn't have any asics yet, so it will be a very long time before 64 bit space is cracked. However, if NXT price goes up significantly, specialized NXT miner asics won't be too far behind

James

P.S. My guess is that a lot of the 250 million(!) darkNXT is founder or large early adopter NXT put into  "savings" accts, without realizing (or caring) about the "weak" 64 bit security

[jl777]

Peercover server has been update to .5.0, if anyone still has not gotten thei deposits into their ripple wallets, let me know.

Also, I think there are several thousand dgex accts. The single large account is actually spread across thousands of accounts. The current distribution charts/tables I have seen do not reflect this

James

[opticalcarrier]

P.S. My guess is that a lot of the 250 million(!) darkNXT is founder or large early adopter NXT put into  "savings" accts, without realizing (or caring) about the "weak" 64 bit security

THIS.  I described all this and even went so far as to call it 'dumb' in a previous post.  CfB I think it was referred to it a 'big brass balls'

[intel]

P.S. My guess is that a lot of the 250 million(!) darkNXT is founder or large early adopter NXT put into  "savings" accts, without realizing (or caring) about the "weak" 64 bit security

You forget about probability of huge transfer made accidentally by stakeholder to wrong account number because of NXT Client freeze, like many other users who had such issue before but with less amounts.

[TwinWinNerD]

P.S. My guess is that a lot of the 250 million(!) darkNXT is founder or large early adopter NXT put into  "savings" accts, without realizing (or caring) about the "weak" 64 bit security

You forget about probability of huge transfer made accidentally by stakeholder to wrong account number because of NXT Client freeze, like many other users who had such issue before but with less amounts.

I don't think that is a huge issues. The 250m are most likely from people that don't even know that you have to make a transaction to create a public key.
Hell i didn't know until 7 days ago and i have 6 digits of them...

[opticalcarrier]

P.S. My guess is that a lot of the 250 million(!) darkNXT is founder or large early adopter NXT put into  "savings" accts, without realizing (or caring) about the "weak" 64 bit security

You forget about probability of huge transfer made accidentally by stakeholder to wrong account number because of NXT Client freeze, like many other users who had such issue before but with less amounts.

I don't think that is a huge issues. The 250m are most likely from people that don't even know that you have to make a transaction to create a public key.
Hell i didn't know until 7 days ago and i have 6 digits of them...

As far as we all are concerned (those of use with no access to those accts with no published public keys) they are the same scenario and are subject to cracking.

Ive already reached out to counterra and asked them to look into curve25519 performance of their terraminer IV 2THps sha256 asics

[etlase3]

As far as we all are concerned (those of use with no access to those accts with no published public keys) they are the same scenario and are subject to cracking.

Ive already reached out to counterra and asked them to look into curve25519 performance of their terraminer IV 2THps sha256 asics

I don't know how these nxt accounts are being secured, but a sha256 asic is going to have a performance of 0 for curve25519...