[ANN][DASH] Dash (dash.org) | First Self-Funding Self-Governing Crypto Currency

[coins101]

So a few thousand pages back, I suggested a social media aspect to DRK to provide anonymous networks along with e-cash.

It turns out that Yik Yak went for the anonymous social media bit and has since raised $60m and will likely be sold for the odd $billion in a few years.

Which one of you idea stealing bastards is behind Yik Yak?

 

https://digiday.com/platforms/inside-yik-yak-anonymous-sharing-app-sweeping-colleges/

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[wozzek23]

Total Masternodes: 1358 = 1358 actives + 0 inactives (Last refresh: Tue Dec 09 2014 19:12:37)
Estimated daily payout for an active node (blocks with MN payments last 24h: 100%): 0.58 DRK/day (Last Refreshed: Tue Dec 09 2014 19:12:42)

OMG what is going on? Are the top 10 wallets moving funds to masternodes?

I follow various Darkcoin related statistics data for my fun and this is the ONLY one I do not like. (aside the price that I don't get why is still as low as $2.25 or something). I raised the question, of coins being locked in the Masternode, wondering (hypothetically) what would happen if ALL the coins are locked out? Many a member told me it is too early to worry about it, and that pure economics would not allow any problems with it but I wonder / worry about LIQUIDITY!

Again, hypothetically, if only us - Darkcoin supporters - would buy the coins and at the end have ALL of them locked in MN, the value of one DRK could be a one million dollars for all I care, but who would buy the coin for a million? No one, I guarantee you. So, I might sell that one coin for a $1.00 (one dollar) in order to find a greedy buyer outside the community. And voila!, all the coins just lost 99.999999% of their value.

I don't buy an argument that scarcity would increase the price for the price itself is NOT, could NOT and SHOULD not be the only consideration.

I am currently at 28% loss with my Darkcoin investment. But I've also made 350% - in the last 30 days - on shorting Russian ruble on FOREX. (I'm sorry, our Russian friends, I hate to see how the Financial Crime Cartel is destroying your economy, but I could not let free money go away)  So, if I cared ONLY about the price / profit, I'd convert all my coins into a more profitable investment (at least on the short run) and forget about freedom, privacy, anonymity, cheap remittance of currency that is currently at 12% for fiat garbage, according to the World Bank (a $540 Billion market) and all sort of incredible benefits e-Cash (Darkcoin) could provide to the people all over the world. But if this cash sits in my MN or in my wallet and does nothing else but provide me, and only me, with a coin or two "reward", and the Network with some security, damn... something indeed might be wrong.

Ponder this: as of today, 27.57% of ALL Darkcoins in circulation are already locked in Masternodes. On November 12th, less than a month ago, that percentage was 24.57% so the # of locked in coins outpaces the overall coins supply quite rapidly. [3% or for 40% on an annual basis] With the price as it is and the pace of MN growth we could see 50% off ALL coins being locked in Masternodes in less than six, perhaps four months.

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

[coins101]

snip......

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain to me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Without master nodes you don't get anonymity or instant transactions.

You might as well use dogecoin.

next question....this time, make it harder so we need to break a sweat.

[innergy]

Another potential partner:
http://www.coindesk.com/bitmarkets-launches-decentralised-bitcoin-marketplace-tor-support/

[wozzek23]

snip......

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain to me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Without master nodes you don't get anonymity or instant transactions.
You might as well use dogecoin.

next question....this time, make it harder so we need to break a sweat.

No, no, kindly do not go ad hominem just as easy as that.

As a member of Darkcoin Foundation, Darkcoin investor, MN owner and the author of the 1st draft "DARKCOIN: A Private E-Cash Manifesto" (https://darkcointalk.org/threads/darkcoin-private-e-cash-manifesto.2460/#post-22058) I don't need to be dismissed with a dogecoin remark just like that.

I get the Masternodes value but all my points still stay. I do believe the issue I raised is a potentially serious problem and would like someone to help me understand why it is not. (the problem)

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

snip......

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain to me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Without master nodes you don't get anonymity or instant transactions.
You might as well use dogecoin.

next question....this time, make it harder so we need to break a sweat.

No, no, kindly do not go ad hominem just as easy as that.

As a member of Darkcoin Foundation, Darkcoin investor, MN owner and the author of the 1st draft "DARKCON: A Private E-Cash Manifesto" (https://darkcointalk.org/threads/darkcoin-private-e-cash-manifesto.2460/#post-22058) I don't need to be dismissed with a dogecoin remark just like that.

I get the Masternodes value but all my points still stay. I do believe the issue I raised is a potentially serious problem and would like someone to help me understand why it is not. (the problem)

Freudian slip, that!

[oblox]

Total Masternodes: 1358 = 1358 actives + 0 inactives (Last refresh: Tue Dec 09 2014 19:12:37)
Estimated daily payout for an active node (blocks with MN payments last 24h: 100%): 0.58 DRK/day (Last Refreshed: Tue Dec 09 2014 19:12:42)

OMG what is going on? Are the top 10 wallets moving funds to masternodes?

I follow various Darkcoin related statistics data for my fun and this is the ONLY one I do not like. (aside the price that I don't get why is still as low as $2.25 or something). I raised the question, of coins being locked in the Masternode, wondering (hypothetically) what would happen if ALL the coins are locked out? Many a member told me it is too early to worry about it, and that pure economics would not allow any problems with it but I wonder / worry about LIQUIDITY!

Again, hypothetically, if only us - Darkcoin supporters - would buy the coins and at the end have ALL of them locked in MN, the value of one DRK could be a one million dollars for all I care, but who would buy the coin for a million? No one, I guarantee you. So, I might sell that one coin for a $1.00 (one dollar) in order to find a greedy buyer outside the community. And voila!, all the coins just lost 99.999999% of their value.

I don't buy an argument that scarcity would increase the price for the price itself is NOT, could NOT and SHOULD not be the only consideration.

I am currently at 28% loss with my Darkcoin investment. But I've also made 350% - in the last 30 days - on shorting Russian ruble on FOREX. (I'm sorry, our Russian friends, I hate to see how the Financial Crime Cartel is destroying your economy, but I could not let free money go away)  So, if I cared ONLY about the price / profit, I'd convert all my coins into a more profitable investment (at least on the short run) and forget about freedom, privacy, anonymity, cheap remittance of currency that is currently at 12% for fiat garbage, according to the World Bank (a $540 Billion market) and all sort of incredible benefits e-Cash (Darkcoin) could provide to the people all over the world. But if this cash sits in my MN or in my wallet and does nothing else but provide me, and only me, with a coin or two "reward", and the Network with some security, damn... something indeed might be wrong.

Ponder this: as of today, 27.57% of ALL Darkcoins in circulation are already locked in Masternodes. On November 12th, less than a month ago, that percentage was 24.57% so the # of locked in coins outpaces the overall coins supply quite rapidly. [3% or for 40% on an annual basis] With the price as it is and the pace of MN growth we could see 50% off ALL coins being locked in Masternodes in less than six, perhaps four months.

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

It's a digital coin being able to be split into decimals. Each "whole" coin has 100,000,000 units and there will certainly be more than just 1 coin worth in circulation. That's plenty of liquidity. If you only look at it from the viewpoint of whole coins, then sure, there is a problem, but it's a non issue in something that could be split out even more decimals. It IS economics: supply and demand. As reward for masternodes increase, demand for masternodes increase. As the price per coin increases, some existing holders will sell some of their stash until an equilibrium is formed.

[wozzek23]

snip......

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain to me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Without master nodes you don't get anonymity or instant transactions.
You might as well use dogecoin.

next question....this time, make it harder so we need to break a sweat.

No, no, kindly do not go ad hominem just as easy as that.

As a member of Darkcoin Foundation, Darkcoin investor, MN owner and the author of the 1st draft "DARKCON: A Private E-Cash Manifesto" (https://darkcointalk.org/threads/darkcoin-private-e-cash-manifesto.2460/#post-22058) I don't need to be dismissed with a dogecoin remark just like that.

I get the Masternodes value but all my points still stay. I do believe the issue I raised is a potentially serious problem and would like someone to help me understand why it is not. (the problem)

Freudian slip, that!

What the fuck that means? That I am a con or you think I am implying the Darkcoin is con / Darkcon? (a memo for future readers: I made a typo, Darkcon vs. Darkcoin when quoting my post on Darkcoin talk and will now correct that typo)

Can we discuss the CRUX of what I wrote or are we going to bullshit about typos and dogecoins? It's the same for me, I am on the same boat I love and support but I do not want to waste my time on pointless garbage.

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

If you knew me, you would know I meant no disrespect. We are all Darkcoiners, I was just having fun with wordplay...if it upsets you, I offer to delete my post.

[strix]

snip......

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain to me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Without master nodes you don't get anonymity or instant transactions.
You might as well use dogecoin.

next question....this time, make it harder so we need to break a sweat.

No, no, kindly do not go ad hominem just as easy as that.

As a member of Darkcoin Foundation, Darkcoin investor, MN owner and the author of the 1st draft "DARKCON: A Private E-Cash Manifesto" (https://darkcointalk.org/threads/darkcoin-private-e-cash-manifesto.2460/#post-22058) I don't need to be dismissed with a dogecoin remark just like that.

I get the Masternodes value but all my points still stay. I do believe the issue I raised is a potentially serious problem and would like someone to help me understand why it is not. (the problem)

If there were only one DRK in circulation it would be worth far more than a million FRNs, and its Duffs would be in heavy use, due to the security provided by all the master nodes. The master node holders would be making their fortunes on the the services they provide, as it is safe to assume that in that glorious day all DRK would have been mined. DRK is not like gold, in that it is infinitely divisible. The higher the value of DRK in purchasing power, the lower the portion we need to use. I say in purchasing power rather than FRNs, because it is likely that their ultimate value will be less than the paper used to print them. We have already seen that debasement in pennies, where the original copper versions have been priced out of circulation.

[qwizzie]

snip......

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain to me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Without master nodes you don't get anonymity or instant transactions.
You might as well use dogecoin.

next question....this time, make it harder so we need to break a sweat.

No, no, kindly do not go ad hominem just as easy as that.

As a member of Darkcoin Foundation, Darkcoin investor, MN owner and the author of the 1st draft "DARKCON: A Private E-Cash Manifesto" (https://darkcointalk.org/threads/darkcoin-private-e-cash-manifesto.2460/#post-22058) I don't need to be dismissed with a dogecoin remark just like that.

I get the Masternodes value but all my points still stay. I do believe the issue I raised is a potentially serious problem and would like someone to help me understand why it is not. (the problem)

Freudian slip, that!

to wozzek23

first : its not a fact that the price will rise substantially once we reached 3000 MN .. its very difficult to predict what the market does or will do in the nearby future. Really all we can do is pray and hope.
second : there will always be selllers who will sell at their own targetprice .. its a seller / buyer market after all with plenty day traders (just look at Bitcoin)
third : with mass-adoption comes a zillion ways to spent darkcoin (anonymously !), dont underestimate the power of buying and selling goods or services through cryptocurrency

[wozzek23]

Ponder this: as of today, 27.57% of ALL Darkcoins in circulation are already locked in Masternodes. On November 12th, less than a month ago, that percentage was 24.57% so the # of locked in coins outpaces the overall coins supply quite rapidly. [3% or for 40% on an annual basis] With the price as it is and the pace of MN growth we could see 50% off ALL coins being locked in Masternodes in less than six, perhaps four months.

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

It's a digital coin being able to be split into decimals. Each "whole" coin has 10,000,000 units and there will certainly be more than just 1 coin worth in circulation. That's plenty of liquidity. If you only look at it from the viewpoint of whole coins, then sure, there is a problem, but it's a non issue in something that could be split out even more decimals. It IS economics: supply and demand. As reward for masternodes increase, demand for masternodes increase. As the price per coin increases, some existing holders will sell some of their stash until an equilibrium is formed.
[/quote]

Yeah, I am aware of this argument - I think it was you telling me this the first time I raised the question. We may end up like that famous, one singular Richard Feynman electron (his one-electron universe postulate, meant as a joke) and have 1 Darkcoin in circulation that is than split into 10,000,000 unites that circulate and create the value.

I can't be sure but I don't see it as a solution for the problem. It is not entirely unlikely like another hypothetical situation in which your bank does not have dollar bills so it gives you 400,000,000.00 pennies to buy a car. (and the dollar is also mostly just digits in the Financial Crime Cartel's networks) I can't see a fraction of an unit as the base for the unit's value. I simply can't...

[coins101]

snip......

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain to me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Without master nodes you don't get anonymity or instant transactions.
You might as well use dogecoin.

next question....this time, make it harder so we need to break a sweat.

No, no, kindly do not go ad hominem just as easy as that.

As a member of Darkcoin Foundation, Darkcoin investor, MN owner and the author of the 1st draft "DARKCOIN: A Private E-Cash Manifesto" (https://darkcointalk.org/threads/darkcoin-private-e-cash-manifesto.2460/#post-22058) I don't need to be dismissed with a dogecoin remark just like that.

I get the Masternodes value but all my points still stay. I do believe the issue I raised is a potentially serious problem and would like someone to help me understand why it is not. (the problem)

ok. fair enough. I'm sorry.

Let me try another line of thinking.

As Sir Crouton would say, and Satoshi too (Sir Crouton is now part of crypto royalty), you just move the decimal point to suit circulation needs.

That's how 21 million bitcoins can underpin the global financial system. OR; how ~21m Darkcoins can underpin the global gov paper system

[superplus]

Ponder this: as of today, 27.57% of ALL Darkcoins in circulation are already locked in Masternodes. On November 12th, less than a month ago, that percentage was 24.57% so the # of locked in coins outpaces the overall coins supply quite rapidly. [3% or for 40% on an annual basis] With the price as it is and the pace of MN growth we could see 50% off ALL coins being locked in Masternodes in less than six, perhaps four months.

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

It's a digital coin being able to be split into decimals. Each "whole" coin has 10,000,000 units and there will certainly be more than just 1 coin worth in circulation. That's plenty of liquidity. If you only look at it from the viewpoint of whole coins, then sure, there is a problem, but it's a non issue in something that could be split out even more decimals. It IS economics: supply and demand. As reward for masternodes increase, demand for masternodes increase. As the price per coin increases, some existing holders will sell some of their stash until an equilibrium is formed.

Yeah, I am aware of this argument - I think it was you telling me this the first time I raised the question. We may end up like that famous, one singular Richard Feynman electron (his one-electron universe postulate, meant as a joke) and have 1 Darkcoin in circulation that is than split into 10,000,000 unites that circulate and create the value.

I can't be sure but I don't see it as a solution for the problem. It is not entirely unlikely like another hypothetical situation in which your bank does not have dollar bills so it gives you 400,000,000.00 pennies to buy a car. (and the dollar is also mostly just digits in the Financial Crime Cartel's networks) I can't see a fraction of an unit as the base for the unit's value. I simply can't...

what are u talking about? this scenario seems completely unrealistic..
if there would be that much master nodes, any boost in demand would rise the price very quick which leads to people selling their nodes to cover the volatility.
if there would be just 1 drk left on the market due to huge demand, the price would already be at a million dollars..
nobody would run master nodes at that prices, too many of them, too less reward, too much volatility in crypto

[Kai Proctor]

 

[TaoOfSaatoshi]

LOL! Thanks for posting that. Saved for future Twitter use!

[wozzek23]

As Sir Crouton would say, and Satoshi too (Sir Crouton is now part of crypto royalty), you just move the decimal point to suit circulation needs.

That's how 21 million bitcoins can underpin the global financial system. OR; how ~21m Darkcoins can underpin the global gov paper system

Thanks to all of you guys - qwizzie, strix, oblox (to Tao: all is fine) - for you contributions, I only do not want to quote everyone and hijack the board entirely  

OK, but if you "move the decimal point" you have increased the coins supply 10x. Remember the community's reaction when Evan suggested (in fact it was leaked) a coin merge a while ago? The "merger" would've been funded by Darkcoins. Evan even had a brilliant idea of decreasing the number of circulated coins so, at the end, the number of coins would stay the same. The community went berserk over what would've been, I think about 4% or so, for sure less than 10% (temporary) increase of the total number of coins.

I am not aware of that decimal point move idea, but it would resemble the fiat world in which with a flicker of pen (or an enter on a keyboard) you "create" 10 times more coins thusly defying the very core idea of a "finite number" and you're in a totally new ballgame whose rules do not exist yet. (who would "authorize" such increase? Ben Bernake or that new creature at the FED or "our equivalent" of it?)

By doing this you're taking the power out of mathematics - again, the very core of Bitcon / Darkcoin advantages - and give it back to the people, us, poor carbon based, sub-lunar, corruptible creatures...

[Kai Proctor]

Yeah, I am aware of this argument - I think it was you telling me this the first time I raised the question. We may end up like that famous, one singular Richard Feynman electron (his one-electron universe postulate, meant as a joke) and have 1 Darkcoin in circulation that is than split into 10,000,000 unites that circulate and create the value.

I can't be sure but I don't see it as a solution for the problem. It is not entirely unlikely like another hypothetical situation in which your bank does not have dollar bills so it gives you 400,000,000.00 pennies to buy a car. (and the dollar is also mostly just digits in the Financial Crime Cartel's networks) I can't see a fraction of an unit as the base for the unit's value. I simply can't...

The problem is that you still think physical (paper bills, metallic coins etc.) when you have to think digital, 1 DRK or 1 µDRK it doesn't matter ...

[oblox]

As Sir Crouton would say, and Satoshi too (Sir Crouton is now part of crypto royalty), you just move the decimal point to suit circulation needs.

That's how 21 million bitcoins can underpin the global financial system. OR; how ~21m Darkcoins can underpin the global gov paper system

Thanks to all of you guys - qwizzie, strix, oblox (to Tao: all is fine) - for you contributions, I only do not want to quote everyone and hijack the board entirely  

OK, but if you "move the decimal point" you have increased the coins supply 10x. Remember the community's reaction when Evan suggested (in fact it was leaked) a coin merge a while ago? The "merger" would've been funded by Darkcoins. Evan even had a brilliant idea of decreasing the number of circulated coins so, at the end, the number of coins would stay the same. The community went berserk over what would've been, I think about 4% or so, for sure less than 10% (temporary) increase of the total number of coins.

I am not aware of that decimal point move idea, but it would resemble the fiat world in which with a flicker of pen (or an enter on a keyboard) you "create" 10 times more coins thusly defying the very core idea of a "finite number" and you're in a totally new ballgame whose rules do not exist yet. (who would "authorize" such increase? Ben Bernake or that new creature at the FED or "our equivalent" of it?)

By doing this you're taking the power out of mathematics - again, the very core of Bitcon / Darkcoin advantages - and give it back to the people, us, poor carbon based, sub-lunar, corruptible creatures...

What are you talking about? Moving the decimal point in terms of how the client views a whole coin doesn't magically create 10x the supply (you would just show duffs in this case). The units are already there being that they go out to a duff. You are trying to solve a problem that doesn't exist.

[ddink7]

Total Masternodes: 1358 = 1358 actives + 0 inactives (Last refresh: Tue Dec 09 2014 19:12:37)
Estimated daily payout for an active node (blocks with MN payments last 24h: 100%): 0.58 DRK/day (Last Refreshed: Tue Dec 09 2014 19:12:42)

OMG what is going on? Are the top 10 wallets moving funds to masternodes?

I follow various Darkcoin related statistics data for my fun and this is the ONLY one I do not like. (aside the price that I don't get why is still as low as $2.25 or something). I raised the question, of coins being locked in the Masternode, wondering (hypothetically) what would happen if ALL the coins are locked out? Many a member told me it is too early to worry about it, and that pure economics would not allow any problems with it but I wonder / worry about LIQUIDITY!

Again, hypothetically, if only us - Darkcoin supporters - would buy the coins and at the end have ALL of them locked in MN, the value of one DRK could be a one million dollars for all I care, but who would buy the coin for a million? No one, I guarantee you. So, I might sell that one coin for a $1.00 (one dollar) in order to find a greedy buyer outside the community. And voila!, all the coins just lost 99.999999% of their value.

I don't buy an argument that scarcity would increase the price for the price itself is NOT, could NOT and SHOULD not be the only consideration.

I am currently at 28% loss with my Darkcoin investment. But I've also made 350% - in the last 30 days - on shorting Russian ruble on FOREX. (I'm sorry, our Russian friends, I hate to see how the Financial Crime Cartel is destroying your economy, but I could not let free money go away)  So, if I cared ONLY about the price / profit, I'd convert all my coins into a more profitable investment (at least on the short run) and forget about freedom, privacy, anonymity, cheap remittance of currency that is currently at 12% for fiat garbage, according to the World Bank (a $540 Billion market) and all sort of incredible benefits e-Cash (Darkcoin) could provide to the people all over the world. But if this cash sits in my MN or in my wallet and does nothing else but provide me, and only me, with a coin or two "reward", and the Network with some security, damn... something indeed might be wrong.

Ponder this: as of today, 27.57% of ALL Darkcoins in circulation are already locked in Masternodes. On November 12th, less than a month ago, that percentage was 24.57% so the # of locked in coins outpaces the overall coins supply quite rapidly. [3% or for 40% on an annual basis] With the price as it is and the pace of MN growth we could see 50% off ALL coins being locked in Masternodes in less than six, perhaps four months.

This simply CAN'T be good! I defy anyone to explain me how the currency out the circulation is going to be beneficial for our future users?

Not even one single coin is "locked up" in masternodes. I can spend any or all of the coins in my masternodes just as simply as you can spend the coins in your own wallet. I load up the wallet file (it's a cold wallet, as is prudent) and I spend the money. Easy peasy.

Now if I spend those DRKs, my MN will go offline. But it takes exactly 30 seconds to spend the money that's "tied up" in my masternodes.