Bitcoinica - Advanced Bitcoin Trading Platform

[Yuvea]

is there a chance the FAQ can be extended to detail the trading front-end?  So far, it seems like there's not much documentation available.

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[zhoutong]

is there a chance the FAQ can be extended to detail the trading front-end?  So far, it seems like there's not much documentation available.

We will release a Tour page soon. So that everyone can learn how to start trading.

Thanks for the feedback!

[fastandfurious]

This is awesome. A 17-year old in Singapore invents and implements a bitcoin bucket shop. I'm truly impressed. Imagine the financial fraud he'll invent and implement when he has at least 10 or 20 years of experience.

Ladies and Gentlemen!

We now have a new Jesse Lauriston Livermore and he lives in Singapore.

One big difference. Jesse Livermore made his money from trading at the Bucket Shops, not the other way around.

Besides that, he has done what Mt.Gox and the others should have done many months ago, he should have BIG credit for that, very intelligent indeed. I was looking for something like this, especially the opportunity to short sell. The market needs it, strange that it took a 17 year old to see it and to deliver it.

[zhoutong]

This is awesome. A 17-year old in Singapore invents and implements a bitcoin bucket shop. I'm truly impressed. Imagine the financial fraud he'll invent and implement when he has at least 10 or 20 years of experience.

Ladies and Gentlemen!

We now have a new Jesse Lauriston Livermore and he lives in Singapore.

What's so special about the country I'm living in? And what? "financial fraud"?

While I don't really understand what you mean, I have to say that the Bitcoin market is open for all, and new ideas are coming out every day. I urge you to look at the product itself instead of judging by other factors.

I'm not interested in unethically making other Bitcoin fans' money in this united community. What we want is to enlarge and enrich the Bitcoin market and Bitcoinica does the job of bringing in Forex traders.

[fastandfurious]

So, can you explain for us in detail what the fees are when you are leveraging?

[zhoutong]

So, can you explain for us in detail what the fees are when you are leveraging?

There are no fees.

We may implement margin interest for non-active traders. But currently there are zero fees in any kind of trading.

The spread is inclusive of everything. All trading, deposit and withdraw transactions (excluding wire) are free.

[fastandfurious]

So what is "maintenance"?

You should have a more detailed FAQ.

[omri]

This is awesome. A 17-year old in Singapore invents and implements a bitcoin bucket shop. I'm truly impressed. Imagine the financial fraud he'll invent and implement when he has at least 10 or 20 years of experience.

Ladies and Gentlemen!

We now have a new Jesse Lauriston Livermore and he lives in Singapore.

What's so special about the country I'm living in? And what? "financial fraud"?

Look at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Leeson
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barings_Bank

It all happened when you were a little baby.

[zhoutong]

So what is "maintenance"?

You should have a more detailed FAQ.

Yeah, indeed. I'm working on that.

FAQ is meant for FAQs. If some questions are frequently asked, I will definitely put in FAQ. Because we just launched the platform less than 2 days ago, I haven't collected that many questions. I apologize for that.

I will make a tour or even a documentation to explain these terms.


You can refer to this FAQ:

What's your Margin Call Policy?
After you've logged in, you can immediately see your real-time account Net Value (total assets) and Maintenance (minimum net value). When your Net Value falls below twice the amount of Maintenance, we will issue a margin call. If you don't take actions before your Net Value falls below Maintenance, all your positions will be liquidated automatically.

[zhoutong]

This is awesome. A 17-year old in Singapore invents and implements a bitcoin bucket shop. I'm truly impressed. Imagine the financial fraud he'll invent and implement when he has at least 10 or 20 years of experience.

Ladies and Gentlemen!

We now have a new Jesse Lauriston Livermore and he lives in Singapore.

What's so special about the country I'm living in? And what? "financial fraud"?

Look at:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Leeson
and
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Barings_Bank

It all happened when you were a little baby.

Alright, I came to Singapore 3 years ago. Didn't know this stuff.

But I decide what kind of person I want to be. I know many people are doubting my abilities in terms of security auditing and the financial concepts because of my age. But what I want to say is, Bitcoinica has added value into the Bitcoin market.

As a member of Bitcoin community, I really hope that everyone can judge this matter correctly. Will everyone be better off if I shut down Bitcoinica now? I don't think so.

If there's something I can't prove now, I will prove with time.

[Clark]

So this is basically a brokerage. You let your customers trade with one another and you hedge their positions on the exchange. Meanwhile, you extract a spread from all transactions.

I will pass on this product, as I am developing my own web-based trading platform that actually sends orders to the market.

[evoorhees]

Alright, I came to Singapore 3 years ago. Didn't know this stuff.

But I decide what kind of person I want to be. I know many people are doubting my abilities in terms of security auditing and the financial concepts because of my age. But what I want to say is, Bitcoinica has added value into the Bitcoin market.

As a member of Bitcoin community, I really hope that everyone can judge this matter correctly. Will everyone be better off if I shut down Bitcoinica now? I don't think so.

If there's something I can't prove now, I will prove with time.

Zhoutong... I'm very impressed with what you've created so quickly. People are understandably skeptical, but I'm sure you'll be proving yourself over time. Bitcoin is much stronger because there are ambitious people like you building new systems. Keep it up!

If my Dwolla clears into MtGox today I might try out some of this margin stuff on your site

[zhoutong]

Alright, I came to Singapore 3 years ago. Didn't know this stuff.

But I decide what kind of person I want to be. I know many people are doubting my abilities in terms of security auditing and the financial concepts because of my age. But what I want to say is, Bitcoinica has added value into the Bitcoin market.

As a member of Bitcoin community, I really hope that everyone can judge this matter correctly. Will everyone be better off if I shut down Bitcoinica now? I don't think so.

If there's something I can't prove now, I will prove with time.

Zhoutong... I'm very impressed with what you've created so quickly. People are understandably skeptical, but I'm sure you'll be proving yourself over time. Bitcoin is much stronger because there are ambitious people like you building new systems. Keep it up!

If my Dwolla clears into MtGox today I might try out some of this margin stuff on your site

Thank you so much for your active support!

Enjoy your trading!

[Clark]

So this is basically a brokerage. You let your customers trade with one another and you hedge their positions on the exchange. Meanwhile, you extract a spread from all transactions.

I will pass on this product, as I am developing my own web-based trading platform that actually sends orders to the market.

I don't mean this to say that your product will fail. This is basically the only way that consumer forex works on the market today. You will find plenty of happy customers. I just wish you would be a little more up front with the details of how this works since your customers are used to all orders going to the market.

[zhoutong]

So this is basically a brokerage. You let your customers trade with one another and you hedge their positions on the exchange. Meanwhile, you extract a spread from all transactions.

I will pass on this product, as I am developing my own web-based trading platform that actually sends orders to the market.

That will be a good try. It seems that Bitcoinica will get competitors soon. (Haha, joking.)

I think yours is like a web-based API wrapper. That will be useful for traders who are not comfortable with other exchanges' interfaces or want more features that can be done via API.

Actually being a brokerage is just the very beginning for Bitcoinica. We have future plans too. We will keep everyone updated.

Taking this strategy makes Bitcoinica the third largest trading platform right now (3,724 BTC traded in first 24 hours). We have successfully avoided the network effect associated with every exchange. (Positive feedback loop: Thin order book -> No volume -> No traders -> Thin order book -> No volume ...)

[Alex Zee]

17 years old made it??? Holy shit. You must be genius, zhoutong.

Very impressive!

[Isepick]

Thank you, as a miner I now have a way to hedge my losses when the exchange rate gets too low. I would have went short at $10 had this service been around. MtG and Tradehill should have done this a while ago. Takes a 17 yr old to actually get the things done we've been promised elsewhere for months. Again, Thank you.

[zhoutong]

I want to say that I don't think you

So this is basically a brokerage. You let your customers trade with one another and you hedge their positions on the exchange. Meanwhile, you extract a spread from all transactions.

I will pass on this product, as I am developing my own web-based trading platform that actually sends orders to the market.

I don't mean this to say that your product will fail. This is basically the only way that consumer forex works on the market today. You will find plenty of happy customers. I just wish you would be a little more up front with the details of how this works since your customers are used to all orders going to the market.

I understand your point. But I target different customers.

I don't want to grab market share from Mt. Gox or TradeHill. They are, instead, my partners.

The only way to build a new Bitcoin trading platform today is to get investors from elsewhere. Our aim is forex traders (especially day traders).

Mt. Gox and TradeHill are like stock markets, which are okay for a relatively small market like Bitcoin. But what if we want to make it larger? This is how abstraction comes in.

My design approach is to take out the noise: If Bitcoin is really a currency, why should we care so much about BTCUSD's volume? Why should we even see the order book? I know these are two important components for every market, but it's not important to everyone. Here, Bitcoinica guarantees liquidity, gives people the opportunities to use margin and do short selling, and giving quotes with acceptable spreads.

It saves people's time, money and creates a lot more opportunities for various kinds of investments.

I built Bitcoinica because I wanted a completely revolutionary platform. I have always been trading on Mt. Gox, if I don't need it, I won't start from scratch and build it. Now I trade on Bitcoinica myself. I think it's a good thing and I should share with people, while at the same time I can make small profits to fund my future projects.

[WiseOldOwl]

My god you beat me too this.
Congrats!
Not being able to code is absolutely costing me a fortune. It is pretty much the worst knowing what to do and not having the means to do it.
If anyone has the means to do it but doesnt know what to do, they should hit me up. LOL

[Clark]

Mt. Gox and TradeHill are like stock markets, which are okay for a relatively small market like Bitcoin. But what if we want to make it larger? This is how abstraction comes in.

My design approach is to take out the noise: If Bitcoin is really a currency, why should we care so much about BTCUSD's volume? Why should we even see the order book? I know these are two important components for every market, but it's not important to everyone. Here, Bitcoinica guarantees liquidity, gives people the opportunities to use margin and do short selling, and giving quotes with acceptable spreads.

The reason brokerages exist in the stock / forex markets is because the exchanges charge large fees to have a seat at the table. Since the Bitcoin exchanges are free for everyone to use, this reduces the role of a brokerage. Now, you are providing a valuable service to people by allowing short and long positions as well as the different types of orders. I think you will have success with your clients, but there is a shade of mistruth about what you do.

My position is one of a fundamental philosophical difference. I think that short selling should actually produce an effect on the market. I think that every order should touch the market. If someone sells short, you are not actually lending them the Bitcoin as happens in the stock markets. If someone gets a margin call from you, it's not because your clearing institution is asking you to settle your account before close of business.

Without touching the market, it's all just numbers in your database.