[NEM] NEM -New Economy Movement - No Envy Movement - Updates+Discussion thread

[Eadeqa]

"all country coins would still be listed as someone (developer) owns them" ---> it should. (I should be corrected here - if the dev. are allowed to sell the premine then they are outstanding shares, otherwise they re not).  CMC should not list coin that has a sign of market manipulation but it is incorrect to not count the premine.

This was the main problem that country coins exploited to get on top of the list, even though 50 to 70 percent were not tradable and were "locked" for future release to a country.

Only stakes that are available for trade on asset exchanges should be counted to calculate market cap --

coinmarketcap will not make the same mistake as they did with country coin, artificially inflating the ranking.  I think he already learnt his lesson,

[1714224849]

1714224849

[1714224849]

1714224849

[1714224849]

1714224849

[Eadeqa]

I think that we should have own NEM wallet (at least the alpha version release) , before NEM listed on CoinMarketCap.

I think it should not be listed at all -- not on regular list -- until official launch. Same should apply to mediasafe.

Maybe there can be separate list for assets. It would be fine on that list

[utopianfuture]

"all country coins would still be listed as someone (developer) owns them" ---> it should. (I should be corrected here - if the dev. are allowed to sell the premine then they are outstanding shares, otherwise they re not).  CMC should not list coin that has a sign of market manipulation but it is incorrect to not count the premine.

This was the main problem that country coins exploited to get on top of the list, even though 50 to 70 percent were not tradable and were "locked" for future release to a country.

Only stakes that are available for trade on asset exchanges should be counted to calculate market cap --

coinmarketcap will not make the same mistake as they did with country coin, artificially inflating the ranking.  I think he already learnt his lesson,

In the case of country, the coins are locked up for a purpose so they are not outstanding shares. In the case of NEM, no regular share is locked up. For example: any stakeholder can request a token and sell it tomorrow. It is real money and completely actionable. If NEM stake shoot up to 10.000$ tomorrow, I am sure the tokens will be running out pretty fast. It does not stop there. I am open to list else where as long as there are requests so ALL shares are actually tradable and sellable.

I did not talk with Gliss yet but you can bet that NEM will be listed in CMC before the official launch as long as he think maidsafe could be there.

[TwinWinNerD]

"all country coins would still be listed as someone (developer) owns them" ---> it should. (I should be corrected here - if the dev. are allowed to sell the premine then they are outstanding shares, otherwise they re not).  CMC should not list coin that has a sign of market manipulation but it is incorrect to not count the premine.

This was the main problem that country coins exploited to get on top of the list, even though 50 to 70 percent were not tradable and were "locked" for future release to a country.

Only stakes that are available for trade on asset exchanges should be counted to calculate market cap --

coinmarketcap will not make the same mistake as they did with country coin, artificially inflating the ranking.  I think he already learnt his lesson,

In the case of country, the coins are locked up for a purpose so they are not outstanding shares. In the case of NEM, no regular share is locked up. For example: any stakeholder can request a token and sell it tomorrow. It is real money and completely actionable. If NEM stake shoot up to 10.000$ tomorrow, I am sure the tokens will be running out pretty fast. It does not stop there. I am open to list else where as long as there are requests so ALL shares are actually tradable and sellable.

I did not talk with Gliss yet but you can bet that NEM will be listed in CMC before the official launch as long as he think maidsafe could be there.

How much do you want to bet? :p

Gliss also has the requirement that the trading must be on atleast one exchange with a good trackrecord and a good API. I don't think he will implement his own implementation for the AE just for one asset. So I wouldn't be so sure about getting listed

[utopianfuture]

"all country coins would still be listed as someone (developer) owns them" ---> it should. (I should be corrected here - if the dev. are allowed to sell the premine then they are outstanding shares, otherwise they re not).  CMC should not list coin that has a sign of market manipulation but it is incorrect to not count the premine.

This was the main problem that country coins exploited to get on top of the list, even though 50 to 70 percent were not tradable and were "locked" for future release to a country.

Only stakes that are available for trade on asset exchanges should be counted to calculate market cap --

coinmarketcap will not make the same mistake as they did with country coin, artificially inflating the ranking.  I think he already learnt his lesson,

In the case of country, the coins are locked up for a purpose so they are not outstanding shares. In the case of NEM, no regular share is locked up. For example: any stakeholder can request a token and sell it tomorrow. It is real money and completely actionable. If NEM stake shoot up to 10.000$ tomorrow, I am sure the tokens will be running out pretty fast. It does not stop there. I am open to list else where as long as there are requests so ALL shares are actually tradable and sellable.

I did not talk with Gliss yet but you can bet that NEM will be listed in CMC before the official launch as long as he think maidsafe could be there.

How much do you want to bet? :p

Gliss also has the requirement that the trading must be on atleast one exchange with a good trackrecord and a good API. I don't think he will implement his own implementation for the AE just for one asset. So I wouldn't be so sure about getting listed

Big enough so I can pay him to implement technicality.

[utopianfuture]

I think that we should have own NEM wallet (at least the alpha version release) , before NEM listed on CoinMarketCap.

I think it should not be listed at all -- not on regular list -- until official launch. Same should apply to mediasafe.

Maybe there can be separate list for assets. It would be fine on that list

I partly agree. NEMstake is an asset rather than a coin.

[TwinWinNerD]

"all country coins would still be listed as someone (developer) owns them" ---> it should. (I should be corrected here - if the dev. are allowed to sell the premine then they are outstanding shares, otherwise they re not).  CMC should not list coin that has a sign of market manipulation but it is incorrect to not count the premine.

This was the main problem that country coins exploited to get on top of the list, even though 50 to 70 percent were not tradable and were "locked" for future release to a country.

Only stakes that are available for trade on asset exchanges should be counted to calculate market cap --

coinmarketcap will not make the same mistake as they did with country coin, artificially inflating the ranking.  I think he already learnt his lesson,

In the case of country, the coins are locked up for a purpose so they are not outstanding shares. In the case of NEM, no regular share is locked up. For example: any stakeholder can request a token and sell it tomorrow. It is real money and completely actionable. If NEM stake shoot up to 10.000$ tomorrow, I am sure the tokens will be running out pretty fast. It does not stop there. I am open to list else where as long as there are requests so ALL shares are actually tradable and sellable.

I did not talk with Gliss yet but you can bet that NEM will be listed in CMC before the official launch as long as he think maidsafe could be there.

How much do you want to bet? :p

Gliss also has the requirement that the trading must be on atleast one exchange with a good trackrecord and a good API. I don't think he will implement his own implementation for the AE just for one asset. So I wouldn't be so sure about getting listed

Big enough so I can pay him to implement technicality.

Touchê!

But still I don't think the AE qualifies as an exchange with a proven trackrecored in his books. Also no coin build on XCP/RIPPLE ect is listed.

Nonetheless, will be nice to see some novelty

[utopianfuture]

"all country coins would still be listed as someone (developer) owns them" ---> it should. (I should be corrected here - if the dev. are allowed to sell the premine then they are outstanding shares, otherwise they re not).  CMC should not list coin that has a sign of market manipulation but it is incorrect to not count the premine.

This was the main problem that country coins exploited to get on top of the list, even though 50 to 70 percent were not tradable and were "locked" for future release to a country.

Only stakes that are available for trade on asset exchanges should be counted to calculate market cap --

coinmarketcap will not make the same mistake as they did with country coin, artificially inflating the ranking.  I think he already learnt his lesson,

In the case of country, the coins are locked up for a purpose so they are not outstanding shares. In the case of NEM, no regular share is locked up. For example: any stakeholder can request a token and sell it tomorrow. It is real money and completely actionable. If NEM stake shoot up to 10.000$ tomorrow, I am sure the tokens will be running out pretty fast. It does not stop there. I am open to list else where as long as there are requests so ALL shares are actually tradable and sellable.

I did not talk with Gliss yet but you can bet that NEM will be listed in CMC before the official launch as long as he think maidsafe could be there.

How much do you want to bet? :p

Gliss also has the requirement that the trading must be on atleast one exchange with a good trackrecord and a good API. I don't think he will implement his own implementation for the AE just for one asset. So I wouldn't be so sure about getting listed

Big enough so I can pay him to implement technicality.

Touchê!

But still I don't think the AE qualifies as an exchange with a proven trackrecored in his books. Also no coin build on XCP/RIPPLE ect is listed.

Nonetheless, will be nice to see some novelty

He already said he is looking for Nxt asset API to implement Nxt asset. That is without any "special" incentive.

[Kuttingcorners]

i wish i bought a stake for my gf i didn't realize you were able to do that till it was too late.

[TwinWinNerD]

i wish i bought a stake for my gf i didn't realize you were able to do that till it was too late.

Feel free to buy a stake in the asset exchange.

[xtester]

NEM's Great Equality Experiment And The Marshmallow Test

What Equality Means?

The other day I found myself reflecting on NEM, what it is and what we all want to make of it. It seems there is a great discussion going on in the world regarding inequality and so NEM equality experiment comes at the precisely right point in time. As usual I think people focus on the wrong things. We should strive to give people equal opportunities, but they are not and should not be equal in outcome. In fact, though most of us start as equal now, I have no doubt we will not end as equal. If high productivity people work and risk 10x more than the other people, it's common sense that they should also be rewarded 10x more. Indeed, I think this kind of inequality is a natural and even necessary effect of the free market. If you would want to cut this kind of inequality off, you would also have to cut startups, inventions and innovations with it, since this may be the greatest driver for that.

Here are two quotes with which I tend to agree:

Worry about skin in the game, not inequality. Worry about equality in opportunity not outcome. Worry about the powerful corporations taking over the system via lobbyists and blocking artisans. Worry about the class of privileged mandarins-WNSITG (with no skin in the game) taking over the system via "grandes ecoles"..." - Nassim Nicholas Taleb

Free people are not equal, and equal people are not free. - Unknown

NEM And The Altcoin Landscape

Unfortunately the altcoin landscape is currently plagued with cheap scams and elaborate pump and dump schemes along with a horde of impulsive people enjoying playing this game. However NEM has nothing to do with this landscape. While we may well go through a cambrian crypto-explosion phase, NEM seems to be already between the fittest and is only getting stronger every passing day.

I know things are more complex but for the sake of simplicity consider the following graph:

                                                                              The Altcoin Landscape

                                
                             Cheap Scams          Elaborate Scams             Clones                Low Innovation         Deep Innovation
                                      I--------------------I--------------------I--------------------I--------------------I

       Approx. Time:        1 Day                      1 Week                  1 Month               3 - 6 Months                1 Year

      Approx. Difficulty:      1/10                       2/10                       4/10                       6/10                       10/10

Approx. Value Created:    1 btc                      10 btc                     50 btc                    100 btc                    10000 btc



You must understand that while it would take 1 day to create a cheap scam, 1 month to clone a complex coin like Nxt, it would probably take at least about 1 year to invent a deeply innovative coin if you have all other necessary resources at your disposal¹(Nxt would be good example of that). Indeed, it would be both stupid and frustrating to confuse deep innovation with clones or low innovation and demand otherwise. NEM aims to bring deep innovation on multiple levels, so when the alpha version along with more interesting details will be disclosed, I think a lot of people will get very excited and some will even get nervous. Indeed this could be one of the most important developments of the altcoin world in 2014. But as you might understand, until the right moment comes, most of these details need to be kept secret for obvious strategic reasons.

Anyway, starting with our extremely competent and responsible dev team, our large, talented and diverse community, our fair distribution and equality experiment, I think you can all see that with each passing day NEM is evolving to be a whole different kind of creature, unlike anything you have seen it the altcoin world until now. But in order to see that, you must get out of the noisy and impulsive crowd and focus on the signal. If you look close enough I'm sure you won't be disappointed.

The Marshmallow Test And Financial Freedom

It seems there are two major impediments on the road to financial freedom. One of them is the economic and banking system which we are trying to solve at least partially through NEM. The other one is a bit more counter-intuitive and less thought of, it's ourselves(with all the decisions and wrong moves we make). If we want to achieve something we must shift from a consumer mindset to a producer mindset, and therein lies the key.

Looking at the marshmallow experiment which emphasizes self-control and delayed gratification as a better predictor of success than IQ, I can only wonder what all those people selling NEM now will think in a couple of months.

If you would have to choose between receiving 1.5 btc for your share now or delaying gratification to receive at least 10x that amount in a couple of months, what would you choose?

If self-control and delayed gratification are a good predictor of success, it seems quite obvious to me, impulsivity may be an even better predictor of failure.

So in the end, I can only say be wise and make smart decisions because although we all start with an equal opportunity, ultimately our decisions, contributions and productivity will decide our outcome, and trust me, as it looks, there won't be any equality in that.




References
¹ Through necessary resources I mean an enormous amount of brain power, time and energy to invest and conceptualize such a novel technology and an even greater amount of brainpower, time, energy and determination to transform things from the realm of ideas to reality. But it gets even more intriguing, since although these resources are necessary, in a lot of cases they may still not be sufficient.

[makoto1337]

NEM equality experiment and the marshmallow test

What equality means?

The other day I found myself reflecting on NEM, what it is and what we all want to make of it. It seems there is a great discussion going on in the world regarding inequality and so NEM equality experiment comes at the precisely right point in time. As usual I think people focus on the wrong things. We should strive to give people equal opportunities, but they are not and should not be equal in outcome. In fact, though most of us start as equal now, I have no doubt we will not end es equal. If high productivity people work and risk 10x more than the other people, it's common sense that they should also be rewarded 10x more. Indeed, I think this kind of inequality is a natural and even necessary effect of the free market. If you would want to cut this kind of inequality off, you would also have to cut startups, inventions and innovations with it, since this may be the greatest driver for that.

Here are two quotes with which I tend to agree:

Worry about skin in the game, not inequality. Worry about equality in opportunity not outcome. Worry about the powerful corporations taking over the system via lobbyists and blocking artisans. Worry about the class of privileged mandarins-WNSITG (with no skin in the game) taking over the system via "grandes ecoles"..." - Nassim Nicholas Taleb

Free people are not equal, and equal people are not free. - Unknown

The altcoin landscape and financial freedom

Unfortunately the altcoin landscape is currently plagued with cheap scams, elaborate pump and dump schems and a lot of impulsive people to play this game. However NEM has nothing to do with this landscape. While we may well go through a cambrian crypto-explosion phase, NEM seems to be already between the fittest and is only getting stronger every passing day.

I know things are more complex but for the sake of simplicity consider the following graph:

                                                                              The Altcoin Landscape

                                
                             Cheap Scams          Elaborate Scams             Clones                Low Innovation         Deep Innovation
                                      I--------------------I--------------------I--------------------I--------------------I

       Approx. Time:        1 Day                      1 Week                  1 Month               3 - 6 Months                1 Year

      Approx. Difficulty:      1/10                       2/10                       4/10                       6/10                       10/10

Approx. Value Created:    1 btc                      10 btc                     50 btc                    100 btc                    10000 btc



What you must understand is that while it would take 1 day to create a cheap scam, 1 month to clone a complex coin like Nxt, it would probably take around 1 year to invent a deeply innovative coin if you have all other necessary resources at your disposal(Nxt would be good example of that). Indeed, it would be both stupid and frustrating to confuse deep innovation with clones or low innovation and demand otherwise. NEM aims to bring deep innovation on multiple levels, so when alpha and more details will be out, I think people will get very excited. Indeed this could be one of the most important developments of the altcoin world in 2014.

Starting with our extremely competent and responsible dev team, our large, talented and diverse community, our fair distribution and equality experiment, I think you can see with each passing day, NEM is evolving to be a whole different creature than anything you have seen it the altcoin world until now. But in order to see that, you must get out of the noisy and impulsive crowd and focus on the signal. If you look close enough I'm sure you won't be disappointed.

NEM and marshmallows

It seems there are two major impediments on the road to financial freedom. One of them is the economic and banking system which we are trying to solve at least partially through NEM. The other one is a bit more counter-intuitive and less thought of, it's ourselves(with all the decisions and wrong moves we make). If we want to achieve something we must shift from a consumer mindset to a producer mindset.

Looking at the marshmallow experiment which emphasizes self-control and delayed gratification as a better predictor of success than IQ, I can only wonder what all those people selling NEM now will think in a couple of months.

If you would have to choose between receiving 1.5 btc for your share now or delaying gratification and receiving 10x that amount in a couple of months, what would you choose?

If self-control and delayed gratification are a good predictor of success, it seems to me impulsivity may be an even better predictor of failure.

So in the end, I can only say be wise and make smart decisions because although we all start with an equal opportunity, ultimately our decisions, contributions and productivity will decide our outcome, and trust me, as it looks, there won't be any equality in that.

Another great and informative post!

I really feel that crypto 3.0 will be an interface/information presentation revolution. We can use technology to give people better information and help them make informed decisions.

[Tompa]

NEM equality experiment and the marshmallow test

Thank you for this great post and wisdom.

[Kuttingcorners]

i wish i bought a stake for my gf i didn't realize you were able to do that till it was too late.

Feel free to buy a stake in the asset exchange.

thats funny because i was on the fence about buying one now that it 15 times the first price, but once i looked at the new wallet i knew i wanted to get one for her so i just bought a bunch of net

[BVeyron]

Interesting! Read with curiosity!

[dewey556]

I was wondering why there was a large amount of stake dumpers but then I remembered this experiment (delayed gratification)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QX_oy9614HQ

you can either eat it now or you can wait.


edit: I didnt even read the post above mentioning the same thing   what a coincident

[LifeisGreat88088]

NEM equality experiment and the marshmallow test

What equality means?

The other day I found myself reflecting on NEM, what it is and what we all want to make of it. It seems there is a great discussion going on in the world regarding inequality and so NEM equality experiment comes at the precisely right point in time. As usual I think people focus on the wrong things. We should strive to give people equal opportunities, but they are not and should not be equal in outcome. In fact, though most of us start as equal now, I have no doubt we will not end es equal. If high productivity people work and risk 10x more than the other people, it's common sense that they should also be rewarded 10x more. Indeed, I think this kind of inequality is a natural and even necessary effect of the free market. If you would want to cut this kind of inequality off, you would also have to cut startups, inventions and innovations with it, since this may be the greatest driver for that.

Here are two quotes with which I tend to agree:

Worry about skin in the game, not inequality. Worry about equality in opportunity not outcome. Worry about the powerful corporations taking over the system via lobbyists and blocking artisans. Worry about the class of privileged mandarins-WNSITG (with no skin in the game) taking over the system via "grandes ecoles"..." - Nassim Nicholas Taleb

Free people are not equal, and equal people are not free. - Unknown

The altcoin landscape and financial freedom

Unfortunately the altcoin landscape is currently plagued with cheap scams, elaborate pump and dump schems and a lot of impulsive people to play this game. However NEM has nothing to do with this landscape. While we may well go through a cambrian crypto-explosion phase, NEM seems to be already between the fittest and is only getting stronger every passing day.

I know things are more complex but for the sake of simplicity consider the following graph:

                                                                              The Altcoin Landscape

                                
                             Cheap Scams          Elaborate Scams             Clones                Low Innovation         Deep Innovation
                                      I--------------------I--------------------I--------------------I--------------------I

       Approx. Time:        1 Day                      1 Week                  1 Month               3 - 6 Months                1 Year

      Approx. Difficulty:      1/10                       2/10                       4/10                       6/10                       10/10

Approx. Value Created:    1 btc                      10 btc                     50 btc                    100 btc                    10000 btc



What you must understand is that while it would take 1 day to create a cheap scam, 1 month to clone a complex coin like Nxt, it would probably take around 1 year to invent a deeply innovative coin if you have all other necessary resources at your disposal(Nxt would be good example of that). Indeed, it would be both stupid and frustrating to confuse deep innovation with clones or low innovation and demand otherwise. NEM aims to bring deep innovation on multiple levels, so when alpha and more details will be out, I think people will get very excited. Indeed this could be one of the most important developments of the altcoin world in 2014.

Starting with our extremely competent and responsible dev team, our large, talented and diverse community, our fair distribution and equality experiment, I think you can see with each passing day, NEM is evolving to be a whole different creature than anything you have seen it the altcoin world until now. But in order to see that, you must get out of the noisy and impulsive crowd and focus on the signal. If you look close enough I'm sure you won't be disappointed.

NEM and marshmallows

It seems there are two major impediments on the road to financial freedom. One of them is the economic and banking system which we are trying to solve at least partially through NEM. The other one is a bit more counter-intuitive and less thought of, it's ourselves(with all the decisions and wrong moves we make). If we want to achieve something we must shift from a consumer mindset to a producer mindset.

Looking at the marshmallow experiment which emphasizes self-control and delayed gratification as a better predictor of success than IQ, I can only wonder what all those people selling NEM now will think in a couple of months.

If you would have to choose between receiving 1.5 btc for your share now or delaying gratification and receiving 10x that amount in a couple of months, what would you choose?

If self-control and delayed gratification are a good predictor of success, it seems to me impulsivity may be an even better predictor of failure.

So in the end, I can only say be wise and make smart decisions because although we all start with an equal opportunity, ultimately our decisions, contributions and productivity will decide our outcome, and trust me, as it looks, there won't be any equality in that.

Another great and informative post!

I really feel that crypto 3.0 will be an interface/information presentation revolution. We can use technology to give people better information and help them make informed decisions.

Really great post.

[vemdoctor9]

Two good lines in this post....

Free people are not equal, and equal people are not free. - Unknown

NEM is evolving to be a whole different kind of creature, unlike anything you have seen it the altcoin world until now.

Great.  What are the features and innovations that make NEM so powerful?

[xtester]

Just made some minor additions and corrections to what I have posted above.

[Tompa]

Just made some minor additions and corrections.

Where please?