★ ZEIT ★ [COMMUNITY & KNIGHTS] [ULTRA LOW INFLATION] [MICRO-PAYMENTS]

[stevegreer]

I agree with CapSer, this downtrend, though temporary I'm sure, is alarming. We were making great strides and have come too far to allow our coin to be trashed by dumpers looking to make a quick buck off of the LTC pump. That goes against the grain of our strive for this coin to be a long term investment.
One one hand, it is good that weak hands are handing over their coins for cheap, but on the other hand, losing that much value in that short of a time does not look good for potential new investors.
Now, I will be the first to admit that I am nowhere near genius level when it comes to investing, so maybe I've got it all wrong. Someone please correct me if I do so that I can learn something about it. But anyway, as a Knight, I am more than willing to forego the interest I would earn and move a few million Zeit into some walls if this action would help stabilize and prevent further losses.

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[CapSER2.0]

The main function of the exchange markets is to provide liquidity to the people who need it, and also to acquire a serious currency savings, in our case ZEIT.
A healthy currency is one that has a volume of trade interesting and important and that does not vary much in price! It is tolerable to vary by 20% for occasional needs of large holders, but very large variations works against us all we want to ZEIT!

Suggestion to solve this: That the large holders of ZEIT have about 5 u 10% of its liquid capital well in LTC or BTC, to meet the occasional needs and demands of other holders who need cash, and prevent collapses of ZEIT in a way unacceptable!

It is a bestiality that an individual sells 20 million of ZEIT and the price falls more than 40% !!!!!!!!!!!!!
There 31,964,912,390 ZEIT in circulation, and an individual sells 20,000,000 (0.06%) and produces a disaster!!!  

[CapSER2.0]

It can not be that one or two or three Knights make a sacrifice for everyone! When the benefits are for everyone!

Yesterday I spent my money buying ZEIT up to 294 litoshis! And for what? For the rest see comfortable good film to watch how it ends! It's not like that !!!! 

[Rent_a_Ray]

We aren't sitting idle, Capser2.0
Without the active knighthood neither the high of 485 nor stopping the dump at 142 were possible.
There are 4-6 active knights, but we need all knights. That was the primary idea behind.
Criticism isn't the solution but support.
I personally have 100 LTC in buy support - how much do you have?

Visit the official forum - there you'll find a hidden area prepared for the knights. (Sanctum of Knights)

Cheers,
Ray

[CapSER2.0]

We aren't sitting idle, Capser2.0
Without the active knighthood neither the high of 485 nor stopping the dump at 142 were possible.
There are 4-6 active knights, but we need all knights. That was the primary idea behind.
Criticism isn't the solution but support.
I personally have 100 LTC in buy support - how much do you have?

Visit the official forum - there you'll find a hidden area prepared for the knights. (Sanctum of Knights)

Cheers,
Ray

OK thanks Rent_a_Ray!
I will be more active from now on, having some LTC or BTC available for withstand crashes like these. And I think we should all do the same, and act when necessary to avoid unacceptable collapses.

[kiklo]

OK,

Lets be clear this is not a race that is over today , or next week.

This is a Marathon , that will last for years before the Final Winner is chosen.

If the price lowers , then that allows new people to enter at a lower price, also allowing more Knights to meet the requirements of joining in March of 2016. It also shakes out the ones that have no faith in Zeit, and would just dump later anyway.

Lets step back for a minute.
Last year we were only $22,000 market cap, we were at ~$200,000 before the litecoin pump,
that pump placed us, over $700,000 in less than a month. Those craving cash sold out to get a quick buck, their choice. This lower Zeit to currently $394,977, that is still almost a doubling from 2 months ago.
So in 2 months our Marketcap doubled and now everyone is worried about the sky falling ?  

When I look at this we are doing Amazing well , especially considering Zeit is less than 2 years old.

 


FYI:
Why Zeit can't lose, if the price of Litecoin keeps rising , then our market cap keep growing, even if dumpers dump.
If Litecoin hit rock bottom, then everyone would buy up zeit so fast, that our Marketcap would skyrocket.
Zeit is the only WIN / WIN coin out there.
Something to thing about.  

[solarion]

It can not be that one or two or three Knights make a sacrifice for everyone! When the benefits are for everyone!

Yesterday I spent my money buying ZEIT up to 294 litoshis! And for what? For the rest see comfortable good film to watch how it ends! It's not like that !!!!  

This price manipulation is the work of one bot(or two if you count both craptsy markets). Craptsy ALWAYS has the lowest price and it's often half what it is at the other markets due to this manipulation. Just watch the fake price action at craptsy for a few minutes and this fact becomes clear. It's obvious a well stocked bot is manipulating the price discovery mechanism and holding ZeitCoin down.

To combat this we all need to work together and break the bot's owner. I've added 40LTCs worth of buy support to the already large order at 168 on the craptsy ZEIT/LTC market. Infighting and blaming each other isn't going to help, but if we all work together and make a huge wall then the bot will either break itself trying to drop the price even lower or we'll all get really cheap ZeitCoin. I believe the bot will take down the price as soon as litecoin gains significant ground against BTC & fiat, so help break JP Morgan ...er the manipulator by piling on at 168.

[CapSER2.0]

I agree with CapSer, this downtrend, though temporary I'm sure, is alarming. We were making great strides and have come too far to allow our coin to be trashed by dumpers looking to make a quick buck off of the LTC pump. That goes against the grain of our strive for this coin to be a long term investment.
One one hand, it is good that weak hands are handing over their coins for cheap, but on the other hand, losing that much value in that short of a time does not look good for potential new investors.
Now, I will be the first to admit that I am nowhere near genius level when it comes to investing, so maybe I've got it all wrong. Someone please correct me if I do so that I can learn something about it. But anyway, as a Knight, I am more than willing to forego the interest I would earn and move a few million Zeit into some walls if this action would help stabilize and prevent further losses.

I think that you think very well, and we agree on a lot!
And thank you very much for your sacrifice on behalf of all!

[stevegreer]

OK,

Lets be clear this is not a race that is over today , or next week.

This is a Marathon , that will last for years before the Final Winner is chosen.

If the price lowers , then that allows new people to enter at a lower price, also allowing more Knights to meet the requirements of joining in March of 2016. It also shakes out the ones that have no faith in Zeit, and would just dump later anyway.

Lets step back for a minute.
Last year we were only $22,000 market cap, we were at ~$200,000 before the litecoin pump,
that pump placed us, over $700,000 in less than a month. Those craving cash sold out to get a quick buck, their choice. This lower Zeit to currently $394,977, that is still almost a doubling from 2 months ago.
So in 2 months our Marketcap doubled and now everyone is worried about the sky falling ?  

When I look at this we are doing Amazing well , especially considering Zeit is less than 2 years old.

 


FYI:
Why Zeit can't lose, if the price of Litecoin keeps rising , then our market cap keep growing, even if dumpers dump.
If Litecoin hit rock bottom, then everyone would buy up zeit so fast, that our Marketcap would skyrocket.
Zeit is the only WIN / WIN coin out there.
Something to thing about.  

Kiklo, you have a gift of words, my friend. You explained that well. So I say, you big money holders do your thing and let's keep enjoying our coin and community! Viva la Zeit!

[john_doe]

I think there's a bit of paranoia here. Why would anyone want to destroy zeitcoin? You can't even do that anyway. At best you can temporarily lower its price and that's it. Just relax and enjoy the cheap prices

[CapSER2.0]

It can not be that one or two or three Knights make a sacrifice for everyone! When the benefits are for everyone!

Yesterday I spent my money buying ZEIT up to 294 litoshis! And for what? For the rest see comfortable good film to watch how it ends! It's not like that !!!!  

This price manipulation is the work of one bot(or two if you count both craptsy markets). Craptsy ALWAYS has the lowest price and it's often half what it is at the other markets due to this manipulation. Just watch the fake price action at craptsy for a few minutes and this fact becomes clear. It's obvious a well stocked bot is manipulating the price discovery mechanism and holding ZeitCoin down.

To combat this we all need to work together and break the bot's owner. I've added 40LTCs worth of buy support to the already large order at 168 on the craptsy ZEIT/LTC market. Infighting and blaming each other isn't going to help, but if we all work together and make a huge wall then the bot will either break itself trying to drop the price even lower or we'll all get really cheap ZeitCoin. I believe the bot will take down the price as soon as litecoin gains significant ground against BTC & fiat, so help break JP Morgan ...er the manipulator by piling on at 168.

Thanks Solarion!!! Your work is excellent!!! I will strengthen your price support for creating super containment wall that prevents unjustified and disproportionate crashes!  

[kiklo]

I think there's a bit of paranoia here. Why would anyone want to destroy zeitcoin? You can't even do that anyway. At best you can temporarily lower its price and that's it. Just relax and enjoy the cheap prices

Ok, this will get some tinfoil hats pics, but here goes.

You own a business where you are basically controlling a large part of the money supply.
A new business opens up down the street with a new technology that is faster , more convenient, even allowing money to be transferred virtually at very cheap rates, and placing control of the monetary system into the hands of the people, removing your control.

The Tech is already out there, so you can't just buy them out and own it completely, your only real option is to try and discredit them , by causing massive fluctuations in their price, and then pointing at them and saying look how unstable they are, they are not suitable to conduct business. Now you know this is a complete fabrication but if you can stop them early enough , the public mindset will stop or hinder their growth , this allows you to keep control of the money supply and keep your advantage while destroying this new business model.

A good Example is
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Killed_the_Electric_Car%3F
We could have had electric cars back in the 90s, but the oil industry zapped them ~25 years ago to maintain their control of their market and still hinder to this day causing them to be unaffordable for most.
And think on this , why don't the top of electric cars have solar panel integrated into the frame panels, helping recharge the batteries, when the sun is shinning.

 

[john_doe]

A new business opens up down the street with a new technology that is faster , more convenient, even allowing money to be transferred virtually at very cheap rates, and placing control of the monetary system into the hands of the people, removing your control.

You described every cryptocurrency in existence here

[stevegreer]

You described every cryptocurrency in existence here

This is true, but how many of the hundreds of alt coins have come and gone in the little over 1 year that Zeit has been around? Countless. Zeit is proving to be a force to reckon with, so that may have investors in other coins a little worried.

[kiklo]

You described every cryptocurrency in existence here

No,
Just coins that use PoS instead of PoW.
PoW coins do not give control to the people.
Reason being all PoW coins final home will be with Corporate or Government miners, as individuals will not be able to keep up in the ASICS arms race.

And in regards to PoS, other factors required to be global are size, there has to be enough quantity to be worldwide, otherwise they will be too rare to meet the global needs. Other Factors are Speed, & Network security, and an Interest Rate that can compete against stocks,  Zeit has that. Main thing is the ZeitKnights, a growing group of individuals that will protect Zeit in its early years. Do some other PoS coins meet some of these requirements, sure. But Zeit is the only one that meets all of them.  

 

[atronite]

I agree with CapSer, this downtrend, though temporary I'm sure, is alarming. We were making great strides and have come too far to allow our coin to be trashed by dumpers looking to make a quick buck off of the LTC pump. That goes against the grain of our strive for this coin to be a long term investment.
One one hand, it is good that weak hands are handing over their coins for cheap, but on the other hand, losing that much value in that short of a time does not look good for potential new investors.
Now, I will be the first to admit that I am nowhere near genius level when it comes to investing, so maybe I've got it all wrong. Someone please correct me if I do so that I can learn something about it. But anyway, as a Knight, I am more than willing to forego the interest I would earn and move a few million Zeit into some walls if this action would help stabilize and prevent further losses.

The real reason why prices vary so much is because liquidity for Zeit is LOW on all markets. It wouldn't take much to crash the markets. 10M zeit is all it takes to clear out the cryptopia market on the bid side. It is only possible for the price to drop from 440 to 142 BECAUSE there are so few buyers on the bid side. A real market shouldn't gyrate +/- 20% percent just on the sale of 15 Million Zeit (esp when we have over 30 BILLION coins floating around).

With such low liquidity on the markets that we ARE on, is it any wonder that prices went the way it did? You couldn't buy a BUDGET LAPTOP with Zeit without the store crashing the prices 60% because they need to get LTC and then convert that LTC to cash to buy more wholesale laptops in fiat. If all it takes is 2 BTC worth of volume to crash prices, then I'm sorry, but we need more liquidity. Big question is, who's willing to provide it? And at what sustainable prices?

And then there's the issue that we're going to encounter major resistance from 10 to 17 satoshi level, which was our previous high from the mintpal days.

And again, look at other coins. ALL other coins besides BTC suffered from LTC dump, not just Zeitcoin. We just moved with the market.

[solarion]

The real reason why prices vary so much is because liquidity for Zeit is LOW on all markets. It wouldn't take much to crash the markets. 10M zeit is all it takes to clear out the cryptopia market on the bid side. It is only possible for the price to drop from 440 to 142 BECAUSE there are so few buyers on the bid side. A real market shouldn't gyrate +/- 20% percent just on the sale of 15 Million Zeit (esp when we have over 30 BILLION coins floating around).

With such low liquidity on the markets that we ARE on, is it any wonder that prices went the way it did? You couldn't buy a BUDGET LAPTOP with Zeit without the store crashing the prices 60% because they need to get LTC and then convert that LTC to cash to buy more wholesale laptops in fiat. If all it takes is 2 BTC worth of volume to crash prices, then I'm sorry, but we need more liquidity. Big question is, who's willing to provide it? And at what sustainable prices?

And then there's the issue that we're going to encounter major resistance from 10 to 17 satoshi level, which was our previous high from the mintpal days.

And again, look at other coins. ALL other coins besides BTC suffered from LTC dump, not just Zeitcoin. We just moved with the market.

Liquidity is more of a concern to sellers than buyers. Buyers will naturally migrate to the market with the lowest price at the moment they wish to buy...as ever the lowest price is at craptsy. Currently Zeit is 28% cheaper at craptsy than at either of the BTC markets. The lowest price is ALWAYS at craptsy, because that market is being held down by a bot. Coincidentally or not so coincidentally that's also the market that sets the price of ZeitCoin and the other markets follow. The only good thing about the fake price action at craptsy is that the spreads are artificially kept low.

Craptsy is again malfunctioning btw, there's a bid and ask posted at the same price point. Their software has done this regularly for months...if not years. It's really a very poorly run exchange. 

[groggin]

  

   aye it's a skinny market with occasional big waves. danger! will robinson! danger! but this is the beginning of things crypo, what else should one expect? if you believe in zeit, (and why shouldn't you - we have a hardworking & knowledgeable team here) what - me? worry?  

[kiklo]

We can make those waves have less punch.
Normally this idea gets shot down, but here it is.
Our Interest Rate drops down to 15% in ~ 7 months, and ~ year later down to the final 5% rate.
What if we change it so in ~7 months , at the next rate change drop it to the final 5% rate for good.
(Basically skip the 15% year)

Edit: this idea has been scrapped after a little schooling from Solarion.  

 

[solarion]

Interesting plan kiklo, but I don't think it will make much of a difference. Quick back of the napkin math puts inflation at right around 16.5% since Zeit went full PoS 431 days ago. That comes out to .038% per day or 13.97% per year at the pace we've been on and that should be coming down with the drop from 25% to 20%, though I haven't confirmed that. Fact is a lot of people just park their coins on exchanges and don't bother with staking at all. Two of the largest 10 wallet balances haven't changed in one year according to cryptoID's wallet guesstimates...that's 2.5b coins not staking right there and a year ago that was roughly 9% of the supply.

I personally think people are nuts to park significant quantities of any coin(particularly PoS coins) on exchanges given all the hacks and thefts that have occurred, but it seems some people never learn. Anyway the people that don't think 23-28% compound interest is worth their time or effort are making everyone else's ZeitCoin stakes more valuable and those people(myself included) are likely to be the people that actually care about the success of this crypto...so THANK YOU SLACKERS!

I don't think we should change anything fundamental about the plan just because someone manages to make a bot to collar the price on what is quite frankly the worst run exchange I've ever seen. Though annoying, the price rigging will only last until they run out of coins and I'm betting our determination is >>> theirs. I think we should remain consistent and stick to the plan. I think we should just make the bot sell as cheap as possible on craptsy and drain the place of liquidity at every opportunity...then move that liquidity to a better run exchange that has given us a BTC pairing and not just a bunch of excuses.