[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency

[crypto_zoidberg]

W h a t   a   g r o s s   i r o n y that the most legitimate and economic initial distribution of any cryptocoin existing (and therefore the most potential #2 coin in the months and years to come) happens to be a coin with an unbelievably messy codebase, intentionally made scammy, buggy, unoptimized, crippled and obfuscated by the (B)CN scamdevs.

It's not irony. It's misunderstanding.
You probably was confused when someone convinced you to invest money into CN-based project(or you decided it by yourself) - this is not bitcoin-fork with mature life cycle, this is brand new, developed from scrach software that has a lot of work ahead. Every one who at least little familiar with software development should realize what does it mean, esspecially for software related with security. The problem is that you've missed this fact.

And after an about half year of public run there was found first critical bug that was unfortunately used to exploit with Monero network... (and this is sad, i could understand stress that was felt by all involved in xmr people), but this quality indicator many many times higher than bitcoin development has.
Yeah, it's yet enother good chance to blame CryptoNote devs, but i really doubt that any of XMR devs had done their own cryptocurrency, written from scratch and worked fine. (okay, almost fine  ).

The only problem of CryptoNote codebase is that it's undocumented and don't have comments in code... well, that's true. But this is very different from "unbelievably messy codebase intentionally made scammy, buggy, unoptimized". (And don't take into account CryptoNight PoW hash function since it was really suspicious code, and i also agree about C-code, never understood why people use "C" when this is potentialy buggy language? ).

Compared Bitcoin-based projects and CryptoNote technology it's the same as compare say "ford focus", that is good well-known car, and Tesla-prototype, that has bright ideas, a lot of work behind it, but still not perfect, without instructions and documentations, with a lot of work ahead and unfortunaley with some new bugs there.

So it is not a CN fail, it was just your own choice. That i believe is good choice.


PS: I didn't meant that current Tesla is buggy and without instructions and documentation - i used it juse as an example of something new.


Just my 2 satosi. Sorry for late post.

[1714826709]

1714826709

[smooth]

^ makes some excellent points. 

[rpietila]

W h a t   a   g r o s s   i r o n y that the most legitimate and economic initial distribution of any cryptocoin existing (and therefore the most potential #2 coin in the months and years to come) happens to be a coin with an unbelievably messy codebase, intentionally made scammy, buggy, unoptimized, crippled and obfuscated by the (B)CN scamdevs.

It's not irony. It's misunderstanding.
You probably was confused when someone convinced you to invest money into CN-based project(or you decided it by yourself) - this is not bitcoin-fork with mature life cycle, this is brand new, developed from scrach software that has a lot of work ahead. Every one who at least little familiar with software development should realize what does it mean, esspecially for software related with security. The problem is that you've missed this fact.

And after an about half year of public run there was found first critical bug that was unfortunately used to exploit with Monero network... (and this is sad, i could understand stress that was felt by all involved in xmr people), but this quality indicator many many times higher than bitcoin development has.
Yeah, it's yet enother good chance to blame CryptoNote devs, but i really doubt that any of XMR devs had done their own cryptocurrency, written from scratch and worked fine. (okay, almost fine  ).

The only problem of CryptoNote codebase is that it's undocumented and don't have comments in code... well, that's true. But this is very different from "unbelievably messy codebase intentionally made scammy, buggy, unoptimized". (And don't take into account CryptoNight PoW hash function since it was really suspicious code, and i also agree about C-code, never understood why people use "C" when this is potentialy buggy language? ).

Compared Bitcoin-based projects and CryptoNote technology it's the same as compare say "ford focus", that is good well-known car, and Tesla-prototype, that has bright ideas, a lot of work behind it, but still not perfect, without instructions and documentations, with a lot of work ahead and unfortunaley with some new bugs there.

So it is not a CN fail, it was just your own choice. That i believe is good choice.


PS: I didn't meant that current Tesla is buggy and without instructions and documentation - i used it juse as an example of something new.


Just my 2 satosi. Sorry for late post.

- I understand it is hard to swallow my text. Perhaps it was too harsh. I try to tone down. I've had a lot of stress lately.

- I admire the CN team's work. The implementation of the world's first functioning anonymous coin tech is a marvellous achievement.

- Now comes the sad part. I think most of the team participated in a scam, and that's why I call them scammers. The BCN coin was said to be 2 years old, but that is a lie. Whoever says that but knows better is a liar. Not good. I am not buying coins from liars or scammers.

- Monero is also using the same tech, and is the only coin that has community-led devs. Certainly they are not so good as you who have created it! I don't believe that the current core team could make it from scratch. I appreciate creative work a lot because that's what I myself do. But I still buy Monero because I just cannot participate in a scam.

- I abhor scam so much that when talking about James, I always mention that I don't have anything against him but something feels scammy. It sounds very stupid and James must be puzzled, but not speaking out when I have a feeling.. is just not my way.

- I believe now would be a time for a great reconciliation. CryptoNote tech is better than the alternatives, and having someone from the original team working on Monero would be great. It is just that all evil things, scams, malice etc. must be left behind.

[smooth]

- Now comes the sad part. I think most of the team participated in a scam, and that's why I call them scammers. The BCN coin was said to be 2 years old, but that is a lie. Whoever says that but knows better is a liar. Not good. I am not buying coins from liars or scammers.

I don't ever remember CZ saying that, but perhaps you weren't implying that anyway.

As far as the people who do clearly and loudly put forward that sham, I have no disagreement with what you said.

[rdnkjdi]

- Now comes the sad part. I think most of the team participated in a scam, and that's why I call them scammers. The BCN coin was said to be 2 years old, but that is a lie. Whoever says that but knows better is a liar. Not good. I am not buying coins from liars or scammers.

I don't ever remember CZ saying that, but perhaps you weren't implying that anyway.

As far as the people who do clearly and loudly put forward that sham, I have no disagreement with what you said.

Has it been proven that zoidberg is part of the original team or is it still suspicion due to his familiarity with the code?

[smooth]

- Now comes the sad part. I think most of the team participated in a scam, and that's why I call them scammers. The BCN coin was said to be 2 years old, but that is a lie. Whoever says that but knows better is a liar. Not good. I am not buying coins from liars or scammers.

I don't ever remember CZ saying that, but perhaps you weren't implying that anyway.

As far as the people who do clearly and loudly put forward that sham, I have no disagreement with what you said.

Has it been proven that zoidberg is part of the original team or is it still suspicion due to his familiarity with the code?

No it hasn't been proven. It's a reasonable suspicion he had some involvement based on his knowledge of the code (I would say more than familiarity) and the stuff in the rethink-your-strategy post (though I found that part of the post pretty unconvincing) but what that involvement might have been I don't think anyone really has any idea, or they're not saying.

EDIT: Furthermore this is getting very off-topic for the Monero thread. Please take it elsewhere.

[windjc]

Fellow XMRs,

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

One of the reasons I lost confidence was the desperation I am seeing in the figure heads of the XMR community - the epitome of which is in desperate scared nonnsensical threads like this one ---> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=771925.0

I would hope that the leaders in this community would talk to and reign in your "spokespeople" who are giving this coin a HORRIBLE reputation. The fear mongering and arrogance that is thinly masked insecurity is depressing. Please think about taking this coin in a different PR direction. Thank you.

[smooth]

Fellow XMRs,

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

One of the reasons I lost confidence was the desperation I am seeing in the figure heads of the XMR community - the epitome of which is in desperate scared nonnsensical threads like this one ---> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=771925.0

I would hope that the leaders in this community would talk to and reign in your "spokespeople" who are giving this coin a HORRIBLE reputation. The fear mongering and arrogance that is thinly masked insecurity is depressing. Please think about taking this coin in a different PR direction. Thank you.

Who are you?
See Monero Missives #1: "(in no particular order) - tacotime, eizh, smooth, fluffypony, othe, davidlatapie, NoodleDoodle

^ Only spokespeople, and even then only when it is clear they are speaking on behalf of the project and not as individuals.

Glad I could help clear that up for you.

[windjc]

Fellow XMRs,

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

One of the reasons I lost confidence was the desperation I am seeing in the figure heads of the XMR community - the epitome of which is in desperate scared nonnsensical threads like this one ---> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=771925.0

I would hope that the leaders in this community would talk to and reign in your "spokespeople" who are giving this coin a HORRIBLE reputation. The fear mongering and arrogance that is thinly masked insecurity is depressing. Please think about taking this coin in a different PR direction. Thank you.

Who are you?
See Monero Missives #1: "(in no particular order) - tacotime, eizh, smooth, fluffypony, othe, davidlatapie, NoodleDoodle

^ Only spokespeople, and even then only when it is clear they are speaking on behalf of the project and not as individuals.

Glad I could help clear that up for you.

Ok, let me be more clear. Rpietila is HURTING the reputation of XMR. You guys need to put a muzzle on him. Immediately. People are starting to despise him across the crypto world - from east to west. If you guys dont see this, look around. If you are in an XMR bubble please step out of it. The tides are turning against Risto and unfortunatley against XMR>

[smooth]

Ok, let me be more clear. Rpietila is HURTING the reputation of XMR. You guys need to put a muzzle on him. Immediately. People are starting to despise him across the crypto world - from east to west. If you guys dont see this, look around. If you are in an XMR bubble please step out of it. The tides are turning against Risto and unfortunatley against XMR>

* smooth checks the secret control panel deep inside Monero headquarters.

Nope, no button on there to shut up people who post on bitcointalk. He says what he wants. I don't really care what he says, although some of it I find interesting, much of it I don't. So far I'm not finding you very interesting though.

[coinits]

Fellow XMRs,

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

One of the reasons I lost confidence was the desperation I am seeing in the figure heads of the XMR community - the epitome of which is in desperate scared nonnsensical threads like this one ---> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=771925.0

I would hope that the leaders in this community would talk to and reign in your "spokespeople" who are giving this coin a HORRIBLE reputation. The fear mongering and arrogance that is thinly masked insecurity is depressing. Please think about taking this coin in a different PR direction. Thank you.

Led by the nose much? If I had 6 figures in XMR, with its price rise, I would not have sold.

Are you spreading FUD? Did you really have that many coins?

[coinits]

Fellow XMRs,

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

One of the reasons I lost confidence was the desperation I am seeing in the figure heads of the XMR community - the epitome of which is in desperate scared nonnsensical threads like this one ---> https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=771925.0

I would hope that the leaders in this community would talk to and reign in your "spokespeople" who are giving this coin a HORRIBLE reputation. The fear mongering and arrogance that is thinly masked insecurity is depressing. Please think about taking this coin in a different PR direction. Thank you.

Who are you?
See Monero Missives #1: "(in no particular order) - tacotime, eizh, smooth, fluffypony, othe, davidlatapie, NoodleDoodle

^ Only spokespeople, and even then only when it is clear they are speaking on behalf of the project and not as individuals.

Glad I could help clear that up for you.

Ok, let me be more clear. Rpietila is HURTING the reputation of XMR. You guys need to put a muzzle on him. Immediately. People are starting to despise him across the crypto world - from east to west. If you guys dont see this, look around. If you are in an XMR bubble please step out of it. The tides are turning against Risto and unfortunatley against XMR>

And how do you propose that the DEVS do that? Since when is it the DEVS responsibility to 'muzzle' people? Opinions are like assholes. Everyone has one, well except if you have a colostomy shit bag of FUD to spread.

[aminorex]

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

I am somewhat gratified to hear this.  It explains most of the selling, and it means the coins are in more stable hands.  You always have been a tad...excitable.  If you panic buy back it should mean a fair bit of incremental demand.  I shall have to frontrun that...sorry.

[rpietila]

Fellow XMRs,

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

(Funny that I heard this same thing in the trollbox today.) You have an obsession on me, you know deep inside it is you who needs to apologize. But you won't do it. You don't even ask me to do anything, just stalk. The door is still open.

To others: this is a personal matter.

[arielbit]

such action around here 

are we gonna see cheap XMR again? 

[coinits]

Fellow XMRs,

I recently had close to 6 figures in XMR. I used to be in love with this coin. I have sold it all, pending regaining confidence.

(Funny that I heard this same thing in the trollbox today.) You have an obsession on me, you know deep inside it is you who needs to apologize. But you won't do it. You don't even ask me to do anything, just stalk. The door is still open.

To others: this is a personal matter.

Trolls going to troll. Ignore and move forward.

[coinits]

such action around here 

are we gonna see cheap XMR again? 

It is cheap right now.

[aminorex]

such action around here 

are we gonna see cheap XMR again? 

It is cheap right now.

And the price doesn't have to change for it to get cheaper:  E[p(t)] is increasing monotonically in t. 

[iCEBREAKER]

W h a t   a   g r o s s   i r o n y that the most legitimate and economic initial distribution of any cryptocoin existing (and therefore the most potential #2 coin in the months and years to come) happens to be a coin with an unbelievably messy codebase, intentionally made scammy, buggy, unoptimized, crippled and obfuscated by the (B)CN scamdevs.

It's not irony. It's misunderstanding.
You probably was confused when someone convinced you to invest money into CN-based project(or you decided it by yourself) - this is not bitcoin-fork with mature life cycle, this is brand new, developed from scrach software that has a lot of work ahead. Every one who at least little familiar with software development should realize what does it mean, esspecially for software related with security. The problem is that you've missed this fact.

And after an about half year of public run there was found first critical bug that was unfortunately used to exploit with Monero network... (and this is sad, i could understand stress that was felt by all involved in xmr people), but this quality indicator many many times higher than bitcoin development has.
Yeah, it's yet enother good chance to blame CryptoNote devs, but i really doubt that any of XMR devs had done their own cryptocurrency, written from scratch and worked fine. (okay, almost fine  ).

The only problem of CryptoNote codebase is that it's undocumented and don't have comments in code... well, that's true. But this is very different from "unbelievably messy codebase intentionally made scammy, buggy, unoptimized". (And don't take into account CryptoNight PoW hash function since it was really suspicious code, and i also agree about C-code, never understood why people use "C" when this is potentialy buggy language? ).

Compared Bitcoin-based projects and CryptoNote technology it's the same as compare say "ford focus", that is good well-known car, and Tesla-prototype, that has bright ideas, a lot of work behind it, but still not perfect, without instructions and documentations, with a lot of work ahead and unfortunaley with some new bugs there.

So it is not a CN fail, it was just your own choice. That i believe is good choice.


PS: I didn't meant that current Tesla is buggy and without instructions and documentation - i used it juse as an example of something new.


Just my 2 satosi. Sorry for late post.

- I understand it is hard to swallow my text. Perhaps it was too harsh. I try to tone down. I've had a lot of stress lately.

- I admire the CN team's work. The implementation of the world's first functioning anonymous coin tech is a marvellous achievement.

- Now comes the sad part. I think most of the team participated in a scam, and that's why I call them scammers. The BCN coin was said to be 2 years old, but that is a lie. Whoever says that but knows better is a liar. Not good. I am not buying coins from liars or scammers.

- Monero is also using the same tech, and is the only coin that has community-led devs. Certainly they are not so good as you who have created it! I don't believe that the current core team could make it from scratch. I appreciate creative work a lot because that's what I myself do. But I still buy Monero because I just cannot participate in a scam.

- I abhor scam so much that when talking about James, I always mention that I don't have anything against him but something feels scammy. It sounds very stupid and James must be puzzled, but not speaking out when I have a feeling.. is just not my way.

- I believe now would be a time for a great reconciliation. CryptoNote tech is better than the alternatives, and having someone from the original team working on Monero would be great. It is just that all evil things, scams, malice etc. must be left behind.

Hug it out you crazy fellows!   

-CZ, RP is not a dev and relies on others to evaluate code quality.  If Peter Todd & Co. misstate and over-dramatize the CN code's problems, RP (among others) will accept those expert opinions.  It's not RP's fault that there is so much trolling; he's also a victim of it, but in a different way than you.

-RP, CZ has seen his project under social engineering attack (FUD campaign, etc.) since before Monero was subject to trolls/hacks so he's also been having a 'busy' week, to say the least.  And it's not his fault you didn't buy dirt-cheap BBR, despite it being the obvious hedge.

-Last week, I made an appeal for interdenominational understanding/support/dialog, only to be rudely rebuffed by DTS and others aghast at the mere mention of XMR's sister coin.  It was nice so see others join me in mocking the narcissistic parochial foolishness of the XMR rox - BBR sux fundamentalists, and satisfying seeing half or more of the last week's posts in both coins' threads mention their twin.

-David Latapie, the infamous socialist, send me a nice (but cryptic) PM about reposting my "Narcissism of small differences" analysis of the sibling rivalry.   

-So you are both stressed and should realize these are the good old days which we'll look back on and laugh about someday, preferably in mutual company as we enjoy exquisite wine/cigars at Castle Ristopia!   

[David Latapie]

And the price doesn't have to change for it to get cheaper:  E[p(t)] is increasing monotonically in t.

hypothesis accepted

Could you explain what E[p(t)] means?

-David Latapie, the infamous socialist, send me a nice (but cryptic) PM about reposting my "Narcissism of small differences" analysis of the sibling rivalry.   

That my way to say "I like your text so much that I posted it as memorable quote on my Google+ account

Long live taxes!