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BTCrawl
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June 25, 2014, 11:39:42 AM |
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The only people I can see being upset by the move to POS would be those who invested heavily in scrypt asics.
They can still mine on the PoS multipool though!  Moving to PoS won't hurt anyone, not even miners. They will be able to continue to mine and at the same time help push the price of Naut up. |
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Doging
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June 25, 2014, 11:42:43 AM
Last edit: June 25, 2014, 11:56:04 AM by Doging |
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The only people I can see being upset by the move to POS would be those who invested heavily in scrypt asics.
They can still mine on the PoS multipool though! Moving to PoS won't hurt anyone, not even miners. They will be able to continue to mine and at the same time help push the price of Naut up. Are there any other scrypt coins with the same potential out there? Just checked dedicatedpool and it seems everyone is mining X11 and X13 these days. Asic resistance looks like the way forwards to me. |
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asnghost
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June 25, 2014, 11:54:23 AM
Last edit: June 25, 2014, 12:17:49 PM by asnghost |
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I'm not a dumping miner and let me remind you that there would be NO nautilus coins if it were not for miners. im not having a go at miners, i just think its a bit extreme asking BK to fork the code right before POS is implemented. Im well aware that there would be no coins if miners didnt mine and dump also as i scored some pretty cheap coins right at the bottom. =) i think the coin distribution is quite good on this coin, very spread out with the NSF holding alot with price appreciation in mind, on rather small volume naut can increase in price a lot in the coming weeks. i havent stopped buying and also havent sold 1 naut either and dont plan to any time soon as i believe this could be something very special in the future. =) everything going smoothly with POS implementation and Jon Fitch winning his fight will gravitate more people to the coin, we could see x3 the current prices we are right now and stabilising up there because POS will further limit the amount of new coins entering the market. Stay strong nauti peeps HOOOLLLLLDDDD!!! now is the perfect time - you're asking him to start POS with 75% of the coins still unmined - IMHO I think that rather self centered isn't it. you have what you want - so just ignore the rest of the people who enabled you to get here.... rather greedy if you ask me. and the fight has no bearing whatsoever on this discussion. I'm asking what reasonable that's all - even by his own admission BK acknowledges that mining has virtually stopped because of flaw in Digishield and that it's not good for the coin and thanks fr coming clean - the bottom line is that you don't want any new coins entering the market - you got what you want so the hell with the rest of us, huh? well - I have some bad news for you. the average miner like myself who got this coin started can't compete with the huge mining farms because of the difficulty but nevertheless there are 1,440 new blocks generated every day and the only two pools still mining this coin are 0feenaut and ipominer and between these two pools they only get about 15 blocks in a day so that leaves 1,425 blocks to the huge mining farms who have taken over so guess what - the huge mining farms are still mining 1,425 blocks per day and that's 225,150 coins per day so I have some bad news for you - they're going to unleash a dump on you guys the likes of what you've never seen that's 1,576,050 coins per week they're mining - so guess what - the price of this coin is completely out of your control - they're going to control it's destiny. they could run this coin down to 1 satoshi in nanoseconds if they felt like it. so you argument for not letting new coins entering the market is without merit, because they're going to enter the market whether you like it or not. according to specs there should be around 1440 blocks daily according to blockexlorer: block 23496 was mined at 17 june around 9am latest block 24936 mined at 25 june around 7am So in 8 days 1440 blocks were mined. So supply increase is very limited, it's more like 20 naut average per block now. |
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jjj0923
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June 25, 2014, 12:09:51 PM |
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The only people I can see being upset by the move to POS would be those who invested heavily in scrypt asics.
They can still mine on the PoS multipool though! Moving to PoS won't hurt anyone, not even miners. They will be able to continue to mine and at the same time help push the price of Naut up. Are there any other scrypt coins with the same potential out there? Just checked dedicatedpool and it seems everyone is mining X11 and X13 these days. Asic resistance looks like the way forwards to me. sure RZR, Start and Octocoin are all kicking ass to name a few. |
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jjj0923
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June 25, 2014, 12:12:11 PM |
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I'm not a dumping miner and let me remind you that there would be NO nautilus coins if it were not for miners. im not having a go at miners, i just think its a bit extreme asking BK to fork the code right before POS is implemented. Im well aware that there would be no coins if miners didnt mine and dump also as i scored some pretty cheap coins right at the bottom. =) i think the coin distribution is quite good on this coin, very spread out with the NSF holding alot with price appreciation in mind, on rather small volume naut can increase in price a lot in the coming weeks. i havent stopped buying and also havent sold 1 naut either and dont plan to any time soon as i believe this could be something very special in the future. =) everything going smoothly with POS implementation and Jon Fitch winning his fight will gravitate more people to the coin, we could see x3 the current prices we are right now and stabilising up there because POS will further limit the amount of new coins entering the market. Stay strong nauti peeps HOOOLLLLLDDDD!!! now is the perfect time - you're asking him to start POS with 75% of the coins still unmined - IMHO I think that rather self centered isn't it. you have what you want - so just ignore the rest of the people who enabled you to get here.... rather greedy if you ask me. and the fight has no bearing whatsoever on this discussion. I'm asking what reasonable that's all - even by his own admission BK acknowledges that mining has virtually stopped because of flaw in Digishield and that it's not good for the coin and thanks fr coming clean - the bottom line is that you don't want any new coins entering the market - you got what you want so the hell with the rest of us, huh? well - I have some bad news for you. the average miner like myself who got this coin started can't compete with the huge mining farms because of the difficulty but nevertheless there are 1,440 new blocks generated every day and the only two pools still mining this coin are 0feenaut and ipominer and between these two pools they only get about 15 blocks in a day so that leaves 1,425 blocks to the huge mining farms who have taken over so guess what - the huge mining farms are still mining 1,425 blocks per day and that's 225,150 coins per day so I have some bad news for you - they're going to unleash a dump on you guys the likes of what you've never seen that's 1,576,050 coins per week they're mining - so guess what - the price of this coin is completely out of your control - they're going to control it's destiny. they could run this coin down to 1 satoshi in nanoseconds if they felt like it. so you argument for not letting new coins entering the market is without merit, because they're going to enter the market whether you like it or not. according to specs there should be around 1440 blocks according to blockexlorer: block 23496 was mined at 17 june around 9am latest block 24936 mined at 25 june around 7am So in 8 days 1440 blocks were mined. So supply increase is very limited, it's more like 20 naut average per block now. by his own admission digishield has been detrimental to the coin - man you guys are soooo greedy... I have lots of Naut and I want more. I'm in the top 100 holders and I want to mine more. don't be so protective - it's not good for the coin. |
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Doging
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June 25, 2014, 12:29:41 PM |
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The only people I can see being upset by the move to POS would be those who invested heavily in scrypt asics.
They can still mine on the PoS multipool though! Moving to PoS won't hurt anyone, not even miners. They will be able to continue to mine and at the same time help push the price of Naut up. Are there any other scrypt coins with the same potential out there? Just checked dedicatedpool and it seems everyone is mining X11 and X13 these days. Asic resistance looks like the way forwards to me. sure RZR, Start and Octocoin are all kicking ass to name a few. Then like (BTCrawl said) why not just add them to the multipool and get paid in NAUT? |
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BTCrawl
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June 25, 2014, 12:52:48 PM |
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The only people I can see being upset by the move to POS would be those who invested heavily in scrypt asics.
They can still mine on the PoS multipool though! Moving to PoS won't hurt anyone, not even miners. They will be able to continue to mine and at the same time help push the price of Naut up. Are there any other scrypt coins with the same potential out there? Just checked dedicatedpool and it seems everyone is mining X11 and X13 these days. Asic resistance looks like the way forwards to me. sure RZR, Start and Octocoin are all kicking ass to name a few. Then like (BTCrawl said) why not just add them to the multipool and get paid in NAUT? Exactly I'm suspecting some posters here might not know how a PoS multipool works. That's okay, and I'm sorry if I sounded rude in my earlier posts. Basically the way it works is that since PoS coins are only generated by people holding the coins, you can't mine them in the normal way. You can however set up a multipool (which is in the works) that mines other coins, sell them for Bitcoins and buy Nautiluscoins to be payed to the miners. This accomplishes three things: 1. It pushes the price of the coin up, rather than down as regular PoW mining does. 2. It provides a lot more volume, which is great for traders and exchanges alike. 3. It provides better security for smaller coins as the network is controlled by the people holding the coin (the stakers). This means that it doesn't matter if there's only one large PoS multipool. With PoW mining one always has to make sure to spread the hash rate out over several pools to avoid centralization. Hope that can clear some confusion up here To summarise: You will still be able to mine Naut after the PoS switch. The difference is that you will help out the coin in several ways when doing so. It's really a win-win for everyone with Naut's best interest at heart. |
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BK_PHI (OP)
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June 25, 2014, 01:08:12 PM |
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Morning -
Scrolling through the thread it looks like we had some good discussions going on, I'll try to answer what I can...
PoS - It is happening. As I mentioned before my original idea of tying PoS to a real world price index is too complicated to securely implement. So PoS will be a 'regular' PoS.
I am still aiming to have it live by the time of the fight - that is the goal. There are a lot of other coins that have newfangled tech and fancy algos - which I think is a necessary for the crypto world to evolve. I am always open to integrating the latest technology, BUT I see the value of the coin in the long run being a function of network effects rather than technology. If BTC launched today it would never make it past the first mining round...but it has value because of the network effect. That is what I am trying to bring to NAUT - the deal with Jon Fitch is just the beginning.
Website - YES it needs to be updated to be newbie friendly. I am currently finishing writing a book on Bitcoin/altcoins (which NAUT will be at least one chapter, maybe more)- the book will be published this fall - I will be finished by this weekend and then can focus my attention on the website. It will be newbie friendly by fight time.
-BK
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BTCrawl
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June 25, 2014, 01:19:52 PM |
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Morning -
Scrolling through the thread it looks like we had some good discussions going on, I'll try to answer what I can...
PoS - It is happening. As I mentioned before my original idea of tying PoS to a real world price index is too complicated to securely implement. So PoS will be a 'regular' PoS.
I am still aiming to have it live by the time of the fight - that is the goal. There are a lot of other coins that have newfangled tech and fancy algos - which I think is a necessary for the crypto world to evolve. I am always open to integrating the latest technology, BUT I see the value of the coin in the long run being a function of network effects rather than technology. If BTC launched today it would never make it past the first mining round...but it has value because of the network effect. That is what I am trying to bring to NAUT - the deal with Jon Fitch is just the beginning.
Website - YES it needs to be updated to be newbie friendly. I am currently finishing writing a book on Bitcoin/altcoins (which NAUT will be at least one chapter, maybe more)- the book will be published this fall - I will be finished by this weekend and then can focus my attention on the website. It will be newbie friendly by fight time.
-BK
The bringer of good news, lol  Great to hear that everything is running smoothly! I agree completely on the idea that coins have value due to their networking effect. Technical innovations, being that this is open source, means that a coin with new features will have an advantage for about a week before it's copied. That can always be added later on, but the important thing is trust in the people behind the coin, as well as a strong community and merchant acceptance. Best of luck on the book! |
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cypz
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June 25, 2014, 01:28:07 PM |
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Morning -
Scrolling through the thread it looks like we had some good discussions going on, I'll try to answer what I can...
PoS - It is happening. As I mentioned before my original idea of tying PoS to a real world price index is too complicated to securely implement. So PoS will be a 'regular' PoS.
I am still aiming to have it live by the time of the fight - that is the goal. There are a lot of other coins that have newfangled tech and fancy algos - which I think is a necessary for the crypto world to evolve. I am always open to integrating the latest technology, BUT I see the value of the coin in the long run being a function of network effects rather than technology. If BTC launched today it would never make it past the first mining round...but it has value because of the network effect. That is what I am trying to bring to NAUT - the deal with Jon Fitch is just the beginning.
Website - YES it needs to be updated to be newbie friendly. I am currently finishing writing a book on Bitcoin/altcoins (which NAUT will be at least one chapter, maybe more)- the book will be published this fall - I will be finished by this weekend and then can focus my attention on the website. It will be newbie friendly by fight time.
-BK
morning BK thanks for the update i think the website is very important as it is the sales page for naut to new and old users alike. It may be good to have a "in development" section and a "getting started with naut" with maybe community made videos on the easiest way to purchase naut. An important feature imo is a wallet usable on smart phones as this is the main way non computer savvy people will have access and buy their funds. A multi signature html5 wallet that stakes for you so you have complete control over your funds but dont rely on a centralised service to keep ur funds safe. |
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Doging
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June 25, 2014, 01:37:02 PM |
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The only people I can see being upset by the move to POS would be those who invested heavily in scrypt asics.
They can still mine on the PoS multipool though! Moving to PoS won't hurt anyone, not even miners. They will be able to continue to mine and at the same time help push the price of Naut up. Are there any other scrypt coins with the same potential out there? Just checked dedicatedpool and it seems everyone is mining X11 and X13 these days. Asic resistance looks like the way forwards to me. sure RZR, Start and Octocoin are all kicking ass to name a few. Then like (BTCrawl said) why not just add them to the multipool and get paid in NAUT? Exactly I'm suspecting some posters here might not know how a PoS multipool works. That's okay, and I'm sorry if I sounded rude in my earlier posts. Basically the way it works is that since PoS coins are only generated by people holding the coins, you can't mine them in the normal way. You can however set up a multipool (which is in the works) that mines other coins, sell them for Bitcoins and buy Nautiluscoins to be payed to the miners. This accomplishes three things: 1. It pushes the price of the coin up, rather than down as regular PoW mining does. 2. It provides a lot more volume, which is great for traders and exchanges alike. 3. It provides better security for smaller coins as the network is controlled by the people holding the coin (the stakers). This means that it doesn't matter if there's only one large PoS multipool. With PoW mining one always has to make sure to spread the hash rate out over several pools to avoid centralization. Hope that can clear some confusion up here To summarise: You will still be able to mine Naut after the PoS switch. The difference is that you will help out the coin in several ways when doing so. It's really a win-win for everyone with Naut's best interest at heart. I know other coins are setting up multipools but it does sound perfect for NAUT. I find multipool returns are limited unless you're extremely tactful about how you sell the coins you mine, wait too long and you're mining at a loss, sell too soon and miss out on a decent return, let the multipool auto-sell and profits are often minimal if that. What you really want is payment in a coin which is likely to appreciate in value. The best method is to watch this forum like a hawk and get in early on the right coin but it's time consuming and disappointing when you back the wrong horse. I just couldn't understand the talk about dumping it down to 1 sat. |
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J.E.S.U.S!!!
Newbie
 Offline
Activity: 10
Merit: 0
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June 25, 2014, 01:41:11 PM |
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Hi, any problem with the blockchain? transition to PoS?
I sent Nauts a few hours ago and 0 confirmations. My wallet don´t synchronize. (stuck in 7 hours back)
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BTCrawl
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June 25, 2014, 01:42:32 PM |
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I know other coins are setting up multipools but it does sound perfect for NAUT. I find multipool returns are limited unless you're extremely tactful about how you sell the coins you mine, wait too long and you're mining at a loss, sell too soon and miss out on a decent return, let the multipool auto-sell and profits are often minimal if that. What you really want is payment in a coin which is likely to appreciate in value.
The best method is to watch this forum like a hawk and get in early on the right coin but it's time consuming and disappointing when you back the wrong horse. I just couldn't understand the talk about dumping it down to 1 sat.
Normally PoS multi pools are handled manually as far as I know. So the people running the pool take all the coins that's been mined for the last 12 hours (for example), sell them and then purchase whatever coin the multipool is mining. This means that the skill of the people running it somewhat determiners the outcome. One can usually count on a certain return however, as long as they don't mess up completely |
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BK_PHI (OP)
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June 25, 2014, 01:46:26 PM |
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Hi, any problem with the blockchain? transition to PoS?
I sent Nauts a few hours ago and 0 confirmations. My wallet don´t synchronize. (stuck in 7 hours back)
Looks like we are stuck on a block-difficulty spiked to 650. I am renting an ASIC farm to push it through -BK |
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J.E.S.U.S!!!
Newbie
Offline
Activity: 10
Merit: 0
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June 25, 2014, 01:47:49 PM |
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Thanks!
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BTCrawl
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June 25, 2014, 01:55:41 PM |
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Hi, any problem with the blockchain? transition to PoS?
I sent Nauts a few hours ago and 0 confirmations. My wallet don´t synchronize. (stuck in 7 hours back)
Looks like we are stuck on a block-difficulty spiked to 650. I am renting an ASIC farm to push it through -BK This might be a little too far off into the future to start planning right now, but one thing we could do when the PoS multipool launches is to raise a couple of BTC as a community and rent ASIC farms to mine for the first few days to kick things off. It will be a great little publicity stunt, as well as giving the price quite a push that would add to the interest in Naut. |
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BK_PHI (OP)
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June 25, 2014, 01:57:16 PM |
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Hi, any problem with the blockchain? transition to PoS?
I sent Nauts a few hours ago and 0 confirmations. My wallet don´t synchronize. (stuck in 7 hours back)
Looks like we are stuck on a block-difficulty spiked to 650. I am renting an ASIC farm to push it through -BK This might be a little too far off into the future to start planning right now, but one thing we could do when the PoS multipool launches is to raise a couple of BTC as a community and rent ASIC farms to mine for the first few days to kick things off. It will be a great little publicity stunt, as well as giving the price quite a push that would add to the interest in Naut. I am in! |
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BTCrawl
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June 25, 2014, 02:01:12 PM |
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Hi, any problem with the blockchain? transition to PoS?
I sent Nauts a few hours ago and 0 confirmations. My wallet don´t synchronize. (stuck in 7 hours back)
Looks like we are stuck on a block-difficulty spiked to 650. I am renting an ASIC farm to push it through -BK This might be a little too far off into the future to start planning right now, but one thing we could do when the PoS multipool launches is to raise a couple of BTC as a community and rent ASIC farms to mine for the first few days to kick things off. It will be a great little publicity stunt, as well as giving the price quite a push that would add to the interest in Naut. I am in! Great! Let's revisit this in a couple of weeks |
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