Why Poloniex Has Rejected SuperCoin

[counter]

Very interesting turn of events.  I was just checking the Supercoins I got from there and now this...  Wouldn't have expected this.  It is an interesting dissucssion but for me I'd just like to know what the devs think and if I should buy some cheap coins.  

I don't mind either way honestly but it would be nice to see it on polo with all the other suspect coins haha,  I guess I'm just not one to discriminate.  

[zmeddy]

Points that most people will agree on:

- Coin code more critically reviewed by exchanges is a good thing
- Poloniex / Busoni has been proven very trustworthy, for example in the case of 12.5% stolen BTC in march: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=499580
- If SUPER was unrightfully not listed, it is unfortunate for them that they are among the first to have its code so scrutinously reviewed.

In the last case I feel sorry mainly for the unknowing people that invested substantial amounts and panic sold.

I hope that this issue will be reasonably resolved without namecalling (is never a good idea imo, even if you would have all the right to do so). It is confusing enough to follow this thread without off-topic discussions.

[e1ghtSpace]

Guys, if pow generates the MAX MONEY, can you still generate more money from pos?
I need to know.

[Mrjitter]

CrapExchange and crapdevelopers on Poloniex....

trust is lost ... CryptoRush 2.0

[cyberhacker]

CrapExchange and crapdevelopers on Poloniex....

trust is lost ... CryptoRush 2.0

where is busoni?

[bitrap]

Points that most people will agree on:

- Coin code more critically reviewed by exchanges is a good thing
- Poloniex / Busoni has been proven very trustworthy, for example in the case of 12.5% stolen BTC in march: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=499580
- If SUPER was unrightfully not listed, it is unfortunate for them that they are among the first to have its code so scrutinously reviewed.

In the last case I feel sorry mainly for the unknowing people that invested substantial amounts and panic sold.

I hope that this issue will be reasonably resolved without namecalling (is never a good idea imo, even if you would have all the right to do so). It is confusing enough to follow this thread without off-topic discussions.

Can it also be agreed that Busoni may have very well jumped the gun on declaring SuperCoin to be as suspect as implied? If so, I think we're due an apology or at least an admittance of this episode of incompetence.

[L3pje]

2 BTC down the drain, thanks Busoni.
Please next time don't just post that fast.

When dev changes it, will it be added on polo?

[maryvale]

OK, let me tell (or teach, for some) you how the total coin is calculated:

1st, look at this function

int64_t GetProofOfWorkReward(int nHeight, int64_t nFees, const CBlockIndex* pindex)

and this

int64_t GetProofOfWorkBonusRewardFactor(CBlockIndex* pindex)

1st function calculates the regular pow payout, and the 2nd calculates the superblocks.

Now, block 1 = 2.5 mil coins (was a mini IPO I think)
block 2 - block 19200: 512 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 256 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 128 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 64 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 32 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 16 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 8 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 4 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 2 coins/block
afterwards: 1 coins/block

now the pow will be cut off at 1-2 coins/block.

Next, look at the superblocks: superblock
   - Every 3 hours there will be a block with 4X normal payment (initial 2048 coins)
   - Every day there will be a block with 16X normal payment (initial 8192 coins)
   - Every 5 days there will be a block with 128X normal payment (initial 65536 coins)

So at initial phase, the 1 block day average coin is:
1 day = 960 * 512 + 8 * (2,048 - 512) + (8,192 - 512) + 1/5 * (65,536 - 512)
   = 491,520 + 12,288 + 7,680 + 13,004.8
   = 524,492.8 coins

Total = 524,492.8 * (20 + 10 * 0.5 * ( 1 + 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8 + ... ))
   = 524,492.8 * 10 * (2 + 1) = 15,734,784 coins

This adds 2.5 mil mini IPO, total PoW = 18.2 millions.

On top of this, you can calculate the PoS, PoS is difficult to calculate precisely, but you can estimate max possible value. My estimate is that it is under 50 millions as devs of Supercoin said.

Simple math, isn't it?

[provenceday]

OK, let me tell (or teach, for some) you how the total coin is calculated:

1st, look at this function

int64_t GetProofOfWorkReward(int nHeight, int64_t nFees, const CBlockIndex* pindex)

and this

int64_t GetProofOfWorkBonusRewardFactor(CBlockIndex* pindex)

1st function calculates the regular pow payout, and the 2nd calculates the superblocks.

Now, block 1 = 2.5 mil coins (was a mini IPO I think)
block 2 - block 19200: 512 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 256 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 128 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 64 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 32 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 16 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 8 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 4 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 2 coins/block
afterwards: 1 coins/block

now the pow will be cut off at 1-2 coins/block.

Next, look at the superblocks: superblock
   - Every 3 hours there will be a block with 4X normal payment (initial 2048 coins)
   - Every day there will be a block with 16X normal payment (initial 8192 coins)
   - Every 5 days there will be a block with 128X normal payment (initial 65536 coins)

So at initial phase, the 1 block day average coin is:
1 day = 960 * 512 + 8 * (2,048 - 512) + (8,192 - 512) + 1/5 * (65,536 - 512)
   = 491,520 + 12,288 + 7,680 + 13,004.8
   = 524,492.8 coins

Total = 524,492.8 * (20 + 10 * 0.5 * ( 1 + 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8 + ... ))
   = 524,492.8 * 10 * (2 + 1) = 15,734,784 coins

This adds 2.5 mil mini IPO, total PoW = 18.2 millions.

On top of this, you can calculate the PoS, PoS is difficult to calculate precisely, but you can estimate max possible value. My estimate is that it is under 50 millions as devs of Supercoin said.

Simple math, isn't it?

+1

[badchild]

I wonder if Polo will give refunds to all the people that panic sold based on their faulty FUD.

where is busoni?

[provenceday]

busoni must stand out to apologize to those ppl lost bunch of money and SUPER dev.

it's true.

they make some mistake, hope busoni can handle this thing correctly, he is a honest guy, i also donate him 0.7 BTC on the Poloniex Hacker event.

[bitcoinwonders010]

bittrex official statement will get things on track plus busoni needs to apologize

[counter]

Simple math, isn't it?

Generally speacking it seems pretty straight forward but when you throw the code text in the mix along with some other variables it tends to be rather intimidating shall I say.  Interesting how two different views of the "Max Coins" are so far apart and I'm anxious to get a final say on the total at this point.  Thanks for the breakdown of your calculation.

[doch]

bittrex official statement will get things on track plus busoni needs to apologize

Well, hopefully Polo can learn from this at least. I'm all for exchanges vetting the code on coins they add, but if you're going to do it, please have someone who knows what they're looking at do it.

[maryvale]

OK, let me tell (or teach, for some) you how the total coin is calculated:

1st, look at this function

int64_t GetProofOfWorkReward(int nHeight, int64_t nFees, const CBlockIndex* pindex)

and this

int64_t GetProofOfWorkBonusRewardFactor(CBlockIndex* pindex)

1st function calculates the regular pow payout, and the 2nd calculates the superblocks.

Now, block 1 = 2.5 mil coins (was a mini IPO I think)
block 2 - block 19200: 512 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 256 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 128 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 64 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 32 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 16 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 8 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 4 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 2 coins/block
afterwards: 1 coins/block

now the pow will be cut off at 1-2 coins/block.

Next, look at the superblocks: superblock
   - Every 3 hours there will be a block with 4X normal payment (initial 2048 coins)
   - Every day there will be a block with 16X normal payment (initial 8192 coins)
   - Every 5 days there will be a block with 128X normal payment (initial 65536 coins)

So at initial phase, the 1 block day average coin is:
1 day = 960 * 512 + 8 * (2,048 - 512) + (8,192 - 512) + 1/5 * (65,536 - 512)
   = 491,520 + 12,288 + 7,680 + 13,004.8
   = 524,492.8 coins

Total = 524,492.8 * (20 + 10 * 0.5 * ( 1 + 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8 + ... ))
   = 524,492.8 * 10 * (2 + 1) = 15,734,784 coins

This adds 2.5 mil mini IPO, total PoW = 18.2 millions.

On top of this, you can calculate the PoS, PoS is difficult to calculate precisely, but you can estimate max possible value. My estimate is that it is under 50 millions as devs of Supercoin said.

Simple math, isn't it?

Questions? I can explain each and every number if needed

[daywalkerneo]

Let's take a look at some other popular coins on Poloniex:

Silkcoin
Maximum POW supply: ~45 million

Great, let's check the code:

Code:

static const int64_t MAX_MONEY = 2000000000 * COIN;

Uh oh, 2 billion is a lot more than 45 million! Better de-list SC right away!

Cinni
Total Coins: 15,000,000

Hmm...

Code:

static const int64 MAX_MONEY = 100000000 * COIN;

I'm not very good at math but I think 100 million may be slightly more than 15 million.

Strange that you never gave a shit about things like this before?

We have recently raised our reviewing standards to look for more than just trojans and security exploits. SC and CINNI were not subjected to that kind of scrutiny. We will investigate them, though. And if it turns out that they are like SuperCoin and deliberately inserted those values, then we might have a problem. I cannot comment on them at this point, since we have not looked over the code yet for things like this.

We are attempting to raise the bar on the quality of the coins we list. We are well aware that this stance will be met with some opposition, particularly when a popular coin is rejected, but we are willing to take the heat for that. The idle pursuit of volume was never the intention behind Poloniex.

good call cinni and sc are trash coins for sure along with most of these copy paste coins with no value

[provenceday]

OK, let me tell (or teach, for some) you how the total coin is calculated:

1st, look at this function

int64_t GetProofOfWorkReward(int nHeight, int64_t nFees, const CBlockIndex* pindex)

and this

int64_t GetProofOfWorkBonusRewardFactor(CBlockIndex* pindex)

1st function calculates the regular pow payout, and the 2nd calculates the superblocks.

Now, block 1 = 2.5 mil coins (was a mini IPO I think)
block 2 - block 19200: 512 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 256 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 128 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 64 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 32 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 16 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 8 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 4 coins/block
next 9600 (10 days) blocks: 2 coins/block
afterwards: 1 coins/block

now the pow will be cut off at 1-2 coins/block.

Next, look at the superblocks: superblock
   - Every 3 hours there will be a block with 4X normal payment (initial 2048 coins)
   - Every day there will be a block with 16X normal payment (initial 8192 coins)
   - Every 5 days there will be a block with 128X normal payment (initial 65536 coins)

So at initial phase, the 1 block day average coin is:
1 day = 960 * 512 + 8 * (2,048 - 512) + (8,192 - 512) + 1/5 * (65,536 - 512)
   = 491,520 + 12,288 + 7,680 + 13,004.8
   = 524,492.8 coins

Total = 524,492.8 * (20 + 10 * 0.5 * ( 1 + 1/2 + 1/4 + 1/8 + ... ))
   = 524,492.8 * 10 * (2 + 1) = 15,734,784 coins

This adds 2.5 mil mini IPO, total PoW = 18.2 millions.

On top of this, you can calculate the PoS, PoS is difficult to calculate precisely, but you can estimate max possible value. My estimate is that it is under 50 millions as devs of Supercoin said.

Simple math, isn't it?

Questions? I can explain each and every number if needed

no question. it's the truth.

[iGotSpots]

Max money isn't really what you are saying it is but its good to not list it due to lies

[maryvale]

Max money isn't really what you are saying it is but its good to not list it due to lies

I think it was left over from previous version, since it does not do anything (just transactions), I guess dev does not bother to change it. Nothing is wrong there, you set a limit does not mean you need to reach it.

[maryvale]

If the amount of coins to be mined could be adjusted with a simple code update, why would any coin be considered secure?

The key here is majority of the network (51%) needs to agree and adopt the changes. P2p coin follows simple majority rules.