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Author Topic: ███►BetcoinRakeback.com | 58-83% RAKEBACK [Here ONLY] | ACR WPN Tourneys◄███  (Read 100365 times)
DarkDays
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February 10, 2016, 06:05:36 PM
 #661

Let's go over the things you've said and facts:

1. You claim you are "not even an employee or staff member"

2. Affiliate's don't have access to information showing any bonus', tier rakeback, or table starter rakeback accrued by the people that they refer

3. You don't play cash games on Betcoin (assuming you only have one account and are not a multiaccounter)

YET you claim that you know, for a fact, that if Betcoin were to process refunds based on the 600,000 hands that they overraked their players, the refunds would be negligible.  HOW could you possibly know that?  You can't know that based on the information/API that you receive from Betcoin...you can't know that based on playing in the games, because you don't so you don't know the player tendencies (as I mentioned, a very small number of people use TSR...based on my database I'd estimate it's under 10%).  Where are you getting your information from?  Are you making it up?  Why would you make something like that up if that lie only helps Betcoin and hurts nearly every player, including a majority of the ones who signed up under you?

This is probably the most infuriating aspect of dealing with people who work for Betcoin or those who aspire to work for Betcoin...they just make shit up and then disappear!
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February 10, 2016, 10:13:13 PM
 #662

Although you've ignored so many of my questions/comments, I'll respond to each of yours.  I'd really appreciate you did the same.  (If i missed anything it wasn't intentional, just let me know)

Quote
I'm not even an employee or staff member and you just continue to attack me.  


Whether or not you are employed by betcoin is irrelevant.  When you help Betcoin generate revenue, you're partners.  

I'm sure you know this, but Betcoins business model relys heavily on affiliate marketing to drive new traffic.  They also reward affiliates very well.  (you seem to receive more rewards than even the top teir offers)

Your income is directly affected by the revenue your players generate.

The more your signups generate, the more you make, thats because you and Betcoin have a partnership.  Period.

THe fact that youre seriously trying to claim "its not my fault Betcoin is doing unethical things even though  I have income that is coming directly from them and I'm trying to convince as many people as possible to sign up and deposit on their site" is really pathetic.

In any affiliate model, there is no excuse for choosing to be anything but 100% transparent with their signups, even if it's at the cost of their own personal income.  

This conflict of interest is the very reason many regulatory bodies either ban the affiliate model all together or regulate the affiliates.  If they didn't do this, affiliates would be able to gain from unethical behavior.  For example: if an online poker site is stealing from its players, an affiliate could choose to be unethical and state that they are not stealing, or they are stealing only a couple pennies.  This would be very unethical, but it would result in the affilites  short term profit.

I realize Betcoin isn't regulated.  I realize there are tons of scummy affiliates.  Thats no excuse for you to be anything but honest.  


Quote
Also if you dislike/distrust me, why did you sign up under me (I found out about this when Betcoin Jessica made a post of your accounts)?  I just provide a good service to poker players.

It's obvious this is more of a thinly veiled attempt at discrediting me than a question.  

I did not sign up under you.  I assume you are refering to me being nickles987 or btcjbtc, I am not.  I didn't know about your thread until a week or so after I had signed up under grindabit.  I wish I had though, because you are able to return more rakeback than any other affiliate even gets paid, I would have made several bitcoins more in rakeback than I had from Chazlys lame rakerace.  

Betcoin Jessica has accused me of many things that are not true, mostly something to do with me playing on their site every day - "she" is lying.  I'm not sure if they are dumb enough to think that accusing me of this would somehow disprove all the evidence I've presented, or if they were simply behaving like children.  If they could, they would be trying to prove that what I said was untrue, not that I'm a cheater.  I could be one of the biggest cheaters of all time, and it still wouldn't change the facts about betcoin.

If I were to sign up a new account to play poker on, I would be a fool not to use your link.  That doesn't give you the right to tell everyone else lies.


Quote
I also don't know what deceptive thing I said about the BBJ.
I suggest going through all your posts to make a list of all the deceptive things you've said.  Then you can post them all, along with the truth and players who may not know they were deceived will no longer believe something that isn't true.

Quote
But it's great you signed up under me, you'll be getting one of the highest rewards in the industry obviously, and I'll benefit from that just a little bit as well.

This is the type of childish passive aggressive comment that Betcoin makes which really doesn't accomplish anything.  I'd really appreciate it if you spent more time responding the the serious issues I've brought up.




Please, return the courtesy of responding.

I'd prefer you respond to my questions from this post : https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=683727.msg13749228#msg13749228

But if you want to make things simpilar, Ill ask just one question at a time.

Between 10/31/15 and 12/10/15 What percentage of hands were won by a player that was currently receiving 100% rakeback on Betcoin at both non Heads Up tables and at only Heads Up tables.  Please explain how confident you are in this number and why.  

(So two numbers, one for Headsup and one for the rest)


I don't know the exact numbers, but that amount that Betcoin overraked was minute when you factor in everything I mentioned....  

Twitchy, you said it yourself, that you do believe the issues mentioned were honest mistakes due to incompetency/inexperience and for that we're in agreement here.  But all the libel just needs to stop.
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February 10, 2016, 10:39:39 PM
 #663


I don't know the exact numbers, but that amount that Betcoin overraked was minute when you factor in everything I mentioned....  

Twitchy, you said it yourself, that you do believe the issues mentioned were honest mistakes due to incompetency/inexperience and for that we're in agreement here.  But all the libel just needs to stop.

But you don't know how much the "factors that you mentioned" actually played into each player's account, right?  Because since you aren't an employee of Betcoin, you wouldn't be able to see that information, right?  So you are just guessing, right?  And your guess is ill-informed, right?  Because you don't play cash games on Betcoin, right?

Why are you guessing in a way that hurts players and helps Betcoin (and, to an extent, you since you overprofitted from all of these players getting overraked)? 
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February 10, 2016, 10:52:01 PM
 #664

I would assume he isn't proffiting from it as you say. Since he if above 100% payback on the rake he pays back on an average of what he claims.

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February 10, 2016, 11:19:59 PM
 #665



I don't know the exact numbers, but that amount that Betcoin overraked was minute when you factor in everything I mentioned....  

Twitchy, you said it yourself, that you do believe the issues mentioned were honest mistakes due to incompetency/inexperience and for that we're in agreement here.  But all the libel just needs to stop.

Please show us how you factor this in so we can understand why you believe it's minute.

I've provided perfectly reasonable explanations on why I believe its not minute.

For example: I explained why I believe they were taking over 280 extra chips per hour (per table) at the high stakes HU cash tables (from 10/31 - 12/9)

You can't just say "when I calculate I find the total amount to be extremely small" and then not show us what you calculated or tell us the number you found...


Twitchy, you said it yourself, that you do believe the issues mentioned were honest mistakes due to incompetency/inexperience and for that we're in agreement here.  But all the libel just needs to stop.

NO

I belive the initial stolen money was unintentional.  The way they decided to handle it after realizing their mistake is criminal.

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February 10, 2016, 11:21:48 PM
 #666

I would assume he isn't proffiting from it as you say. Since he if above 100% payback on the rake he pays back on an average of what he claims.

Hes obv receiving more of his players rake than he's returning.

However I'm sure like Betcoin and any other casino, poker is a way to get people in the door so they can lose money in the casino and sportsbook.

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February 11, 2016, 03:05:39 AM
 #667

I would assume he isn't proffiting from it as you say. Since he if above 100% payback on the rake he pays back on an average of what he claims.

So you assume that Xiao is running his affiliate business at a loss?  That's not very realistic.

Let's say, for example, that Betcoin gets 50% of a player's rake, Xiao gets the other 50%.  He gives 40% of that to the player, so he nets 10%.  A player under him plays in 10 pots that should have been raked 2 and were instead raked 5.  So 20 in rake total, he contributed 10.  Betcoin keeps 5, Xiao gets 1, the player gets 4 back.  So he paid 6 total in net rake, 5 to Betcoin and 1 to Xiao.  But under the illegally raised rake, the total rake was 50.  He contributed 25.  Betcoin keeps 12.5, Xiao gets 2.5, the player gets 10 back.  So because of the overraking, the player has now paid (net) 15 where he should have only paid 6.  Of the 9 extra chips that were stolen from the player, Betcoin got 7.5 of them and Xiao got 1.5 of them.  Everyone wins...except for the players.
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February 11, 2016, 07:03:25 AM
 #668

I would assume he isn't proffiting from it as you say. Since he if above 100% payback on the rake he pays back on an average of what he claims.

Hes obv receiving more of his players rake than he's returning.

However I'm sure like Betcoin and any other casino, poker is a way to get people in the door so they can lose money in the casino and sportsbook.

He's offering 50-190% rakeback. So yes his players get their rake (back) and then some on average. He gets 20%+ of their deposit/play threw/losses. Not sure how the 20% is messured.

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February 11, 2016, 07:54:48 PM
 #669

The BBJ has just been hit!  More details later on!
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February 11, 2016, 09:25:52 PM
 #670

The BBJ has just been hit!  More details later on!

It shouldn't have been because there were only two players in the hand and there wasn't a jackpot drop taken.  I know you think that the people who want Betcoin to act ethically are "trolls", but please put aside your personal feelings and stand up for the players.  Please voice your concern for what is right and don't let Betcoin steal ANOTHER 21 coins.
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February 11, 2016, 09:49:15 PM
 #671

The BBJ has just been hit!  More details later on!

It shouldn't have been because there were only two players in the hand and there wasn't a jackpot drop taken.  I know you think that the people who want Betcoin to act ethically are "trolls", but please put aside your personal feelings and stand up for the players.  Please voice your concern for what is right and don't let Betcoin steal ANOTHER 21 coins.

+1

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February 11, 2016, 11:08:12 PM
 #672

Betcoin corrected article, says BBJP not paid out.

Now maybe Xiao will get back to answering this question...I hope so.


I don't know the exact numbers, but that amount that Betcoin overraked was minute when you factor in everything I mentioned....  

Twitchy, you said it yourself, that you do believe the issues mentioned were honest mistakes due to incompetency/inexperience and for that we're in agreement here.  But all the libel just needs to stop.

But you don't know how much the "factors that you mentioned" actually played into each player's account, right?  Because since you aren't an employee of Betcoin, you wouldn't be able to see that information, right?  So you are just guessing, right?  And your guess is ill-informed, right?  Because you don't play cash games on Betcoin, right?

Why are you guessing in a way that hurts players and helps Betcoin (and, to an extent, you since you overprofitted from all of these players getting overraked)? 

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February 12, 2016, 07:34:43 AM
 #673

Betcoin corrected article, says BBJP not paid out.

Now maybe Xiao will get back to answering this question...I hope so.


I don't know the exact numbers, but that amount that Betcoin overraked was minute when you factor in everything I mentioned....  

Twitchy, you said it yourself, that you do believe the issues mentioned were honest mistakes due to incompetency/inexperience and for that we're in agreement here.  But all the libel just needs to stop.

But you don't know how much the "factors that you mentioned" actually played into each player's account, right?  Because since you aren't an employee of Betcoin, you wouldn't be able to see that information, right?  So you are just guessing, right?  And your guess is ill-informed, right?  Because you don't play cash games on Betcoin, right?

Why are you guessing in a way that hurts players and helps Betcoin (and, to an extent, you since you overprofitted from all of these players getting overraked)? 

Wow you guys need to leave Xiao the fuck alone, everything about this service is amazing.
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February 12, 2016, 05:04:39 PM
 #674

Betcoin corrected article, says BBJP not paid out.

Now maybe Xiao will get back to answering this question...I hope so.


I don't know the exact numbers, but that amount that Betcoin overraked was minute when you factor in everything I mentioned....  

Twitchy, you said it yourself, that you do believe the issues mentioned were honest mistakes due to incompetency/inexperience and for that we're in agreement here.  But all the libel just needs to stop.

But you don't know how much the "factors that you mentioned" actually played into each player's account, right?  Because since you aren't an employee of Betcoin, you wouldn't be able to see that information, right?  So you are just guessing, right?  And your guess is ill-informed, right?  Because you don't play cash games on Betcoin, right?

Why are you guessing in a way that hurts players and helps Betcoin (and, to an extent, you since you overprofitted from all of these players getting overraked)? 

Wow you guys need to leave Xiao the fuck alone, everything about this service is amazing.

Excellent point...oh wait, you didn't make any.

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February 12, 2016, 10:19:40 PM
 #675

People have been upset over the 3 second warning until timeout.  I know it's an inconvenience, but this is the best advice I can give for the time being:


Click the settings button:





Then select Auto Engage Time Bank:


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February 13, 2016, 01:18:33 AM
 #676

People have been upset over the 3 second warning until timeout.

I can assure you this is the least of any regulars worries at Betcoin.

The fact that they wont return the rake they stole, for example, is much more serious.  Perhaps if you could explain exactly how you are able draw the conclusion that the amount stolen from any player is so small that it doesn't matter then players would be less upset.

Support doesn't seem to have an answer either, this is how they handled it with one of the highest volume players on Betcoin who signed up under your affiliate link. (emerald vip level mostly from poker)
(read bottom to top)

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February 13, 2016, 01:37:16 PM
 #677

Xiao gets paid to bring players to Betcoin.





Betcoin steals from players.





Xiao says Betcoin only stole pennies for a brief period





Players show Xiao proof that Betcoin was stealing 10's of Bitcoins for almost a month and a half.





Xiao says Betcoin only stole pennies for a brief period






Players ask Xiao to explain why he keeps saying this.






Xiao tries to play the victim!
Quote
"I'm not even an employee or staff member and you just continue to attack me.  "






Players keep asking why Xiao thinks Betcoin only stole pennies briefly when theres proof that they stole way more for way longer





Xiao posts tutorial on enabling automatic time bank because "People have been upset over the 3 second warning until timeout"







Amazing
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February 13, 2016, 02:22:18 PM
 #678

Thanks! Looks like good place to start my gambling with bitcoins, looks like good site




.




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cryptosmoker
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February 13, 2016, 05:49:34 PM
 #679

Thanks! Looks like good place to start my gambling with bitcoins, looks like good site

you're most welcome
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February 13, 2016, 06:27:50 PM
 #680

Xiao gets paid to bring players to Betcoin.





Betcoin steals from players.



It's literally the exact same blueprint that Betcoin used on these forums last year.

Step 1: Say something off the top of your head, with no proof or logic behind it, that you think makes you look good.

Step 2: Ignore any question or comment, no matter how reasonable, because you can't back up what you said.

Step 3: Bump a post from months and months ago (you can see in the post that he bumped, the BBJ was 6BTC) to try to bury discussion.


When will these business novices learn that running a poker related business takes hard work and dedication.  You can't lie to and hide from your customers because they won't be your customers any longer and all you'll be left with is low volume freeroll grinders and chat box beggars.  If you screw something up, say "hey I screwed that up I'm sorry and I'm going to work to fix it".  If your players need help, help them!
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