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1001  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: [EMUNIE] We are not dead, just busy building megacool stuff *teasers inside* on: August 24, 2014, 09:27:55 PM
Does eMunie still have a goal to regulate the value of its currency by issuing more when demand requires this as originally planned or is it going to use some other mechanism? Has anything been changed in that regard over the last few months?
1002  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: R.I.P NXT on: August 24, 2014, 02:18:15 PM
Satoshi and other early bitcoin adopters can dump bitcoin to shit any time.
Central banks can dump fiat to shit any time.
You get the idea Wink Let me know which investment is 100% secure, I'll buy it instantly.
1003  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Is PoS dead? on: August 24, 2014, 01:49:59 PM
But there is one problem with pure PoS coins:

Rich get richer JUST by sitting on their stake.

which (in my opinion) inevitably leads to centralisation of stake (just getting all fees until you get all the currency).
It will take definitely much longer time than centralisation of mining power did, but it probably will happen some time.
And wide adoption of such currency is only speeding the process (more transactions → more fees)
Am I wrong?
That is the only thing that i dont like about NXT and
that is where NEM with their Proof of Importance algorithm can succeed.
Indeed, the main problem is that the difference between the rich and the poor gets worse with POS. Sure it is energy efficient, but that does not make up for anything. POS does not have a future, and sadly I do not see even NEM succeeding. It's all speculation who knows what will happen in the upcoming weeks.

Some of the assets on NXT AE have gone up 500%, which means if the poor bought in to them, they'd be 5 times more rich now. And if the rich didn't buy, they'd still have the same. Which means there are opportunities born every minute, you just need to search for them and make your bets. Wisely. It's the companies that (will) run on top of NXT that add the value, sitting on stakes and not investing means the person is not actively exploring opportunities and will surely miss on them, and then pay more to buy shares of those companies.
1004  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: R.I.P NXT on: August 24, 2014, 01:45:22 PM
Sure RIP NXT.
The rollback(although not success) things has totally ruined the reputation of NXT.
Plus the initial scam, NXT is definitely dead. Grin Grin
The price will never rise up again.
The price is much low than the beginning of the year.

I smell, you will be the one buying at the top Smiley
1005  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: [Bitshares] bitUSD discussion on: August 24, 2014, 01:12:12 PM
We need a BTSX/NXT trading pair. Let's petition exchanges. Whether you're a BTSX believer or NXT believer, why do you want to go to Bitcoin? If you want to invest in both, and want to reshuffle your investments between the two as prices fluctuate, there is even less reason to exchange to Bitcoin first.


There must be a BTSX<->NXT direct exchange!

If you disagree, you're an enemy of both BTSX and NXT.

Please petition Bter in their support thread:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=280806.0

And it happened, folks!

https://bter.com/trade/btsx_nxt

now we don't need to touch Bitcoin with a ten foot pole Grin
1006  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Service Announcements (Altcoins) / Re: [ANN][Exchange] Bter.com [Android App] [Deposit BTSX Now!][Tweets by @btercom] on: August 23, 2014, 11:29:41 AM
Please add a BTSX/NXT trading pair.
1007  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: [Bitshares] bitUSD discussion on: August 23, 2014, 11:27:24 AM
We need a BTSX/NXT trading pair. Let's petition exchanges. Whether you're a BTSX believer or NXT believer, why do you want to go to Bitcoin? If you want to invest in both, and want to reshuffle your investments between the two as prices fluctuate, there is even less reason to exchange to Bitcoin first.


There must be a BTSX<->NXT direct exchange!

If you disagree, you're an enemy of both BTSX and NXT.

Please petition Bter in their support thread:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=280806.0
1008  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Bitshares - The Great Satan on the Blockchain on: August 23, 2014, 05:30:17 AM
That was us making an investment decision based upon expected growth.

Well, that would be like self-fulfilling prophecy then, wouldn't it? You prop up the price with the IPO funds and there is your expected growth realized in price charts Wink

Please reconsider your decision, or you may end up being grouped in the same category as keynesian central bankers. And you can also end up being owner of a sizeable portion of BTSX (20-30%), which goes against decentralization ideals and goals.
1009  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Bitshares - The Great Satan on the Blockchain on: August 23, 2014, 05:07:40 AM
my economics are Austrian.   

Well, that's good. Except this doesn't correlate with Bitshares's decision to support the price of BTSX with the IPO funds. This is rigging of the market, not free market, and this is exactly what central banks do in the fiat world.
1010  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Is PoS dead? on: August 23, 2014, 04:59:49 AM
Nxt, Maidsafe, Ethereum, Stellar and NEM are all PoS.

The combined market cap of them is still rather large and have room to grow further. So, PoS is very much alive.

I think in a year or two from now Bitcoin will still be number #1 but that these and/or other PoS will take up the 2-10 spots according to market cap.

To me, the only PoW I see surviving in two years is bitcoin.   

While I think Bitcoin is very awesome, I also think it is flawed.  These others are just far more advanced in tech. 

I am not sure if those advances are going to be enough in the short term to overcome Bitcoins very large first mover advantage.  Ultimately it is the breadth of a network that makes a coin valuable not necessarily its tech.  In that aspect for now Bitcoin is king.

I see Dogecoin surviving as well. But it will probably switch to PoW/PoS model. Maybe even pure PoS. There are also chances it will attract all miners from Litecoin and become the Bitcoin of Scrypt. It will survive because it will be a tipping currency of choice and will find more ways into the gaming world, especially with younger generation who are/will be the main users and who make a very large share of the Internet users market. The inflation rate of Doge is a non-issue, starting from 2015 it will be smaller than that of Bitcoin or Litecoin until 2020. By 2020 a lot of things will have happened, there will be other survivors by then.
1011  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Marketplace (Altcoins) / Re: bter hacked and lost 50m nxt on: August 22, 2014, 06:10:08 AM
So NXT is experiment and is not supposed to be taken seriously or used in production environment in long run.
Then why do we care so much about that theft ?

Believe it or not, all cryptos are still a big experiment. And it's not like production environment can be forced or influenced to use this or that crypto. Exactly, why do you care so much about that theft? It's over, most of the funds was returned, some damage has been done, but it also brought a lot of advertisement, which is going to smooth out the little damage over the long run. Hacker still keeps 8m, which is 0.8% of the total supply. If he chooses to sell it, he can depress price for a couple of weeks, that's the worst he can do.
1012  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: It looks like NXT has taken the 4th spot from BTSX on coinmarketcap. on: August 21, 2014, 05:10:48 PM
I guess it's nice to see NXT actually survive that hack and such, that the confidence is not (completely) lost.

There is actually more confidence now than before Smiley Short-term price fluctuations are of little importance.
1013  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: August 21, 2014, 12:40:20 PM
And currency can't all end up in the hands of the power-law distributed savers. It also has to be continuously debased so that spenders can spend. Savers and spenders are symbiotic.

In NXT there are plans to implement Monetary System that will allow to create currencies (both PoS and PoW) on top of NXT that should gain additional value compared to NXT coins. This is supposed to work as an anti-deflation mechanism and help stakeholders diversify and distribute their stakes when they see more value in those currencies.

There are also incentives for stakeholders to invest in successful enterprises running on NXT Asset Exchange, because shares of successful companies can appreciate faster than NXT coins. Debts can also be settled in shares of enterprises, not just in NXT coins.

Both of these mechanisms are supposed to help with distribution and fight centralization of stakes. I guess it will take a few years before we find out if it worked Smiley
1014  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: August 21, 2014, 12:05:32 PM
what do you guys think of the idea of using a digital token as a collateral to lend "dollars" into existence?

This idea might work in the future, when/if tokens have more trust and credit worthiness than dollars.
1015  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: NeM-NxT-ORA-QORA-Node-DRK-QUARK-Spoetnik-KolinEvans-Illuminati SCAMMER AXIS on: August 21, 2014, 09:28:49 AM
Alright, I am selling.
1016  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: August 20, 2014, 07:20:28 PM
No. You need the majority of stake in any point of time past, to forge all the history of the future from that point of time on. So any group who ever had 51% of the currency/votes/etc. can rewrite the history at will. Or any group that can coerce any group at any point of time. There is also no mechanism to keep track which of the forks is the correct one.

Yes, there is a mechanism to keep track which fork is correct. It's called Economic Clustering. But it will likely never be utilized, as getting private keys of 51% coins seems a much more insurmountable task than coercing 2-3 biggest PoW pool operators to follow a certain agenda. But EC will be there just in case, so yes, nodes can know which fork is correct and be in consensus. There is also a penalty in EC for forgers who forge on an incorrect fork.
1017  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Is PoS dead? on: August 20, 2014, 06:48:55 PM
the burden of proof is on you.

No, sorry, it's your money that is at risk. You have to do all the leg work by yourself and for yourself, not someone else Smiley
1018  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: Is PoS dead? on: August 20, 2014, 06:35:35 PM
the reason POW is successful is because of the incentives.

The only successful PoW is Bitcoin, and only because it has a few years first mover advantage, and habituation and herd mentality keep its market cap above others. But that's not forever.
1019  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: August 20, 2014, 05:52:32 PM
We are discussing the technical soundness of PoS here, not the economical soundness of attacks.


You mean we just skip straight to you possessing 51% of the coins? Smiley

rpietila mentioned it's cheaper to attack PoS, that's economical soundness, I was answering to him.

Perhaps you should keep asking on nxtforum.org to get answers, be persistent, if you're interested, don't expect being spoon-fed answers.
1020  Alternate cryptocurrencies / Altcoin Discussion / Re: rpietila Altcoin Observer on: August 20, 2014, 05:44:40 PM
So one attack vector is forging with timestamps artifiically advanced by almost 15 secs,
and having many nodes disagree on whether the new block is valid or not...

You need coins to forge, a lot of them, that's why it's called Proof-of-Stake Smiley Why would you destroy your own investment if you spent billions of USD to buy up 51% of coins (or 90% of coins when TF is implemented)?
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