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Last try here for education sake.
If you try to achieve mass adoption you need to understand phase separation mechanics in physics.
Think of getting control over density of water when you reach 100C at 1 atm by having a fast heating velocity.
You just cant. If it starts boiling the density drops hyperbolic and as far as I can remember there can be higher order phase separations less understood and even harder to 'control'. We learn about that a complex system needs to find equilibrium at its own dynamics. Who dares to have this understanding and power individually?
Findinig this equilibrium quickly, simple rules are your friend + maximal distribution from start.
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I m human, I might.
If you ARE god, you set the rules.
If not, decentralization is best approach also for defining the rules by evolution and selection of the strongest. So they must be simple and genius = from god.
I hope your stuff is better than ETH and you re not like VB try to play god.
Strongest money is just not elastic, cause money is base entity for valuation of all goods and services.
Compare to numbers in math.
Compare to work in pyhsics.
Not good to change basis of any metrics.
Think of a simple example and it will help illustrate why the statment "strongest money is not elastic" is maybe not the right way to go. A community of 10 people have 50 coins in circulation so they can use them as a medium of exchange between other members within the group for goods and services (i.e. closed economy). These 50 coins have a perceived value as defined by the relative basket of goods and services each coin can procure. The coins themselves are basically worthless intrinsically, but they have value in that they are mutually agreed to as a medium of exchange between the 10 citizens. Over time the population of 10 people now grows to 50 (through normal birth and immigration activities). At this point in time there are still 50 coins in circulation, but there are not enough of them to transact normal business activity and thus their percieved value increases as they are now a scarce resource. This increase in perceived value of the coin doesn't really reflect an increase in the true value of the goods and services produced by the citizens, but merely an increase in the demand for the coin (which isn't really a good or service that adds value to the economy). This warped scarcity now drives volatility in the overall normal flow of business activity and can cause some businesses to fail in the short term and eventually nearly all to stall out if there aren't enough coins to do the transactions required for business. If instead there was an autonomous computer that continuously monitored the supply of coins relative to the overall demand for them and instantly deposited the newly created supply into each citizen's wallet at a proportional and fair value relative to their existing holdings then the net effect would be a zero increase in inflation since all holders increased their holdings at the same level as before the increase. However, the new supply now enables businesses to continue operating and growing at optimal levels. Mostly understood and yes there will be always fiat to solve some issues here. But fiat (here your central computer goes into) is set to always loose against better money like gold or bitcoin. Edit: There is no need to mimic fiat in crypto world. We need sth really orthogonal thats the genius new thing. The mixture of bitcoin and fiat is there to be and everybody is free to decide how much to invest into. |
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I have been following you for years with much interest, I post very little. How to you plan to stablize the price of your coin? I realize that the market will ultimatly decide the value of a coin but for mass adoption I believe you will need some measure of stability, even if it means a slow and steady increase in the value of your work.
It seems most people will not 'mass adopt' unless there is some level of stability. If you look at the jump(pump) and fall of any coin it does not take much to realize that an astute individual would not accept the great variance in price without abandoning a coin. Even for a smaller holder...having 50$ one day and only 30$ the next because of great swing in price and lack of trust in the whole system will not produce the mass adoption you are looking for. I realize social media adoption may be a bit diffrent but I think the idea for stability in price still applies. I also realize a pegged price seems to be a failure at this point...
Your thoughts?
D
You cannot stabilize exchange rates during any exponential growth phase unless you having unlimit money to do narrow market making. This guy knows what he's talking about and that is almost exactly what we are doing Elastic supply gives the resources required to do said market making. If you are wondering it works VERY well! ... Said the FED and Keynsyman. I believe in open markets and selfregulation. The less but genius rules the better. Who are you try to get control over complex systems? God? Just because one attempt failed spectacularly due to a number of issues such as a biased distribution, delay in economic information propagation, abuse of money creation, greed and corruption; doesn't mean it can't work if managed and regulated properly. If an economic system is void of the above issues, which decentralized technology now allows us to do, then at the macro scale it simply comes down to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand. Ok, I see we talk about sth very different. You talk about goods and services, I was about money. Not at all, you can quantify money to fit the same simple parameters as supply and demand economics if you are smart about it. If you manage to set money equal to work hours you would not want anybody doing some elastic to your work time, would you? That's a different paradigm though as its the consumption of a resource you can not get more of easily (or at all) thus it is a scare commodity. There is no way to regulate that and it has to operate under free-market principles. Think of money akin to something that can be cheaply manufactured yet maybe worth more than the sum of its parts (demand). The manufacturing process and assembly line for said money is the network itself with its consensus and economic rules. If you manufacture too much of something, its perceived value drops, and vice versa if you don't create enough. Same applies with money. The whole philosophy of inflation, and the central banks informing us that inflation is good, is so that the newly "printed" money at the top of the pyramid is worth the same as the money at the bottom so they can extract more value from it before the currency devalues slightly due to over supply. As the new money trickles down the broad economy starts to feel the effect of it and the value of each unit in circulation devalues, pushing the price of good and services up. If you remove that abuse alone, then already we are on the way to a more stable and dependable currency. Ultimately my point is, that just because you and a few of use here know how to use volatile money, the rest of the world does not and expects a currency to be stable from day to day. Until that happens, crypto and alternative money systems will remain under adopted at large. I see you try to do your last fight here and regulators like you need more and more words for that to tweek logic. All what you do with your ellastic supply of money, work, store of value is taking the risk from the lemmings, keep them uneducated and get rich personally. I would recommend you have good disclaimers on that. I try to,educate the lemmings. You judge what helps more to our world. Huh?? How can I be a regulator and "get rich personally" if the system is decentralized and I have no control over the elasticity of the supply once the initial rules are set and are fair. I think perhaps you are confusing me with someone else :-) I m human, I might. If you ARE god, you set the rules. If not, decentralization is best approach also for defining the rules by evolution and selection of the strongest. So they must be simple and genius = from god. I hope your stuff is better than ETH and you re not like VB try to play god. Strongest money is just not elastic, cause money is base entity for valuation of all goods and services. Compare to numbers in math. Compare to work in pyhsics. Not good to change basis of any metrics. |
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I have been following you for years with much interest, I post very little. How to you plan to stablize the price of your coin? I realize that the market will ultimatly decide the value of a coin but for mass adoption I believe you will need some measure of stability, even if it means a slow and steady increase in the value of your work.
It seems most people will not 'mass adopt' unless there is some level of stability. If you look at the jump(pump) and fall of any coin it does not take much to realize that an astute individual would not accept the great variance in price without abandoning a coin. Even for a smaller holder...having 50$ one day and only 30$ the next because of great swing in price and lack of trust in the whole system will not produce the mass adoption you are looking for. I realize social media adoption may be a bit diffrent but I think the idea for stability in price still applies. I also realize a pegged price seems to be a failure at this point...
Your thoughts?
D
You cannot stabilize exchange rates during any exponential growth phase unless you having unlimit money to do narrow market making. This guy knows what he's talking about and that is almost exactly what we are doing Elastic supply gives the resources required to do said market making. If you are wondering it works VERY well! ... Said the FED and Keynsyman. I believe in open markets and selfregulation. The less but genius rules the better. Who are you try to get control over complex systems? God? Just because one attempt failed spectacularly due to a number of issues such as a biased distribution, delay in economic information propagation, abuse of money creation, greed and corruption; doesn't mean it can't work if managed and regulated properly. If an economic system is void of the above issues, which decentralized technology now allows us to do, then at the macro scale it simply comes down to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand. Ok, I see we talk about sth very different. You talk about goods and services, I was about money. Not at all, you can quantify money to fit the same simple parameters as supply and demand economics if you are smart about it. If you manage to set money equal to work hours you would not want anybody doing some elastic to your work time, would you? That's a different paradigm though as its the consumption of a resource you can not get more of easily (or at all) thus it is a scare commodity. There is no way to regulate that and it has to operate under free-market principles. Think of money akin to something that can be cheaply manufactured yet maybe worth more than the sum of its parts (demand). The manufacturing process and assembly line for said money is the network itself with its consensus and economic rules. If you manufacture too much of something, its perceived value drops, and vice versa if you don't create enough. Same applies with money. The whole philosophy of inflation, and the central banks informing us that inflation is good, is so that the newly "printed" money at the top of the pyramid is worth the same as the money at the bottom so they can extract more value from it before the currency devalues slightly due to over supply. As the new money trickles down the broad economy starts to feel the effect of it and the value of each unit in circulation devalues, pushing the price of good and services up. If you remove that abuse alone, then already we are on the way to a more stable and dependable currency. Ultimately my point is, that just because you and a few of use here know how to use volatile money, the rest of the world does not and expects a currency to be stable from day to day. Until that happens, crypto and alternative money systems will remain under adopted at large. I see you try to do your last fight here and regulators like you need more and more words for that to tweek logic. All what you do with your ellastic supply of money, work, store of value is taking the risk from the lemmings, keep them uneducated and get rich personally. I would recommend you have good disclaimers on that. I try to,educate the lemmings. You judge what helps more to our world. |
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I have been following you for years with much interest, I post very little. How to you plan to stablize the price of your coin? I realize that the market will ultimatly decide the value of a coin but for mass adoption I believe you will need some measure of stability, even if it means a slow and steady increase in the value of your work.
It seems most people will not 'mass adopt' unless there is some level of stability. If you look at the jump(pump) and fall of any coin it does not take much to realize that an astute individual would not accept the great variance in price without abandoning a coin. Even for a smaller holder...having 50$ one day and only 30$ the next because of great swing in price and lack of trust in the whole system will not produce the mass adoption you are looking for. I realize social media adoption may be a bit diffrent but I think the idea for stability in price still applies. I also realize a pegged price seems to be a failure at this point...
Your thoughts?
D
You cannot stabilize exchange rates during any exponential growth phase unless you having unlimit money to do narrow market making. This guy knows what he's talking about and that is almost exactly what we are doing Elastic supply gives the resources required to do said market making. If you are wondering it works VERY well! ... Said the FED and Keynsyman. I believe in open markets and selfregulation. The less but genius rules the better. Who are you try to get control over complex systems? God? Just because one attempt failed spectacularly due to a number of issues such as a biased distribution, delay in economic information propagation, abuse of money creation, greed and corruption; doesn't mean it can't work if managed and regulated properly. If an economic system is void of the above issues, which decentralized technology now allows us to do, then at the macro scale it simply comes down to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand. Ok, I see we talk about sth very different. You talk about goods and services, I was about money. Not at all, you can quantify money to fit the same simple parameters as supply and demand economics if you are smart about it. If you manage to set money equal to work hours you would not want anybody doing some elastic to your work time, would you? |
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I have been following you for years with much interest, I post very little. How to you plan to stablize the price of your coin? I realize that the market will ultimatly decide the value of a coin but for mass adoption I believe you will need some measure of stability, even if it means a slow and steady increase in the value of your work.
It seems most people will not 'mass adopt' unless there is some level of stability. If you look at the jump(pump) and fall of any coin it does not take much to realize that an astute individual would not accept the great variance in price without abandoning a coin. Even for a smaller holder...having 50$ one day and only 30$ the next because of great swing in price and lack of trust in the whole system will not produce the mass adoption you are looking for. I realize social media adoption may be a bit diffrent but I think the idea for stability in price still applies. I also realize a pegged price seems to be a failure at this point...
Your thoughts?
D
You cannot stabilize exchange rates during any exponential growth phase unless you having unlimit money to do narrow market making. This guy knows what he's talking about and that is almost exactly what we are doing Elastic supply gives the resources required to do said market making. If you are wondering it works VERY well! ... Said the FED and Keynsyman. I believe in open markets and selfregulation. The less but genius rules the better. Who are you try to get control over complex systems? God? Just because one attempt failed spectacularly due to a number of issues such as a biased distribution, delay in economic information propagation, abuse of money creation, greed and corruption; doesn't mean it can't work if managed and regulated properly. If an economic system is void of the above issues, which decentralized technology now allows us to do, then at the macro scale it simply comes down to https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply_and_demand. Ok, I see we talk about sth very different. You talk about goods and services, I was about money. |
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I have been following you for years with much interest, I post very little. How to you plan to stablize the price of your coin? I realize that the market will ultimatly decide the value of a coin but for mass adoption I believe you will need some measure of stability, even if it means a slow and steady increase in the value of your work.
It seems most people will not 'mass adopt' unless there is some level of stability. If you look at the jump(pump) and fall of any coin it does not take much to realize that an astute individual would not accept the great variance in price without abandoning a coin. Even for a smaller holder...having 50$ one day and only 30$ the next because of great swing in price and lack of trust in the whole system will not produce the mass adoption you are looking for. I realize social media adoption may be a bit diffrent but I think the idea for stability in price still applies. I also realize a pegged price seems to be a failure at this point...
Your thoughts?
D
You cannot stabilize exchange rates during any exponential growth phase unless you having unlimit money to do narrow market making. This guy knows what he's talking about and that is almost exactly what we are doing Elastic supply gives the resources required to do said market making. If you are wondering it works VERY well! ... Said the FED and Keynsyman. I believe in open markets and selfregulation. The less but genius rules the better. Who are you try to get control over complex systems? God? |
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Please do your math correct and calc how much it costs to rearrange same amount of blocks within PoW vs PoS under a 51% attack.
Tip: Include hardware / longterm investment here (bitcoin Asics can mostly been profitable used ONLY to mine bitcoin) and separate this from fungible investments.
PoS is not that secure.
Man , the stupid is running wild today. Hard Coded Checkpoints research them , they completely protect a blockchain, which is why PoW & PoS BOTH used them. The Current BTC Transactions History of the last 12 hours (probably more) can be rewritten on a whim by the Chinese Mining Pools. (You call that secure.)  I tell you like I tell the other theory mongers in these forums, PoS is so insecure and so easy for you to break, Cut the BS, Pick one and show me , otherwise, I am just going to assume you are flaccid in your argument like good old Dino is. (Feel Free and try and Destroy ZEIT it is proof of stake , it will be a good laugh for me.)  FYI: Since we know for Certain the last 12 hours of Transaction History of BTC can be overwritten, To prove PoS is less secure than POW, You are going to have to overwrite the last 15 hours or so of a PoS coin. Like I said Take your best shot at ZEIT , I can always use a good laugh. Hey does this Prove Proof of Stake is More Secure than PoW , when you can't do it. Yes, cant fix stupid. So you say your hard coded nodes do all nice. I give up. You win your pos coins. Go for! |
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I have been following you for years with much interest, I post very little. How to you plan to stablize the price of your coin? I realize that the market will ultimatly decide the value of a coin but for mass adoption I believe you will need some measure of stability, even if it means a slow and steady increase in the value of your work.
It seems most people will not 'mass adopt' unless there is some level of stability. If you look at the jump(pump) and fall of any coin it does not take much to realize that an astute individual would not accept the great variance in price without abandoning a coin. Even for a smaller holder...having 50$ one day and only 30$ the next because of great swing in price and lack of trust in the whole system will not produce the mass adoption you are looking for. I realize social media adoption may be a bit diffrent but I think the idea for stability in price still applies. I also realize a pegged price seems to be a failure at this point...
Your thoughts?
D
You cannot stabilize exchange rates during any exponential growth phase unless you having unlimit money to do narrow market making. Stabilitiy is a state of equilibrium that can only happen with a critical mass of bids and ask... Btw first adoption happens from traders liking exactly the high volatility. |
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Mhmmm, dat wird aber den Chinesen auch wieder nicht gefallen. Hat da die PBoC sich ins Knie geballert? |
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To me it looks that simple:
PoW
Most secure way, but expensive ( security = order is expensive, think of entropy )
But does not really scale.
Use case is store of value.
PoS
Less secure ( a 51% attacker can rewrite the entire blockchain, ...) and less expensive.
Better scaling.
Use case is transaction.
Best use of both is in combination by side chains (PoS) settle into the PoW chain.
PoW is only as secure as who controls 51% of the ASICS. PoS
Less secure ( a 51% attacker can rewrite the entire blockchain, ...) and less expensive. Both PoS & PoW use Hard Coded Checkpoints built directly into the Software code, (Cheap Protection from Long Range History Attacks)No Reorganization can happen past a checkpoint.  So any wallet with even 1 checkpoint can never have it's entire blockchain rewritten. Also some Coins employ a rolling checkpoint that will not reorg past a specific number, Nxt is 720 blocks and Blackcoin is 500 blocks , after that number their chain is locked beyond rewrite.  Please do your math correct and calc how much it costs to rearrange same amount of blocks within PoW vs PoS under a 51% attack. Tip: Include hardware / longterm investment here (bitcoin Asics can mostly been profitable used ONLY to mine bitcoin) and separate this from fungible investments. PoS is not that secure. |
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To me it looks that simple:
PoW
Most secure way, but expensive ( security = order is expensive, think of entropy )
But does not really scale.
Use case is store of value.
PoS
Less secure ( a 51% attacker can rewrite the entire blockchain, ...) and less expensive.
Better scaling.
Use case is transaction.
Best use of both is in combination by side chains (PoS) settle into the PoW chain.
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Warum nicht. Bei 100 EUR/BTC könnte ich mir noch mal 1k BTC sichern, also macht weiter so! Mit EUR bin ich sowieso total unzufrieden. Den nehmen nich mal mehr die Behörden (Rundfunk, Finanzamt und Landkreis) an. Was soll ich den Bestand also noch länger behalten?! Irgendetwas muss ja konstant bleiben in diesen volatilen Zeiten. Ja genau, ich oute mich auch hier als EUR Antihodler, dump this shit! |
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.... Und EC Abrechnungsskandal gleich in der Tagesschau eben hinterher, leider ohne den logischen Hinweis auf bitcoin vom Weltspiegel davor.
Ja, GPU Mining hat mich auch irritiert. Mach das Genesis Mining auch?
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Gut das man Island als Beispiel genommen hat und nicht (wie meistens) China.
1 Mio EUR strom pro Monat !! |
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