[ANN] BTCJam - Peer to Peer Bitcoin Lending

[SpaceJelly]

ok, thanks for the clarification, I always wondered if that was the case. I'm not bothered about ratings as I don't ever plan to borrow on there, but am happy to throw a few loose coins around to help others

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[Snipes777]

Was the point of registering a bitcointalk name so that people could get scammer tags for being late? How late do they need to be to earn a scammer tag?

[boonies4u]

Was the point of registering a bitcointalk name so that people could get scammer tags for being late? How late do they need to be to earn a scammer tag?

I don't think being late on a loan makes you a scammer in and of itself.

[gweedo]

Was the point of registering a bitcointalk name so that people could get scammer tags for being late? How late do they need to be to earn a scammer tag?

I don't think being late on a loan makes you a scammer in and of itself.

Being late means nothing, if they default on payments, then they should get a scammer tag, but you have to take that up with theymos

[Snipes777]

right, so the question is how late constitutes a default? right now it isn't set up as it cant go into collection yet, so its seemingly endless in case they do pay back, but I would ask that it maybe be considered default, but still left open after a long period of lateness.

[XxionxX]

It isn't a big deal because I didn't lose a lot of money, but I put 2btc(they were $20 at the time no big deal) into btcjam and I wanted to try out the system.

This user: Bemtje

He had a good rating when I loaned him money. His rating 'evaporated' when I came to check on it this month(take a look at the user page, his rating is 0/17, yet his identity is verified as well as his credit score. Wtf!?). I no longer trust the rating system on btcjam and I will be removing the small amount of funds I have left.

I would not feel comfortable putting large amounts of funds into btcjam and I won't be using it again unless they reform their website and answer the questions I put on this thread MONTHS ago.

I cannot message this user, I cannot rate him and warn others about his lack of payments, and I only see a broken system which allows users to abuse trust. Too bad, btcjam seemed so cool...

I really wanted to like btcjam, sorry.

Edit: I can't even withdraw the last .0045btc I was going to put it in my bitcointipbot on reddit...

[Tulkas]

It isn't a big deal because I didn't lose a lot of money, but I put 2btc(they were $20 at the time no big deal) into btcjam and I wanted to try out the system.

This user: Bemtje

He had a good rating when I loaned him money. His rating 'evaporated' when I came to check on it this month(take a look at the user page, his rating is 0/17, yet his identity is verified as well as his credit score. Wtf!?). I no longer trust the rating system on btcjam and I will be removing the small amount of funds I have left.

I would not feel comfortable putting large amounts of funds into btcjam and I won't be using it again unless they reform their website and answer the questions I put on this thread MONTHS ago.

I cannot message this user, I cannot rate him and warn others about his lack of payments, and I only see a broken system which allows users to abuse trust. Too bad, btcjam seemed so cool...

I really wanted to like btcjam, sorry.

Edit: I can't even withdraw the last .0045btc I was going to put it in my bitcointipbot on reddit...

In every credit rating system you have a good rating if you pays back your loans. If you have a good fico score and start to make late payments or simply do not pay then at all your rating will decrease. This is normal and expected.

You can rate a user if you are a verified member, anonymous users cannot rate others, I'm sorry for that but we can't allow users with low verified information to rate others because this will allow malicious users to use puppet accounts to get high reputation.

About the messages, you can communicate with the borrower through the loan messaging system. The user to user messaging system is underway.

[Tulkas]

right, so the question is how late constitutes a default? right now it isn't set up as it cant go into collection yet, so its seemingly endless in case they do pay back, but I would ask that it maybe be considered default, but still left open after a long period of lateness.

We consider a payment late for more than 120 days a default.

[gappie]

When creating a loan linked to MtGoxUSD, what rate is used to determine the equivalent USD value of the loan when it is activated and then the equivalent amount of BTC when it is repaid?

Is it the last price on the MtGox website or some weighted average for an hour, 6 hours, a day? Where can I see the exact rate that is used? I need to know at what rate I am working with.

[jayguar]

Is anyone seeing server error in BTCJAM? I got it a few times.

[Tulkas]

When creating a loan linked to MtGoxUSD, what rate is used to determine the equivalent USD value of the loan when it is activated and then the equivalent amount of BTC when it is repaid?

Is it the last price on the MtGox website or some weighted average for an hour, 6 hours, a day? Where can I see the exact rate that is used? I need to know at what rate I am working with.

Last MtGox sell value at loan activation. Updated every 7 minutes.

[creativex]

Seems like the soaring exchange rate has encouraged many to "forget" to make payments. I'm done with unsecured loans.

[Tulkas]

Seems like the soaring exchange rate has encouraged many to "forget" to make payments. I'm done with unsecured loans.

Those are our current global numbers:

loans: 1016
total payments: 3833
payments late: 862
fully repaid loans: 584

We have a repayment rate of 77.51%

Despite the 4x price increase the repayment rate decreased only 0.5%.
Remember that many of the borrowers are also miners or work directly with BTC so the exchange price will not affect them.

Also, you always can invest on mtgoxusd/eur referenced loans.

[creativex]

Oh well, as long as the overall default rate only rose .5%. That makes me feel a lot better about my first four defaulters all within the last month.

People cannot or will not repay at these exchange rates. If you don't believe me we can PM Ian Bakewell and request his input...

[Newar]

I have received a rating from user senseless, although according to my records and the site, I have not loaned money to him. I thought this was not possible?

[sal002]

Has anyone else noticed that the calculation of interest is incorrect?  If you make an early payment, interest still accumulates as if you made the payment later.     

[Tulkas]

Has anyone else noticed that the calculation of interest is incorrect?  If you make an early payment, interest still accumulates as if you made the payment later.     

There are many online calculators, this one, for example:
http://www.bankrate.com/calculators/mortgages/loan-calculator.aspx

They ask for annual percent rate (APR), to convert to monthly just multiply by 12 (and set the payment cycle to one of the monthly options on BTCJam):
http://www.wikicfo.com/(S(ad5nas45u0zr13fcts5u0y55))/Print.aspx?Page=Annual%20Percent%20Rate&AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1

[sal002]

Correct.  Those assume payments are only made on the dates specified, not early.  A payment made earlier should alter future payment amounts as the interest cost is decreased.  Maybe you should prevent allowing an early payment in the functionality?

[sal002]

Seems like the soaring exchange rate has encouraged many to "forget" to make payments. I'm done with unsecured loans.

Understood - but for some people who borrowed and used the money in real economic endevours, the rates now on repayment exceed loan sharks.  More specifically, when pegged to real currency, the loan violate many jurisdictions usuary laws since given the currency exchange the "interest" is now in excess of 400%.

At the same time I can understand the argument that these are pure BTC loans and no reference to local currency should be made.  I think that ignores the real world of getting BTC to fund real world tasks which often requires the conversion.

[creativex]

Seems like the soaring exchange rate has encouraged many to "forget" to make payments. I'm done with unsecured loans.

Understood - but for some people who borrowed and used the money in real economic endevours, the rates now on repayment exceed loan sharks.  More specifically, when pegged to real currency, the loan violate many jurisdictions usuary laws since given the currency exchange the "interest" is now in excess of 400%.

At the same time I can understand the argument that these are pure BTC loans and no reference to local currency should be made.  I think that ignores the real world of getting BTC to fund real world tasks which often requires the conversion.

I understand all too well. I borrowed 50BTC @ 5.xx% for six months on btcjam when the exchange rate was $12ish. In dollar terms the interest rate is probably in the thousands of %. I have one payment remaining.

Excuses are meh...you borrow it, you repay it. Obviously others disagree.