[ANN][LSK] Lisk | Blockchain Application Platform for JavaScript Developers

[denixspe]

Notable contributions to the LISK network should be rewarded by the LISK team imho. Otherwise only delegates would be interested in doing anything for LISK and we have to think about much bigger audience here.

No, Lisk is a decentralized blockchain. The decentralized community should reward contributing delegates by voting for them. That's the idea behind DPoS. A centralized entity should not be needed to reward these delegates.
I decided to not give 25% to my voters, but to donate those 25% to contributing people and great projects. Every voter who says this is greedy is just greedy himselve. He prefers his own personal profit over the benefit for the whole Lisk ecosystem.
If all those percentages shared to voters would be invested into great Lisk projects and into people organizing meetups, creating tools, fixing bugs instead, we could be already at twice or three times the price we are now. And everybody who owns LSK would profit much more from higher prices than from a few single LSK payed out because of voting. Think in long term, not short term to get big rewards!
So, .cryptic. tell me who is greedy here:
1) the delegates spending 25% to people contributing to Lisk and promising projects,
2) voters who try to get higher rewards by doing absolutely NOTHING for Lisk
?

Ok.But if you dont give nothing why somone have to vote you?If everybody thinks like that whats the purpose of all this?This is just a question not a provocation.

[1715426262]

1715426262

[cc001]

Notable contributions to the LISK network should be rewarded by the LISK team imho. Otherwise only delegates would be interested in doing anything for LISK and we have to think about much bigger audience here.

No, Lisk is a decentralized blockchain. The decentralized community should reward contributing delegates by voting for them. That's the idea behind DPoS. A centralized entity should not be needed to reward these delegates.
I decided to not give 25% to my voters, but to donate those 25% to contributing people and great projects. Every voter who says this is greedy is just greedy himselve. He prefers his own personal profit over the benefit for the whole Lisk ecosystem.
If all those percentages shared to voters would be invested into great Lisk projects and into people organizing meetups, creating tools, fixing bugs instead, we could be already at twice or three times the price we are now. And everybody who owns LSK would profit much more from higher prices than from a few single LSK payed out because of voting. Think in long term, not short term to get big rewards!
So, .cryptic. tell me who is greedy here:
1) the delegates spending 25% to people contributing to Lisk and promising projects,
2) voters who try to get higher rewards by doing absolutely NOTHING for Lisk
?

Ok.But if you dont give nothing why somone have to vote you?If everybody thinks like that whats the purpose of all this?This is just a question not a provocation.

People should realize that they can earn much more when the Lisk price increases instead of getting some additional LSK without having a higher price. I give you an example, what do you prefer?:
1) now: 1000 LSK with $5 each ($5000), later: 1000 LSK with $20 each ($20000)
2) now: 1000 LSK with $5 each ($5000), later: 1100 LSK with $5 each ($5500)

I think we agree that example 1) is the "better" one. To get a higher price, Lisk must become better, Lisk must be used by much more people, Lisk must become more popular. To reach this, people should organize meetups, build tools, build apps, and so on... To motivate people/delegates to do all those things, you should vote for them, so they can keep forging, and using their funds to do those things, or to fund such projects.

Meaning: by voting for delegates who contribute much to the Lisk ecosystem, you help increasing the price of Lisk which brings you much bigger earnings (X-folds) than just collecting a few additional single LSKs.
This means: by voting for such delegates who contribute to the Lisk ecosystem, you invest longterm into Lisk and you will get much higher rewards than voting for delegates who contribute nothing than paying out some LSK.

[CarlosCorreia]

I'm trying to change some votes in Lisk Nano but I'm getting always an error.
Untill now I had always vote in online wallet, but now I found that I can vote and unvote in the same transaction.

"Invalid transaction timestamp. Timestamp is in the future."

Anyone knows what is this and how can I solve it?

[$dakini]

I'm trying to change some votes in Lisk Nano but I'm getting always an error.
Untill now I had always vote in online wallet, but now I found that I can vote and unvote in the same transaction.

"Invalid transaction timestamp. Timestamp is in the future."

Anyone knows what is this and how can I solve it?

Looks like your system's time stamp is out of sync with the network's time. Try to use some ntp servers for your local machine to get the correct time and try again.

[CarlosCorreia]

Looks like your system's time stamp is out of sync with the network's time. Try to use some ntp servers for your local machine to get the correct time and try again.

Thank You very much!!!
Don't know why, but my clock was a few minuts forward.
Fixed now. Delegates voting done!

[digicoin]

Notable contributions to the LISK network should be rewarded by the LISK team imho. Otherwise only delegates would be interested in doing anything for LISK and we have to think about much bigger audience here.

No, Lisk is a decentralized blockchain. The decentralized community should reward contributing delegates by voting for them. That's the idea behind DPoS. A centralized entity should not be needed to reward these delegates.
I decided to not give 25% to my voters, but to donate those 25% to contributing people and great projects. Every voter who says this is greedy is just greedy himselve. He prefers his own personal profit over the benefit for the whole Lisk ecosystem.
If all those percentages shared to voters would be invested into great Lisk projects and into people organizing meetups, creating tools, fixing bugs instead, we could be already at twice or three times the price we are now. And everybody who owns LSK would profit much more from higher prices than from a few single LSK payed out because of voting. Think in long term, not short term to get big rewards!
So, .cryptic. tell me who is greedy here:
1) the delegates spending 25% to people contributing to Lisk and promising projects,
2) voters who try to get higher rewards by doing absolutely NOTHING for Lisk
?

>> voters who try to get higher rewards by doing absolutely NOTHING for Lisk

You are wrong. LISK holder supports LISK market value by buying and holding LSK. Without them, LSK is a SELL.

>> the delegates spending 25% to people contributing to Lisk and promising projects,

Where is the report? How do you know which projects are promising? Your friend's projects? Or USD 200 freelance projects? Don't tell me that you are writing some line of codes, fixing some typos and ask community for paying you USD 6000 per month forever. It is too greedy.

Please don't act as if you were sole contributor to LISK project. Everyone here is contributing to LISK project in different ways.

I strongly support active contributors to LISK and prefer voting them over profit sharing only delegates. However, let be transparent, fair and accountable. Don't be too greedy and see voters as idiots

Dear voters,
 
Let raise your voice and ask delegates for increasing their profit sharing ratio to at least 50% and consider unvoting the following delegates

+ corsaro: 10% share only
+ tembo: 15% share only
+ mrv: 5% share only
+ redsn0w: 10% share only
+ splatters: 10% share only
+ joel: 15%
+ dakk: 15%
+ 4miners.net: 0%
+ cc001: 0%
+ digitron: 0%
+ hmachado: 0%
+ grumlin: 0%
+ goldeneye: 0%
+ liskgate: 0%
+ punkrock: 0%
+ gr33ndrag0n: 0%

It is a waste of money and time to vote for delegates that share nothing to voters. It is simply too greedy

All of them are from GDTPool

Also, vote for techbytes because he shares 90% reward https://lisk.cryptopools.com


Delegate owners please contact http://earnlisk.com/ owner to update your profit sharing ratio

[mrv777]

I strongly support active contributors to LISK and prefer voting them over profit sharing only delegates. However, let be transparent, fair and accountable. Don't be too greedy and see voters as idiots

Dear voters,
 
Let raise your voice and ask delegates for increasing their profit sharing ratio to at least 50% and consider unvoting the following delegates

+ corsaro: 10% share only
+ tembo: 15% share only
+ mrv: 5% share only
+ redsn0w: 10% share only
+ splatters: 10% share only
+ joel: 15%
+ dakk: 15%
+ 4miners.net: 0%
+ cc001: 0%
+ digitron: 0%
+ hmachado: 0%
+ grumlin: 0%
+ goldeneye: 0%
+ liskgate: 0%
+ punkrock: 0%
+ gr33ndrag0n: 0%

It is a waste of money and time to vote for delegates that share nothing to voters. It is simply too greedy

All of them are from GDTPool

Also, vote for techbytes because he shares 90% reward https://lisk.cryptopools.com


Delegate owners please contact http://earnlisk.com/ owner to update your profit sharing ratio

You say "I strongly support active contributors to LISK and prefer voting them over profit sharing only delegates", but you are telling people to unvote active contributors to lisk like myself that has been closing Github issues at lisk's beginning, providing lisktools.io (which does need to be updated, but waiting for Lisk 1.0 with new API), and providing the Lisk Android Wallet https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=mrv.liskgdt.wallet
or gr33ndrag0n is bad even though he has been the one providing the most reliable snapshots for everyone, makes sure snapshots work with new lisk releases, and has provided alternate wallets and explorer sine the beginning?
or hmachado is bad even though he has provided liskak for all delegates to keep their nodes running smoothly
or 4miners.net is bad even though he has provided great new explorer features and has contributed to closing GitHub issues.
or cc001 who HQ has thought it a good enough delegate that they made a lisk.chat moderator, helping countless new people in chat and has provided many tutorials and guides in the forums.

And instead

You ask people to vote for a profit sharing only delegate that is openly selling the Lisk they keep and providing nothing for Lisk except a pool delegate.

I also find it interesting that you are only asking to unvote GDT members and community contributors; when there is another person in the top 101 that is running 2 delegates and sharing nothing with one of them while providing nothing for Lisk except the other delegate which is a pool.  Hmm....  

Edit: I missed that you said Don't be too greedy and see voters as idiots.  You say this but then tell everyone to vote for a delegate sold all the forged lisk that they set aside for app development for personal gains; and admits to just selling the 50% they weren't sharing with voters; again for presumably just personal gains since they aren't contributing to the Lisk community anymore.

Edit 2: If you want a 90% pool vote in, wouldn't it make more sense to vote gdtpool instead of techbytes?  techbytes has a history of just selling what lisk they can for their own profits.  gdtpool says they will use the 10% not shared to fund and donate to Lisk development projects.  Also, the gdtpool excludes all GDT members so more goes back commuity voters.  Again, this makes your points very interesting.... 

[cc001]

Where is the report? How do you know which projects are promising? Your friend's projects? Or USD 200 freelance projects? Don't tell me that you are writing some line of codes, fixing some typos and ask community for paying you USD 6000 per month forever. It is too greedy.

Here are all my reports:
https://forum.lisk.io/viewtopic.php?f=50&t=1278
You can follow there all transactions I did, see all my donations, and check all my contributions, scripts, tutorials, etc...
You can see there that I already donated around $40000 USD in 7 months to promising people and projects supporting Lisk. I have an additional $360000 USD !! in reserve, ready to be donated to great app/sidechain projects when SDK is ready.
So, if you have something contributed to Lisk, please let me know, I'm ready to donate to you as well if I think you've done something worthful.
But please don't tell me anything about "greedy"!

Please don't act as if you were sole contributor to LISK project. Everyone here is contributing to LISK project in different ways.

So then, what are you doing to help Lisk as a complete ecosystem? Actually you hurt it, and everybody who would like to see Lisk growing should do exactly the opposite of what your are suggesting.
The people you say people should unvote are exactly those guys who did most for Lisk! Unvoting them hurts Lisk very badly.
Actually I think you are here trying to hurt Lisk and people should ignore your comments

However, let be transparent, fair and accountable. Don't be too greedy and see voters as idiots

If you check my transparency reports linked above, you will see that I am extremely transparent.
I don't see voters as idiots. It's the opposite. Voters are at the core of a DPoS system. But voters have a big responsibility and influence about how a system like Lisk will grow in the future. Voters can profit much more from their votes when they vote contributing people, trying to increase the value of Lisk instead of only voting for short term gains.

I strongly support active contributors to LISK and prefer voting them over profit sharing only delegates.

I don't think so. If it's true what you are saying, you wouldn't try to convince people to unvote the most active delegates! All you are interested in is getting as much free money as possible, without doing anything.

[kaedcoin]

You're trying to avoid the fact that you share nearly nothing from your forging.

You help the community, yes, okay that's right, and that's why me for example, i wouldn't complain about you sharing, say, 25%.

But 0% or 5% is greedy, even if you help the community.

And i'd rather see every delegate sharing more than 50%, not 0 or 5% like you... Even 30% min from each delegate would be a big improvement.

Nobody here asks you to share 90, 80, 70% from your forging reward.

Telling us that it's "me helping with stuff OR me sharing" is a false dilemma. You know that. There are delegates, even in your own pool, who do both.

And, plus, i don't defend Elite pool. They are bad too. Your two pools are bad for the community, with too much power in the hands of only 2 entities, and very little sharing output...

Doing this, you won't get LSK to rise above its current price, because people, small voters/owners won't simply buy and hold their LSK when there's so little benefits, they'll rather sell it everytime it rises and buy it when it falls.



(i don't approve what techbytes did with his LSK, selling lots of it for selfish profits is bad, and i've already voted for "delegate" GDTpool and don't plan to unvote it)

[adamvp]

I am proud Lisk bagholder xD
I would like to ask you what with LISK rebranding  I heard it was planned for August but as everyone can see there's end of September and still nothing happend...
Etheteum is one step from entering the mainstream and what with Lisk?

[cc001]

I am proud Lisk bagholder xD
I would like to ask you what with LISK rebranding  I heard it was planned for August but as everyone can see there's end of September and still nothing happend...
Etheteum is one step from entering the mainstream and what with Lisk?

https://blog.lisk.io/lisk-rebrand-development-timeline-76bbf1f81cf5

[kaedcoin]

Delegates actually earn forging more than 2800 LSK per WEEK* (or prove me i'm wrong). Telling us that WE are greedy voters because we want you to share more is INSULTING.




* 10s per block, 8640 per day, 60480 per week 5 LSK per block / 101 delegates

[mrv777]

Telling us that WE are greedy voters because we want you to share more is INSULTING.

I did't call you greedy, I called the delegate that just sells what they don't share greedy  
Also, you are not looking at the whole picture.  Just because I don't share how you want me to, doesn't mean I don't share a lot.  
I have a 5% share that originally was supposed to just be a thank you to voters.  Then I also donate to the gdtpool every week, so that more than doubles my sharing (this is just like elite pool where they all donate to one account that gives out the funds, we have a similar concept).  Then I have a large chunck of my forged funds reserved for donations.  This fund I have used several times already to make donations.  So that is the big way I share.  Same type of concept as Lisk HQ's community fund

So when you look at the whole picture I reserve around 50% of my forged lisk to share and donate.

Would you also call lightcurve a greedy delegate since it shares nothing and just goes to the employees of Lisk HQ??

[kaedcoin]

Telling us that WE are greedy voters because we want you to share more is INSULTING.

I did't call you greedy, I called the delegate that just sells what they don't share greedy  
Also, you are not looking at the whole picture.  Just because I don't share how you want me to, doesn't mean I don't share a lot.  
I have a 5% share that originally was supposed to just be a thank you to voters.  Then I also donate to the gdtpool every week, so that more than doubles my sharing (this is just like elite pool where they all donate to one account that gives out the funds, we have a similar concept).  Then I have a large chunck of my forged funds reserved for donations.  This fund I have used several times already to make donations.  So that is the big way I share.  Same type of concept as Lisk HQ's community fund

So when you look at the whole picture I reserve around 50% of my forged lisk to share and donate.

Would you also call lightcurve a greedy delegate since it shares nothing and just goes to the employees of Lisk HQ??

Do not try to avoid the fact you're not sharing to your voters as much as lots of other delegates do, even if they contribute to the community, even delegates who are in your own pool. You're not sharing 50% of your LSK back to the community, that's a pretty big lie.

That's not some kind of dilemma mate. You can share more to your voters AND contribute as you do. You can do both, you know you do, you gain enough to do both.
You earn lots of LSK from your delegate position, i made a calculation mistake previously, that's almost 3000 LSK a week you gain, right ?
With the price of LSK on the market, that's a lot of money, we don't talk about LSK price several months ago.


And for the greedy/insulting part i was talking to your mate cc001, who is now telling this kind of thing about voters who don't agree with the way you do :

"Actually I think you are here trying to hurt Lisk and people should ignore your comments

Or this

So, .cryptic. tell me who is greedy here:
1) the delegates spending 25% to people contributing to Lisk and promising projects,
2) voters who try to get higher rewards by doing absolutely NOTHING for Lisk

It reminds me of politicians tactics and replies.
*spits*

Well voters HOLD LSK, vote for you people, that's why YOU can forge and contribute and share and donate. And voters don't sell it even if they could gain large benefits by doing it.

But continue to insult us while we just want a bigger part of the cake we help you to make days after days ; we won't forget.

[cc001]

Well voters HOLD LSK, vote for you people, that's why YOU can forge and contribute and share and donate. And voters don't sell it even if they could gain large benefits by doing it.

That's exactly how the system should work. And don't forget the most important thing about delegates: They are those who secure the network and process the blocks. And a secure and stable network is important for Lisk to succeed.

... we just want a bigger part of the cake...

Then do something useful for Lisk. Organize a meetup. tweet about it. Explain it to friends. Write a tool. Publish a website. Do ANYTHING, let me know and I'm very happy to award you with much more than only a few single LSK for voting. Help contributing to Lisk by increasing its value. That's how you will get a bigger part of the cake.

[kaedcoin]

Well voters HOLD LSK, vote for you people, that's why YOU can forge and contribute and share and donate. And voters don't sell it even if they could gain large benefits by doing it.

That's exactly how the system should work. And don't forget the most important thing about delegates: They are those who secure the network and process the blocks. And a secure and stable network is important for Lisk to succeed.

... we just want a bigger part of the cake...

Then do something useful for Lisk. Organize a meetup. tweet about it. Explain it to friends. Write a tool. Publish a website. Do ANYTHING, let me know and I'm very happy to award you with much more than only a few single LSK for voting. Help contributing to Lisk by increasing its value. That's how you will get a bigger part of the cake.

A) I'm not that kind of guy who will say "i've done this, i've done that, please give me something". I do if i think i can and i don't wait for anyone 1) to tell me to help 2) to thank me because i helped.

B) Do not truncate what i say. That's insulting but maybe that's the way you thank your voters.
I said :

Well voters HOLD LSK, vote for you people, that's why YOU can forge and contribute and share and donate. And voters don't sell it even if they could gain large benefits by doing it.

But continue to insult us while we just want a bigger part of the cake we help you to make days after days ; we won't forget.

AGAIN : Being voters, being holders, being buyers and not sellers is already helping LSK to grow. If you can't see it, you're blind.

[mrv777]

... we just want a bigger part of the cake...

Then do something useful for Lisk. Organize a meetup. tweet about it. Explain it to friends. Write a tool. Publish a website. Do ANYTHING, let me know and I'm very happy to award you with much more than only a few single LSK for voting. Help contributing to Lisk by increasing its value. That's how you will get a bigger part of the cake.

This!  I will and have gladly donated to people contributing.  

B) Being voters, being holders, being buyers and not sellers is already helping LSK to grow. If you can't see it, you're blind.

If this is what should be rewarded then I should be rewarding myself too just for this  As I have bought more lisk, voted, and hold.  So I'm helping Lisk grow though that and contributions, so I guess I should be giving myself double  
In reality though, voters and holders already get rewarded by the people and delegates that work on projects on Lisk and increase it's value.  So those people are already getting their share.  If they also wanted their account to be like a savings account where they earn interest on their holdings, that is what PoS is 

[kaedcoin]

You guys continue arguing because you don't want to gain less money than you do. That's all.

That's fun the two of you are amongst the less sharing delegates of the top101 list.

And you keep arguing while there are lots of delegates SHARING far more than you AND still CONTRIBUTING to the community and the LISK ecosystem.

[mrv777]

You guys continue arguing because you don't want to gain less money than you do. That's all.

That's fun the two of you are amongst the less sharing delegates of the top101 list.

And you keep arguing while there are lots of delegates SHARING far more than you AND still CONTRIBUTING to the community and the LISK ecosystem.

You just don't seem to like that we share through donations to projects instead of directly to voters.  We do share a lot more then you are trying to give us credit for.
You also seem to be ignoring the delegates that are contributing less and sharing the same or less then us too.

I'm also still curious what you think of the lightcurve delegate

Edit: If you want us to share more with you, just show us something you are working on for Lisk.  We reward contributions, not the size of your wallet.  Your sharing will just lead to the rich getting richer issue that many don't like too

[mrv777]

I am proud Lisk bagholder xD
I would like to ask you what with LISK rebranding  I heard it was planned for August but as everyone can see there's end of September and still nothing happend...
Etheteum is one step from entering the mainstream and what with Lisk?

Hi!

Here is the blog post Lisk HQ recently posted about the rebrand timeline: https://blog.lisk.io/lisk-rebrand-development-timeline-76bbf1f81cf5