[Avalon ASIC] Batch #2 pre-Sale Thread

[crazy_rabbit]

This is how i read it:

Batch one flopped, some serious issues have been discovered with the initial chips that rolled out.
They've managed to salvage a few chips and build a few units that sort of work and sent out a couple of prototypes.
They now need money to pay for a respin and are banking that the second run will work and they'll have enough chips to fulfill batches 1 & 2.

Good call.  I +1 this as the most reasonable explanation.

On the strangely positive note, I guess we have no reason to expect a massive dump by ASIC miners anytime soon. So, dear BTC price, feel free to keep climbing...

[tytus]

Even Jeff and BTC Foundation may receive functioning Avalon, think twice before you order the 2nd batch:

南瓜这次发货的方法我很熟悉
我见过有人这么做，做出来的产品良品率低，就从矮子里面找高个的
拼凑出来几台最稳定的机器先拿出去
我和群里的也说过，我相信他发给JEFF的那个机器是工作的很完美的机器
一旦JEFF发了评测，后面的人哪怕拿到的是垃圾也只会认为自己比较倒霉

Translation:

I know the way how NGZ is shipping his product.

I knew someone shipped his product like this before: Since most of the products were defective, he picked the best ones and built a few stable machine for first round shipping.

I told other people in the channel: I believe he will send a perfect machine to Jeff. When Jeff has released his report, other customers will just think they are unlucky even they receive a crappy machine.

The hashing chips have yield problems (depending on the optimization of the density even 50% of chips can be bad). If You assemble a board with bad chips the whole board is bad (unless the board is designed for redundancy). On the other hand testing each chip separately is very expensive and time consuming (without special equipment that allows on wafer testing).
The only proof for the batch1 machines to be functional is a 50% increase of the hashing power.

[Gomeler]

Even Jeff and BTC Foundation may receive functioning Avalon, think twice before you order the 2nd batch:

南瓜这次发货的方法我很熟悉
我见过有人这么做，做出来的产品良品率低，就从矮子里面找高个的
拼凑出来几台最稳定的机器先拿出去
我和群里的也说过，我相信他发给JEFF的那个机器是工作的很完美的机器
一旦JEFF发了评测，后面的人哪怕拿到的是垃圾也只会认为自己比较倒霉

Translation:

I know the way how NGZ is shipping his product.

I knew someone shipped his product like this before: Since most of the products were defective, he picked the best ones and built a few stable machine for first round shipping.

I told other people in the channel: I believe he will send a perfect machine to Jeff. When Jeff has released his report, other customers will just think they are unlucky even they receive a crappy machine.

The hashing chips have yield problems (depending on the optimization of the density even 50% of chips can be bad). If You assemble a board with bad chips the whole board is bad (unless the board is designed for redundancy). On the other hand testing each chip separately is very expensive and time consuming (without special equipment that allows on wafer testing).
The only proof for the batch1 machines to be functional is a 50% increase of the hashing power.

I would imagine that the company that did the packaging of the chips would also be running a functionality test. I believe that was mentioned a while back.

[tytus]

I would imagine that the company that did the packaging of the chips would also be running a functionality test. I believe that was mentioned a while back.

You can order many additional things (testing) but they cost money.

[Korbman]

Translation:

I know the way how NGZ is shipping his product.

I knew someone shipped his product like this before: Since most of the products were defective, he picked the best ones and built a few stable machine for first round shipping.

I told other people in the channel: I believe he will send a perfect machine to Jeff. When Jeff has released his report, other customers will just think they are unlucky even they receive a crappy machine.

I verify that the translation is correct, and I am somewhat concerned with this issue.

As enormously disconcerting as this is, thanks for the update John.

[BitSyncom]

BitSyncom,
What about Lancelot upgrade program. Will all Lancelot customers be able to get 399 USD discount for their Lancelots as promised? Can you write a bit more about how shall we proceed with ordering/payment in case we do upgrade?
10X

This matter has been addressed and updated in the first thread.

[greyhawk]

If they don't want to do customer service then they shouldn't expect customers. The best small business routinely go over and beyond on customer service. This breeds loyalty and a healthy business.

That's very Western of you. Things usually don't work like that in the East.

[siulynot]

Its silly how many times ive read threads about scams like this on SR.

The next thing will be the shipping is late due to whatever responsability the postman can have.

There is a rule in SR that should also apply to everything else in BTC: NEVER FINALIZE EARLY

[Luno]

I have a hard time believing that NGZ is running a scam, but he might be in over his head and invested in this with all his own money and some loans.

This kind of borrowing from future orders is illegal, but happens in every line of business every day in any country.

I used to work for a travelling agency, and if suddently seat prices got more expensive or my boss had partied too hard for too long, he would run som ad's with special discounted offers, taking peoples money, to pay for the tourists wanting to get home next week! He is still in business and has been for 30 years!!

[mjester93]

Its silly how many times ive read threads about scams like this on SR.

The next thing will be the shipping is late due to whatever responsability the postman can have.

There is a rule in SR that should also apply to everything else in BTC: NEVER FINALIZE EARLY

Amen to that. I wouldn't put any money up toward an ASIC until there's 100% proof that I'm going to get it.

[2112]

The hashing chips have yield problems (depending on the optimization of the density even 50% of chips can be bad). If You assemble a board with bad chips the whole board is bad (unless the board is designed for redundancy). On the other hand testing each chip separately is very expensive and time consuming (without special equipment that allows on wafer testing).
The only proof for the batch1 machines to be functional is a 50% increase of the hashing power.

I wrote many times already that SHA-2 is essentially self-testing and one of the cheapest possible to test. Anyone claiming otherwise is incompetent or deceiving.

I need to quote the signature too because it looks like the author is going to solicit money himself. It may be worth to keep eye on his business.

PicoStocks.com, High-tech startup fundraising, evaluation and profit sharing

[tytus]

The hashing chips have yield problems (depending on the optimization of the density even 50% of chips can be bad). If You assemble a board with bad chips the whole board is bad (unless the board is designed for redundancy). On the other hand testing each chip separately is very expensive and time consuming (without special equipment that allows on wafer testing).
The only proof for the batch1 machines to be functional is a 50% increase of the hashing power.

I wrote many times already that SHA-2 is essentially self-testing and one of the cheapest possible to test. Anyone claiming otherwise is incompetent or deceiving.

"Cheap" does not mean it is free. You have to plan the test in the project and order it. How else can You do a "self-test" on few thousand chips from 6 engineering run wafers?

I need to quote the signature too because it looks like the author is going to solicit money himself. It may be worth to keep eye on his business.

PicoStocks.com, High-tech startup fundraising, evaluation and profit sharing

Correct. We are also working on an ASIC chip.

[cedivad]

[Korbman]

If they don't want to do customer service then they shouldn't expect customers. The best small business routinely go over and beyond on customer service. This breeds loyalty and a healthy business.

That's very Western of you. Things usually don't work like that in the East.

Which is why they're quickly discovering that pandering to us "Westerners" is mildly aggravating (to put it lightly of course).

@Team Avalon - Welcome to the world of business. Judging by your current demeanor, my guess is that you're new here.
Quick words of advice:

The customer’s perception is your reality.
-Kate Zabriskie, Author of: Customer Service Excellence

[Unacceptable]

That they are paying for an ASIC, not the cajoling/cuddling that comes out of customer care.

So, they are the Soup Nazi of ASICs?

   "Excuse me, my ASIC didn't come with a power cord"
  "YOU WANT POWER CORD??? 50 BTC!!"
   "...but he got one for free"
  *angrily grabs asic from customer* "NO ASIC FOR YOU!!"

I did this one awhile ago 



I can't believe Avalon acting this way,I am shocked to be honest.....No proof,no SALE!!

[SellingMyGPUs]

Dear Yifu,

can you explain how you will overlook/manage the second wave of orders if you are not in NY where you have full access to the backend (as that seems to restrict you from answering customer questions and address opened tickets).

Better hosting this time so the site does not collapse under the load of thousands of potential orders placed?

[BitSyncom]

Dear Yifu,

can you explain how you will overlook/manage the second wave of orders if you are not in NY where you have full access to the backend (as that seems to restrict you from answering customer questions and address opened tickets).

Better hosting this time so the site does not collapse under the load of thousands of potential orders placed?

I will of course be in NY when order happens, better hosting has been acquired. I do not for see any problems. We try to only make the same mistake once.

[kaerf]

Can you manually courier back a device on your way back to the US?  I know you mentioned something like this before...but seriously. just one device to have someone demo.

[PuertoLibre]

Can you manually courier back a device on your way back to the US?  I know you mentioned something like this before...but seriously. just one device to have someone demo.

Sounds like a good backup plan if Jeff doesn't get his on time!

[SellingMyGPUs]

I will of course be in NY when order happens, better hosting has been acquired. I do not for see any problems. We try to only make the same mistake once.

So does that mean once you are back in NY in 2 days, you'll be also addressing those Batch 1 order questions and tickets or have you all together abandoned those customers?