[ANN][STEEM][POW] - NO IPO | NO PREMINE | NO INSTAMINE (relaunch)

[cryptohunter]

what is the actual reasoning behind not having windows binaries?

Is it that you have not been able to make them?

Is there anyone here that can make them?

[1714188877]

1714188877

[1714188877]

1714188877

[1714188877]

1714188877

[NextGenCrypto]

NextGen, Steemd, if you would like to be a witness I will vote for your continued efforts if you would be willing to reveal a bit about yourself and are interested in a long-term job running a node.

If you are interested in becoming a witness please share with everyone a little about yourself.  There are 19 slots available.

I'd be happy to.

As many have, I joined the crypto world after the sudden increase in price and publicity a few years back now.  The latest project I've worked on in the crypto space is Synergy Cloud, a web based trading bot (similar to other basic bots out there) that allows users to trade across a few exchanges in reward for burning Synergy Coin.  I'm also very involved in the Coinbar project and spend a lot of time looking for new cryptos to get involved in and doing some trading here and there.     Professionally, I'm a project manager working for a large e-commerce company mainly focusing on machine learning.  I've got a good amount of hardware at my disposal and will continue to support the STEEM project. 

[puppies]

Very interesting.  I'm not gonna pretend that I quite understand what you are doing yet with the vesting, but I'll keep reading.  In the mean time its awesome to see another coin based on graphene.  Sexiest framework ever.  I am currently mining. 

[Bubba-Gump]

NextGen, Steemd, if you would like to be a witness I will vote for your continued efforts if you would be willing to reveal a bit about yourself and are interested in a long-term job running a node.

If you are interested in becoming a witness please share with everyone a little about yourself.  There are 19 slots available.

I'm interested in being a witness as well, but maybe the only way I can prove my support for this coin is that I have been mining it to a bunch of aliases for a few days. I have steemroller and stanleysteemer. I also have a bunch of coin names including ethereum, ripple, namecoin, and litecoin. I also have been mining a few ticker symbols like btc, eth, and bts. I can prove ownership of all these aliases and that they were created before the devs mentioned slots for witnesses.

I like a lot of things about bitshares, especially pegged currencies, so I'm excited about a bitshares-based coin. One thing I dislike is the potential for abuse with delegated PoS, although the bitshares model seems to address most of my concerns.

As my backposts indicate, I am especially displeased with the lisk delegated PoS model, where the initial distribution is based on an ICO, and each stakeholder can vote multiple times with their stake.

STEEM is interesting because it dispenses with PoS altogether, but not on the back of stakeholders. When I saw this idea of delegated PoW, I realized its importance and started mining.

I know my post history here at bitcointalk is somewhat limited, but I am mostly a lurker, except when I feel like I have something to say. You can see my account is fairly old, so I have been around long enough to know when something special pops up.

[valzav]

This wasn't bad enough. After the first 12 or so hours of mining, all their miners crashed, exposing that they were mining to 100 different witnesses to hide the fact that they (he) was one entity. The devs wouldn't have been caught except that their mining instructions were wrong, and no one else was mining because, even if they couldn't get the client to build, they entered mining commands that caused them to get no blocks. The devs will claim this isn't on purpose, but check the original thread. You'll see that no one mined a block when the dev's miners were down.

Then, as I have stated many times, when their miners crashed again, I mined a significant amount of steem that night in their absence. To prevent my vesting that and driving the price of vests up on them, they relaunched to ensure COMPLETE CONTROL AND CENTRALIZATION.

@Eclipse Crypto, I was mining from the first hours on the initial network before the relaunch and I didn't notice any crashes - the network was pretty stable. thereverseflash has reported his seed node crashed but if you were already connected to the network it shouldn't had affected you. I think you either got on a fork or it's possible that you could mine a lot because the difficulty was very low the first day - I myself was able to mine on my laptop the first day much more than over the next few days after relaunch. So I think even if relaunch wasn't favorable for me personally it was a good thing for the system because more independent miners were able to participate - all we want right now is to grow the value of the STEEM we mined, it's better to have less stake in more valuable token than big stake in the token that has no value.

[drays]

The latest master branch contains enhancements to POW that should boost mining efficiency by 33%.

Is it safe to assume you were mining using that efficient version from the very beginning, just to give yourself another 33% advantage over the "regular" miners?

The answer is yes, most definitely...  . Information is money, isn't it, and you used it in so many ways... Wasn't it more honest to just premine this and make an ICO, instead of running all those 'games'?

**************

I mine this from the very beginning. But I am not going to ask anybody to let me run a 'witness' node.

[puppies]

I would be interested in running a witness node for steem.  I have been an active BTS witness for the last 2 years or so.

[SalimNagamato]

i want to try run steem witness node
a little about myself:

i work as system administrator,
mostly interested in useful POW and if it can work with crypto (can see from my signature)
been mining STEEM with my VPSs because it looked unique coin (i did not use my work servers - it would be both illegal and unfair)
i have accounts steempty and fmooo mining at the moment

[Xeldal]

I'm running a couple mining instances now.  They seem to be working.  I'm not sure though.  Its been about 12 hours at ~4k hash rate and no STEEM balance yet. queue seems to always be around 92 and time to produce seems to jump around randomly always between 200 and 600 minutes.

I'm also interested in running a witness for STEEM. I've been an active witness for BitShares for the last 2 years and this project looks very interesting.  I'd be happy to dedicate my time to support it.

[kahir]

thereverseflash still no plans for windows wallets

[drays]

thereverseflash still no plans for windows wallets

It shouldn't be too hard to build Windows wallet for this, if you have fast enough Windows PC with some free space. Just no real incentive to do so. I have just one Win PC for instance, which could just add some more-or-less considerable hash to me, but not enough to make me bother with making this wallet.

BTW, I wouldn't be suprised if there are people who already built Win daemons, but keep them for themselves not to create competition for themselves, as compiled Win daemon will immediately skyrocket the difficulty. It looks like this particular coin is all about keeping info for themselves, noone really wants to share much - people follow Devs example

From the other hand, as the devs already got the dominant share they wanted to get, I would expect them to release win binaries soon.

[thereverseflash]

i want to try run steem witness node
a little about myself:

i work as system administrator,
mostly interested in useful POW and if it can work with crypto (can see from my signature)
been mining STEEM with my VPSs because it looked unique coin (i did not use my work servers - it would be both illegal and unfair)
i have accounts steempty and fmooo mining at the moment

Network admin experience sounds like the right skill set for this.  I'll vote for steempty.

Because the network uses approval voting, we can vote for more than 19  witnesses and let everyone else decide which of our nominees actually are selected.

Our influence over the network will decrease over time, but during the bootstrap phase it beneficial.  

  

Wasn't it more honest to just premine this and make an ICO, instead of running all those 'games'?

We would have preferred the premine + ICO route.  It would have been cleaner, lower risk (in terms of getting desired stake), etc.  Then we talked to lawyers and read the regulations and saw how Ripple was prosecuted.

Conclusion: premine + ICO could force us to register as MSB and cost hundreds of thousands of dollars. Furthermore, it would undermine the real use case for Steem.  ICO also carries
the risk of SEC violations.  I am not saying that a premine + ICO couldn't be done legally without becoming a MSB or violating SEC, I am merely stating that it is more challenging / risky.

Meanwhile Bitcoin, Litecoin, Dogecoin, and other mined coins appear to be accepted and explicitly accounted for in the regulations.  

When it comes to the law and regulations, how you do something is often more important than the result achieved.

So we released a coin with open code that fully documents the protocol for anyone willing to work for it and didn't mine anything before all information about the protocol was technically available to the public. In theory,
anyone could see the protocol and realize the new business opportunities it creates. There is no "insider" information when the protocol is open and anyone can build on it.  

Our only advantage is *information* about how we intend to use the platform. The irony is that there are legal risks in sharing information about what we intend to do for a
coin until after we have done it. That information could be interpreted as a promise that in turn would give the coin value derived from our future actions.  So we didn't promise anything, but we still
know what our plans are. End result, we valued the coin higher than anyone else.  We purchased it with our own miners. Speculators willing to take a risk competed with us even though they didn't
know exactly what we planned to do with the coin.

We also have learned from past experiences like ProtoShares that was used to launch BitShares. Invictus had intended to mine it and make money on the appreciation after BitShares
actually came out, but instead GPU miners and faster mining algorithms were developed within a week of launch. That left the BitShares team struggling for a solution. It is reasonable to
expect that anyone with a profiler and some programming skills could come up with a faster, more efficient, implementation of mining that we did. Higher performance could have been achieved
with just a hour of effort by a competent programmer.  

So, if you are OK with the concept of premine + ICO, and if you value having a development team funded by capital appreciation, and if you value having a team do the best it
can to insulate itself for burdensome regulations, then you can appreciate what was done with STEEM.  If you don't like 'games' then blame the government for their rules, don't blame the people who play by them.

[cryptohunter]

what is the actual reasoning behind not having windows binaries?

Is it that you have not been able to make them?

Is there anyone here that can make them?

The reasoning behind not having windows binaries is that the devs continue to use their insider knowledge to fuck over the community.

The list of how they do this is growing longer.

Most recently you will notice that they offered someone a position as a witness. How are they able to offer this position? Because they have now secured all control over this coin by using this concept of vests. This coin is COMPLETELY CENTRALIZED NOW.

Here's how they did it:

First, they did a typical instamine/flashmine/freemine scam (yes scam) where they released

(1) no compiled wallets
(2) no instructions to build
(3) incomplete and inaccurate instructions to mine

This wasn't bad enough. After the first 12 or so hours of mining, all their miners crashed, exposing that they were mining to 100 different witnesses to hide the fact that they (he) was one entity. The devs wouldn't have been caught except that their mining instructions were wrong, and no one else was mining because, even if they couldn't get the client to build, they entered mining commands that caused them to get no blocks. The devs will claim this isn't on purpose, but check the original thread. You'll see that no one mined a block when the dev's miners were down.

Then, as I have stated many times, when their miners crashed again, I mined a significant amount of steem that night in their absence. To prevent my vesting that and driving the price of vests up on them, they relaunched to ensure COMPLETE CONTROL AND CENTRALIZATION.

After the relaunch, no one would challenge them on mining because if they did, the devs would just relaunch this scamcoin again. So, no one who pays attention (and the people who have the means to procure whatever hashes they want are also the people who are paying attention), would challenge them on the hashes. As they hoped, no one did and they completely dominated the hashes for 1 week.

Now after 1 week of hashing, they dump all their coins into vests, where the price of a vest goes up with the amount vested. This is not your typical stakeholding where one unit of currency is worth one stake. This is on purpose so that they can COMPLETELY CONTROL THIS COIN IN A CENTRALIZED WAY after just 1 week.

Vests don't cost 1 STEEM anymore like they did when the devs bought them. They now cost 5 STEEM. That means that you will need to dominate all the hashes for 5 weeks just to match the control the devs have after 1 week. They have driven your costs up by 5, not using the market, as should be done, but by using this freemine/threat-of-relaunch scam.

So, why don't we all just mine for 5 weeks and decentralize control ourselves? There are two main reasons.

First, anyone who is paying attention (this includes all smart people with BTC to throw at things like this) won't dump money on a scam like this. So you are going to get a bunch of gullible small timers who don't have the foresight to convert to vests anyway, even if vests were legit. The small timers just want to get a profit asap.

Second, there's only 3 more weeks left of true mining before delegated mining kicks in. Delegated mining is when the devs pick 19 "witnesses" to mine. Maybe they might pick one or two legit miners, but the most likely scenario, given the scam they have perpetrated so far, is that they will pick at least 17 instances of themselves to mine.

In other words, it's impossible now to decentralize this coin because the devs have rigged it since the beginning. Not only that, they will be getting all the coins, unchallenged, for as small of a price as they want to pay.

By the way, I'm keeping track here. The devs are going to have to stay low and so will this coin. If it ever gets big, then these devs will be fucked because they will not be able to deny they control the entire currency.

sounds like a relaunch is needed or else branded a scam.

[drays]

@thereverseflash: thanks for taking the time to explain. Glad to make sure you are very serious about this project. So basically this is a kind of premined/ICO coin, done with a twist to avoid legal implications. Though I am not really happy with the miserable amount of information released at the beginning (which particularly lead me mine this rather in "on idle" mode), but well, I understand - you made the work, you want to get the appropriate reward.
The launch may seem to be unfair to some, but in fact it is not any worse than all those LISK/WAVE/etc ICOs. Maybe even better.

sounds like a relaunch is needed or else branded a scam.

@cryptohunter: relaunch? Good joke. Want to get a bigger piece of the cake? I would also like a relaunch, that could let me mine this more seriously, but I doubt this is an option, as things were done exactly to the plan, as far as I understand. It seems to me, instead of relaunch, the dev soon will provide the windows binaries + another piece of info to further increase the interest.
And - it is branded a scam by one person only - mostly by personal reasons. With all the respect to eclipse_crypto, thats just a personal war, attempt of revenge for not letting him to get the dominance.

[cryptohunter]

@thereverseflash: thanks for taking the time to explain. Glad to make sure you are very serious about this project. So basically this is a kind of premined/ICO coin, done with a twist to avoid legal implications. Though I am not really happy with the miserable amount of information released at the beginning (which particularly lead me mine this rather in "on idle" mode), but well, I understand - you made the work, you want to get the appropriate reward.
The launch may seem to be unfair to some, but in fact it is not any worse than all those LISK/WAVE/etc ICOs. Maybe even better.

sounds like a relaunch is needed or else branded a scam.

@cryptohunter: relaunch? Good joke. Want to get a bigger piece of the cake? I would also like a relaunch, that could let me mine this more seriously, but I doubt this is an option, as things were done exactly to the plan, as far as I understand. It seems to me, instead of relaunch, the dev soon will provide the windows binaries + another piece of info to further increase the interest.
And - it is branded a scam by one person only - mostly by personal reasons. With all the respect to eclipse_crypto, thats just a personal war, attempt of revenge for not letting him to get the dominance.

I don't think him expecting to mine on a fair playing field is requesting dominance.
Trust me when I tell you one person calling a project a scam can brand that project as a scam in the minds of the majority of this board.. if that person has evidence pointing to it being a scam.

When are the windows binaries being released?

[hrossik]

Code:

2940303ms th_a       witness.cpp:352               on_applied_block     ] hash rate: 14647 hps  target: 27 queue: 94 estimated time to produce: 152.72493570924649475 minutes
2941392ms th_a       application.cpp:394           handle_transaction   ] Got 1 transactions from network
2942471ms th_a       application.cpp:394           handle_transaction   ] Got 1 transactions from network
2943178ms th_a       witness.cpp:352               on_applied_block     ] hash rate: 14909 hps  target: 27 queue: 95 estimated time to produce: 150.04105797393074795 minutes
2946059ms th_a       witness.cpp:352               on_applied_block     ] hash rate: 14754 hps  target: 27 queue: 95 estimated time to produce: 151.61733315259138521 minutes

I've been mining with this hashrate for 12 hours and still got nothing.. Any idea what I might be doing wrong? Am I mining?

What is the proper way of checking how much I earned? I run a cli_wallet, which connects to ./steemd --rpc-endpoint --seed-node="52.38.66.234:2001", but I always have to use --replay-blockchain, otherwise it gets outdated and doesn't sync automatically and if I want to check after some time, I need to restart the rpc-endpoint and replay the chain..

[drays]

Those with tiny little minds who can't see through all the complexities might be thinking that I'm dwelling on relaunch because it effected me. Yeah, it effected me. No shit sherlock.

@Eclipse Crypto: Watch your tongue, a "great big mind". You are good at coding, and have good tech skills. That doesn't make you wiser or even smarter than many other people. I know that type of coders who think their competence in narrow tech field makes them so much more clever than everyone else. Typically that unhealthy attitude is cured with time and age.
Yes, I don't take all your words as god-given, and I never take anyone's words as they are. I prefer to read between the lines, think independently and make my own conclusions. And among others things, what I see here is a personal vendetta of a pissed-off guy. Look inside yourself, be honest with yourself, and you will see that too. Don't pretend to be scam-buster. If they let you mine all you wanted, all your scam-accusation activity would never even appear here.

Now - technically I agree to everything you told up to now. But I disagree with the interpretation and conclusions, which are affected by attitude and hence are not objective.

*********************

@Everyone Else: lets forget about the ways this was done for a moment. The actual result is: the coin is premined currently, and concentrated in the hands of the devs, as all we actually expected. Basically this is the same situation LISK (or many other current ICO coins) had before actually doing the ICO. So why this is called scam, and all the rest - not? Just because of the details on how this was launched? To me its doesn't seem to be that important. Lets see what the devs are going to do with this further. That will define whether this is a scam or not.

[drays]

Code:

2940303ms th_a       witness.cpp:352               on_applied_block     ] hash rate: 14647 hps  target: 27 queue: 94 estimated time to produce: 152.72493570924649475 minutes
2941392ms th_a       application.cpp:394           handle_transaction   ] Got 1 transactions from network
2942471ms th_a       application.cpp:394           handle_transaction   ] Got 1 transactions from network
2943178ms th_a       witness.cpp:352               on_applied_block     ] hash rate: 14909 hps  target: 27 queue: 95 estimated time to produce: 150.04105797393074795 minutes
2946059ms th_a       witness.cpp:352               on_applied_block     ] hash rate: 14754 hps  target: 27 queue: 95 estimated time to produce: 151.61733315259138521 minutes

I've been mining with this hashrate for 12 hours and still got nothing.. Any idea what I might be doing wrong? Am I mining?

What is the proper way of checking how much I earned? I run a cli_wallet, which connects to ./steemd --rpc-endpoint --seed-node="52.38.66.234:2001", but I always have to use --replay-blockchain, otherwise it gets outdated and doesn't sync automatically and if I want to check after some time, I need to restart the rpc-endpoint and replay the chain..

Try to use "import_key YOUR_MINING_KEY" on the "cli_wallet". Then run "list_my_accounts" there. You should see whether you got anything. With this hashrate you should have catched a block in 12 hours. Also better add all the three seednodes in the config file. The first one doesn't seem to work always.

[cryptohunter]

Those with tiny little minds who can't see through all the complexities might be thinking that I'm dwelling on relaunch because it effected me. Yeah, it effected me. No shit sherlock.

@Eclipse Crypto: Watch your tongue, a "great big mind". You are good at coding, and have good tech skills. That doesn't make you wiser or even smarter than many other people. I know that type of coders who think their competence in narrow tech field makes them so much more clever than everyone else. Typically that unhealthy attitude is cured with time and age.
Yes, I don't take all your words as god-given, and I never take anyone's words as they are. I prefer to read between the lines, think independently and make my own conclusions. And among others things, what I see here is a personal vendetta of a pissed-off guy. Look inside yourself, be honest with yourself, and you will see that too. Don't pretend to be scam-buster. If they let you mine all you wanted, all your scam-accusation activity would never even appear here. This is how I see it. I may be wrong, and you are free to disagree, the same as I disagree with you.

*********************

@Everyone Else: lets forget about the ways this was done for a moment. The actual result is: the coin is premined currently, and concentrated in the hands of the devs, as all we actually expected. Basically this is the same situation LISK (or many other current ICO coins) had before actually doing the ICO. So why this is called scam, and all the rest - not? Just because of the details on how this was launched? To me its doesn't seem to be that important. Lets see what the devs are going to do with this further. That will define whether this is a scam or not.

total shill for this project - words should be ignored!

If no windows  wallet today, then it must be time to announce this as a scam on the main board so people may avoid this project in the future.

If it is not a scam for the devs to be pulling a xcoin/dark kind of captive instamine then explain clearly why it is not a scam to be doing so.

[seedtrue]

Those with tiny little minds who can't see through all the complexities might be thinking that I'm dwelling on relaunch because it effected me. Yeah, it effected me. No shit sherlock.

@Eclipse Crypto: Watch your tongue, a "great big mind". You are good at coding, and have good tech skills. That doesn't make you wiser or even smarter than many other people. I know that type of coders who think their competence in narrow tech field makes them so much more clever than everyone else. Typically that unhealthy attitude is cured with time and age.
Yes, I don't take all your words as god-given, and I never take anyone's words as they are. I prefer to read between the lines, think independently and make my own conclusions. And among others things, what I see here is a personal vendetta of a pissed-off guy. Look inside yourself, be honest with yourself, and you will see that too. Don't pretend to be scam-buster. If they let you mine all you wanted, all your scam-accusation activity would never even appear here. This is how I see it. I may be wrong, and you are free to disagree, the same as I disagree with you.

*********************

@Everyone Else: lets forget about the ways this was done for a moment. The actual result is: the coin is premined currently, and concentrated in the hands of the devs, as all we actually expected. Basically this is the same situation LISK (or many other current ICO coins) had before actually doing the ICO. So why this is called scam, and all the rest - not? Just because of the details on how this was launched? To me its doesn't seem to be that important. Lets see what the devs are going to do with this further. That will define whether this is a scam or not.

total shill for this project - words should be ignored!

If no windows  wallet today, then it must be time to announce this as a scam on the main board so people may avoid this project in the future.

If it is not a scam for the devs to be pulling a xcoin/dark kind of captive instamine then explain clearly why it is not a scam to be doing so.

You can run it in a free VM on your Windows machine.