Cryptopia Cryptocurrency Platform Services and Development

[JollyGood]

Oh well, since this situation will take years to resolve the only winners in this are Grant Thornton because they are guaranteed to have a income for the period they are employed to clean this mess up

https://www.grantthornton.co.nz/update-for-cryptopia-account-holders-25-October-2019/

[1714993506]

1714993506

[1714993506]

1714993506

[TheCryproMaster]

Oh well, since this situation will take years to resolve the only winners in this are Grant Thornton because they are guaranteed to have a income for the period they are employed to clean this mess up

https://www.grantthornton.co.nz/update-for-cryptopia-account-holders-25-October-2019/

Liquidators are THE vultures in our society they feed on failure and as you said are guaranteed to make a very very healthy income from this. And as seen with 200m in assets in dispute they will spin this fucker to the maximum benefit for themselves. Yes years of fat undisputed fees.

What a great business model, if its a shit return fuck it and move on, an asset rich company, holy shit milk the cow dry.

And yes that fucking mooseshit sisquo2121 wants a gang of fired up locals to smash down the doors and 'take bats to them', but in a civilized society ruled by the man we got to bend over and take it sans lube.

 
 

[JollyGood]

Liquidators are THE vultures in our society they feed on failure and as you said are guaranteed to make a very very healthy income from this. And as seen with 200m in assets in dispute they will spin this fucker to the maximum benefit for themselves. Yes years of fat undisputed fees.

What a great business model, if its a shit return fuck it and move on, an asset rich company, holy shit milk the cow dry.

And yes that fucking mooseshit sisquo2121 wants a gang of fired up locals to smash down the doors and 'take bats to them', but in a civilized society ruled by the man we got to bend over and take it sans lube.

It would not surprise me at all if any liquidator dragged it out for as long as possible to get paid as long as possible. Not saying it will happen in this case but it would not surprise me.

How much do you think they will manage to keep for themselves as a percentage of the final total on top of their salaries?

[TheCryproMaster]

As much as their overfed fat bloated waistlines can carry.

Some more info, long read but worth it.

On Tuesday, October 8th, the XTRABYTES™ Co-founder and the Operational Security Manager conducted a phone call with a representative of Grant Thornton, the firm in charge of liquidating Cryptopia. The goal of this call was to find out what the intentions of the liquidation firm are and how that would affect XTRABYTES’™ particular situation.

We have since been in regular contact with that same representative as we had agreed upon, to make sure that the content of our update was 100% accurate.

The final draft of this update was sent to Grant Thornton on Monday October 21st, for them to go over and give it their seal of approval regarding the Cryptopia situation. However, it appears as though they found the content of this update to their liking since they issued an update themselves on Friday October 25th, using most of the points we have included in this update.

Our guess is that they believed that they could reach a larger Cryptopia audience if they released an update themselves. And although all the things we found relevant and important to share through our update are included in the official update from Grant Thornton, we have chosen to get our update out as well because we feel it might offer some additional details and information which wasn’t included by Grant Thornton in their update.

The things we learned from the phone call, which are being confirmed by the official update from Grant Thornton, is that; although some of the information was already communicated by the firm through their previous press releases, some things were not obvious at the time for most people when reading them.

The person we spoke to on the phone is in charge of the technical part of handling the liquidation. He explained to us what they have been doing and what remains to be done.

It is important to understand that Grant Thornton is not investigating the actual hack, this is the responsibility of the authorities in New Zealand. This means that the firm is only able to deal with the assets that were not affected. What will happen with the coins that were stolen during the hack will have to wait for the conclusion of the police investigation. Whilst Grant Thornton are not investigating the root cause of the hack, they are undertaking a tracing exercise of the affected coins with a view to seeking a freezing and, ultimately, a return of those coins for the benefit of coin holders where possible.

When the firm was tasked with the job in May of this year, they identified 3 phases:
◦Phase 1: identifying where all the assets are located and which assets were affected by the hack.

Since this includes collecting data that was stored in several locations, each having their own jurisdictions and regulations, means that several court procedures had to be concluded to collect all this data.


◦Phase 2: setting up safe environments for all the different assets to ensure that no malicious code was left behind which could potentially trigger unwanted activity when setting up the wallets for all the different assets.

This phase also required the move of hardware from the offices of Cryptopia to a location controlled by the liquidation firm.


◦Phase 3: identifying all the users so that the assets that are in their possession can be returned to their rightful owners, in full compliance with the law.

This phase also requires a court ruling on how the assets have to be classified so the correct procedures for returning the assets can be determined.


The representative of the firm that we spoke with assured us that the assets that belonged to the customers of Cryptopia will in no way be used to pay for the cost of liquidation. Grant Thornton has every intention to return all the funds, which they have control over, to the rightful owners. However, a court decision is required to determine the legal state of the cryptocurrencies held by Cryptopia in order to know the correct conditions for this return.

Grant Thornton does not have a say in this matter and is entirely dependent on the New Zealand courts for this decision. They are, however, taking every step to ensure that the eventual return of the funds will happen in accordance with the law. Since there are no precedents, it is impossible to make assumptions about a court decision in the matter. The people at Grant Thornton have ensured us that regardless of the court ruling they will make every effort to maximize the return of assets held by Cryptopia to their rightful owners.

It is important to understand that, in order to return the coins to their owners, the correct procedures will need to be followed, to make sure that everything happens in accordance with the law. This includes the requirement to identify the owners before any coins can be returned.

We have asked specifically whether it will be possible for people that didn’t verify their accounts on Cryptopia to comply with these requirements and the answer was yes. Meaning that people who hadn’t verified their account will have the opportunity to do so when the time comes. How this will be done is not known at this point.


So which phases have been concluded at this point?

According to the person we spoke with on the phone, phase 1 has been completed. This means that all assets (that are still in possession of Cryptopia) have been located and all data related to these assets has been collected.

Phase 2 is ongoing; this includes rebuilding the secured environment to access the located assets and collected data. This is a highly complicated process which involves 900 different assets and over 900.000 customers.

The order in which the different environments for the different assets is being set up is decided on a number of factors and do not only include coin value or market cap, but also the number of coins and people involved for each asset, among others.

Phase 3 could start before the conclusion of phase 2, however, this will also require a lot of planning given the large number of different nationalities and subsequent regulations pertaining to identification.

We explained to the firm’s representative that our concerns and the concerns of most other people in the crypto world, comes from the fact that there is very little communication about what has been going on and what the plans are. They acknowledged our concerns and asked us what we would suggest to help alleviate these concerns.

Being a blockchain development company we pointed out the benefits of decentralization and suggested the firm to reach out to the different development teams to help them set up safe wallets to access the funds that hadn’t been affected by the hack, since every development team knows their own technology best of all.

The person we spoke with was open to this suggestion and could see the benefit of including the different development teams to help them conclude the second phase of their plan.


Where does this leave us now?

An important thing to take away from this conversation is that Grant Thornton will make every effort to maximize the return of funds that were held by Cryptopia to the rightful owners and that even the people that hadn’t verified their accounts will get a chance to do so. However, before any return can take place, a court decision regarding the legal state of the cryptocurrencies held by Cryptopia is required.

We also know that the firm is taking every precaution to make sure that whatever lead to the hack in the first place doesn’t (unintentionally) happen again while they are trying to resolve this situation.

The firm is willing to cooperate with the different development teams to find solutions that will perhaps speed up the process of liquidating Cryptopia.

We concluded the phone call by suggesting that we write this announcement and send it to them first to make sure we are not spreading inaccuracies, which is something that they very much appreciated.

We also agreed to reach out to each other in the near future to see how we can possibly assist them in setting up a bespoke wallet that would make it possible for them to return our blocked coins to their rightful owners.

We want to thank the people at Grant Thornton for taking the time to speak to us and for their openness in their communication during our phone call. Let’s not forget there are little to no precedents, especially in New Zealand, where Cryptopia was located, on how to handle a situation like this.

This means that a lot of the steps that can be taken and need to be taken have to be figured out, debated and decided upon.

The phone calls gave us the confidence that Grant Thornton has every intention to do right by everyone, but it might take some time to accomplish this.

So, in the meantime, we have offered our cooperation and the technical skills of our development team because we prefer to be part of the solution, rather than sitting back and complaining.

Thanks for your continuous support.

The XTRABYTES™ team

[AyouthR]

A few hours ago, the Swiss company Sooho published a report  analysing all the movements of funds that had gone missing in the wake of the attack on Cryptopia, which resulted in the loss of several million dollars from the platform.

https://medium.com/soohoio/malicious-crypto-transaction-report-2-cryptocurrencies-of-hacker-who-attacked-cryptopia-flowed-f421f0c0ada1

The followed figure is a result that we tracked cryptopia hacker’s cryptocurrency flow. And you can check that some cryptocurrencies inflowed to Yobit.

Key figures
Amount taken from Cryptopia : 30788.732011 ETH
Amount flowed to Yobit : 1420 ETH
Amount flowed to EtherDelta : 9000 ETH
Amount deposited address in purple : 17,254.553271203880180626 ETH
Amount deposited address in green : 3,589.9961822 ETH
We confirmed that some of the leaked Ether from the hacking of Cryptopia on the New Zealand exchange in January 19 was deposited on the Yobit on September 22 and 23.
Flow of the cryptocurrencies
The below are the details of the movement of the cryptocurrencies.
Amount taken from Cryptopia was total 30788.732011 ETH.
Most of the funds are still deposited at 0x845f93f489b524f19864db6e0ab581c532b58d36 (approximately 17,255 ETH).
During the transfer of funds from Hacker’s account to 0x845f93f489b524f19864db6e0ab581c532b58d36, 9,000 ETH flowed into EtherDelta in May after several carrying addresses.
After September, 5010 ETH among the amount deposited at 0x845f93f489b524f19864db6e0ab581c532b58d36 transferred to 0xd759ea4c6e8e2c77b7e04eeebc1fac32ed332dcc
Again, 1420 ETH among the 5010 ETH was transferred to 4 addresses that are included in Yobit.
The remain — about 3600ETH — are transferred to 0x3a840d0164acca60292a6b594531dfc98af2701d and still stay there.
Therefore, it is required for Yobit to do further investigation for the relevant addresses listed below. In addition, each exchange should register the following address as Blacklist as soon as possible, and do monitoring.
Wallet address list
Addresses related to Yobit
0x41dd55d4671756896b488626a9ca0a0ea1201539
0xc3c75adc57b71fa0cba5e25cdc378101993d29a3
0xa488827ffd2d5a69e76946955f10f1fef0fb94fb
0xa449b6bb309c4d959539552545400f041cc4ae4c
2. Addresses related to EtherDelta
0xa53fd6e0b9765b8d6081827fbf43d36bdf2eb85e
0xc5883084a66ac9e08379256269c18345ccefe458
0x621e2e9f1cdc03add35ab930b074f9419f294045
0x338fdf0d792f7708d97383eb476e9418b3c16ff1
3. Addresses required to monitoring
0x845f93f489b524f19864db6e0ab581c532b58d36
0x3a840d0164acca60292a6b594531dfc98af2701d
4. Addresses included in this money laundering
0x30d4bffec44037f5fe9d4336968c573cba9d018a
0x3fbaa73a433daa0f6c43d1c732c3f97a86f3a427
0xd96ba527be241c2c31fd66cbb0a9430702906a2a
0xd4e79226f1e5a7a28abb58f4704e53cd364e8d11
0x7d90b19c1022396b525c64ba70a293c3142979b7
0xd759ea4c6e8e2c77b7e04eeebc1fac32ed332dcc
0xb7443e088232cd680ff20b7518eba2fc9e1b3c32
0x552981f6e2ec9de9811e9490b7cac486c3a9dd32

If you have any request for cryptocurrency transaction tracking and analysis, don’t hesitate to contact to us. (contact@sooho.io)
Thank you.

ORG:Grant Thornton
URL;TYPE=PREF:https://www.grantthornton.co.nz/meet-our-people/david-ruscoe/
TEL;TYPE=WORK:+64 4 495 3763
EMAIL:david.ruscoe@nz.gt.com

ORG:Grant Thornton
URL;TYPE=PREF:https://www.grantthornton.co.nz/meet-our-people/russell-moore/
TEL;TYPE=WORK:+64 9 922 1237
EMAIL:russell.moore@nz.gt.com

As of now everything is being handled by the courts. If I was located near Cryptopia headquarters I would go to the courts and demand a hearing in front of a judge to explain what has happened with this Cryptopia scam.

The courts have only been listening to the shady liquidator Grant Thornton give a one sided con job and not tell the whole truth about what has happened.

Now of course I mean anyone but shyto disaster. That shemale  is obviously working for Cryptopia to silence any criticism with childish insults and third grade taunts.

CHRISTCHURCH COURTS

Justice & Emergency Services Precinct
20 Lichfield Street
Christchurch
DX WX10021
T 0800 268 787, or +64 9 583 1900 from overseas
F 03 962 4302

Email: christchurchhc@justice.govt.nz |

(please note the Christchurch District Court's email address is christchurch.dc@justice.govt.nz )


ALL COURTS

https://www.courtsofnz.govt.nz/utilities/contact/courts

thanks for the addresses, I sent an email, they will be aware for the funds traced

[Timelord2067]

Funny thing is I haven't received a single email from either Cryptopia or Grant Thornton since before this drama began.  Not even when 100+ alt coins were hacked the year prior.

[JanpriX]

Another update regarding these "liquidators". 

"Cryptopia Liquidators Have Made Progress But Yet to Announce Reimbursement Date"

• Liquidators for hacked crypto exchange Cryptopia report making strides in reconciling user funds.
• Accounting firm stressed patience as they sort through more than 900,000 clients while complying with NZ laws.
• Also, according to them "While our reconciliation process is progressing well, we still require direction from the New Zealand courts before we can return crypto-assets to customers. The information outlining the legal process included in the last communication is still current and is set out below--."

Source: https://www.cryptoglobe.com/latest/2019/10/cryptopia-liquidators-have-made-progress-but-yet-to-announce-reimbursement-date/?amp=yes

[Viper1]

To put all this in perspective for all those complaining about how long things are taking. Mt.Gox filed for liquidation in 2014 and shit with that one is still going on. So settle in cause if it happens "quick", you can count yourself extremely fortunate.

[Labrader]

This ( https://www.grantthornton.co.nz/update-for-cryptopia-account-holders-25-October-2019/ )is an interesting update and let's do an analysis of the weasel words they use:

1. Customers did not have individual wallets and it is impossible to determine individual ownership using just the keys in the wallets. While Cryptopia held details of customer holdings and reported these on the Exchange, the crypto-assets themselves were pooled (co-mingled) in coin wallets. As a centralised exchange, customers' trades would occur in the exchange's internal ledger without confirmation on the blockchain.

Stating the obviuos. That's how every centralised exchange works. But why do they state the obvious?

2. No detailed reconciliation process between the customer databases and the crypto-assets held in the wallets has ever been completed.

They keep stating the obvious because in the actual wallets there's less than the database says should be.

We have split the reconciliation process into three main phases:

Phases 1 and 2 are of no interest to us.

But phase 3:

3. Identifying users and repatriation of returns - This phase is at an early stage. A number of legal matters need to be resolved before this phase can progress.

What legal matters? We find the answer in the legal documents they provided in the update. They are asking the court to decide if:
- they should sell all the crypto, pay the creditors with fiat and disburse the rest to customers (haha, that would leave nothing for us)
- they should consider the crypto property held on trust and return it as is (obviously the better outcome)

Either way, the documents reveal that no matter the decision, they are asking for permission to first dip (i.e. steal) into our crypto, to sell it and pay for their liquidation fees. They are also somewhat revealing they stole the haircut crypto and consider it to be Cryptopia property and already paying fees from it. That's why this has to drag: to inflate their bill.

The KYC process cannot be avoided, as it is a legal requirement in New Zealand.

A lie my misrepresentation. KYC is required if you plan to distribute fiat (through banks). It wasn't required when Cryptopia was operational, because it was operating purely on crypto.

[xtraelv]

This ( https://www.grantthornton.co.nz/update-for-cryptopia-account-holders-25-October-2019/ )is an interesting update and let's do an analysis of the weasel words they use:

1. Customers did not have individual wallets and it is impossible to determine individual ownership using just the keys in the wallets. While Cryptopia held details of customer holdings and reported these on the Exchange, the crypto-assets themselves were pooled (co-mingled) in coin wallets. As a centralised exchange, customers' trades would occur in the exchange's internal ledger without confirmation on the blockchain.

Stating the obviuos. That's how every centralised exchange works. But why do they state the obvious?

2. No detailed reconciliation process between the customer databases and the crypto-assets held in the wallets has ever been completed.

They keep stating the obvious because in the actual wallets there's less than the database says should be.

We have split the reconciliation process into three main phases:

Phases 1 and 2 are of no interest to us.

But phase 3:

3. Identifying users and repatriation of returns - This phase is at an early stage. A number of legal matters need to be resolved before this phase can progress.

What legal matters? We find the answer in the legal documents they provided in the update. They are asking the court to decide if:
- they should sell all the crypto, pay the creditors with fiat and disburse the rest to customers (haha, that would leave nothing for us)
- they should consider the crypto property held on trust and return it as is (obviously the better outcome)

Either way, the documents reveal that no matter the decision, they are asking for permission to first dip (i.e. steal) into our crypto, to sell it and pay for their liquidation fees. They are also somewhat revealing they stole the haircut crypto and consider it to be Cryptopia property and already paying fees from it. That's why this has to drag: to inflate their bill.

The KYC process cannot be avoided, as it is a legal requirement in New Zealand.

A lie my misrepresentation. KYC is required if you plan to distribute fiat (through banks). It wasn't required when Cryptopia was operational, because it was operating purely on crypto.

Unfortunately it is a legal requirement:



https://www.dia.govt.nz/AML-CFT-Frequently-Asked-Questions-for-DIA-Reporting-Entities#J

[JollyGood]

To put all this in perspective for all those complaining about how long things are taking. Mt.Gox filed for liquidation in 2014 and shit with that one is still going on. So settle in cause if it happens "quick", you can count yourself extremely fortunate.

What can victims do except wait for the Grant Thornton to complete their job? Just wait sadly and hope they recoup some of their funds.

There will never be a quick result on this because they released a notice recently stating the sheer number of accounts and transactions they need to look at would be huge so the whole process will be time consuming.

All the while this is going on and investors are suffering, can anybody cateorgorically state the owners of cryptopia are not charged with any criminal offence and are not even on bail?

[Viper1]

can anybody cateorgorically state the owners of cryptopia are not charged with any criminal offence and are not even on bail?

What did they do that would warrant them being charged with something?

These days these things don't phase me much. It's all part of putting your money in the hands of some "anonymous" people on the internet. All you can do is minimize the risk, spread it out, and just wait for some losses. Cryptsy, these guys plus a couple more for smaller amounts, 2 or three payment sites similar to Paypal. I've lost plenty over the years and have learned to just take it in stride.

[sisquo2121]

We should get the value of the coins at the time of the hack not what they're worth right now. The altcoins have gone down in the satoshi value and BTC has gone down in USD value. So say for example the coins were worth 400 million USD at the time of the hack. They're probably worth about 100 million USD right now.

On top of that these lowlifes at Grant Thornton are treating the customers coins are they're own personal slush fund that they can dip into and pay they're own fees as well as creditor fees.

This is why we need lawyers representing us in the New Zealand courts so these lowlifes at Grant Thornton don't give us back a fraction of what were owed.

[JollyGood]

can anybody cateorgorically state the owners of cryptopia are not charged with any criminal offence and are not even on bail?

What did they do that would warrant them being charged with something?

These days these things don't phase me much. It's all part of putting your money in the hands of some "anonymous" people on the internet. All you can do is minimize the risk, spread it out, and just wait for some losses. Cryptsy, these guys plus a couple more for smaller amounts, 2 or three payment sites similar to Paypal. I've lost plenty over the years and have learned to just take it in stride.

Were they at least investigated thoroughly for fraud? Does anybody know if they were at any point arrested for questioning before being completely discharged?

And what was the official reason given for them not being charged with any criminality?

[Viper1]

can anybody cateorgorically state the owners of cryptopia are not charged with any criminal offence and are not even on bail?

What did they do that would warrant them being charged with something?

These days these things don't phase me much. It's all part of putting your money in the hands of some "anonymous" people on the internet. All you can do is minimize the risk, spread it out, and just wait for some losses. Cryptsy, these guys plus a couple more for smaller amounts, 2 or three payment sites similar to Paypal. I've lost plenty over the years and have learned to just take it in stride.

Were they at least investigated thoroughly for fraud? Does anybody know if they were at any point arrested for questioning before being completely discharged?

And what was the official reason given for them not being charged with any criminality?

As far as I know they were hacked and it's being investigated. Beyond that, unless law enforcement finds they did it (the systems would also have to be analyzed to determine if any fraud took place), then I don't see what they would have done to warrant criminal action. Beyond that maybe people could go after them for something like negligence.

[almightyruler]

We should get the value of the coins at the time of the hack not what they're worth right now. The altcoins have gone down in the satoshi value and BTC has gone down in USD value. So say for example the coins were worth 400 million USD at the time of the hack. They're probably worth about 100 million USD right now.

How do you propose an insolvent company comes up with an extra $300 million in cash?

Also, be careful what you wish for. Imagine if in a few years time, when the liquidation was finally completed, customers were paid out something like 70% of their balances in USD (or NZD) based on "hack time value", but BTC was up 300% since then...

[TheCryproMaster]

On top of that these lowlifes at Grant Thornton are treating the customers coins are they're own personal slush fund that they can dip into and pay they're own fees as well as creditor fees.

This is why we need lawyers representing us in the New Zealand courts so these lowlifes at Grant Thornton don't give us back a fraction of what were owed.

Personal slush fund, wtf, what evidence do you have this is happening?

[sisquo2121]

On top of that these lowlifes at Grant Thornton are treating the customers coins are they're own personal slush fund that they can dip into and pay they're own fees as well as creditor fees.

This is why we need lawyers representing us in the New Zealand courts so these lowlifes at Grant Thornton don't give us back a fraction of what were owed.

Personal slush fund, wtf, what evidence do you have this is happening?

They've stated they're using some of the funds to pays creditors you dumb fuck. Stop even commenting on anything I say you fucking idiot.

I at least have evidence for my claims where as you have zero evidence for anything you say. Like your  zero evidence  claim that this will take years to finish. We all know you work for Cryptopia so get the fuck off this bitcointalk and go fucking jump off a bridge you piece of shit.

[sisquo2121]

We should get the value of the coins at the time of the hack not what they're worth right now. The altcoins have gone down in the satoshi value and BTC has gone down in USD value. So say for example the coins were worth 400 million USD at the time of the hack. They're probably worth about 100 million USD right now.

How do you propose an insolvent company comes up with an extra $300 million in cash?

Also, be careful what you wish for. Imagine if in a few years time, when the liquidation was finally completed, customers were paid out something like 70% of their balances in USD (or NZD) based on "hack time value", but BTC was up 300% since then...

That's not my problem to have to deal with. I just want the BTC value of all my coins at the time of the hack. The altcoin I had has gone down 10 times in value since the hack and I would have definitely sold it off way before that and gotten 10 times the value they'd be giving me now.

I simply used USD value to show how the values of the coins between the hack and now has changed. The bottom line is I want the value in BTC of all the coins I had at the time the hack happened not what they're worth now.

[Viper1]

claim that this will take years to finish

Mt. Gox happened in 2014 and is still ongoing. Although Cryptsy was outright theft, it closed right at the start of 2016. Mid 2017 they were only up to selling the house and they said it would take a long time, a year or more to get a settlement from that. I haven't heard any update about it. History shows it can take years.