Wall Observer BTC/USD - Bitcoin price movement tracking & discussion

[JayJuanGee]

Well, I'm worried about the effect the new Circle stance on bitcoin will be...It's harder to buy BTC with USD now, but why would Circle do that to us???  

Harder?  How's it harder?   The policy changes have created differences regarding methods of buying/selling and changes in limits in some categories but overall have not made buying or selling BTC "harder"

The limits they put on purchasing bitcoin make it harder to get enough coin to do anything substantial.  Many are relocating their coin just for that reason.  It seems that some of "the powers that be" are pushing BTC into the direction of regulation and centralization via third party manipulation.... Correct?

After reading various comments about the changes at Circle, I made a couple of posts on the topic of Circle's changes.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=178336.msg12514803#msg12514803


In essence, a lot of the posts about Circle seems to be substantively FUD-ish.

Surely, every exchange (or bitcoin company connected to a bank) has various policies and differentiations that are attempts to comply with some of the regulations while at the same time attempting to compete to obtain users.

At first, when I did NOT understand the extent of some of Circle's changes, I became upset because I was NO longer getting instant availability, and then after reading some of the apparent FUD, I got more worked up... but then after, I in fact looked into the matter, I saw that my buy and sell amounts were increased from $2500 per week to $3000 per week, and actually, I could get all of my bitcoins instantaneously and for free, as long as I used a debit account, rather than a bank transfer.

Instead of griping about the supposed big brother connections of Circle, one should figure out ways to strategically employ its tools to advantage, and surely, if there are better terms in other places (including more privacy or fewer fees or higher limits, then surely, a person may want to employ those tools (if they can be found).

Circle is attempting to become a big player in the Bitcoin space; however, it seems that they have a ways to go in order to attempt to catch up to Coinbase.  I use both;however, I understand as well that some people do NOT want to have accounts with any of these kinds of entities that seem to be find various ways to be compliant with various US regulations, including various KYC and AML laws.

Actually, these days, there seems to be a lot of options, but yes, some of the bigger players that are complying with various regulations also bring some sense of security that they are NOT going to run off with your BTC.... and surely some people believe that the costs of having accounts with some of the big regulated payers is greater than the benefits...and they can chose to put their BTC in other places or buy and sell their BTC in other locations.  There do remain options, as you mentioned.

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[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[Andre#]

Bitfinex went from 4 times the volume of Bitstamp half a year ago via 1.5 times two months ago, to a half of Bitstamp's volume the past month and a quarter the past week. Is BFX dying?

Where did you get this chart from?

The data comes from bitcoincharts.com, the graph I made with LibreOffice.

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[cjmoles]

Well, I'm worried about the effect the new Circle stance on bitcoin will be...It's harder to buy BTC with USD now, but why would Circle do that to us???  

Harder?  How's it harder?   The policy changes have created differences regarding methods of buying/selling and changes in limits in some categories but overall have not made buying or selling BTC "harder"

The limits they put on purchasing bitcoin make it harder to get enough coin to do anything substantial.  Many are relocating their coin just for that reason.  It seems that some of "the powers that be" are pushing BTC into the direction of regulation and centralization via third party manipulation.... Correct?

After reading various comments about the changes at Circle, I made a couple of posts on the topic of Circle's changes.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=178336.msg12514803#msg12514803


In essence, a lot of the posts about Circle seems to be substantively FUD-ish.

Surely, every exchange (or bitcoin company connected to a bank) has various policies and differentiations that are attempts to comply with some of the regulations while at the same time attempting to compete to obtain users.

At first, when I did NOT understand the extent of some of Circle's changes, I became upset because I was NO longer getting instant availability, and then after reading some of the apparent FUD, I got more worked up... but then after, I in fact looked into the matter, I saw that my buy and sell amounts were increased from $2500 per week to $3000 per week, and actually, I could get all of my bitcoins instantaneously and for free, as long as I used a debit account, rather than a bank transfer.

Instead of griping about the supposed big brother connections of Circle, one should figure out ways to strategically employ its tools to advantage, and surely, if there are better terms in other places (including more privacy or fewer fees or higher limits, then surely, a person may want to employ those tools (if they can be found).

Circle is attempting to become a big player in the Bitcoin space; however, it seems that they have a ways to go in order to attempt to catch up to Coinbase.  I use both;however, I understand as well that some people do NOT want to have accounts with any of these kinds of entities that seem to be find various ways to be compliant with various US regulations, including various KYC and AML laws.

Actually, these days, there seems to be a lot of options, but yes, some of the bigger players that are complying with various regulations also bring some sense of security that they are NOT going to run off with your BTC.... and surely some people believe that the costs of having accounts with some of the big regulated payers is greater than the benefits...and they can chose to put their BTC in other places or buy and sell their BTC in other locations.  There do remain options, as you mentioned.

Very well said.  I understand the regulatory complications involved in working with US banks (been playing poker professionally online since it became available so I've seen some very creative third party processes); however, what worries me is that there seems to be quite a bit of market manipulation by a handful of players which seems to be an antithesis to the whole bitcoin project.  It is a wonder that bitcoin is even allowed to be purchased with USD which makes me very suspicious of what's being negotiated behind closed doors.

[phoenix1]

Bitfinex went from 4 times the volume of Bitstamp half a year ago via 1.5 times two months ago, to a half of Bitstamp's volume the past month and a quarter the past week. Is BFX dying?

Bitfinex lost XBT Provider / KnCMiner as a client very recently. Might be related to them not applying for the BitLicense or a Trust charter since XBT Provider also stopped using OKCoin.

Given the volume of XBT I can't see how this would make a significant impact on the volumes of either exchange. It is very hard to see the increase in volume on Stamp as anything other than wash volume, and the recent ridiculous volume spikes on the Chines exchanges is definitely wash volume. Thousands of BTC trading with no move in price. It's clearly bullshit.
What it means, I don't know. But extra effort is IMO being put into inflating volumes across multiple exchanges at the moment.
I don't doubt that BFX may lose a few clients over the Bitlicense thing, but this is not an adequate explanation for the changes seen over the last month IMO.

[JayJuanGee]

Well, I'm worried about the effect the new Circle stance on bitcoin will be...It's harder to buy BTC with USD now, but why would Circle do that to us???  

Harder?  How's it harder?   The policy changes have created differences regarding methods of buying/selling and changes in limits in some categories but overall have not made buying or selling BTC "harder"

The limits they put on purchasing bitcoin make it harder to get enough coin to do anything substantial.  Many are relocating their coin just for that reason.  It seems that some of "the powers that be" are pushing BTC into the direction of regulation and centralization via third party manipulation.... Correct?

After reading various comments about the changes at Circle, I made a couple of posts on the topic of Circle's changes.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=178336.msg12514803#msg12514803


In essence, a lot of the posts about Circle seems to be substantively FUD-ish.

Surely, every exchange (or bitcoin company connected to a bank) has various policies and differentiations that are attempts to comply with some of the regulations while at the same time attempting to compete to obtain users.

At first, when I did NOT understand the extent of some of Circle's changes, I became upset because I was NO longer getting instant availability, and then after reading some of the apparent FUD, I got more worked up... but then after, I in fact looked into the matter, I saw that my buy and sell amounts were increased from $2500 per week to $3000 per week, and actually, I could get all of my bitcoins instantaneously and for free, as long as I used a debit account, rather than a bank transfer.

Instead of griping about the supposed big brother connections of Circle, one should figure out ways to strategically employ its tools to advantage, and surely, if there are better terms in other places (including more privacy or fewer fees or higher limits, then surely, a person may want to employ those tools (if they can be found).

Circle is attempting to become a big player in the Bitcoin space; however, it seems that they have a ways to go in order to attempt to catch up to Coinbase.  I use both;however, I understand as well that some people do NOT want to have accounts with any of these kinds of entities that seem to be find various ways to be compliant with various US regulations, including various KYC and AML laws.

Actually, these days, there seems to be a lot of options, but yes, some of the bigger players that are complying with various regulations also bring some sense of security that they are NOT going to run off with your BTC.... and surely some people believe that the costs of having accounts with some of the big regulated payers is greater than the benefits...and they can chose to put their BTC in other places or buy and sell their BTC in other locations.  There do remain options, as you mentioned.

Very well said.  I understand the regulatory complications involved in working with US banks (been playing poker professionally online since it became available so I've seen some very creative third party processes); however, what worries me is that there seems to be quite a bit of market manipulation by a handful of players which seems to be an antithesis to the whole bitcoin project.  It is a wonder that bitcoin is even allowed to be purchased with USD which makes me very suspicious of what's being negotiated behind closed doors.

Actually, I retain a similar level of scepticism regarding motives for acceptance and even the degree to which regular joe blow investors are sufficiently informed about material facts in order to make informed investments.  Yes, the more and more Governments and financial institutions are "on-board" or even quasi-on-board, we are going to get behind the scene bad motives, but we are also going to have some legitimate semi-anarchical sentiments mixed therein.

prior to the 2013 bubble, there was likely quite a bit less government involvement in BTC; however, there are outstanding suspicions that even by 2011, some of MTGox's fiasco's were in part or wholely driven by US Govt manipulations.  In that regard, we may invest into BTC and believe that prices are being driven by certain kinds of decentralization ideology forces, but in the end find out that something else was going on behind the scenes.  Similar matters is true regarding the control of the mining or control of various less regulated exchanges and some kinds of bad motives can end up delivering considerable negative repercussions on the security, legitimacy, solvency and/or confidences in BTC (or the blockchain).

Many of us attempt to stay attuned to happenings in the bitcoin space through this forum and other similar information sources, yet ultimately, we probably need to exercise some faith when we are trying to decide what to do based on the information in our hands, and hope that we are NOT being materially mislead in some regards.  In essence, I still conclude that Circle and its various actors are NOT as mal-aligned or maliciously aligned as your earlier post and some of the other recent Circle bashing posts have made them out to be.
 

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[ElectricMucus]

Someone just sold 100+ BTC on a market with low liquidity. Here's the chart.

Why would someone do this? It temporarily brought down the price by 33%.

Somebody wants to top off their paypal account and doesn't give a shit about slippage because gains are still astronomical for some people.

In case you don't know selling Bitcoins for Linden Dollars and then buying Dollars is the one true way of doing that, unless you are willing to risk total loss by some shady exchange service. Ironically the only way to get money on a Bitcoin exchange onto a paypal account without that or slippage is  to buy something with bitpay, return it and get a refund, but that only works for small amounts, since the merchant won't willingly participate in this.

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

Someone just sold 100+ BTC on a market with low liquidity. Here's the chart.

Why would someone do this? It temporarily brought down the price by 33%.

Somebody wants to top off their paypal account and doesn't give a shit about slippage because gains are still astronomical for some people.

In case you don't know selling Bitcoins for Linden Dollars and then buying Dollars is the one true way of doing that, unless you are willing to risk total loss by some shady exchange service. Ironically the only way to get money on a Bitcoin exchange onto a paypal account without that or slippage is  to buy something with bitpay, return it and get a refund, but that only works for small amounts, since the merchant won't willingly participate in this.

Are there really that many people still desperate to get their value out of Bitcoin? I thought maybe naively that that stage was behind us...

[Cconvert2G36]

Someone just sold 100+ BTC on a market with low liquidity. Here's the chart.

Why would someone do this? It temporarily brought down the price by 33%.

Somebody wants to top off their paypal account and doesn't give a shit about slippage because gains are still astronomical for some people.

In case you don't know selling Bitcoins for Linden Dollars and then buying Dollars is the one true way of doing that, unless you are willing to risk total loss by some shady exchange service. Ironically the only way to get money on a Bitcoin exchange onto a paypal account without that or slippage is  to buy something with bitpay, return it and get a refund, but that only works for small amounts, since the merchant won't willingly participate in this.

Are there really that many people still desperate to get their value out of Bitcoin? I thought maybe naively that that stage was behind us...

This really hinges on the distinction between desperation and ambivalence.

[gentlemand]

Are there really that many people still desperate to get their value out of Bitcoin? I thought maybe naively that that stage was behind us...

That stage will surely never end.

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

Impossible overhang of hoarded coins in every direction all trying to squeeze through the head of the same cashing-out pin. Is there a gif for this?

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[Norway]

Too the blood moon!

[BlindMayorBitcorn]

Too the blood moon!

[JayJuanGee]

Too the blood moon!

That's disturbing, no, BMB?

[ChartBuddy]

Coin
Explanation

[kingscrown]

Total time logged in: 19 days, 13 hours and 30 minutes.