ChartBuddy
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Activity: 2282
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1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
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February 25, 2016, 09:00:48 PM |
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Andre#
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February 25, 2016, 09:31:02 PM |
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Initial Impression -- The Good - Thin blocks, Weak Blocks (Also Found in Core's roadmap) The Bad - Advocating for SPV mining , which is a problem exacerbated by their Validate Once proposal, and pushing off the many benefits of Segwit till the end of the year The Ugly - 3rd/4th Q 2016 adaptive rule for a block size limit that heavily incentivizes those with better bandwidth which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth and make many home mining operations obsolete because they cannot compete with the propagation times with larger operations who can afford better uplinks. There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposal which makes it a non-starter from the get go IMHO. "which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth" -- less centralization, yaay! "make many home mining operations obsolete" -- good to see you still know how to throw in a joke.
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adamstgBit
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Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
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February 25, 2016, 09:34:01 PM |
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Initial Impression -- The Good - Thin blocks, Weak Blocks (Also Found in Core's roadmap) The Bad - Advocating for SPV mining , which is a problem exacerbated by their Validate Once proposal, and pushing off the many benefits of Segwit till the end of the year The Ugly - 3rd/4th Q 2016 adaptive rule for a block size limit that heavily incentivizes those with better bandwidth which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth and make many home mining operations obsolete because they cannot compete with the propagation times with larger operations who can afford better uplinks. There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposal which makes it a non-starter from the get go IMHO. "which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth" -- less centralization, yaay!"make many home mining operations obsolete" -- good to see you still know how to throw in a joke. lmao that not a bad point to much minning happens in chain anyway! ( but the sad truth, that which we ALL know, is that none of the chinese miners will stop mining in china )
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billyjoeallen
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Activity: 1106
Merit: 1007
Hide your women
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February 25, 2016, 09:37:02 PM Last edit: February 25, 2016, 10:07:37 PM by billyjoeallen |
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Initial Impression -- The Good - Thin blocks, Weak Blocks (Also Found in Core's roadmap) The Bad - Advocating for SPV mining , which is a problem exacerbated by their Validate Once proposal, and pushing off the many benefits of Segwit till the end of the year The Ugly - 3rd/4th Q 2016 adaptive rule for a block size limit that heavily incentivizes those with better bandwidth which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth and make many home mining operations obsolete because they cannot compete with the propagation times with larger operations who can afford better uplinks. There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposal which makes it a non-starter from the get go IMHO. Ugly? UGLY?? This is exactly what we need, something that neutralizes the Chinese electricity and labor cost advantage. Without some way of doing that, we cannot regain censorship resistance. The fact that does so while increasing network performance is just a bonus. The problem i see obviously is that Chinese miners will be reluctant to adopt it. But if they don't adopt it or something like it, I don't see much future for Bitcoin. Either it will stagnate or it will grow to the point where it becomes a threat to the PRC and they will take over the network. This proposal is the only ray of hope I see for overcoming the dual problems of scaling and miner concentration.
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adamstgBit
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Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
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February 25, 2016, 09:47:18 PM |
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if you small blocker truly believe the shit you say you should from a group that wishes to lower block limit to 0.5MB.
you'll get more decentralization and security, for everything else there's the Lighting Network promiseland.
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BlindMayorBitcorn
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Activity: 1260
Merit: 1116
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February 25, 2016, 09:48:42 PM |
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Initial Impression -- The Good - Thin blocks, Weak Blocks (Also Found in Core's roadmap) The Bad - Advocating for SPV mining , which is a problem exacerbated by their Validate Once proposal, and pushing off the many benefits of Segwit till the end of the year The Ugly - 3rd/4th Q 2016 adaptive rule for a block size limit that heavily incentivizes those with better bandwidth which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth and make many home mining operations obsolete because they cannot compete with the propagation times with larger operations who can afford better uplinks. There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposal which makes it a non-starter from the get go IMHO. Ugly? UGLY?? This is exactly what we need, something that neutralizes the Chinese electricity and labor cost advantage. Without some way of doing that, we cannot regain censorship resistance. The fact that does so while increasing network performance is just a bonus. The problem i see obviously is that Chinese miners will be reluctant to adopt it. But if they don't adopt it or something like it, I don't see much future for Bitcoin. Either it will stagnate or it will grow to the point where it becomes a threat to the PRC and they will take over the network. This proposal is the only ray of hope I see for overcoming the duel problems of scaling and miner concentration. Is he wrong about this? There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposal
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betterangels
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![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
February 25, 2016, 09:50:15 PM |
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great deal for quick buck right now.
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adamstgBit
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Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
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February 25, 2016, 09:52:09 PM |
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Initial Impression -- The Good - Thin blocks, Weak Blocks (Also Found in Core's roadmap) The Bad - Advocating for SPV mining , which is a problem exacerbated by their Validate Once proposal, and pushing off the many benefits of Segwit till the end of the year The Ugly - 3rd/4th Q 2016 adaptive rule for a block size limit that heavily incentivizes those with better bandwidth which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth and make many home mining operations obsolete because they cannot compete with the propagation times with larger operations who can afford better uplinks. There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposal which makes it a non-starter from the get go IMHO. Ugly? UGLY?? This is exactly what we need, something that neutralizes the Chinese electricity and labor cost advantage. Without some way of doing that, we cannot regain censorship resistance. The fact that does so while increasing network performance is just a bonus. The problem i see obviously is that Chinese miners will be reluctant to adopt it. But if they don't adopt it or something like it, I don't see much future for Bitcoin. Either it will stagnate or it will grow to the point where it becomes a threat to the PRC and they will take over the network. This proposal is the only ray of hope I see for overcoming the duel problems of scaling and miner concentration. Is he wrong about this? There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposalyup thats wrong... Reduce the effect of block propagation times on orphan rates (lost miner income) De-emphasize block size as an obstacle for scaling and open up potential for on-chain transaction throughput gains using several improvements (listed below). Optimizations for bandwidth constrained nodes via improvements to the P2P layer Note: We intend to discuss various solutions such as the ones listed below and pick the best ones.
Parallel validation of blocks (theoretically reduces the profitability of excessive-sized block attacks). Headers-first mining (largely nullifies excessive-sized block attacks). Thin blocks: Blocks refer to transactions that have been well propagated rather than including them, allowing for minimization of bandwidth use. Weak blocks: allow miners to pre-announce the blocks they are working on, to minimize the data sent once a block is found. Validate Once: Transactions that have been validated when entering a node’s memory pool do not need to be revalidated when included in a block (speeds up block validation).
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ChartBuddy
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Activity: 2282
Merit: 1800
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
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February 25, 2016, 10:00:49 PM |
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billyjoeallen
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Activity: 1106
Merit: 1007
Hide your women
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February 25, 2016, 10:01:23 PM |
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Initial Impression -- The Good - Thin blocks, Weak Blocks (Also Found in Core's roadmap) The Bad - Advocating for SPV mining , which is a problem exacerbated by their Validate Once proposal, and pushing off the many benefits of Segwit till the end of the year The Ugly - 3rd/4th Q 2016 adaptive rule for a block size limit that heavily incentivizes those with better bandwidth which would drive miners from China to locations with better bandwidth and make many home mining operations obsolete because they cannot compete with the propagation times with larger operations who can afford better uplinks. There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposal which makes it a non-starter from the get go IMHO. Ugly? UGLY?? This is exactly what we need, something that neutralizes the Chinese electricity and labor cost advantage. Without some way of doing that, we cannot regain censorship resistance. The fact that does so while increasing network performance is just a bonus. The problem i see obviously is that Chinese miners will be reluctant to adopt it. But if they don't adopt it or something like it, I don't see much future for Bitcoin. Either it will stagnate or it will grow to the point where it becomes a threat to the PRC and they will take over the network. This proposal is the only ray of hope I see for overcoming the duel problems of scaling and miner concentration. Is he wrong about this? There is no consideration for centralization concerns or the costs of nodes with this proposalYou are going to have some node centralization in either the CRTA or the Classic RoadMap. The problem is that there are always tradeoffs, so you have to judge which problem is worse: node centralization (nodes are cheap compared to mines) or mining concentration. Having overwhelming concentration of mining in a single political jurisdiction would be a serious problem anywhere, but having the same issue in Red China makes it much worse. The PRC has murdered more of it's own citizens than any other government in the history of civilization. they massacred their own people by the thousands as recently as 1989. They manipulate currency as a standard matter of policy. They have made it illegal for banks in China to hold Bitcoin accounts or for goods and services to be traded for BTC within the country. Increasing hashing power within China is producing negative security returns.
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harrymmmm
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February 25, 2016, 10:01:57 PM |
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if you small blocker truly believe the shit you say you should from a group that wishes to lower block limit to 0.5MB.
you'll get more decentralization and security, for everything else there's the Lighting Network promiseland.
I know that you know that most people want bigger blocks - sooner or later. Why keep saying stuff like this?
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harrymmmm
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![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
February 25, 2016, 10:05:02 PM |
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This proposal is the only ray of hope I see for overcoming the duel problems of scaling and miner concentration.
Heheh. If only it was a duel problem we could quickly solve it at 20 paces. So easy ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif)
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adamstgBit
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Activity: 1904
Merit: 1037
Trusted Bitcoiner
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February 25, 2016, 10:06:44 PM |
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if you small blocker truly believe the shit you say you should from a group that wishes to lower block limit to 0.5MB.
you'll get more decentralization and security, for everything else there's the Lighting Network promiseland.
I know that you know that most people want bigger blocks - sooner or later. Why keep saying stuff like this? I blurt shit out when i'm stressed and angry.
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BlindMayorBitcorn
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February 25, 2016, 10:12:35 PM |
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^Fact ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif)
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adamstgBit
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Activity: 1904
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Trusted Bitcoiner
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February 25, 2016, 10:38:01 PM |
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let try and change to mood in here. ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fs9.postimg.org%2Ftaj7bzzxb%2FUntitled.png&t=665&c=3J6lumTm4_bwHQ) classic head and shoulders pattern about to complete, targeting just under 400. AKA DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM
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Fatman3001
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Activity: 1526
Merit: 1013
Make Bitcoin glow with ENIAC
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February 25, 2016, 10:40:40 PM |
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let try and change to mood in here. ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fs9.postimg.org%2Ftaj7bzzxb%2FUntitled.png&t=665&c=3J6lumTm4_bwHQ) classic core head and shoulders pattern about to complete, targeting just under 400. AKA DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM ftfy
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bargainbin
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February 25, 2016, 10:52:47 PM |
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... The PRC has murdered more of it's own citizens than any other government in the history of civilization. they massacred their own people by the thousands as recently as 1989. ...
To be fair, they never had a shortage of people ![Smiley](https://bitcointalk.org/Smileys/default/smiley.gif) "People who try to commit suicide -- don't attempt to save them! . . . China is such a populous nation, it is not as if we cannot do without a few people." --Mao Zedong
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julian071
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![](https://bitcointalk.org/Themes/custom1/images/post/xx.gif) |
February 25, 2016, 10:53:58 PM |
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let try and change to mood in here. ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=http%3A%2F%2Fs9.postimg.org%2Ftaj7bzzxb%2FUntitled.png&t=665&c=3J6lumTm4_bwHQ) classic core head and shoulders pattern about to complete, targeting just under 400. AKA DOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOM ftfy lol
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ChartBuddy
Legendary
Online
Activity: 2282
Merit: 1800
1CBuddyxy4FerT3hzMmi1Jz48ESzRw1ZzZ
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February 25, 2016, 11:00:49 PM |
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iCEBREAKER
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Crypto is the separation of Power and State.
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February 25, 2016, 11:02:33 PM |
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Note: This is our initial roadmap proposal. We will run this by miners, companies and users for feedback, before it is finalized.
![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2Fv1S5FoR.jpg&t=665&c=_26bSR2yaq2vhQ) ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2F8imzuC5.jpg&t=665&c=7T1r1c-SxwbghQ) The Bitcoin Classic team ![](https://ip.bitcointalk.org/?u=https%3A%2F%2Fi.imgur.com%2FaKP4Jod.jpg&t=665&c=TLB03ffabBYstA)
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