MtGox withdrawal delays [Gathering]

[sturle]

I sent you PM several weeks ago asking what could be the best way to get money out of Gox.

Yes, you wrote "time is not critical".  I had two suggestions depending on how time critical it was.  If time was critical, I would have offered one more suggestion.  Then time suddenly got critical, or what triggered your IMHO irrational behaviour?  You will get your BTC, and you could have got your USD or EUR as well if time was not critical.  I hope you withdrew at least some via SEPA?

[rpietila]

I can fully understand the frustration of people who can't get to their money.

You were personally aware of my case. Is there something you would have done otherwise? How much do the Gox owe me now after one month of time wasted + $150k in costs? Apparently nothing, since you are so smart to be on the other side of the trade.

We all know that this technical glitch has all the signs of a technical glitch, and absolutely no signs of MtGox being out of BTC.

Which is pure and unadulterated hogwash. During my effort to get something out from the shithole, the situation got constantly more difficult, and the system started to work strangely. How do you explain for example this. data.

When trying to get out, I needed to buy bitcoins. There was 700 bitcoins offered until $982, which was a reasonable 0.6% slippage from the current price which was in the verge of a full-blown panic (23% over BS). At 9:57 I enter a market order to buy 700 bitcoins. The goxlag is about 2 minutes, after which I learn that I only get like 470 bitcoins. Where did the rest go? I made about 4% extra loss by purchasing them later when the price was higher. Needless to say, my turnover in exchanges in 2013 was in the $10,000,000s and I have executed quite a few market orders (almost 10,000 trades totally) and NEVER experienced such a trick.

In fact they filled up their hot wallet several times during last week, - - I took the opportunity to withdraw just after refill, and got myself a new round of profit by buying MtGox BTC at a discount with BTC I withdrew from MtGox.

Are you so distanced from reality that you don't even realize that using insider information (such as timing of refills in the instance when others cannot get their money out, and then selling the very coins withdrawn to the very customers who cannot withdraw due to their lack of said insider information) IS A CRIME.

Choose one: You get proprietary information from Mt.Gox technical workings, transfer to yourself the money that supposedly was there for everyone, and sell it for profit to the actual recipients. [] FRAUD [] NOT FRAUD.

Mt.Gox: You better destroy your archives quickly, for otherwise all your co-conspirators will get crushed when the LE is upon this. Fuck you.
NSA/FBI/KGB/CIA: If the said exchange is under your control and Mark is held hostage, fuck you.
Sturle: Fuck you.

[sturle]

I guess being a software engineer by trade doesn't make me a technical person now does it? lol  

Not automatically, no.  Any VB programmer can call herself "software engineer".  Perhaps you are capable of understanding what has been happening if you try, but you don't.  You don't even make an attempt.  Your only interest is the spreading of FUD.  And if it is true that you don't make money on it, I can honestly not understand what drives you to waste your time and energy.

I dislike market manipulation by spreading of false rumours and passing of speculation as a fact, and try to correct it by presenting the most accurate information I can find.  That's my motivation.

[fonzie]

Mt.Gox: You better destroy your archives quickly, for otherwise all your co-conspirators will get crushed when the LE is upon this. Fuck you.
NSA/FBI/KGB/CIA: If the said exchange is under your control and Mark is held hostage, fuck you.
Sturle: Fuck you.

I like your style  

[rpietila]

I sent you PM several weeks ago asking what could be the best way to get money out of Gox.

Yes, you wrote "time is not critical".  I had two suggestions depending on how time critical it was.  If time was critical, I would have offered one more suggestion.  Then time suddenly got critical, or what triggered your IMHO irrational behaviour?  You will get your BTC, and you could have got your USD or EUR as well if time was not critical.  I hope you withdrew at least some via SEPA?

They played with me all this time compounding my losses (premium going up). Finally I was in the understanding that I can only withdraw EUR 10,000 per 20 days, which in reality is about 80,000 per year IF the situation does not get worse. Considering that it was constantly and rapidly getting worse (as evidenced by the premium to BS widening rapidly in 25-26), and in my evaluation 25% would trigger a full panic, I pre-empted at 23%. The panic came later same day.

Now, listen: The only thing that stopped Gox dollars from becoming worthless that day was the escalation of BTC withdrawal difficulties. As goxBTC becomes endangered also, their ratio can better be manipulated (both are at the mercy of the puppetmasters). I don't know which is the cause and which is the effect of these. But bank run followed.

Fuck you.

[smoothie]

I guess being a software engineer by trade doesn't make me a technical person now does it? lol  

Not automatically, no.  Any VB programmer can call herself "software engineer".  Perhaps you are capable of understanding what has been happening if you try, but you don't.  You don't even make an attempt.  Your only interest is the spreading of FUD.  And if it is true that you don't make money on it, I can honestly not understand what drives you to waste your time and energy.

I dislike market manipulation by spreading of false rumours and passing of speculation as a fact, and try to correct it by presenting the most accurate information I can find.  That's my motivation.

LOL you think that my saying I'm a software engineer that it implies I am a VB programmer? LOL of course once again you would assume the worst to try to discredit your opposition.

I'm much more well versed in other programming languages than VB. VB is for noobs in my view.

Sturle if you knew anything about my rep as being smoothie on these forums is that of calling peoples'/businesses' BS out. Obviously the recent actions and statements from MTGOX are bullshit.

[smoothie]

I can fully understand the frustration of people who can't get to their money.

You were personally aware of my case. Is there something you would have done otherwise? How much do the Gox owe me now after one month of time wasted + $150k in costs? Apparently nothing, since you are so smart to be on the other side of the trade.

We all know that this technical glitch has all the signs of a technical glitch, and absolutely no signs of MtGox being out of BTC.

Which is pure and unadulterated hogwash. During my effort to get something out from the shithole, the situation got constantly more difficult, and the system started to work strangely. How do you explain for example this. data.

When trying to get out, I needed to buy bitcoins. There was 700 bitcoins offered until $982, which was a reasonable 0.6% slippage from the current price which was in the verge of a full-blown panic (23% over BS). At 9:57 I enter a market order to buy 700 bitcoins. The goxlag is about 2 minutes, after which I learn that I only get like 470 bitcoins. Where did the rest go? I made about 4% extra loss by purchasing them later when the price was higher. Needless to say, my turnover in exchanges in 2013 was in the $10,000,000s and I have executed quite a few market orders (almost 10,000 trades totally) and NEVER experienced such a trick.

In fact they filled up their hot wallet several times during last week, - - I took the opportunity to withdraw just after refill, and got myself a new round of profit by buying MtGox BTC at a discount with BTC I withdrew from MtGox.

Are you so distanced from reality that you don't even realize that using insider information (such as timing of refills in the instance when others cannot get their money out, and then selling the very coins withdrawn to the very customers who cannot withdraw due to their lack of said insider information) IS A CRIME.

Choose one: You get proprietary information from Mt.Gox technical workings, transfer to yourself the money that supposedly was there for everyone, and sell it for profit to the actual recipients. [] FRAUD [] NOT FRAUD.

Mt.Gox: You better destroy your archives quickly, for otherwise all your co-conspirators will get crushed when the LE is upon this. Fuck you.
NSA/FBI/KGB/CIA: If the said exchange is under your control and Mark is held hostage, fuck you.
Sturle: Fuck you.

lol in a manner of speaking. So be it. Well said.

[krudkeeper]

Why doesn't everyone just use coinbase or campbx?

[donk4u]

Why doesn't everyone just use coinbase or campbx?

because have money stuck on gox? freaking genius u thanks for that awesome and useless advice though.

[sturle]

I can fully understand the frustration of people who can't get to their money.

You were personally aware of my case. Is there something you would have done otherwise? How much do the Gox owe me now after one month of time wasted + $150k in costs? Apparently nothing, since you are so smart to be on the other side of the trade.

Why didn't you follow my advice?

We all know that this technical glitch has all the signs of a technical glitch, and absolutely no signs of MtGox being out of BTC.

Which is pure and unadulterated hogwash. During my effort to get something out from the shithole, the situation got constantly more difficult, and the system started to work strangely. How do you explain for example this. data.

When trying to get out, I needed to buy bitcoins. There was 700 bitcoins offered until $982, which was a reasonable 0.6% slippage from the current price which was in the verge of a full-blown panic (23% over BS). At 9:57 I enter a market order to buy 700 bitcoins. The goxlag is about 2 minutes, after which I learn that I only get like 470 bitcoins. Where did the rest go? I made about 4% extra loss by purchasing them later when the price was higher. Needless to say, my turnover in exchanges in 2013 was in the $10,000,000s and I have executed quite a few market orders (almost 10,000 trades totally) and NEVER experienced such a trick.

If you trade during lag, there is no way to know how many coins will be on sale when your order gets executed.  My bot for instance will not trade on old information, and pulls it's offers whenever the lag goes over a certain threshold.  If the lag went over this threshold before you entered your order, my bot would cancel more than 250 BTC worth of asks, and the cancellation would take effect before your order executed.  It could actually be my fault.  Sorry about that..

In fact they filled up their hot wallet several times during last week, - - I took the opportunity to withdraw just after refill, and got myself a new round of profit by buying MtGox BTC at a discount with BTC I withdrew from MtGox.

Are you so distanced from reality that you don't even realize that using insider information (such as timing of refills in the instance when others cannot get their money out, and then selling the very coins withdrawn to the very customers who cannot withdraw due to their lack of said insider information) IS A CRIME.

If information you have from observing previous behaviour is insider information, then technical analysis is as well.  I have been analysing how MtGox works instead of wasting time on speculation and FUD.  This does not make me an insider.  I never told anyone who sold their MtGox BTC it was a good idea.  I told them the opposite.  They wouldn't listen to reason and still wanted to sell.  I even bought some MtGox BTC 1:1 from people who had real life problems due to the glitch.

Choose one: You get proprietary information from Mt.Gox technical workings, transfer to yourself the money that supposedly was there for everyone, and sell it for profit to the actual recipients. [] FRAUD [] NOT FRAUD.

I don't have any proprietary information from MtGox.  I rely 100% on published information available to everyone who looks for it.  Lurking in #mtgox helps, of course, since I get to know what people ask support about and their answers.  There are about 1000 people there now, and the information given there is the same as everyone get.

E.g.:

22:09 <@ne0futur> "invalid bitcoin adress"
22:09 <@ne0futur> generally means the hotwallet is empty
22:10 <@ne0futur> just try again in a few hours when it will be refilled

When people start reporting "invalid bitcoin adress" errors, you can assume the hot wallet is empty and will be refilled in a few hours maximum.  Just start trying.  (The @ sign means it is a channel operator speaking, i.e. someone working for MtGox.)

Mt.Gox: You better destroy your archives quickly, for otherwise all your co-conspirators will get crushed when the LE is upon this. Fuck you.
NSA/FBI/KGB/CIA: If the said exchange is under your control and Mark is held hostage, fuck you.
Sturle: Fuck you.

I don't think #mtgox is officially logged, but there are probably many other lurkers who keep their logs.  They can even have mine.  Except for a few ordinary support tickets, all my communication with MtGox will be there.

[sturle]

Why doesn't everyone just use coinbase or campbx?

Because they take only USAnian customers, and even worse: They are located in the USSA.  Does fiat transfers to and from CampBX work again, btw?

[rpietila]

Dear mods,

Yes, I said "fuck you" 4 times, after learning that sturle is selling me my very own money that he gets to withdraw from Mt.Gox whereas I don't, pocketing a profit, calling me useful idiot, and bragging about the whole matter in public.

Just in case swearing is prohibited by rules.

sturle: **** ***.

Others: I am seeking for legal advice, solicit by PM.

[donk4u]

Dear mods,

Yes, I said "fuck you" 4 times, after learning that sturle is selling me my very own money that he gets to withdraw from Mt.Gox whereas I don't, pocketing a profit, calling me useful idiot, and bragging about the whole matter in public.

Just in case swearing is prohibited by rules.

sturle: **** ***.

Others: I am seeking for legal advice, solicit by PM.

are we allowed to witdraw now? SOrry wasn't trying to be wise guy thought missed an announcement. Sturle seems like a real low life.

[sturle]

I sent you PM several weeks ago asking what could be the best way to get money out of Gox.

Yes, you wrote "time is not critical".  I had two suggestions depending on how time critical it was.  If time was critical, I would have offered one more suggestion.  Then time suddenly got critical, or what triggered your IMHO irrational behaviour?  You will get your BTC, and you could have got your USD or EUR as well if time was not critical.  I hope you withdrew at least some via SEPA?

They played with me all this time compounding my losses (premium going up). Finally I was in the understanding that I can only withdraw EUR 10,000 per 20 days, which in reality is about 80,000 per year IF the situation does not get worse. Considering that it was constantly and rapidly getting worse (as evidenced by the premium to BS widening rapidly in 25-26), and in my evaluation 25% would trigger a full panic, I pre-empted at 23%. The panic came later same day.

You can withdraw 50k EUR per 20 days with a trusted account.  I suggested you waited for Moneypolo integration, since time was not critical.  You could do 50k EUR / 20 days while you waited, which is 900k EUR in a year.  1.22 million USD / year.  If time was critical, and you were willing to take a loss, I would have suggested the emergency withdrawal option with 5% bank fees.  You can even withdraw USD to EUR this way, since MtGox can exchange USD to JPY to EUR at the same 5% fee as USD to JPY to USD, saving a currency conversion on your side.

Now, listen: The only thing that stopped Gox dollars from becoming worthless that day was the escalation of BTC withdrawal difficulties. As goxBTC becomes endangered also, their ratio can better be manipulated (both are at the mercy of the puppetmasters). I don't know which is the cause and which is the effect of these. But bank run followed.

The price difference increased for a while after the BTC withdrawal difficulties started to appear.  If you are right, USD on MtGox will be worthless the moment they open the BTC withdrawal floodgates.  I'm ready.  The SEPA and domestic JPY withdrawal queues should be shortening now as well, btw.  People are not withdrawing fiat right now, but take advantage of reverse arbitrage to be ready if your scenario happens.

[sturle]

Yes, I said "fuck you" 4 times, after learning that sturle is selling me my very own money that he gets to withdraw from Mt.Gox whereas I don't, pocketing a profit, calling me useful idiot, and bragging about the whole matter in public.

I did not sell you you own money.  This happened before I made my offer in this thread, after a few successful trades with people on IRC.  I didn't trade with you until after BTC withdrawals were halted.

[isimme]

Sturle seems like a real low life.

STOP with the ad hominem/personal attacks..

[smoothie]

Sturle seems like a real low life.

STOP with the ad hominem/personal attacks..

Perhaps you should tell Sturle that as well. It goes both ways. I've been only calling things as I see it.

[isimme]

Sturle seems like a real low life.

STOP with the ad hominem/personal attacks..

Perhaps you should tell Sturle that as well. It goes both ways. I've been only calling things as I see it.

Smoothie, I've seen you around for awhile as I am more of a lurker then a poster,
and you seem OK, so try and hear me out.

Sturle didn't say "Smoothie is an idiot".

Sturle said "(And useful idiots who are helping the manipulators spreding FUD, while stupid enough to not take the profit from people who run into their trap.)"

Sturle is frustrated with the FUD and certainly shouldn't have said what he said.
Even if he didn't directly say you were an idiot, it would be nice if he apologized to you regardless.

You both have/had money tied up in Mt.Gox
and of course are both sensitive to that investment,
so try and hear each other out.

In general I think Sturle brings a lot more logic and rational thought then the FUDster/Market Manipulators
or rightfully upset average joes angry, rightfully so with GOX as GOX is handling the situation awfully.

Best Regards

[isimme]

FWIW, MTGOX to MTGOX transfers of Bitcoin are still enabled and working.
This means you can sell your GoxBTC for real BTC: Someone gives you a gox deposit address, you send your GoxBTC to that address and be sure to NOT check open-transaction. Coins show up instantly in their Gox accout.
People on Bitcoin talk are offering 60%, 66%, and 70% like prices.
I'll offer 85%— e.g. with round numbers: You pay me 100 GoxBTC I'll pay you 85 real BTC. You send first. This can be pretty handy if you'd like to use the current prices to get your GoxUSD out rapidly by trading for BTC and then selling that coin on something like Coinbase.
I'm mostly interested in trades over >5 BTC because I'm primarily a developer and miner, not a trader and these exchanges impose a fair amount of accounting overhead on me. I'll consider smaller offers, however.
PM if you're interested. (I'll edit or respond to this post when I'm unavailable or have changed my offer)

-----------To anyone interested I will provide the same service as quoted above, please PM if interested?----------

*I am in no way affiliated with MtGox and am offering this service because I believe Gox's problems besides awful PR
are at least with this particular issue of a technical nature. Please all Trolls feel free to quote me and mock me if Gox
does tank tomorrow for lulz?

[kano]

can we please come back to the topic of the post please?
as we know BTC withdrawal are suspended, and today probably will have some news.
what about fiat currencies? when is the last processed withdrawal for EUR/USD/JPY ?

$1k AUD swift 5-Dec ... still not even sent.