BTC-e hacked ??

[erk]

It makes no particular sense

There are quite a few "other exchange sites" out there, and how many of us are using them? On the other hand, if they get off cheap (read the clients' funds are intact), they could just fire up their servers in some really neutral country like Switzerland (or even in Mother Russia herself, which would be the best option if they manage to negotiate favorable terms with the Russian authorities). Btc-e has a name, and if they keep the money of their clients in complete safety, they will get away even stronger, as someones who successfully and rightfully fucked up Uncle Sam himself. I also don't think that this is the end of Btc-e (I don't have a financial stake in the affair but I can certainly feel your pain)

There is also a political angle, what are the first two words of the U.S. Attorney’s Office press release?
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndca/pr/russian-national-and-bitcoin-exchange-charged-21-count-indictment-operating-alleged

They are "Russian National" that's right, they set the prejudicial tone from square one.

The indictment is political.

[migello]

My 2 cents?

is all organized, they'll cash in BCC and magically in august BTC-E will be up and BCC/BTC USD/BCC pairs appear,

my take is that exchanges will control the majority of BCC.

in this scenario will bve possible a BCC takeover BTC

[deisik]

It makes no particular sense

There are quite a few "other exchange sites" out there, and how many of us are using them? On the other hand, if they get off cheap (read the clients' funds are intact), they could just fire up their servers in some really neutral country like Switzerland (or even in Mother Russia herself, which would be the best option if they manage to negotiate favorable terms with the Russian authorities). Btc-e has a name, and if they keep the money of their clients in complete safety, they will get away even stronger, as someones who successfully and rightfully fucked up Uncle Sam himself. I also don't think that this is the end of Btc-e (I don't have a financial stake in the affair but I can certainly feel your pain)

There is also a political angle, what are the first two words of the U.S. Attorney’s Office press release?
https://www.justice.gov/usao-ndca/pr/russian-national-and-bitcoin-exchange-charged-21-count-indictment-operating-alleged

They are "Russian National" that's right, they set the prejudicial tone from square one.

The indictment is political

If it is really so, it may backfire heavily

The obvious means of retaliation would be granting a "political" asylum to Btc-e in Russia itself (after all, it is considered a Russian exchange anyway), and if the admins managed to keep the exchange funds safe (which might well be the case), that would be a heavy blow to the US policy of punishing everyone who comes across them, and would as well give plenty of credit to Russia in general and to Putin personally. I would be surprised if they didn't catch the opportunity. It kinda looks American financial and political elites didn't quite think through the consequences of their actions (though the latter remains to be seen yet)

[buwaytress]

Look guys, lessons to be learnt and learn them well. Whatever the reasons, we know now as we have been told many times: do not store your coins in exchanges/sites/casinos unless they're needed there for trading/investment.

I myself have substantial (for me) amounts in trading, lending and investment but that's also subject to diversification. I know any of them could close shop at any time. What you need, keep securely.

I do feel bad for traders of course... I would definitely feel the hurt if a few of my trades are eaten should one of my exchanges die like this.

[JoeMue]

This is the first time some of my coins and money (approx. 5 BTC + $8000) might be gone... but I am quite calm. My instincts say that the game is far from being over.

1.) Client funds and coins are not compromised.
2.) Admins are in control of the site.
3.) Admins are trying to get the site back to business. Why would they be lying?
4.) A well known exchange is a gold mine.
5.) Taking the clients money/coins and run sounds too risky. Some powerful whales have millions of dollars at BTC-E. No fun to hide from them the rest of your live.
5.) US taking down the biggest russian exchange? Putin never misses a chance kicking US's ass. He might interfere some way.

I think there is at least a 50% chance that BTC-E restarts business in the near future. Let's just wait and see what happens.

[bj9k]

All other unlicensed exchanges are now facing the same danger as it is happening to BTC-e.

US can issue arrest warrant to any of exchanges and their operators (owners and employees) will be arrested when they step into any country that have signed a treaty I have mentioned above.

Lets just hope that BTC-e owners considered this possibility and that they have a way to get out of this. If not, all unlicensed exchanges might close their businesses, at least for US citizens.

[mayax]

All other unlicensed exchanges are now facing the same danger as it is happening to BTC-e.

US can issue arrest warrant to any of exchanges and their operators (owners and employees) will be arrested when they step into any country that have signed a treaty I have mentioned above.

Lets just hope that BTC-e owners considered this possibility and that they have a way to get out of this. If not, all unlicensed exchanges might close their businesses, at least for US citizens.

i am saying that since years ago...

Kraken, Poloniex and Bitfinex are next.

[deisik]

All other unlicensed exchanges are now facing the same danger as it is happening to BTC-e now.

US can issue arrest warrant to any of exchanges and their operators (owners and employees) will be arrested when they step into any country that have signed a treaty I have mentioned above.

Lets just hope that BTC-e owners considered this possibility and that they have a way to get out of this. If not, all unlicensed exchanges might close their businesses, at least for US citizens

What are you talking about?

What "all other unlicensed exchanges" do you refer to? Where these exchanges should get their license and from whom exactly? Maybe, you mean Washington, DC, and the US government? We are not there yet. What the US authorities are doing is not very far from complete lawlessness and surely beyond outrage. Btc-e has basically nothing to do with the US, and if some US citizens are making illegal trades at this exchange, the US government should go after them, not the exchange. In other words, as long as it is not the American exchange, it is none of their business. I am eager to see them attacking, say, China in this manner

[stingray454]

Does anybody notice newbie accounts posting negative things in this thread?

+1, please keep in mind that many people reading this thread could have lost tens or even hundreds of thousand of dollars. For some their entire life savings. Ok, maybe not lost for sure, but at least it has a very uncertain future. Yes, there are risks trading online, but to be honest this was not expected in the least. Comments like "told you so, sucker" doesn't help people feeling really bad right now, quite the opposite. Please keep to facts and discussions.

[stingray454]

What "all other unlicensed exchanges" do you refer to? Where these exchanges should get their license and from whom exactly? Maybe, you mean Washington, DC, and the US government? We are not there yet. What the US authorities are doing is not very far from complete lawlessness and surely beyond outrage. Btc-e has basically nothing to do with the US, and if some US citizens are making illegal trades at this exchange, the US government should go after them, not the exchange. In other words, as long as it is not the American exchange, it is none of their business. I am eager to see them attacking, say, China in this manner

Bitstamp is a fully licenced exchange, for example. https://www.bitstamp.net/payment-institution-license/

But yes, I agree that the US should have no authority what so ever of an exchange in the EU.

[Sukovsky]

Translated from Russian

BTC-e's chief moderator:

In fact, knowing not by hearsay (by a walk through the old "not local" and possible new comments), in order to restore at least an approximate existing infrastructure on the new site, it is necessary to take about a week (3 days at least to rest and get drunk), everything here will depend on the reliability and packing Backup data and communication channel with the new DC ...

plus do not forget that there are also "political" moments in the placement of such services ...

PySy that, when, how and where they hosted and hosted it is not for me to say ...
There is a good chance that the btc-e exchange will resume its work.

I advise you, dear readers, not to make hasty conclusions, conclusions and not to read jaundice. It is worthwhile to understand that the media are now rejoicing against the background of this event, tearing away large traffic and causing panic.

I would like to remind you about 2 hacking of the BTZ-E exchange a couple of years ago. The exchange paid all to a penny in the currency in which it was stolen.

[deisik]

What "all other unlicensed exchanges" do you refer to? Where these exchanges should get their license and from whom exactly? Maybe, you mean Washington, DC, and the US government? We are not there yet. What the US authorities are doing is not very far from complete lawlessness and surely beyond outrage. Btc-e has basically nothing to do with the US, and if some US citizens are making illegal trades at this exchange, the US government should go after them, not the exchange. In other words, as long as it is not the American exchange, it is none of their business. I am eager to see them attacking, say, China in this manner

Bitstamp is a fully licenced exchange, for example. https://www.bitstamp.net/payment-institution-license/

But yes, I agree that the US should have no authority what so ever of an exchange in the EU.

As to me, such license wouldn't help a shit

If the FBI was going after an exchange having it. That wouldn't take long for the US government to declare this license null and void (according to the American laws, obviously). I'd rather say it all quickly comes down whether they can actually do anything rather than follow some local rules and regulations even if there is nothing wrong according to the laws of that jurisdiction. It should be as clear as day to anyone in his right mind that the US jurisdiction takes prevalence and precedence over any local one unless the local government doesn't give a fuck about Uncle Sam and can uphold their position with arms (like Cuba or Iran)

[bj9k]

[What "all other unlicensed exchanges" do you refer to? Where these exchanges should get their license and from whom exactly? Maybe, you mean Washington, DC, and the US government? We are not there yet. What the US authorities are doing is not very far from complete lawlessness and surely beyond outrage. Btc-e has basically nothing to do with the US, and if some US citizens are making illegal trades at this exchange, the US government should go after them, not the exchange. In other words, as long as it is not the American exchange, it is none of their business. I am eager to see them attacking, say, China in this manner

If a country signed a treaty with US and you travel to that country you can be extradited to US if US files arrest warrant based on that treaty. It does not matter your citizenship and where your business is physically located !! This is real life fact which most people don't think about. When you travel another country you are not having diplomatic immunity because you are foreigner. Everyone is practically in huge danger whenever traveling abroad because foreigners don't know details of destination country laws and international treaties that they have signed with other countries.

About licensing exchanges, I don't follow much which country have options to have legal exchange but check for example this https://www.coindesk.com/philippine-central-bank-sees-few-applicants-for-crypto-exchange-license/

Also Bitstamp wrote that they are licensed exchange from Luxembourg.

[stingray454]

If a country signed a treaty with US and you travel to that country you can be extradited to US if US files arrest warrant based on that treaty. It does not matter your citizenship and where your business is physically located !!

While this is very true, it only applies to the person. Even if the admin of BTC-e is prosecuted in the US, they have no control over any business he runs in the country extradited him (and to be honest, btc-e seems to operate from a bunch of different countries). So while he will face charges, I doubt the US can do anything at all about the BTC-e site or keeping it from opening up again. The major problem is probably that the people behind the site would be targets for more US interventions, so they would have to either remain anonymous or stay in countries without extradition treaties.

[deisik]

[What "all other unlicensed exchanges" do you refer to? Where these exchanges should get their license and from whom exactly? Maybe, you mean Washington, DC, and the US government? We are not there yet. What the US authorities are doing is not very far from complete lawlessness and surely beyond outrage. Btc-e has basically nothing to do with the US, and if some US citizens are making illegal trades at this exchange, the US government should go after them, not the exchange. In other words, as long as it is not the American exchange, it is none of their business. I am eager to see them attacking, say, China in this manner

If a country signed a treaty with US and you travel to that country you can be extradited to US if US files arrest warrant based on that treaty. It does not matter your citizenship and where your business is physically located !! This is real life fact which most people don't think about. When you travel another country you are not having diplomatic immunity because you are foreigner. Everyone is practically in huge danger whenever traveling abroad because foreigners don't details of destination country laws and international treaties that they have signed with other countries.

About licensing exchanges, I don't follow much which country have options to have legal exchange but check for example this https://www.coindesk.com/philippine-central-bank-sees-few-applicants-for-crypto-exchange-license/

Also Bitstamp wrote that they are licensed exchange from Luxembourg

I guess you should learn to read

I didn't ask you about what you just wrote, I didn't ask you about citizenship and the possibility of being arrested (just in case, you can get arrested even in your home country and extradited to the US). I asked you about licenses specifically, and how being licensed can help you unless you obtained that license directly from Uncle Sam's hands. So how would the license issued to Bitstamp by Luxembourg authorities help that "licensed" exchange in case the FBI thinks the exchange launders money and is involved in other criminal operations and activities (as they could come to think)? In short, is there any real difference between a "licensed" and "unlicensed" exchange (unless this license is confirmed by Washington, of course)?

[stingray454]

I asked you about licenses specifically, and how being licensed can help you unless you obtained that license directly from Uncle Sam's hands. So how would the license issued to Bitstamp by Luxembourg authorities help that "licensed" exchange in case the FBI thinks the exchange launders money and is involved in other criminal operations and activities (as they could come to think)? In short, is there any real difference between a "licensed" and "unlicensed" exchange (unless this license is confirmed by Washington, of course)?

The FBI, US government or similar can do _nothing_ about foreign companies. US laws applies in the US, not in other countries. What they can do it ask the country to block / shut down the exchange in case of suspicious activities, but it's 100% the target countries choice to do so (if they, say, want to keep a good relation with the US). If you are licenced, you have external auditors checking your exchange on a regular basis, all the government permissions, follow all available laws and anti-money-laundry precautions and so on. It is _definitely_ harder to motivate shutting down a legitimate business because the US wants you to, instead of an illegal money transfer operation breaking local laws and regulations and being suspected for laundry (something auditors would probably catch long before the US if that was the case). So yes, I'd say you are a lot safer on sites like Bitstamp.

[ARTHurt]

On the last page of the arrest warrant published by coindesk

https://www.coindesk.com/110-million-btc-e-fined-us-vows-crackdown-unregulated-exchanges/

it is stated that

IN THE MATTER OF THE SEARCH OF
INFORMATION ASSOCIATED WITH
SERVERS CONTAINING BTC-E-
RELATED CONTENT STORED AT THE
PREMISES CONTROLLED BY
EQUINIX

then we find out Equinix is a data center based right in Redwood City, California, with several  POPs worldwide
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinix
https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinix

So the above warrant is also a search warrant for the servers location which may better explain why BTC-e wend suddenly in 502 and also why one of the tweets was saying something about "network related issues in data center" while FEDs were busy pulling out the RJ45s

don't quote me on that, it's just one of my thoughts

[erk]

On the last page of the arrest warrant published by coindesk

https://www.coindesk.com/110-million-btc-e-fined-us-vows-crackdown-unregulated-exchanges/

it is stated that

IN THE MATTER OF THE SEARCH OF
INFORMATION ASSOCIATED WITH
SERVERS CONTAINING BTC-E-
RELATED CONTENT STORED AT THE
PREMISES CONTROLLED BY
EQUINIX

then we find out Equinix is a data center based right in Redwood City, California, with several  POPs worldwide
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinix
https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinix

So the above warrant is also a search warrant for the servers location which may better explain why BTC-e wend suddenly in 502 and also why one of the tweets was saying something about "network related issues in data center" while FEDs were busy pulling out the RJ45s

don't quote me on that, it's just one of my thoughts

Equinix data center is in Bulgaria too, what makes you think BTC-e would use a Californian data center an risk FinCen problems?
They would have been taken down years ago like Mt Gox was in the US.

[ARTHurt]

On the last page of the arrest warrant published by coindesk

https://www.coindesk.com/110-million-btc-e-fined-us-vows-crackdown-unregulated-exchanges/

it is stated that

IN THE MATTER OF THE SEARCH OF
INFORMATION ASSOCIATED WITH
SERVERS CONTAINING BTC-E-
RELATED CONTENT STORED AT THE
PREMISES CONTROLLED BY
EQUINIX

then we find out Equinix is a data center based right in Redwood City, California, with several  POPs worldwide
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinix
https://ro.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equinix

So the above warrant is also a search warrant for the servers location which may better explain why BTC-e wend suddenly in 502 and also why one of the tweets was saying something about "network related issues in data center" while FEDs were busy pulling out the RJ45s

don't quote me on that, it's just one of my thoughts

Equinix data center is in Bulgaria too, what makes you think BTC-e would use a Californian data center an risk FinCen problems?
They would have been taken down years ago like Mt Gox was in the US.

I didn't say the servers were in California, that was exactly my point saying "with several  POPs worldwide"
While the arrest warrant had jurisdiction in Greece, the same way the search warrant was applicable anywhere between Bulgaria, Poland, etc etc ...

[ARTHurt]

Just another piece of interesting information from my latest experience...

It seems that the Czech accounts used for SEPA deposits are not seized.

Story:
I was just funding my account minutes before the Cloudfare 502 the other day, I was sending like 2.5k.
Then the next day, watching this thread, the moment I've seen the misteryous arrest on the Reuters news I have triggered the transfer cancellation which already shown as "processed"
Just minutes ago the money came back to my bank account so I'm relieved.
My only loss in this business were the 75EUR cancellation commission, lucky me...