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Author Topic: [ANN][ICO] savedroid - BITCOIN SAVING MADE EASY!  (Read 54967 times)
coinsniperX
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April 25, 2018, 06:30:18 PM
 #2821


Please let's stay with the facts. That the minting is taking a bit longer than expected is already stated clearly since beginning of this month. Reasons for this are that the amount of altcoins we accepted was more effort than expected and that the KYC provider was a massive failure and most of the KYC had to be done manually by our team.
Minting of all tokens where all KYC documents have been submitted till the deadline (end of March) and minting mode and wallet have been set till the deadline (around 2 weeks ago) and it's not creditcard, will be finished this week. Noone said that the exchange will be live this week, again please stay with the facts!

Of course we did a mistake from time to time in the past, who doesn't? But be fair and don't make anything up!

Glad to hear that minting mode and the distribution will be finished this week
Where do you plan to add savedroid on exchanges?
bancor, hitbtc, idex, tidex... honestly I don't like any of them and still hope that we will see SVD on some better and more liquid exchange.
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April 25, 2018, 07:26:08 PM
 #2822


Please let's stay with the facts. That the minting is taking a bit longer than expected is already stated clearly since beginning of this month. Reasons for this are that the amount of altcoins we accepted was more effort than expected and that the KYC provider was a massive failure and most of the KYC had to be done manually by our team.
Minting of all tokens where all KYC documents have been submitted till the deadline (end of March) and minting mode and wallet have been set till the deadline (around 2 weeks ago) and it's not creditcard, will be finished this week. Noone said that the exchange will be live this week, again please stay with the facts!

Of course we did a mistake from time to time in the past, who doesn't? But be fair and don't make anything up!

Glad to hear that minting mode and the distribution will be finished this week
Where do you plan to add savedroid on exchanges?
bancor, hitbtc, idex, tidex... honestly I don't like any of them and still hope that we will see SVD on some better and more liquid exchange.
We're looking to add more exchanges in the future as well.

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April 25, 2018, 08:07:22 PM
 #2823

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Savedroid will not participate now on exchanges who charge 2-3 million just for listing without any premium. (comments from the community much appreciated)

Damm... this guys raised 50 mln euro (60 mln usd) !! And they want not pay for good exchanges? This is really suspiciously


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Ulfatron
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April 25, 2018, 08:25:12 PM
 #2824

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Savedroid will not participate now on exchanges who charge 2-3 million just for listing without any premium. (comments from the community much appreciated)

Damm... this guys raised 50 mln euro (60 mln usd) !! And they want not pay for good exchanges? This is really suspiciously

I think they raised 40M Euro or 50M$. It is quite likely that the big exchanges will ask for higher fees due to their little stunt, if they will accept them at all.
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April 25, 2018, 09:40:39 PM
Last edit: April 26, 2018, 12:02:30 AM by tempus
 #2825

Since there is a lot of speculation going on about exchange-listings:

The following is a scenario, focused on the exchange-situation.


It’s a combination of what I know about exchanges in general and given informations from and about Savedroid. It will not be totally accurate or a safe prediction. I think in probabilites. But it is realistic and with some tendency to be likely in my opinion.


Background about the Savedroid-situation:


Information: Yassin Hankir said in the AMA that many exchanges demand high amounts of money for a listing, up to or even above $1 million. He also said about the announced top 5 exchange that he can’t say anything about it, because it’s under NDA.

And yes, it is true that at least some Exchanges sell listings for high amounts and also NDA’s during negotiations are common. They don’t like it to be public but it’s also not a secret. Btw, usually also projects don’t talk about bought listings. That he did and what his intention might be, … let’s get back to that later.


In this post I’ve already pointed on the fact that they’ve used the announcement of a top 5 exchange to hype their ICO, to give it a last push 4 days before it ended:

savedroid ICO: SVD Token will be traded on top 5 exchange
https://medium.com/@ico_8796/savedroid-ico-svd-token-will-be-traded-on-top-5-exchange-f45a453ca3ef

Sidenote: They have used everything they could think of to hype the shit out of the ICO. That’s visible everywhere. I mention that because it shows that they are not just greedy but also unexperienced/stupid/careless. There are several good reasons why legit teams don’t do that, rational reasons - not about idealism or whatever. But, I don’t want to write a book about that, so, back to topic:



A potential scenario regarding the exchange-situation:

They’ve started negotiations with such an exchange or probably asked all of the bigger ones during the ICO. It could have started with a simple question if there would be a way to get listed, if yes how much it would cost etc. But it’s not likely that anything was finalized. More likely is a Memorandum of understanding and that Savedroid had a financial strategy that could have looked like this:

- we are four days before the end of the ICO
- we already know that we have raised many millions
- we would have to pay xxxx Dollar for a listing
- since such an announcement is likely to give the ICO a last big push it would be beneficial to do it. Maybe it would not only pay for itself but even lead to much more money, plus: the market situation after the ICO would be better with a good listing (not even sure if they are capable to think more than just superficially about market-dynamics and potential effects)


Good exchange-listings have multiple, especially several psychological, effects. So there might be some probability that it seemed to be a good decision to come to an agreement, that they would pay for a listing. And that may have given them the option to announce a top 5 exchange. Why it is unlikely that anything was finalized at that time: They were not able to pay and are still not able to do that.

There are two other possibilities:

1) The top 5 announcement was a lie. I don’t want to say that this scenario is likely but it’s not impossible. Reason: Since they don’t say which exchange they also wouldn’t have to be too scared that any of them would dispute, while such an announcement is safe to bring in more money.

2) That there is not even some kind of agreement, that they just thought: "Yes, we’ll pay what they told us" but without that the exchange already agreed.




Situation now - after the PR-Stunt


Important in that context is that there is a new situation now, that is unlikely to have no consequences. Potentially there are at least two important kinds of bad consequences:

They’ve successfully burned down their own credibility. What I can read out of the german media-echo is: They are toxic now. Even payment and banking (those who gave them the award and revoked it after the „Exit-Scam-Prank“) destroy Savedroid now publicly, brand them as snakeoil, not credible, buggy software and so on. Their reason to do so: Probably they want to come clean now and burn all bridges to Savedroid. And of course one can be critical about that move, but if focused only on facts, the given information in that article are true in my opinion. Savedroid is and never was what so many hoped to see in this project.

Another consequence is the financial side. Yassir said in his AMA that especially big Investors would like his PR-Stunt. What he says there between the lines actually is: Big and smart Fintech-Guys see how genius it was, just little and stupid Crypto-Kids still don't get it! But how likely is that? Sure, there is no lack of stupid and/or unexperienced millionaires. Rich guys are not necessarily smarter. But let's stay rational here. It's simply not possible that all of them liked it. I believe it’s the opposite. It's just that rich guys don’t write posts here. They call their lawyers. Yassin also said that not all the ICO-money was in Escrow. Savedroid has made contracts with individual Investors, maybe even with individual conditions. And it’s very likely that many of those contracts are now under review in law firms to find a way to get the money back. In case of NDA's nothing of that is likely to reach the public. The thing here is: Since lawyers tend to do research instead of taking action in an impulsive way, and they are not in a hurry, Savedroid could be in the bad situation that they don't even now yet what may come on the legal front and how much money they may be forced to give back. I believe he also said that big guys liked it to calm down other big guys who maybe didn't like it while he doesn't even know that until now.

Under the line: It’s something I can’t know but they may have to sell back huge amounts. Plus: Many bought into the ICO using Credit Cards. Those guys can reverse transactions (a reason why Savedroid will not give them token until the money is safe).





Now, keep in mind the above - back to the exchange topic:

Savedroid has burned down it’s own credibility and professional exchanges also have their „due diligence list“. Of course they want to avoid to list scams and projects that may turn out as that, because that would damage their own credibility. It’s simply not possible that a serious and professional exchange will just go over this insane PR-Stunt and say "yeah, great!" or "whatever". Much more likely is that they don’t want to list Savedroid anymore, or: that they’ve changed the conditions and that a listing would be much more expensive now.

Combine that with Savedroids situation on the legal and financial side, that it’s likely that they don’t know yet how much they’ll have to pay back, especially to big Investors and Credit Card Users, and that they don’t know what costs they will have to spend to clean up the legal side etc. There are many signs, that they are  scared like... #hopefully.

And if this guy here doesn’t lie, and I believe he tells the truth, this is how Savedroid reacts on guys who want to have their money back:

"Savedroid has destroyed its own reputation whether or not its an exit scam. I believe the majority of us would like a refund and it is crazy for them to lock tokens for 180 days but only give us a short period of 14 days to refund. Very unfair terms and I will be taking action under the Consumer Protection Act 2015. I have already asked my bank for a refund as Savedroid have acted both unprofessionally and in an incompetetive manner. I am still completely unsure if this was a failed exit scam or if they are buying time to take our money.

I spoke to Tobias (co founder) and he is extremely rude and unprofessional and he said he would send me a bill if I refunded (I mean seriously, what will you do with a bill from Germany??)."


Source: Comment on FB

With other words: There is a reason that they try everything not to refund, because that could lead into a dynamic with a damaging result: That they would be left with legal costs but not that much money any more. Add that they are toxic now —> RIP.

Yassin said during the AMA that he doesn’t agree to payfor a listing while I consider it as highly unlikely that they were able to get an agreement for a top-5-exchange-listing without paying for that. That’s why I said in my last post:

„(…) it might very well be that he is already preparing excuses.“

But, just for fun: Let’s assume that I'm wrong and they really were able to secure an agreement for a listing without payment on a big exchange: How likely would it be that this exchange doesn’t care about their clown-show and doesn't step back?

If you consider that as unlikely you also know in which direction this goes if he says that he doesn’t want to pay for a listing now.





Some additional words about the legal side:

I can’t know how deep the trouble is which they are in. But it’s near to impossible that no Investor has called his lawyer. Probably it’s about hundreds who did that while Savedroid is maybe not even aware of all of them. What also most likely happened: Investors have written to the escrows, to exchanges, to their bank etc. - all to make pressure to get a refund. Smart guys don’t want this to be traded, because trading would significantly reduce the chance to get a refund.

I believe that it all will depend on how safe their own legal situation is. I didn’t check their legal stuff because I don’t have the competence to come to safe conclusions. But things like that are in a grey area quiet often. That's why I believe that they also have to fight with a lot of unknowns but maybe scary stuff.




What I believe will be the result of this shit-show:

(it’s speculation of course, because there are too many unknowns to make safe predictions and the situation is not static but vibrant)

1) I believe that several big guys will get their money back. They have some power Crypto-Investors don’t have - not just because of the legal side. Several of them also may have some influence. Savedroid would be stupid to create even more enemies in the German Fintech-space and risk more bad press. Maybe they’ll just give the money back to those who are influential without much complaining.  

2) I believe that Savedroid will do everything not to refund Crypto-Investors and small Investors in general. The reason is simple: If they would agree on that they would have to refund everybody who wants out. And while that would also help those who still would decide to give this a try (because less supply would reduce the risk of dumping later) the Savedroid-ppl want to keep the money of course. And they couldn’t know how many would want to be refunded if they would agree on that possibility. They could lose $20 millions easily. Since they've already proven to be hypocritical teachers who love to educate others about greed it's a safe bet that they’ll fight hard to become multi-millionairs. #this-project-will-never-generate-more-money-than-during-their-Hype-ICO

3) I don’t believe that this will hit a big exchange. Reasons are pointed out above.

4) I don’t believe that this will not lead to significant losses once traded. Even without PR-stunt… this is so damn overvalued. It would need some hype just to keep it’s value, but after a hyped up ICO and a burned down credibility - is there anything left to hype with? Development takes time, right? And how much time was spent on that before their Clown-Show? And now… exactly!

5) Probably they will put some effort in making "everyone" believe that the PR-Stunt also had a lot of positive effects, because they are known now - so much attention! And of course they say that they will keep on with their education, with their message to help this market to become more sustainable and so on. But what should they say else? Admit that they’ve fucked up like no project before while that would directly lead into refunds? Nope… they won’t do that.

6) But yes, the scam-brand and the „fucking-stupid-idiots-brand“ is nothing they’ll ever overcome. Just check the numbers, how much retweets they get, how much views on FB, how much activity there is on reddit etc. Compare that to their successful stunt! There will also not be much more „education“ and „messages“. It’s not even that Crypto would need to forget them. Crypto has never cared much and Investors are unlikely to build buy-walls for their new stupid-clowns-who-are-scam-or-fake-brand.




And yes, I know - some or even many here don’t like to read things like this. But that’s natural in situations without any good solution. My advice is also not to simply believe what I or others say. My advice is to think cold about it all, with some distance, to just take things into consideration, to think in probabilites and to come to conclusions that are not fix but about potential scenarios. Exactly that is what this team shows a total lack of ability in, while they still want to believe to be right. For me it’s astonishing to see such an insane combination of arrogance, hypocrisy and naivety and before all: That there was nobody internally who stopped those who came up with their great fame-creating-kamikaze-scam-let’s-call-it-education-prank-strategy. #welcometothejungle
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April 25, 2018, 11:55:19 PM
 #2826

How can it be early May for listing as in the pinned message it say after KYC and minting you need 2 weeks for emotions now that takes 3 weeks from now which will be middle of May
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April 26, 2018, 12:10:07 AM
 #2827

Good day everybody,

for those who missed yesterday‘s Q&A with CEO Dr. Yassin Hankir, I would like to share some info with you.

Progress:
-    Minting will be finished first week of may for investors.
-    Bounty Tokens will follow directly after
-    Listing in abt 2 weeks after emotions settled down

This savedroid always lie and broke promise, now they delay again about distribution and exchange

before AMA they promise to delivered token and exchange before may, and now they change promise again and again and again and again

now i know this project is just buy some time because no exchange accept their token to be list

shame on you savedroid
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April 26, 2018, 01:43:13 AM
 #2828

How can it be early May for listing as in the pinned message it say after KYC and minting you need 2 weeks for emotions now that takes 3 weeks from now which will be middle of May

May Huh may of 2019 or 2020 or...... .2050 Lol
they just lie and lie to buy some time
this is very bad ico
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April 26, 2018, 08:36:52 AM
 #2829

Regarding exchanges, read what Tempus wrote on page 142. When it comes to smaller exchanges they are probably going to take the money and list, but the bigger ones will make Savedroid jump through more hoops, maybe increase fees or turn them down completely because of the stunt.
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April 26, 2018, 08:47:03 AM
 #2830

I really believe that he could not have done it worse. It is a mockery towards investors and towards the project itself.
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April 26, 2018, 08:48:08 AM
 #2831

This PR-Mega-Joke just damaged everything that SVD managed to build up until now.
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April 26, 2018, 09:01:14 AM
 #2832

Well, as always there are more questions then answers in this project. Savedroid team looked like serious in the beginning of ICO. But now...

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April 26, 2018, 09:13:07 AM
 #2833

Well, as always there are more questions then answers in this project. Savedroid team looked like serious in the beginning of ICO. But now...

Please complete your sentence but now what what happened if keep feeding the trolls than they will continue to make panic us by spreading rumors. Actually is crypto is best strategy buy rumors and sell news it looking they will win this time because of some people who are still at same point till now.
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April 26, 2018, 09:56:05 AM
 #2834

Well, as always there are more questions then answers in this project. Savedroid team looked like serious in the beginning of ICO. But now...

Please complete your sentence but now what what happened if keep feeding the trolls than they will continue to make panic us by spreading rumors. Actually is crypto is best strategy buy rumors and sell news it looking they will win this time because of some people who are still at same point till now.
We're also still answering all serious questions, if they haven't been answered already x-times or are simple FUD by the same repetitive people and Newbie-clones. There's also a 24/7 support at Telegram, so feel free to join us there as it's often better to have a realtime chat than one or two posts a day in a board.

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April 26, 2018, 10:13:38 AM
Last edit: April 26, 2018, 10:28:10 AM by tempus
 #2835

Well, as always there are more questions then answers in this project. Savedroid team looked like serious in the beginning of ICO. But now...

Please complete your sentence but now what what happened if keep feeding the trolls than they will continue to make panic us by spreading rumors. Actually is crypto is best strategy buy rumors and sell news it looking they will win this time because of some people who are still at same point till now.
We're also still answering all serious questions, if they haven't been answered already x-times or are simple FUD by the same repetitive people and Newbie-clones. There's also a 24/7 support at Telegram, so feel free to join us there as it's often better to have a realtime chat than one or two posts a day in a board.

Feel free to answer on the following questions - but I guess that's FUD or I'm one of the repetitive people? Wink

  • It was claimed, the team wanted to prove with the PR-Stunt how easy it is to execute an exit scam and to steal all ICO-funds, your bank and lawyer were forced into statements that everything is safe and now also your CEO confirmed that it would not have been possible to steal the funds. What did you prove then?
  • Whenever asked for refund, the reply is that a refund only would have been possible until 14 days after ICO. Your (debunked) argument was that regulations are so lax that it would have been easy to get away with theft, but when it’s about giving money back to Investors the rules are so strong and wouldn't it be fair to do that?
  • In the AMA was said that there will be no refund because the project didn't change. But wouldn't you agree that Trust and Credibility are crucial and that the "Savedroid is a scam headlines" and "Savedroid has done the most dumb PR Stunt ever" have done significant damage?
  • And wouldn't you agree that the Investors and their Investment were used to promote something they have not bought - the "ICO-advisory-service" you plan to offer?
  • Yassir said in an interview with Gruenderszene that the PR-stunt would not have negative impact on the future price of the token, otherwise the team wouldn’t have done it. How could he/you/the team ever know that?
  • When you planned that PR-stunt…
    …didn’t you think about a potential scenario that an overwhelmed and shocked Investor could have done harm to himself out of desperation?
    …didn’t you think about the scenario that your bank, lawyer, german fintechs, german blockchain association, advisors etc of you would be forced into distancing themselves from Savedroid?
    …didn’t you think about the potential scenario that the connection of words Savedroid and Scam would not be the best brand to move on?
    …didn’t you think about the scenario that you’ll not be able to control the communication and establish your narrative afterwards?
  • Is it possible that there will be legal consequences for Savedroid?
  • In a german article is said that the Savedroid team was thrown out of an office in it’s early days because of „dubios and irresponsible behaviour“ and that you’ve tried to sell user-data. Is that true?
    https://kryptoszene.de/savedroid-status-update-alles-nur-ein-pr-stunt/






Edit: Since you mention the FUD-problem - let's not forget who started the biggest FUD-campaign I've ever seen, targeting the own Investors and credibility of the own project. Shouldn't be necessary to word this as a question...
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April 26, 2018, 12:07:35 PM
 #2836

Let we know, when the distribution is finish and when will be adding at exchanges?
Please giving the exact date when the distribution for bounty.

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tobson2
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April 26, 2018, 12:09:42 PM
Last edit: April 26, 2018, 01:39:25 PM by tobson2
 #2837

Well, as always there are more questions then answers in this project. Savedroid team looked like serious in the beginning of ICO. But now...

Please complete your sentence but now what what happened if keep feeding the trolls than they will continue to make panic us by spreading rumors. Actually is crypto is best strategy buy rumors and sell news it looking they will win this time because of some people who are still at same point till now.
We're also still answering all serious questions, if they haven't been answered already x-times or are simple FUD by the same repetitive people and Newbie-clones. There's also a 24/7 support at Telegram, so feel free to join us there as it's often better to have a realtime chat than one or two posts a day in a board.

Feel free to answer on the following questions - but I guess that's FUD or I'm one of the repetitive people? Wink

  • It was claimed, the team wanted to prove with the PR-Stunt how easy it is to execute an exit scam and to steal all ICO-funds, your bank and lawyer were forced into statements that everything is safe and now also your CEO confirmed that it would not have been possible to steal the funds. What did you prove then?
  • Whenever asked for refund, the reply is that a refund only would have been possible until 14 days after ICO. Your (debunked) argument was that regulations are so lax that it would have been easy to get away with theft, but when it’s about giving money back to Investors the rules are so strong and wouldn't it be fair to do that?
  • In the AMA was said that there will be no refund because the project didn't change. But wouldn't you agree that Trust and Credibility are crucial and that the "Savedroid is a scam headlines" and "Savedroid has done the most dumb PR Stunt ever" have done significant damage?
  • And wouldn't you agree that the Investors and their Investment were used to promote something they have not bought - the "ICO-advisory-service" you plan to offer?
  • Yassir said in an interview with Gruenderszene that the PR-stunt would not have negative impact on the future price of the token, otherwise the team wouldn’t have done it. How could he/you/the team ever know that?
  • When you planned that PR-stunt…
    …didn’t you think about a potential scenario that an overwhelmed and shocked Investor could have done harm to himself out of desperation?
    …didn’t you think about the scenario that your bank, lawyer, german fintechs, german blockchain association, advisors etc of you would be forced into distancing themselves from Savedroid?
    …didn’t you think about the potential scenario that the connection of words Savedroid and Scam would not be the best brand to move on?
    …didn’t you think about the scenario that you’ll not be able to control the communication and establish your narrative afterwards?
  • Is it possible that there will be legal consequences for Savedroid?
  • In a german article is said that the Savedroid team was thrown out of an office in it’s early days because of „dubios and irresponsible behaviour“ and that you’ve tried to sell user-data. Is that true?
    https://kryptoszene.de/savedroid-status-update-alles-nur-ein-pr-stunt/






Edit: Since you mention the FUD-problem - let's not forget who started the biggest FUD-campaign I've ever seen, targeting the own Investors and credibility of the own project. Shouldn't be necessary to word this as a question...


  • What could have been stolen in that moment is all the money which is not covered by an escrow, which is at least still enough for a CEO to survive for a long time. Besides that the escrow only holds the money until all tokens are minted, so it's more our call when we've finished it.
  • No that would not be fair, because the product plan is still valid, the token economics didn't change at all.
  • No I would not agree to that
  • The investors have bought the tokens, as already mentioned the token economics and the product roadmap didn't change at all. Buying a token is NOT buying the full savedroid company.
  • That's our hypotheses, noone can of course predict the future.
  • No we didn't expect that somone harms himself as that also didn't happen in previous real scams. We've investigated these scams a lot and checked what happened there. Besides that I hope that never anyone will invest so much money, that it's worse harming himself, neither for a scam, nor when a token-price drops which is not unlikely in this high-risk market.
    Of course some people will distanciate from us, especially the ones which have a motivation that the current status quo stays intact and no questions about that are asked. We're surprised be the feedback of the FinTech-community, as this PR-stunt was not related at all to FinTech and only a critic at the crypto-scene.
    Of course we think about the brand, but don't think it'll have a long-term impact and the content at the end will survive.
    The communication was definitely not ideal and has to be improved, totally agree on that.
  • Not that I'm aware of
  • That's definitely not true and we're already in contact with our legal department about these false statements. savedroid has NEVER sold or tried to sell user-data!


tobson2
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April 26, 2018, 12:10:38 PM
 #2838

Let we know, when the distribution is finish and when will be adding at exchanges?
Please giving the exact date when the distribution for bounty.
Distribution is happening right now, you can see the progress at https://etherscan.io/address/0xcd09958f02ef83e82a528875dac91beddffe10b1.
Currently there's a lot of traffic on the Ether network, but I'm confident that we can finish all minting this week.

We're currently orchestrating all exchanges for a joined date, planned for beginning of May.

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April 26, 2018, 06:40:35 PM
 #2839

Let we know, when the distribution is finish and when will be adding at exchanges?
Please giving the exact date when the distribution for bounty.
Distribution is happening right now, you can see the progress at https://etherscan.io/address/0xcd09958f02ef83e82a528875dac91beddffe10b1.
Currently there's a lot of traffic on the Ether network, but I'm confident that we can finish all minting this week.

We're currently orchestrating all exchanges for a joined date, planned for beginning of May.

But what about the exact number of tokens which should be transferred for signature campaign participants? There still only stakes calculated in spreadsheet, without token amounts, or this is an old version of spreadsheet?

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1zQKALP1nqwaYAq2mLt59TDhm10-woRVeAiT5Xof6tZQ/edit#gid=1875234943

Thank you tobson2 for your answers above
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April 26, 2018, 07:04:09 PM
 #2840

They should complete distribution sooner as possible because this will ease the situation. We should expect redistribution of tokens which is imminent as many people will make their entry while some will just leave. After all this small shuffle will have healthy and positive effects. That is the reason I urge for quick distribution to end this all what's going on.
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