HashFast launches sales of the Baby Jet

[plasmoske]

And still you haven't answered most of the questions in this thread. Wat the f?

[sneef]

I was not intending to purchase, as the numbers and dates do not work for me.

But i must say, your continued avoiding of questions, to me, seems scammy.

That my 2 Satoshi on this offering.

[AussieHash]

If you really want to do it right you should provide customer protection by providing refunds based on missed opportunity cost.

For example:

• HashFast promises to ship on October 30.
• Customer paid ~60 BTC for a pre-oder unit.
• Customer registers a refund BTC address at the hashfast.com site.
• For every day HashFast misses their target shipping date, a partial automatic refund will be made based on what a 400 GH/s unit would have mined at the difficulty at that date.
• This would continue until either the refund is complete or the unit is delivered.

This would:

• Prevent a BFL-type pitchfork scenario and alleviate worries that HashFast might be hashing with customer hardware at customers expense.
• Give customers peace of mind; At worst they would have provided a free BTC loan to HashFast. At best they get a unit that has already started making some ROI before delivery.
• Provide a strong incentive for HashFast to deliver on time.

We are working on finalizing a guarantee program for purchasers that will provide some good coverage in case of late delivery, the text is being perfected now, and we will be publishing it in the next few days. It will be offered free to all existing purchasers.

From Hashfast's website - they hope to tape out in August - shortening a 12 week timeframe to 6 weeks
https://www.hashfast.com/uniquifystatemen/
https://hashfast.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/07/uniquify_statement_about-_HashFast_ASIC_Chip.jpg

From the KnC thread, some time line discussions about else needs to be done POST tape out.  Assuming the chips don't get stuck in customs for 2 months.

Yipyip, in other words, according to kncminer, by "tape-out" they mean to say that the chip is beyond theoretical design, and is now actually in the fabrication (or build it stage as you put it) plant where they make ASIC chips?

Anyone know how long it takes to fab 50 wafers?

Wafers are manufactured in lots (e.g. 25 wafer each). A Foundry normally gives you a committed cycle time for the concrete 28nm fab for a wafer lot. That time strongly depends on what priority your run got and which tech options you choose (e.g. how many metal layers). If they were lucky and got a so called "rocket" run it could be as fast as 30 to 45 days. Standard runs take between 60 to 90 days.

After that the wafers must be bumped (prepared for flip-chip packaging, probably at another facility), diced in dies and packaged in the flip-chip package. Don't know how long this takes exactly, but it could be easily "2 more weeks".

http://dot-bit.org/tools/nextDifficulty.php

[HashFast]

Does this mean it will cost extra for future purchasers?

No, we are selling all of our first batch of Baby Jet's for $5,600.

[tyrion70]

How come your first batch doesn't go to your biggest customer as of yet: DeadTerra with his IceDrill mining company? I'd expect that a 500TH Sales order would be moved to the top of the line?

[crumbs]

Hi!
We are currently renegotiating the deal with HashFast as it looks like we might not be hitting our goal (though there are still 12 hours left).
At the moment it looks like we will be able to move forward without the full amount, with some changes in the deal.
We will still uphold the commitments made to the investors, we will scale down on the mine but the shares will still be worth 10 mhash each at startup.
The exact details of the deal and what it means for the IPO will be posted in an announcement later.

The lark’s on the wing;
The snail’s on the thorn;
God’s in His heaven --
All’s right with the world! 

[SirWizz]

How come your first batch doesn't go to your biggest customer as of yet: DeadTerra with his IceDrill mining company? I'd expect that a 500TH Sales order would be moved to the top of the line?

He said first batch of baby jets, not first batch of chips. If you think they'll only make 550 chips in the first run... well let's just say that probably won't happen.

[tyrion70]

How come your first batch doesn't go to your biggest customer as of yet: DeadTerra with his IceDrill mining company? I'd expect that a 500TH Sales order would be moved to the top of the line?

He said first batch of baby jets, not first batch of chips. If you think they'll only make 550 chips in the first run... well let's just say that probably won't happen.

Yeah I read that.. but DeadTerra is saying the operation is starting in November.. That means he won't receive his miners untill then. Which I find weird considering that 500TH == 1250 BabyJets.. Since DeadTerra says he had contact with Hashfast for a while I would expect his order to be delivered first. Not a full month later.. Especially if with currect difficulties a full month means almost 60% drop of returns..

[DeaDTerra]

How come your first batch doesn't go to your biggest customer as of yet: DeadTerra with his IceDrill mining company? I'd expect that a 500TH Sales order would be moved to the top of the line?

He said first batch of baby jets, not first batch of chips. If you think they'll only make 550 chips in the first run... well let's just say that probably won't happen.

Yeah I read that.. but DeadTerra is saying the operation is starting in November.. That means he won't receive his miners untill then. Which I find weird considering that 500TH == 1250 BabyJets.. Since DeadTerra says he had contact with Hashfast for a while I would expect his order to be delivered first. Not a full month later.. Especially if with currect difficulties a full month means almost 60% drop of returns..

'
IceDrill.ASIC gets chips from the first batch, the same one that will be used to produce babyjets.
We will not be receiving babyjets, we will have the chips set into racks to fit into our datacenter.
The reason why we state Novemeber is because we are unsure on how long time it will take for the chips to reach us and how long it will take for us to assemble them. Hence we prefer a conservative date.
//DeaDTerra

[tyrion70]

I assume IceDrill and HashFast made an agreement not to sell under $5600/400GH then seeing that 50M shares times 0.0014 / 1250 equals exactly 5600?

[Loredo]

I assume IceDrill and HashFast made an agreement not to sell under $5600/400GH then seeing that 50M shares times 0.0014 / 1250 equals exactly 5600?

That, Sir, is a very good catch! 

I was suspecting that IceDrill was probably not getting much of a discount to list price, since they are keeping 40% of the hash for themselves. 

I wondered, though, just how greedy they might be.  Now we have a plausible answer to that.

[tyrion70]

I assume IceDrill and HashFast made an agreement not to sell under $5600/400GH then seeing that 50M shares times 0.0014 / 1250 equals exactly 5600?

That, Sir, is a very good catch! 

I was suspecting that IceDrill was probably not getting much of a discount to list price, since they are keeping 40% of the hash for themselves. 

I wondered, though, just how greedy they might be.  Now we have a plausible answer to that.

I wasn't implying anything there.. I just did the math and I don't believe in coincidences.. It does make sense from both HashFast and IceDrill perspective though to make such agreement.. You don't want your customers ending up selling your hardware below your price and the other way around.

I assume IceDrill and HashFast made an agreement not to sell under $5600/400GH then seeing that 50M shares times 0.0014 / 1250 equals exactly 5600?

The first batch is a initial sale of 14,500,000 (14.5 million) shares, which will be sold on BitFunder for 0.0014 BTC per share.
The second batch of 3,500,000 (3.5 million) shares and will be sold at 0.0015 BTC per share.
The third batch is of 12,000,000 (12 million) shares and will be sold at the price of 0.0016 BTC per share.

Let's assume the extra 20,000,000 shares are considered at IPO price (0.0014 BTC)

34,500,000 * 0.0014 = 48300 BTC
3,500,000 * 0.0015 = 5250 BTC
12,000,000 * 0.0016 = 19200 BTC
Total BTC = 72750 BTC

Yeah I know about the 1 cent extra on batches 2 and 3.. but the math ends up exactly using the 0.0014 btc.. Was there another intention of your calculation here?

Just trying to figure out here if i should:
a) invest in either IceDrill or Hashfast miners myself
b) start groupbuys for HashFast miners

[MadHasher]

Come on people, either these guys have a very bad PR or this is a scam. If you think anyone not IBM, Intel or another big player can deliver one chip that can use up to 300W in power, you're delusional. And even them would never do such thing if not for experimental purposes (if even viable for that).

[Ytterbium]

Come on people, either these guys have a very bad PR or this is a scam. If you think anyone not IBM, Intel or another big player can deliver one chip that can use up to 300W in power, you're delusional. And even them would never do such thing if not for experimental purposes (if even viable for that).

I don't know why they would go for ONE GIANT CHIP rather then breaking it up into smaller ones to dissipate heat better, there wouldn't be any loss in performance.

[jspielberg]

Yes.. I don't understand this either, except to maybe cut down on the supporting electronics.  KnC has taken this same approach. 

The single point of failure is a little disappointing (compared to bitfury designs), but I have a feeling this is going to be the way 3rd gen hash asics are all going to be, due to component and integration efficiency.  I am not an EE, so I am making an educated guess.

[cypherdoc]

when they talk about this the emphasis is on orders of magnitude increased efficiency.

[minternj]

Still no answer on how we mine on the baby jet. usb, wireless, wired, etc? Also what is the warranty?

[crumbs]

Is it too early for us youngins to learn where Baby Jets come from?  Is it a bit ... eww?

[jspielberg]

Still no answer on how we mine on the baby jet. usb, wireless, wired, etc? Also what is the warranty?

I guess I am not that concerned right now about whether it is USB or standalone-ethernet.  My preference is standalone and it seems like the competition (except for BFL) have all raised the bar to have this feature for their miners. 

That being said, the difference between standalone and not is a $40 raspberry pi, and there is plenty of great open source software to use on it... (so it would be a little silly to not include it).

[Simon Barber]

The Baby Jet will support standalone mining via an Ethernet connection, and upgrade to WiFi via a USB WiFi card.