Alpha Technology Litecoin (Scrypt) ASIC Miner Order Batch 1 Now!

[vesperwillow]

What this all means is that their Titan project is at risk of being temporarily stopped or postponed while they try to settle grievances with sour customers and lawsuits.  Look at Hashfast and how quick they went down the tubes.  It was only 30-60 days for them to file for bankruptcy.  KNCminer is in a worse position than Hashfast.  They are doing the same thing.  Trying to compensate delays with increased hashrates, but what is worse is that KNCminer shipped used and defective equipment as brand new.  That puts them in a whole heap of trouble.

KNC was using their datacenter from December-onward. They amassed a mega pile of BTC, they did this for several reasons. One, was to provide refunds to customers on their 2014 projects, because they knew folks would demand refunds. This allows them to essentially return money to the consumer, without actually losing any money from their liquid assets. They also used the BTC to float other ventures, not on the books. And few know the full extent of their projects.

Regardless of any legal action pending against them, they are a step above the normal wealthy folk. They'll do well for themselves for the remainder of their life, because they know how to shift funds and operate a smart business.

Even if I'm wrong about their tapeout process--which is fine, nothing bad about being wrong--they're still well within their time frame of Q3 delivery, which is what I've stood by. Whether shipped in June or August.. or even December, the multiple petahashes are coming.

Re-focus back on AT, it's almost the close of the business day for them and there's still no response back to issues. And you know they're keeping an eye on this thread.

[Its About Sharing]

What this all means is that their Titan project is at risk of being temporarily stopped or postponed while they try to settle grievances with sour customers and lawsuits.  Look at Hashfast and how quick they went down the tubes.  It was only 30-60 days for them to file for bankruptcy.  KNCminer is in a worse position than Hashfast.  They are doing the same thing.  Trying to compensate delays with increased hashrates, but what is worse is that KNCminer shipped used and defective equipment as brand new.  That puts them in a whole heap of trouble.

KNC was using their datacenter from December-onward. They amassed a mega pile of BTC, they did this for several reasons. One, was to provide refunds to customers on their 2014 projects, because they knew folks would demand refunds. This allows them to essentially return money to the consumer, without actually losing any money from their liquid assets. They also used the BTC to float other ventures, not on the books. And few know the full extent of their projects.

Regardless of any legal action pending against them, they are a step above the normal wealthy folk. They'll do well for themselves for the remainder of their life, because they know how to shift funds and operate a smart business.

Even if I'm wrong about their tapeout process--which is fine, nothing bad about being wrong--they're still well within their time frame of Q3 delivery, which is what I've stood by. Whether shipped in June or August.. or even December, the multiple petahashes are coming.

Re-focus back on AT, it's almost the close of the business day for them and there's still no response back to issues. And you know they're keeping an eye on this thread.

You bring up a point that I'm sure many are starting to see.
If you want to buy lots of coins but don't want to move the market, you have few choices:
You can buy them offline in dark pools. But word is that is getting harder.
You can make an arrangement with Bitpay or the like (I would think) and buy their coins as they come in.
Spend a crap load on miners and just mine them...

[anderl]

What this all means is that their Titan project is at risk of being temporarily stopped or postponed

What are the odds? 50% )?

About zero. KNC have a lot of money and BTC from their mining. So refunds won't kill them like it did Hashfast and is doing to Cointerra.

I can't see a lot of traction in legal action if they remedy the mistakes they made.

They've just got their neptune wafers (http://forum.kncminer.com/forum/resellers-affilicates/general-questions/44990-the-neptune-wafers-have-left-the-building) So there is a light at the end of the tunnel for their Bitcoin customers

If KNC got their Neptune wafers and July is rolling around they will be targeting Neputes to be delivered the beginning of July.  That means they will be in assembly and shipping of Neptunes all of July.  What makes you think they will be able to assemble and ship Neptunes AND accept delivery on Titan wafers, do testing assembly and ship them at the same time.  With the major screw up on Jupiters I don't think the can float that much money and labor around if Neptunes are as screwed up as the Jupiters.  So they will probably ship Titans last day of August to get it in by Q3.  So far their track record is to be late by one month.

And lawsuits and bankruptcy are still on the table.  All that BTC from mining has gone into Neptune and Titan R&D.  With that BTC being stagnant for the better part of the first half of the year they are probably running a little thin.

[anderl]

What this all means is that their Titan project is at risk of being temporarily stopped or postponed while they try to settle grievances with sour customers and lawsuits.  Look at Hashfast and how quick they went down the tubes.  It was only 30-60 days for them to file for bankruptcy.  KNCminer is in a worse position than Hashfast.  They are doing the same thing.  Trying to compensate delays with increased hashrates, but what is worse is that KNCminer shipped used and defective equipment as brand new.  That puts them in a whole heap of trouble.

KNC was using their datacenter from December-onward. They amassed a mega pile of BTC, they did this for several reasons. One, was to provide refunds to customers on their 2014 projects, because they knew folks would demand refunds. This allows them to essentially return money to the consumer, without actually losing any money from their liquid assets. They also used the BTC to float other ventures, not on the books. And few know the full extent of their projects.

Regardless of any legal action pending against them, they are a step above the normal wealthy folk. They'll do well for themselves for the remainder of their life, because they know how to shift funds and operate a smart business.

Even if I'm wrong about their tapeout process--which is fine, nothing bad about being wrong--they're still well within their time frame of Q3 delivery, which is what I've stood by. Whether shipped in June or August.. or even December, the multiple petahashes are coming.

Re-focus back on AT, it's almost the close of the business day for them and there's still no response back to issues. And you know they're keeping an eye on this thread.

Ah so you are saying that KNCminer knew that their Jupiter miners were defective but still shipped them out knowing that they will have to give refunds.  Can you give me a source?  Can I quote you on that?

[s1gs3gv]

the normal wealthy folk

 ^^^ best oxymoron of the day

[vesperwillow]

If KNC got their Neptune wafers and July is rolling around they will be targeting Neputes to be delivered the beginning of July.  That means they will be in assembly and shipping of Neptunes all of July.  What makes you think they will be able to assemble and ship Neptunes AND accept delivery on Titan wafers, do testing assembly and ship them at the same time.  With the major screw up on Jupiters I don't think the can float that much money and labor around if Neptunes are as screwed up as the Jupiters.  So they will probably ship Titans last day of August to get it in by Q3.  So far their track record is to be late by one month.

And lawsuits and bankruptcy are still on the table.  All that BTC from mining has gone into Neptune and Titan R&D.  With that BTC being stagnant for the better part of the first half of the year they are probably running a little thin.

You realize they have more than one assembly line right, and most of their stuff is plug and play. It's not BFL. Their first 2 batches they were able to handle thousands within a couple of weeks.

The screwups on Jupes, I presume you're talking about the batches they recently shipped out, and not the original 2 batches. The recent orders were a fluke done with a lax attitude. Why? Because they didn't care, it was used equipment, and they knew the people would be forced to deal with it. There'd be a few which needed fixing, but it was easier for them to handle a few fixers after the fact than focus too much on packing and making them all nice and new beforehand.

Lawsuits, if any, will sit on the table for awhile. They aren't thin on money. They have plenty of cash and troves of liquid assets. I'm not sure you realize just how much BTC they earned. Consider that they were 30-40% of the global bitcoin hashrate from December onward. 144 blocks per day, let's say 25% went to KNC, that's 36 BTC. Consider their hashrate continued to grow along with global hashrate, and they maintained 25% global hashrate (which we know they maintained more), and it's been 6 months, that's 36 * 182 = 6,552btc. They've provided about a hundred refunds (ballparking this one), let's say 20btc per refund, that's 2,000btc. Leaving them well over 4,000btc. Not to mention the millions in cash they had prior, and the millions in BTC and other currencies.

This is after the cost to setup their hashing centers, and the fact that their customers funded EVERYTHING. Their gross profit on miners was over 90%. There's a reason Sam has that curious smile in all the photos, and it's because the world has tickled him pink. Smart man.

Edit: In other words, if you don't get what I'm saying, customers paid for everything. They were positive ROI in their pockets from day 1, and ever since have made nothing but pretty much pure profit on all fronts.

Ah so you are saying that KNCminer knew that their Jupiter miners were defective but still shipped them out knowing that they will have to give refunds.  Can you give me a source?  Can I quote you on that?

Source? Can you quote me? Dude, go check out the almost 2,000 page KNC thread which I've been a part of since day 1. That, and more, is there. Yes, they shipped used gear. Yes, they admitted not all of it was new. Yes, they admitted that something "went wrong" and for the folks who cried foul, they fixed the machines. Didn't pay for shipping, but fixed the machines. At least some of them.

Why do you think a lot of the former KNC fanbois are pretty hot right now? I also knew the Neptunes would NOT ship before June, and when the orderbooks opened, I put my word on that. People swore up and down to Valhalla and back that they would ship before April, or May at the latest. Called me all sorts of names in the book. I told them at best, Neptunes would ship end of June, but more likely August. It's in the thread, unedited.

Here we are, 6 months later, and my projection is nearly perfect.

And, again to AlphaTec and its customers I have to say, it doesn't look good that Vipers will ship on time *and* on spec. They've already "changed" the design by removing features, and still haven't answered my 5 day old question about CE certification yet, or addressed my suggestions on how to handle the situation. I'm sure they have a great reason .... but as I've shared with the community, I highly encourage NOBODY to remit full payment until, in writing, you guys have a good sensible solution from AT.

It's starting to smell like HashFast all over again.

[anderl]

It's starting to smell like HashFast all over again.

Yeah I feel sorry for all those KNCminer buyers.  Hashfast was denying bankruptcy all the way to a week before filing.  I think KNCminer still have about 30 days.  They gotta crank those Neptunes out so they doing go completely underwater.  Mine on them for about 30 days to recoup some of their losses and then send them used to the customers.

[retro72]

It's starting to smell like HashFast all over again.

Yeah I feel sorry for all those KNCminer buyers.  Hashfast was denying bankruptcy all the way to a week before filing.  I think KNCminer still have about 30 days.  They gotta crank those Neptunes out so they doing go completely underwater.  Mine on them for about 30 days to recoup some of their losses and then send them used to the customers.

Dude has your account been hacked? You were posting some intelligent stuff here a few days ago. Now you're trying to tell the good folks here KNC has 30 days before they go bankrupt? C'mon man you can do better than that.

KNC have MILLIONS in BTC and USD. They could settle a lawsuit at any time. On 2nd of May Forum member Merv77 found 2 BTC wallets linked to them with over 43000 btc, about $25 million usd. I've heard estimates they are making $15 million a month from mining alone.

They have plenty of capital for R&D, refunds AND the co development of Titan and Neptune. Comparing KNC to Hashfast is just a joke. Hashfast's CEO said in May they were "As poor as a church mouse". KNC on the other hand are as rich as Croesus.

This is just FUD pure and simple.

[vesperwillow]

It's starting to smell like HashFast all over again.

Yeah I feel sorry for all those KNCminer buyers.  Hashfast was denying bankruptcy all the way to a week before filing.  I think KNCminer still have about 30 days.  They gotta crank those Neptunes out so they doing go completely underwater.  Mine on them for about 30 days to recoup some of their losses and then send them used to the customers.

Uh dude, I was talking about AlphaTec, not KNC. AT is starting to smell like HF. Refer to retro's post below about BTC wallets, KNC is L O A D E D.

It's starting to smell like HashFast all over again.

Yeah I feel sorry for all those KNCminer buyers.  Hashfast was denying bankruptcy all the way to a week before filing.  I think KNCminer still have about 30 days.  They gotta crank those Neptunes out so they doing go completely underwater.  Mine on them for about 30 days to recoup some of their losses and then send them used to the customers.

Dude has your account been hacked? You were posting some intelligent stuff here a few days ago. Now you're trying to tell the good folks here KNC has 30 days before they go bankrupt? C'mon man you can do better than that.

KNC have MILLIONS in BTC and USD. They could settle a lawsuit at any time. On 2nd of May Forum member Merv77 found 2 BTC wallets linked to them with over 43000 btc, about $25 million usd. I've heard estimates they are making $15 million a month from mining alone.

They have plenty of capital for R&D, refunds AND the co development of Titan and Neptune. Comparing KNC to Hashfast is just a joke. Hashfast's CEO said in May they were "As poor as a church mouse". KNC on the other hand are as rich as Croesus.

This is just FUD pure and simple.

Absolutely agree with this post.

[greentea]

alpha needs to respond to their customers:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=637202.0

[Its About Sharing]

alpha needs to respond to their customers:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=637202.0

I would agree they totally need to respond to customers, but that post is the guys first post.
Isn't that a bit strange, never even joined here before and suddenly this?
No screenshot of his order or email, nothing?

I'm on the customers side, but can't just accept the odd badmouth of a company.

[retro72]

alpha needs to respond to their customers:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=637202.0

I would agree they totally need to respond to customers, but that post is the guys first post.
Isn't that a bit strange, never even joined here before and suddenly this?
No screenshot of his order or email, nothing?

I'm on the customers side, but can't just accept the odd badmouth of a company.

There have been plenty of first post newbies lighting up this thread in favor of Alpha, so I wouldn't write this guy off just yet. Alpha have so far been pretty good when it comes to refunds so maybe he's just unlucky. He's been given another contact email for Alpha so I'd wait a few days before calling this one in.

[s1gs3gv]

It's starting to smell like HashFast all over again.

Yeah I feel sorry for all those KNCminer buyers.  Hashfast was denying bankruptcy all the way to a week before filing.  I think KNCminer still have about 30 days.  They gotta crank those Neptunes out so they doing go completely underwater.  Mine on them for about 30 days to recoup some of their losses and then send them used to the customers.

Uh dude, I was talking about AlphaTec, not KNC. AT is starting to smell like HF. Refer to retro's post below about BTC wallets, KNC is L O A D E D.

It's starting to smell like HashFast all over again.

Yeah I feel sorry for all those KNCminer buyers.  Hashfast was denying bankruptcy all the way to a week before filing.  I think KNCminer still have about 30 days.  They gotta crank those Neptunes out so they doing go completely underwater.  Mine on them for about 30 days to recoup some of their losses and then send them used to the customers.

Dude has your account been hacked? You were posting some intelligent stuff here a few days ago. Now you're trying to tell the good folks here KNC has 30 days before they go bankrupt? C'mon man you can do better than that.

KNC have MILLIONS in BTC and USD. They could settle a lawsuit at any time. On 2nd of May Forum member Merv77 found 2 BTC wallets linked to them with over 43000 btc, about $25 million usd. I've heard estimates they are making $15 million a month from mining alone.

They have plenty of capital for R&D, refunds AND the co development of Titan and Neptune. Comparing KNC to Hashfast is just a joke. Hashfast's CEO said in May they were "As poor as a church mouse". KNC on the other hand are as rich as Croesus.

This is just FUD pure and simple.

Absolutely agree with this post.

+1

[ninjaboon]

I still have not paid my 2/3 balance for the 250Mhs unit.
Do you think I can get a "full" refund at this moment?

[maardein]

I still have not paid my 2/3 balance for the 250Mhs unit.
Do you think I can get a "full" refund at this moment?

It will be tough to get what they owe you. I sent them an email regarding the fact that by law they should give consumers a full refund, this was their reply:

Hello there,

You are not classed as a consumer to us. Our devices are sold and are classed for business use, cryptocurrency mining earnings in the UK is classed as income and is taxable, our units are used purely for mining, therefore every customer is classed as a business-user. It is your duty to register as a business and class your mining earnings from our devices to the relevant governing bodies. As we are selling for business use only therefore our terms of conditions are what you have to comply by as you accepted before you ordered. It is irrelevant if your order is replaced or not.

Regards

Alpha Technology Team

They never told me only businesses should buy their devices. They also never asked for any company information. So I think this is complete rubbish, but the question is will you lawyer up for it?

[vesperwillow]

It will be tough to get what they owe you. I sent them an email regarding the fact that by law they should give consumers a full refund, this was their reply:

Hello there,

You are not classed as a consumer to us. Our devices are sold and are classed for business use, cryptocurrency mining earnings in the UK is classed as income and is taxable, our units are used purely for mining, therefore every customer is classed as a business-user. It is your duty to register as a business and class your mining earnings from our devices to the relevant governing bodies. As we are selling for business use only therefore our terms of conditions are what you have to comply by as you accepted before you ordered. It is irrelevant if your order is replaced or not.

Regards

Alpha Technology Team

They never told me only businesses should buy their devices. They also never asked for any company information. So I think this is complete rubbish, but the question is will you lawyer up for it?

Having kept an eye on their stuff from day 1, they never stated their equipment was for business use only. They may have since changed their terms, but they made it very clear they were going after the consumer market. They even said so. If they were going after businesses, why would they be here? Why would they be targeting only consumers?

Looks like the lies and coverup are becoming overt. The picture is becoming more and more clear folks:

* Lack of customer support/PR presence (almost a week now)
* Terms of sale have changed
* Product features are being removed after paying for the devices
* Questionable timeline, with inquiries being dodged
* No working chip, and no likelihood of having one before July
* First batch of chips will be of varying quality, with no chance to re-run on a bad batch
* Specs changing wildly with no hardware to support their theories
* Haven't addressed the PSU / CE issues, which are significant issues
* Terms of refund changing
* Refund emails being ignored

Welcome to HashFast 2.0; Best of luck to you guys.

[neter]

Having kept an eye on their stuff from day 1, they never stated their equipment was for business use only. They may have since changed their terms, but they made it very clear they were going after the consumer market. They even said so. If they were going after businesses, why would they be here? Why would they be targeting only consumers?

Looks like the lies and coverup are becoming overt. The picture is becoming more and more clear folks:

* Lack of customer support/PR presence (almost a week now)
* Terms of sale have changed
* Product features are being removed after paying for the devices
* Questionable timeline, with inquiries being dodged
* No working chip, and no likelihood of having one before July
* First batch of chips will be of varying quality, with no chance to re-run on a bad batch
* Specs changing wildly with no hardware to support their theories
* Haven't addressed the PSU / CE issues, which are significant issues
* Terms of refund changing
* Refund emails being ignored

Welcome to HashFast 2.0; Best of luck to you guys.

Very good points. My remaining amount is on "on-hold" status so I can't continue and pay the amount. I sent 10-20 mails about this, tweeted it no replies. Malik in the forums threat as if they are someone else and that I should resolve this "on-hold" issue with them.

I don't want to jinx it but seems like something's happening. I still don't believe that we've been scamed as it's foolish to not to take the remaining amount.

Btw, are there anyone else in same situation? The due date is very near...

[retro72]

I still have not paid my 2/3 balance for the 250Mhs unit.
Do you think I can get a "full" refund at this moment?

When I have the energy I'll post the long running saga I've had detailing the illegality of Alpha's refund position regarding consumers and my conversation with the UK Citizens Advice Bureau.

In the meantime, if you are not a business, I suggest you contact Alpha and explain to them you did not know they only sold to businesses as it is not in their terms and conditions. That you are an individual consumer therefore  your order should be voided.

This obviously puts them in a bear trap. If they refuse to void and refund your order they are knowingly selling to consumers therefore are liable to UK consumer law. If they void it you get a full refund. Either way a win/win.

Try this out and please post Alpha's response.

[Meanotor]

what are accountants good at?

manufacturing asics: nope.

collecting money from people and filing for bankruptcy: yes.

[coin@coin]

I still have not paid my 2/3 balance for the 250Mhs unit.
Do you think I can get a "full" refund at this moment?

I got a refund from Alpha-T for my order (paid in January) on PayPal the other day, half the deposit - £70 handling fee.
I rather that than wasting another £5000 on a miner that may or may not get you much money.
If I would invest that £5000 in BTC today I will most definitely make a much better return than going ahead with my order.