NXT :: descendant of Bitcoin - Updated Information

[bitcoinpaul]

@ CfB

Can we reduce only 1 type of transaction fee (i.e Message Fee) or do we have to reduce all the transaction fee?

Interesting idea. We still would have a nice fee for transactions (so the forgers get something for forging). But what would be the consequences for the network, if we would overload it with thousands of messages per minute?

[landomata]

Illegal content.....that is a problem whether the fee is 1nxt or 10 nxt

If it's a problem, and there is no solution, sooner rather than later this will be used by competition to shut down NXT network. Alias and AM features should be disabled until solution is found.

we have discussed this issue on previous occasions...and i'm sure it will be solved but it's the same problem the internet has....i'm not smart enough to suggest any solutions for this one.

[notsoshifty]

Illegal content.....that is a problem whether the fee is 1nxt or 10 nxt

True, but the magnitude of the problem may differ. We shouldn't just ignore it and hope it goes away.

[landomata]

@ CfB

Can we reduce only 1 type of transaction fee (i.e Message Fee) or do we have to reduce all the transaction fee?

Interesting idea. What would be the consequences for the network, if we would overload it with thousands of messages per minute?

there is currently a limit  4 msg per second.


360,000 per 24 hours.


But that will be expanded to a few million within couple months

[devphp]

Illegal content.....that is a problem whether the fee is 1nxt or 10 nxt

True, but the magnitude of the problem may differ. We shouldn't just ignore it and hope it goes away.

That's what I am talking about. If there is no solution, all these apps and promotions is a waste of time.

[utopianfuture]

Not to anyone in particular. Could people refrain from posing such blah blah blah ? or are we destined to evolve into a such WOW community ? Please more real works and real thoughts to push NXT ahead instead. Competition would be fierce in this industry and we can't better such player as Ethereum https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=412878.msg4524703#msg4524703 if we are not trying our best.

peace,

Up

I read only every 2nd post. U could do the same.

NXT-ers are like guerrilla compared to organized army such as Ethereum, Mastercoin.

[landomata]

Illegal content.....that is a problem whether the fee is 1nxt or 10 nxt

True, but the magnitude of the problem may differ. We shouldn't just ignore it and hope it goes away.

That's what I am talking about. If there is no solution, all these apps and promotions is a waste of time.

should we shut down the internet too

[utopianfuture]

@ CfB

Can we reduce only 1 type of transaction fee (i.e Message Fee) or do we have to reduce all the transaction fee?

Interesting idea. We still would have a nice fee for transactions (so the forgers get something for forging). But what would be the consequences for the network, if we would overload it with thousands of messages per minute?

We don't need lower fee now. We need a stable network,  a full client and colored coin first.

Let's take one step at the time. We can't even transfer aliases yet for God's sake.

[Come-from-Beyond]

Interesting idea. We still would have a nice fee for transactions (so the forgers get something for forging). But what would be the consequences for the network, if we would overload it with thousands of messages per minute?

Forgers will pick transactions with higher fee in the 1st place anyway.

[bitcoinpaul]

there is currently a limit  4 msg per second.

What happens if the message-fee is so low that some people flood thousand of messages for fun into the blockchain? Is this doable?

[BitcoinForumator]

@ CfB

Can we reduce only 1 type of transaction fee (i.e Message Fee) or do we have to reduce all the transaction fee?

Interesting idea. We still would have a nice fee for transactions (so the forgers get something for forging). But what would be the consequences for the network, if we would overload it with thousands of messages per minute?

We don't need lower fee now. We need a stable network,  a full client and colored coin first.

Let's take one step at the time. We can't even transfer aliases yet for God's sake.

Exactly. When is the ETA for all of this? Or a particular block when some function will be implemented?

[wesleyh]

there is currently a limit  4 msg per second.

What happens if the message-fee is so low that some people flood thousand of messages for fun into the blockchain? Is this doable?

Of course, it's easy.

[utopianfuture]

Illegal content.....that is a problem whether the fee is 1nxt or 10 nxt

True, but the magnitude of the problem may differ. We shouldn't just ignore it and hope it goes away.

That's what I am talking about. If there is no solution, all these apps and promotions is a waste of time.

should we shut down the internet too

With current blockchain and network capacity then yes spamming is a huge issue. But I doubt lowering fee will cause it unless someone plan to attack the network. I send my messages free via whatsapp, skype, yahoo mess, snap chat and a bunch of other apps. You can't compete by lowering the price with NXT messenger. It has to be a special type of message in the blockchain.

When the novelty wears off, no one is going to pay a dime to send a conversational message via NXT.

[notsoshifty]

we have discussed this issue on previous on occasions...and i'm sure it will be solved but it's the same problem the internet has....i'm not smart enough to suggest any solutions for this one.

It's a different problem. With the general Internet, when illegal content springs up it can generally be dealt with (speed & mechanisms dependent on the type of content), and the rest of the Internet chugs along just fine. Systems that try to combat that (tor etc) do so with sophisticated techniques, and it's a cat & mouse game against the authorities.

Fact is, we are hosting a blockchain that allows arbitrary data to be stored in it, with no mechanism to remove it, and hoping that people won't take advantage of that in a way that harms us. Is that wise?

[notsoshifty]

That's what I am talking about. If there is no solution, all these apps and promotions is a waste of time.

should we shut down the internet too

It's not black&white like that.

The Internet is not all-or-nothing. The nxt blockchain is. If you don't like what's on it (or, if you live in EU/UK/USA, your government or police force doesn't like what's on it), your choice is to host it or not host it; there is no middle ground.

[landomata]

we have discussed this issue on previous on occasions...and i'm sure it will be solved but it's the same problem the internet has....i'm not smart enough to suggest any solutions for this one.

It's a different problem. With the general Internet, when illegal content springs up it can generally be dealt with (speed & mechanisms dependent on the type of content), and the rest of the Internet chugs along just fine. Systems that try to combat that (tor etc) do so with sophisticated techniques, and it's a cat & mouse game against the authorities.

Fact is, we are hosting a blockchain that allows arbitrary data to be stored in it, with no mechanism to remove it, and hoping that people won't take advantage of that in a way that harms us. Is that wise?

so what do you suggest we do to fix this problem.

[landomata]

With current blockchain and network capacity then yes spamming is a huge issue. But I doubt lowering fee will cause it unless someone plan to attack the network. I send my messages free via whatsapp, skype, yahoo mess, snap chat and a bunch of other apps. You can't compete by lowering the price with NXT messenger. It has to be a special type of message in the blockchain.

When the novelty wears off, no one is going to pay a dime to send a conversational message via NXT.

Secure communications seems like a good selling point....as non of the above APP's do that.

NOTE: This is an already released feature the genie is out of the bottle.....i;m just arguing to lower the msg fee....thats all.

EDIT: That would be foolish to suggest Nxt could compete with whatsapp....but there are a lot of people in this world who would use Nxt for secure communications.

[utopianfuture]

we have discussed this issue on previous on occasions...and i'm sure it will be solved but it's the same problem the internet has....i'm not smart enough to suggest any solutions for this one.

It's a different problem. With the general Internet, when illegal content springs up it can generally be dealt with (speed & mechanisms dependent on the type of content), and the rest of the Internet chugs along just fine. Systems that try to combat that (tor etc) do so with sophisticated techniques, and it's a cat & mouse game against the authorities.

Fact is, we are hosting a blockchain that allows arbitrary data to be stored in it, with no mechanism to remove it, and hoping that people won't take advantage of that in a way that harms us. Is that wise?

+1 Don't overestimate the load our blockchain can take as we may end up with 10G data file pretty soon. One reason Bitcoin devs don't want to implement any other features     because Bitcoin already reaches the 10G blockchain and almost maximum bandwith by doing only transaction processing. So now they decided to be a payment specialist only.

When we have asset exchange, plus messenger, voting etc and pyamnet system. We may do 10X the load Bitcoin is taking right now. Need to think ahead.

[notsoshifty]

we have discussed this issue on previous on occasions...and i'm sure it will be solved but it's the same problem the internet has....i'm not smart enough to suggest any solutions for this one.

It's a different problem. With the general Internet, when illegal content springs up it can generally be dealt with (speed & mechanisms dependent on the type of content), and the rest of the Internet chugs along just fine. Systems that try to combat that (tor etc) do so with sophisticated techniques, and it's a cat & mouse game against the authorities.

Fact is, we are hosting a blockchain that allows arbitrary data to be stored in it, with no mechanism to remove it, and hoping that people won't take advantage of that in a way that harms us. Is that wise?

so what do you suggest we do to fix this problem.

I also am not smart enough. I hope the community is.

What I don't want is for us to stick our collective heads in the sand, when we may have an opportunity now to do something before it bites us.

I'd like to clarify that my comments here are not meant to be pro- or anti-censorship, and I mean no moral judgement in any of this. I have a modest investment in nxt, and I don't want that investment to go down the toilet.

[chanc3r]

Illegal content.....that is a problem whether the fee is 1nxt or 10 nxt

True, but the magnitude of the problem may differ. We shouldn't just ignore it and hope it goes away.

That's what I am talking about. If there is no solution, all these apps and promotions is a waste of time.

should we shut down the internet too

With current blockchain and network capacity then yes spamming is a huge issue. But I doubt lowering fee will cause it unless someone plan to attack the network. I send my messages free via whatsapp, skype, yahoo mess, snap chat and a bunch of other apps. You can't compete by lowering the price with NXT messenger. It has to be a special type of message in the blockchain.

When the novelty wears off, no one is going to pay a dime to send a conversational message via NXT.

But people will pay to send a secure message via NXT so why aim it at mass conversational messaging, if NXT messages are confidential and secure then this is a differentiator that means you can charge more and the volume will be lower.