mtgox.com has blocked my account with 45 000 USD in it!

[bitcool]

very interesting. that amount of money can create some havoc in this relative small market....

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[barwench]

if it really is 45000 USD involved, surely this is worth getting the police involved rather than complaining about on a forum? surely without a police report for allegedly stolen 45000 its hard to take you seriously.

[btcsucker]

if it really is 45000 USD involved, surely this is worth getting the police involved rather than complaining about on a forum? surely without a police report for allegedly stolen 45000 its hard to take you seriously.

because the only proof is on scammer's database? not like bitcoin transfers are registered with taxman. also he stole only 4000 btc from me. many other had accounts there. even if money is recovered i can not prove it was mine without his database or wallet.db. so i already write off the money, but if this is nerd (and i suspect), i am glad he does not get to enjoy it. hope mtgox give it to EFF or torservers instead.

i wait for mtgox to explain, but i don't think many outside the forum have 45000btc. he also says already himself mtgox questions source of money.

[S3052]

for sure, if someone sold 45,000 bitcoins in one go, this would be bearish for bitcoins

[Baron]

to bitcool and S3052:
  What do you mean the small market?

Look at blockexplorer.com :
Latest bitcoin blocks (transactions):
Number Hash          Date                Tx Total BTC   size KB
109770 d9a7a5475e... 2011-02-22 21:03:33 13 9913.18    3.149
109769 13b3a4ca43... 2011-02-22 20:58:21 12 4068.25    3.135
109768 196de8f606... 2011-02-22 20:51:51 12 3901.41    2.984
109767 12151881b8... 2011-02-22 20:47:32 12 4086.66    16.387
109766 8652f1d088... 2011-02-22 20:10:11 4 728.75      0.992
109765 5ff15f11b6... 2011-02-22 20:06:18 7 1056.12      1.776

Now look at bitcoinwatch.com:
Bitcoin economy total: 5.49 million BTC or 4802668 USD   
5 million USD is small market for you?


Now you telling that I am bad guy because I wanted trade with more than 40 000 USD, you must be joking.

to barwench: I am not complaining and not saying that mtgox.com steal from me that money, I just reported what situation I have, for this purpose was made this forum.

to btcsucker: As I said I am not "nerd" , so please do not post offtopic posts. Don't be paranoid. You can track where your bitcoin go through the block chain(I don't know how).

mtgox.com was logged into forum today.  I see from his forum account:     Last Active:    Today at 06:29 pm   
badly he don't write here any reply.

[davout]

mtgox.com was logged into forum today.  I see from his forum account:     Last Active:    Today at 06:29 pm   
badly he don't write here any reply.

interesting

[bitcool]

to bitcool and S3052:
  What do you mean the small market?

Market is where buy/sell transactions happen between two individuals, blockexplorer only shows transaction among different btc addresses. I can easily generates tens of thousands btc transactions with my limited stash. it's not indicative at all.

Check the daily trading volume on mtgox and all other btc  exchanges, and compare that to  any known publicly traded company (MSFT/GOOG/WMT/XOM/etc) and tell me what percentage it is, 0.1%, 0.01%, 0.001%, 0.0001%? Even many OTC stocks have higher volume.

[jgarzik]

Now look at bitcoinwatch.com:
Bitcoin economy total: 5.49 million BTC or 4802668 USD   
5 million USD is small market for you?

That is the total number of bitcoins in circulation.  The more relevant statistic is the amount of bitcoins and USD on deposit at each exchange, which is a substantially smaller number than 5.49M BTC.

[TheHoboHarvester]

Now look at bitcoinwatch.com:
Bitcoin economy total: 5.49 million BTC or 4802668 USD   
5 million USD is small market for you?

That is the total number of bitcoins in circulation.  The more relevant statistic is the amount of bitcoins and USD on deposit at each exchange, which is a substantially smaller number than 5.49M BTC.

exactly. Volume of BTC traded for USD <<< Volume of BTC passed around between wallets

[barwench]

if it really is 45000 USD involved, surely this is worth getting the police involved rather than complaining about on a forum? surely without a police report for allegedly stolen 45000 its hard to take you seriously.

because the only proof is on scammer's database? not like bitcoin transfers are registered with taxman. also he stole only 4000 btc from me. many other had accounts there. even if money is recovered i can not prove it was mine without his database or wallet.db. so i already write off the money, but if this is nerd (and i suspect), i am glad he does not get to enjoy it. hope mtgox give it to EFF or torservers instead.

i wait for mtgox to explain, but i don't think many outside the forum have 45000btc. he also says already himself mtgox questions source of money.

Nevertheless, you can make a police report. Even if you don't expect the police to actually help you. (for example, when your passport or wallet is stolen in a random country when you're on holiday, and you want to get a new passport or claim on insurance).

Its in the very least a sign of sincerity: reluctance to even approach police about the issue is a fairly serious warning sign to me.

[ShadowOfHarbringer]

I'm very interested to see how this turns out.

Mtgox respond, over.

[CODERsp]

I'm very great if there is Nerd's account, because he stole 4167 BTC from me. And there can't be smoke without fire. I can provide all information about transfers to BitCoinTrade.biz.

[mtgox]

There is pretty strong evidence that this guy was involved in some theft of BTC. I'm trying to talk to him to make absolutely certain.

[rebuilder]

This raises questions. Is it the place of a marketplace operator to act as judge? I'm not sure about that. Part of me feels less secure having my assets on mt gox if they take it upon themselves to hold funds when they say they suspect foul play. I don't recall seeing any terms of service when I signed up for an account that said that could be done.

That said, it's probably not a bad idea to have a procedure for reclaiming stolen assets, but that's a very sticky swamp to tread in. Marketplace operators shouldn't be responsible for that in my opinion. I think it would be better to have third party magistrates who arbitrate in disputes and when foul play is suspected, and traders, marketplace operators etc. could clearly delineate what rules they play by and which arbitrators they will accept.

I guess I'm proposing an implementation of the Common Economic Protocol and the associated legal system, although I'm not even convinced it's quite workable. Perhaps this community would be a place to try it out.

[jimbobway]

I think mtgox did the right thing.  It's not his job/duty to do so but he went out of his way to fix things.  Swiss banks used to not care too, but now they are holding Egyptian funds.

[FatherMcGruder]

Is it so wrong that any of us should act on our own accord to right a wrong? I don't see it any differently then putting the litter of someone else in the proper receptacle.

[Nefario]

What I find interesting is how this is the second time that a scammer has been dealt with by the community itself, without the need to involve law enforcement(and they couldn't do anythin anyway!).

This is a milestone.

[Bimmerhead]

Is it so wrong that any of us should act on our own accord to right a wrong? I don't see it any differently then putting the litter of someone else in the proper receptacle.

The question isn't so much about righting a wrong, it is about who gets to decide who did what, and what constitutes a wrong.

[rebuilder]

What I find interesting is how this is the second time that a scammer has been dealt with by the community itself, without the need to involve law enforcement(and they couldn't do anythin anyway!).

Is it? I have no way of knowing this was the right thing to do. No way of knowing this really was a case of a scammer being deprived of their profits. Maybe that's the case. Personally I think it's likely to be the case, but I don't know. This is exactly why legal systems developed in the first place - to allow people to have reasonable trust that disputes will be handled in a fair manner.

[Gavin Andresen]

This is exactly why legal systems developed in the first place - to allow people to have reasonable trust that disputes will be handled in a fair manner.

Our legal systems haven't caught up with the Internet.  What's the proper jurisdiction for somebody in Iceland using a bitcoin exchanger in the US who got ripped of by somebody living in (lets see, which country do I want to offend today....)  a seasteading community?