[NEM] NEM -New Economy Movement - No Envy Movement - Updates+Discussion thread

[utopianfuture]

Hi all I would like to show you the good works done by  Kooream. He has filtered out all duplicate hashes from page 1 to 10 registration thread 2.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgHJzpkvTvCxdDNodjQ1MkVSUHh5LV9EcnRuU2wxMWc#gid=2

We begin by filtering out all the invalid transactions. All remaining valid transactions are sorted in alphabetical order to check for duplicate hashes or ID.

if two accounts have the same hashes, then one must be a fraudster. Initially we prioritize the first account with the hash and mark the second account as "fraudster" - if there is an appeal then the account owner would need to show proof of ownership of that transaction either by

1. a signed message with the transaction
2. send a very small amount to NEM accounts

Then the other account would be labeled "fraudster".

Kooream and I would continue to work in this manner and we would like to invite all NEM stakeholders to scrutinize these lists in an effort to weed out all the fraudsters.


UP


I thought of another method. Generally, a genuine new registration posts a reply with a transaction hash right after they make the transaction. Now I will take into account the time lapse between the time stamp of the transaction and the reply post. A newly registered account with more than 10 minutes of lapse between the transaction and the reply post would be marked for further scrutiny. Well i don't see see how a fraudster could get through all of these measures. So all of them will be wiped out eventually.
 

did not you say that my hash was duplicate not seen it on the list. that yellow, I still coast on the list
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdDZ0amZpM00wQXhrR2lJM3pCOGRhNFE#gid=0
 I still coast on the list  as fraudster

I have temporarily fixed your account. The list will be re-organized in a few hours though.

ok, I suggest that the next time you have any questions about any transaction, you contact parties via pm for clarification. AND NOT IMPEACH THE PEOPLE WITHOUT EVIDENCE OF FRAUDSTERS !!!

sorry no PM. everything is in public record.

[Victorius]

So I see someone used my hash, What can I do right now, I dont have more BTC and Im not sure what signing is and how it is done.

[utopianfuture]

So I see someone used my hash, What can I do right now, I dont have more BTC and Im not sure what signing is and how it is done.

Don't worry I will fix it in a few hours.

[kingaltcoins]

Hi all I would like to show you the good works done by  Kooream. He has filtered out all duplicate hashes from page 1 to 10 registration thread 2.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgHJzpkvTvCxdDNodjQ1MkVSUHh5LV9EcnRuU2wxMWc#gid=2

We begin by filtering out all the invalid transactions. All remaining valid transactions are sorted in alphabetical order to check for duplicate hashes or ID.

if two accounts have the same hashes, then one must be a fraudster. Initially we prioritize the first account with the hash and mark the second account as "fraudster" - if there is an appeal then the account owner would need to show proof of ownership of that transaction either by

1. a signed message with the transaction
2. send a very small amount to NEM accounts

Then the other account would be labeled "fraudster".

Kooream and I would continue to work in this manner and we would like to invite all NEM stakeholders to scrutinize these lists in an effort to weed out all the fraudsters.


UP


I thought of another method. Generally, a genuine new registration posts a reply with a transaction hash right after they make the transaction. Now I will take into account the time lapse between the time stamp of the transaction and the reply post. A newly registered account with more than 10 minutes of lapse between the transaction and the reply post would be marked for further scrutiny. Well i don't see see how a fraudster could get through all of these measures. So all of them will be wiped out eventually.
 

did not you say that my hash was duplicate not seen it on the list. that yellow, I still coast on the list
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AlidWok7hW0DdDZ0amZpM00wQXhrR2lJM3pCOGRhNFE#gid=0
 I still coast on the list  as fraudster

I have temporarily fixed your account. The list will be re-organized in a few hours though.

ok, I suggest that the next time you have any questions about any transaction, you contact parties via pm for clarification. AND NOT IMPEACH THE PEOPLE WITHOUT EVIDENCE OF FRAUDSTERS !!!

sorry no PM. everything is in public record.

ok solved !!! thanks !!!  @utopianfuture

[JAMTHIRTEEN13]

Hello,


I have found my name on the Fraudsters list,  I live in spain and I have sent it following the rules, please can you tell me what I have done wrong, I can send you screenshots or anything, I am genuine, did someone took my id number. I want to know what went wrong and I want also to help to clarify this

[ZeroTheGreat]

people are seeking a true fair equal distribution

That's impossible.

How it's different:
1) More $, more % you'll own;
2) No enough BTT-activity, good bye (and good enough activty on your multiple accs, more % you'll own, ofc)?

[utopianfuture]

Hello,


I have found my name on the Fraudsters list,  I live in spain and I have sent it following the rules, please can you tell me what I have done wrong, I can send you screenshots or anything, I am genuine, did someone took my id number. I want to know what went wrong and I want also to help to clarify this

Check back in a few hours as I updated the list. At the moment it is likely that your hash is used by a fraudster but I can fix it. Don't worry.

[Xpedite]

people are seeking a true fair equal distribution

That's impossible.

How it's different:
1) More $, more % you'll own;
2) No enough BTT-activity, good bye (and good enough activty on your multiple accs, more % you'll own, ofc)?

Wow, cryptopost  
Please explain your message since this is not entirely clear to me...

[mindact]

I just find repetitive btt id in stakeholder list.
e.x. id  r3animation at colA.28 free  1636  **nxt  
id Manwe at colA.89 free   129 free
I'm confused and I don't think it is fair.
So how to deal with it? Would these records be merged?

[utopianfuture]

I just find repetitive btt id in stakeholder list.
e.x. id  r3animation at colA.28 free  1636  **nxt 
id Manwe at colA.89 free   129 free
It's confused to me and I don't think it is fair.
So how to deal with it? Would these records be merged?

All duplicate accounts will be deleted except one. Since I enter the names in a chronological order, sometimes an account appear twice because they appear in the list in two separate times.

So the true number of stakeholders would be less than the total number in the list since we would : 1. delete duplicate accounts; 2.delete all fraudsters.

[highscore]

Do ideas about refusal to pay nem? I'm talking about people who have created multiple accounts for registration in the list of stakeholders

[apophis974]

Hello, sorry for my english,

i find my name on the fraudsters list,

Like i explained in my post on the page 2 of the second part thread :
"Hello, i did wrong: i sent 0.003 btc instead of 0.03 ...
So i sent you 350 nxt from 9146814945127570304

Transaction ID 17058110096864951660"

I send a wrong amount the first time with position 1414 on the stakeholder list (498ed3a1c324f915e4a1c84112ed1de1e3a6b22f1982433e8a40349b9fa8f03b   : Amount 0,003 btc), so i send a second time with a good amount (350 nxt ID 17058110096864951660) with position 1484 on the stakeholder list.

So only the second post (with 350 nxt send) is the good.

I'm sorry for that.

Can you fix it?

[utopianfuture]

Update: I temporarily take the stakeholder list offline to make some re-organization. Kooream have been helping me to construct "fraudsters" list; you can comment on his work in the Google sheet https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AgHJzpkvTvCxdDNodjQ1MkVSUHh5LV9EcnRuU2wxMWc#gid=4

I will make changes to the stakeholder list based on Kooream's list. Our efforts would be on the registration thread 2 at first, but will eventually move to registration thread 1 when we catch up with current registrations. Thanks.

UP 

[misterbowls]

This fraudster list is 100% wrong from my observation.  Both my account and grimli333 are not fraudalent.  Grimli333 is someone I got to sign up who is very much into cryptocoins and works on projects etc.

Your list of scammers should list the other scammer pairings.

What you're going to have is a bunch of scammers win by default and then the people who were interested miss out on the fact their money has already been stolen.

It is hard work guys, but just realize that your list is probably way wrong so you're going to have a lot of work to do to get it straightened out.  THanks.

[utopianfuture]

This fraudster list is 100% wrong from my observation.  Both my account and grimli333 are not fraudalent.  Grimli333 is someone I got to sign up who is very much into cryptocoins and works on projects etc.

Your list of scammers should list the other scammer pairings.

What you're going to have is a bunch of scammers win by default and then the people who were interested miss out on the fact their money has already been stolen.

It is hard work guys, but just realize that your list is probably way wrong so you're going to have a lot of work to do to get it straightened out.  THanks.

make comment on the list. That list only shows you where duplicate hashes are. If there is a dispute, then you need to show proof of ownership of the transaction.

edit: i don't see anywhere in the fraudster list saying you are a fraudster. what's wrong ?

[misterbowls]

Line 56?  I shouldn't be in there, so thats the problem ?  I'm not getting all defensive because I think #1 you guys are well intentioned #2 we have time to fix this.

What I am upset is that the list is likely 100% wrong.  If you take the 2nd person in the threads then you will always have the "good" person.  This is probably not a bad idea because they are the ones that will have to take corrective action.

My suggestion would be to come up with a process beforehand.  I would suggest PMs since the fraudster can be a pain in the butt if the "proofs" are publically made.  I'd go a bit further and make a 2nd account just for receiving proof pms.  Maybe create 3 nxt accounts, then have person send you 1 NXT in one of three accounts and tell you which on.  You can either vary # of receiving accounts or # of NXT, but if you make it more than 1 nxt then you have to bother returning it perhaps.

Edit - and what does making comment on list do ?  I guess scammer can't comment on the list since they are not on it ?  So by default the fraudalent people can prove they're legitimate?  Just remember with blockchain scammer can see deposit from your account then claim it is his.  You need to come up with a systematic process to prove ownership, or you're going to add to your workload when 100s of people are doing it in varying ways.

[Kooream]

Line 56?  I shouldn't be in there, so thats the problem ?  I'm not getting all defensive because I think #1 you guys are well intentioned #2 we have time to fix this.

What I am upset is that the list is likely 100% wrong.  If you take the 2nd person in the threads then you will always have the "good" person.  This is probably not a bad idea because they are the ones that will have to take corrective action.

My suggestion would be to come up with a process beforehand.  I would suggest PMs since the fraudster can be a pain in the butt if the "proofs" are publically made.  I'd go a bit further and make a 2nd account just for receiving proof pms.  Maybe create 3 nxt accounts, then have person send you 1 NXT in one of three accounts and tell you which on.  You can either vary # of receiving accounts or # of NXT, but if you make it more than 1 nxt then you have to bother returning it perhaps.

Edit - and what does making comment on list do ?  I guess scammer can't comment on the list since they are not on it ?  So by default the fraudalent people can prove they're legitimate?  Just remember with blockchain scammer can see deposit from your account then claim it is his.  You need to come up with a systematic process to prove ownership, or you're going to add to your workload when 100s of people are doing it in varying ways.

Sorry, the title was misleading. Only duplicated hash has been marked what is mean one of them could be fraudster.

[utopianfuture]

Line 56?  I shouldn't be in there, so thats the problem ?  I'm not getting all defensive because I think #1 you guys are well intentioned #2 we have time to fix this.

What I am upset is that the list is likely 100% wrong.  If you take the 2nd person in the threads then you will always have the "good" person.  This is probably not a bad idea because they are the ones that will have to take corrective action.

My suggestion would be to come up with a process beforehand.  I would suggest PMs since the fraudster can be a pain in the butt if the "proofs" are publically made.  I'd go a bit further and make a 2nd account just for receiving proof pms.  Maybe create 3 nxt accounts, then have person send you 1 NXT in one of three accounts and tell you which on.  You can either vary # of receiving accounts or # of NXT, but if you make it more than 1 nxt then you have to bother returning it perhaps.

Edit - and what does making comment on list do ?  I guess scammer can't comment on the list since they are not on it ?  So by default the fraudalent people can prove they're legitimate?  Just remember with blockchain scammer can see deposit from your account then claim it is his.  You need to come up with a systematic process to prove ownership, or you're going to add to your workload when 100s of people are doing it in varying ways.

oh I think you are confused because of the sheet title. The sheet just lists everyone with the valid transaction hashes they provided. We then sort by the hashes to find duplicate hashes and the fraudsters.
It is not actually that bad as there are about 5-6 fraudsters out of 200 stakeholders. The sheet title is now changed to "hash check" to avoid confusion.

[misterbowls]

Well, I am not under the impression you guys are pointing fingers and calling many fraudsters.  I'm saying that I know 2 people and they were both on that list.  You should name it "people needing to prove ownership so they won't lose their stake".  Then you need to come up with a process.  5-6 fraudsters may not be many but unless you can identify the 100+ shares they tried to steal that is going to be hours of work for you guys.  So I am suggesting you make a 2nd account to receive verification pms to help keep it more manageable.  That way people can't modify things either and further add to confusion.

edit - The above is assuming new accounts on here can receive PMs.  Regardless, I'm just asking that you make process of how you want proof handled so people can start making corrective steps and feel better about their investments.

People complain about people having duplicate stakes.  This is actually a fairly worse problem, but we can 100% fix it.

Thank you for your hard work guys.

[patmast3r]

Line 56?  I shouldn't be in there, so thats the problem ?  I'm not getting all defensive because I think #1 you guys are well intentioned #2 we have time to fix this.

What I am upset is that the list is likely 100% wrong.  If you take the 2nd person in the threads then you will always have the "good" person.  This is probably not a bad idea because they are the ones that will have to take corrective action.

My suggestion would be to come up with a process beforehand.  I would suggest PMs since the fraudster can be a pain in the butt if the "proofs" are publically made.  I'd go a bit further and make a 2nd account just for receiving proof pms.  Maybe create 3 nxt accounts, then have person send you 1 NXT in one of three accounts and tell you which on.  You can either vary # of receiving accounts or # of NXT, but if you make it more than 1 nxt then you have to bother returning it perhaps.

Edit - and what does making comment on list do ?  I guess scammer can't comment on the list since they are not on it ?  So by default the fraudalent people can prove they're legitimate?  Just remember with blockchain scammer can see deposit from your account then claim it is his.  You need to come up with a systematic process to prove ownership, or you're going to add to your workload when 100s of people are doing it in varying ways.

oh I think you are confused because of the sheet title. The sheet just lists everyone with the valid transaction hashes they provided. We then sort by the hashes to find duplicate hashes and the fraudsters.
It is not actually that bad as there are about 5-6 fraudsters out of 200 stakeholders. The sheet title is now changed to "hash check" to avoid confusion.

Well now I'm confused. So the list is supposed to hold all stakeholders and the potential fraudsters are marked ? Because I can't find myself anywhere in that sheet. I bought in when it was 160 NXT.