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Author Topic: [UNO] Unobtanium Info & Discussion - Hardfork block 1042000 - Merge Mine w/BTC!  (Read 1007358 times)
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sirsmokesalot
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August 22, 2014, 09:27:46 PM
 #1901

I've noticed that there has been a large amount of Uno moving through the blockchain, so I decided to test the idea that the uRAN wallet is Cryptsy's.
Remember a week ago or so they split off about 5k UNO from the main wallet into what was (for awhile) the #2 wallet in size.   And then a couple of days ago, the Uno from that #2 wallet began moving through the block chain.

I was messing around today with Cryptsy and here's a transaction where I withdrew 11.111111 Uno:

http://cryptexplorer.com/block/0000000000001601e68308ade07753101fbb22372f60781ec63ef2f349ca5035

You can follow the inputs and outputs quite easily on CryptExplorer.

What does this all mean?  It shows that every time someone does a withdrawal from Cryptsy, Cryptsy will not simply send the withdrawn amount. Instead, they create at least 2 transactions in each block: the first transaction moves their entire Hot wallet to a new address, and the second transaction will go to the withdrawal address.

In the link above, you can watch this happen; I can confirm that the 11.11111 Uno in that transaction was my withdrawal from Cryptsy.

I don't know why Cryptsy wants to move the entire hot wallet in the blockchain for each transaction. I guess Big Vern has his reasons, and maybe the fees will help the miners.

You can watch their hot wallet move through the blockchain, getting smaller and smaller, each time being moved to a fresh address.

Block         Uno
476557     2,059
476597     2,038
476602     2,003   and so on.

I assume that when this hot wallet is depleted, then Cryptsy will split off another chunk of the cold wallet and the process will continue.

Thanks for the detective work! I have tried to poke around but didn't understand what they were doing. What you put forth makes a lot of sense.

We can't grow when we won't criticize ourselves!
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August 22, 2014, 09:44:16 PM
 #1902

Yeah, my detective work points to the fact that there are a ton of people storing UNO on Cryptsy, or they have a ton for some reason... Undecided

Unobtanium - The crypto commodity you keep! |
Hate Inflation? You'll love $UNO
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August 22, 2014, 09:53:29 PM
 #1903

But are the transactions themselves -- and the latest balance -- also stored in the wallet?  So that one would have to back it up/make a copy of it after every deposit/transaction so you don't lose coins? Or is the wallet itself merely a "pointer" to the relevant data in the blockchain and once one has a copy of the wallet backed up say on day 1, that's all you need to show your transactions and balance forever into the future?

(newbie to crypto question...)

No, they are stored on the blockchain. Think of the wallet as the key to your vault, the .dat file has your private keys in it and can move around with you. The blockchain keeps track of all your tx's, not the wallet. So when the network synchs up, it simply assigns all tx's in the blockchain that match your keys to you. You can easily export the private key from your wallet, memorize it, come back in 50 years, punch it in to an Un vault and poof all your coins and transactions will be there!

Awesome, got it, and thank you so much!

Also, thank you so much for creating Un/UNO, and then staying on top of it to bootl!

I've now got a little over 1300 UNOs, and have been mining as well (may give up in October, LOL), it's the only "alt-coin" that has excited me to date.

Jelks


You're most welcome, thats a nice stash of Un too! If you feel like sending ol'Blazr2 a couple for the effort, my addy's in my signature Cheesy
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August 22, 2014, 10:03:00 PM
 #1904

Hi sirsmokesalot,

Yes, I love a good blockchain mystery. It all seems to fit together pretty well.

Cryptsy used to store Uno in individual wallets, so when you did a withdrawal you would sometimes get multiple inputs from many small wallets.
Now they have changed things by putting most of their Uno holdings into a huge cold storage wallet, and having smaller hot wallet that that moves every transaction. When you withdraw, now the only input is from that hot wallet (which changes its address with every withdrawal).

I'm not 100% comfortable with having nearly 30% of uno stashed in one big wallet. We saw how that went down at Coinex. Cryptsy is no Coinex, but now there's only one private key to be stolen or lost instead of many. Maybe this is crypto-security best practice now-- I don't know.

I updated my original post to include a new observation: no network fees are being paid for processing these large transactions which include moving the hotwallet each time. I don't know how that works, exactly. I think the size of the transaction is made up of many inputs; if you move  2k uno but it is comprised of 500 small transactions, the "cost" of moving that 2k uno is high, but the next time that 2k is moved the cost is less, since now it's just one 2k Uno input.  So maybe how this works is when cryptsy moves 2k uno there is no network fee because of this.  Maybe Blazr or someone more versed can shed light on how those network fees are determined.

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August 23, 2014, 03:57:58 AM
 #1905

Un-Ex ('yoon-ex')
23/08/2014 [Western Australia]

The sell-prices on Cryptsy and Mintpal are almost identical at this second: about 0.00353 per UNO.

I offer to sell 10 UNO for .034 BTC ('Trade X01')

Post 'I accept Trade X01' and your UNO address here, and I will extend trust by sending first.

Mark (IndiaMikeZulu), Australia
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August 23, 2014, 04:03:23 AM
 #1906

Un-Ex Update:

Holeeee!! What a community!! Am reading all relevant posts.

@ Bitcoin National: you can buy and sell any amount of UNO you want! I am not in charge. This 'manual' model, though, is more cumbersome. So, I suspect that 'packet-trading' will come to be the norm.

The 'thesis' here I will explain over time. In a nutshell, the possibility of a crypto-community developing itself -- and thereby tripling or quadrupling the price of its coin -- has remained entirely unconsidered. And price independence is the holy grail (Oh!! So that's why Mark is asking for Australians who wanna buy physical bullion!!) And concerted action against The (exchange) Man is a step towards price independence.

My computer skills are utter shite -- but anthropological analyses of this novel phenomenon, the pseudonymous tribe? Can do!!

3 BTC Venture Capital!!!

Spoke to an old old friend last night (he is still on the political left; I am libertarian centrist). He has a kick-arse grasp of revolutionist economics.
In short, he will put up 3 Bitcoin to seed a proof-of-concept project early next year:

thesis: you can't punish those who don't participate in crypto communities -- but you can reward those who do.

Mark (IndiaMikeZulu), Australia
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August 23, 2014, 09:12:26 AM
 #1907

Un-Ex ('yoon-ex')
23/08/2014 [Western Australia]

The sell-prices on Cryptsy and Mintpal are almost identical at this second: about 0.00353 per UNO.

I offer to sell 10 UNO for .034 BTC ('Trade X01')

Post 'I accept Trade X01' and your UNO address here, and I will extend trust by sending first.

Mark (IndiaMikeZulu), Australia


can i get 5 for .017 ?
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August 23, 2014, 10:52:37 AM
 #1908

@ Wickedsick: yup!! Post your UNO wallet address in my pm. Me go beddy byes now. Coins at dawn, with corrected buy-price.

Mark
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August 23, 2014, 12:16:02 PM
 #1909

@ Wickedsick: yup!! Post your UNO wallet address in my pm. Me go beddy byes now. Coins at dawn, with corrected buy-price.

Mark

sent
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August 23, 2014, 03:03:44 PM
 #1910

@ Wickedsick: yup!! Post your UNO wallet address in my pm. Me go beddy byes now. Coins at dawn, with corrected buy-price.

Mark

Hi Mark. What do you think of the work that has been done at http://www.cryptotc.us/ ?  How close does this match your vision of trust-based p2p crypto exchange?

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August 24, 2014, 12:23:34 AM
 #1911

Guess who is setting up an exchange?
And guess which coin will be there?


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August 24, 2014, 01:42:01 AM
 #1912

Un-Ex

24/08/2014 Western Australia

Gettin' It Optimal:

suppose this link is part of the exchange:

https://www.cryptsy.com/markets/view/133

Thus, we can just pop in; check the first (decent) sell-order; and do fresh arithmetic.

Daily volume (CMC, most recent last): 0.15%,

Price this morning (Cryptsy): 1 UNO = .0039

Should have our first Trusted-Trader rating today!

Mark
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August 24, 2014, 02:22:43 AM
 #1913

But are the transactions themselves -- and the latest balance -- also stored in the wallet?  So that one would have to back it up/make a copy of it after every deposit/transaction so you don't lose coins? Or is the wallet itself merely a "pointer" to the relevant data in the blockchain and once one has a copy of the wallet backed up say on day 1, that's all you need to show your transactions and balance forever into the future?

(newbie to crypto question...)

No, they are stored on the blockchain. Think of the wallet as the key to your vault, the .dat file has your private keys in it and can move around with you. The blockchain keeps track of all your tx's, not the wallet. So when the network synchs up, it simply assigns all tx's in the blockchain that match your keys to you. You can easily export the private key from your wallet, memorize it, come back in 50 years, punch it in to an Un vault and poof all your coins and transactions will be there!

Awesome, got it, and thank you so much!

Also, thank you so much for creating Un/UNO, and then staying on top of it to bootl!

I've now got a little over 1300 UNOs, and have been mining as well (may give up in October, LOL), it's the only "alt-coin" that has excited me to date.

Jelks


You're most welcome, thats a nice stash of Un too! If you feel like sending ol'Blazr2 a couple for the effort, my addy's in my signature Cheesy

Just sent you a nice little chunk.

Jelks
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August 24, 2014, 02:31:06 AM
 #1914

@ Falling Knife: gee, it's an interesting site. I am gonna spend some time checkin' it out. But my suggestion is much deeper-rooted -- and I will put my cards on the table one by one.

Basically, though, it consciously adds to 'the basic existing Internet model' a range of face-to-face, on da street, merchant-network-developing, long-term-trust-centric, overtly theoretical practices that make the core community of the currency something that anyone can see makes the currency long-term-viable.

So, far, we have identified the following: currencies derive lasting value from:

(a) 'functionality' -- cryptos serve a function (and some have more and different functions). Everyone understands (a)

(b) merchant network -- of course, it's part of functionality, but . . . hmmm . . . not quite. Let's return to this issue.

(c) 'structuralist function' -- people accord values/'significations' to things (Red roses = love). In the case of cryptos, it's a libertarian political leverage/giving the banks competition. (c) confuses the shit out of most people, though that doesn't make it any less real.

(d) a maintenance-cost-free and publicly-verifiable asset that actually 'backs' a currency. Lots of confusion and emotion and scammery goin' on here! Ask me about our Guerilla Fruit Tree Coin. (d) is where some of the triumphs await. You will be blown away when you hear some of the ideas we have on this one!

(f) physical-bullion sales (etc) -- having these 'embedded' in the core community will give a currency a very valuable anti-GFC leverage as the depression really starts gettin' ugly. It's also woven into the face-to-face thing. And it is the price-independence thing. Let's get stuck into this -- 'national chapters'!

(e) community-as-asset -- think historically on this one: when you consider a business deal, you always consider both the product and the guys sellin' it. I envisage the 'core UNO-community' as a respected think-tank to which is attached an array of projects. Five years from now, after the scam coins have all collapsed, those who have worked honestly and diligently, and become publicly recognised as such, will be that 'function.' That will enhance the coin's value, but just as importantly, it will benefit those recognised core-members.

m.  

  
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August 24, 2014, 03:48:42 AM
 #1915

Greetings,

A new wallet for Unobtanium, jswallet:

http://cryptap.us/uno/jswallet

A fork of RushWallet, this may work well for iOS/Android/any devices. No hot wallets, this wallet is a random brainwallet stored as a url. Makes for easy disposable wallets. This is beta for now...

Feedback is welcome.

Regards,

website | PGP fingerprint: 692C 0756 E57D 2FA1 7601 3729 010B 717F 231C E7AA | BTC Address: 1CrYPTB1o7QWc8hXqBMP2LtAJh1VMtTFBh
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August 24, 2014, 06:17:41 AM
 #1916

@ Cryptapus, an android wallet?? Wow, android = higher transactional volumes!!

U
n
olives
beer
tune up my computer
a
n
i
u
m


Baby steps, but I used Unobtanium to buy stuff this week.

@ Bitcoin National: your support for the notion of P2P is most encouraging. I read your post. Agree with almost all -- please teach me:

if Cryptsy and Mintpal screw us around, why give them any custom at all? Does a coin-community gain more leverage -- squeaky wheel gets the oil -- the higher its trade-volume is? It makes sense that a coin have two major exchanges (+ significant P2P). Is it risky to only have two?

[And -- s#@t, I have so much to learn -- the bots on Cryptsy? are they responsible for those queues of tiny little sells and buys??]

m.

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August 24, 2014, 01:27:12 PM
 #1917


@ Bitcoin National: your support for the notion of P2P is most encouraging. I read your post. Agree with almost all -- please teach me:

if Cryptsy and Mintpal screw us around, why give them any custom at all? Does a coin-community gain more leverage -- squeaky wheel gets the oil -- the higher its trade-volume is? It makes sense that a coin have two major exchanges (+ significant P2P). Is it risky to only have two?

[And -- s#@t, I have so much to learn -- the bots on Cryptsy? are they responsible for those queues of tiny little sells and buys??]

m.



I like this P2P exchange, and I had to sit on my hands for you generous 10 for 0.034 offer, best others take such a sweet deal.  So yes x1000 lets build up an inner trade network. Just by posting here in the thread at first, but we can come up with a improving system step by step.

Also http://www.cryptotc.us looks to be a good place to post longer term bids so there is less 'maintenance' required.

But I think both should be used.

--

Cryptsy has a history of flooding the books with bot dust (micro bids).  In the long run we can get our own bots into the action and play ping pong all day.  But for the human traders this stuff tends to piss one off.  Add in cry's lack of customer support and I am no great fan of promoting others to use their exchange.  But Mint and Cry are the majors so we have to keep some coins on stock there.  However, my guess is that Arb guys will naturally do that on their own.  

I am in favor of coinbroker or bittrex as the main exchange floor.  And yes I think squeaky wheel gets the oil, so we will need to get squeaky with the staff and see which is willing to be the better service provider.

And there's more!  The NAUT pairing is very interesting, and they have a strong community too!  And Blackcoin looks to be an emerging major pairing. So I have great hopes for moving towards UNO being traded most in ALTS not BTC. the price-independence thing

Speaking of altmarket.com ... hmmm ...  Grin

Last the big goal is to pair UNO with $$$, and eliminate this nasty illusion that it must be tied to BTC/$$$ price.

Baby steps, but I used Unobtanium to buy stuff this week.
...
U
n
olives
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a
n
i
u
m


(b) merchant network


If you are saying what I think you are saying.  Great idea!  I was of the opinion that UNO can be 'just' a 'store of value' coin but now I think UNO does need some 'buy power utility'.  Every coin does!  So it is a very smart move to identify UNO with a 'product/service' line.  It can be unique stuff Wink  But we need to have a list of stuff you can get with UNO.  So if anyone wants to trade xyz for uno just post it and I will try to get a list going.

@cryptapus for doing what will make UNO a great coin for the 'but I want to buy stuff with it' crowd.  Well there you go, you can spend from your smart phone.  Swweeet!

---
Quote
(e) community-as-asset -- think historically on this one: when you consider a business deal, you always consider both the product and the guys sellin' it. I envisage the 'core UNO-community' as a respected think-tank to which is attached an array of projects. Five years from now, after the scam coins have all collapsed, those who have worked honestly and diligently, and become publicly recognised as such, will be that 'function.' That will enhance the coin's value, but just as importantly, it will benefit those recognised core-members.

hands down, without question, BINGO!
bottom line that is what UNO is

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Revolutionized.  ──


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Blazr2
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August 24, 2014, 08:47:02 PM
 #1918

But are the transactions themselves -- and the latest balance -- also stored in the wallet?  So that one would have to back it up/make a copy of it after every deposit/transaction so you don't lose coins? Or is the wallet itself merely a "pointer" to the relevant data in the blockchain and once one has a copy of the wallet backed up say on day 1, that's all you need to show your transactions and balance forever into the future?

(newbie to crypto question...)

No, they are stored on the blockchain. Think of the wallet as the key to your vault, the .dat file has your private keys in it and can move around with you. The blockchain keeps track of all your tx's, not the wallet. So when the network synchs up, it simply assigns all tx's in the blockchain that match your keys to you. You can easily export the private key from your wallet, memorize it, come back in 50 years, punch it in to an Un vault and poof all your coins and transactions will be there!

Awesome, got it, and thank you so much!

Also, thank you so much for creating Un/UNO, and then staying on top of it to bootl!

I've now got a little over 1300 UNOs, and have been mining as well (may give up in October, LOL), it's the only "alt-coin" that has excited me to date.

Jelks


You're most welcome, thats a nice stash of Un too! If you feel like sending ol'Blazr2 a couple for the effort, my addy's in my signature Cheesy

Just sent you a nice little chunk.

Jelks


Yow! Muchas Gracias! Thanks very much Cheesy
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August 24, 2014, 09:10:16 PM
 #1919

I'm really excited to be holding UNO.
I enjoy this community.

You guys put the UN in fUN.

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August 24, 2014, 09:15:32 PM
 #1920

I'm inspired by the ALS "cold water" challenge in the USA.  
Let me challenge you and every crypto investor to the 5 Un challenge.

Let's see what will happen if everyone buys just 5 Un before the end of the month. I nominate all of you to buy just 5 more Un before Sept. 1. It'll cost you less than ten bucks.

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