Russian Invasion of Ukraine[In Progress]

[be.open]

Or Russian propaganda is lying and they haven't really destroyed that many - if any - TB2s, as evidenced by Russian forces constantly being embarrassed by said drones.

It's good that Lyusya Arestovich, the mouthpiece of Ukrainian propaganda, is a crystal-clearly honest person.

Speaking of which, I take it you haven't got the talking points on cruiser's sinking yet? Fire and detonation? Entire crew evacuated? Totally not Ukrainian missiles? Instead Ukrainians randomly attacked some barns in Kursk oblast? Anything?

Breathe deeply, you are excited.

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[Branko]

This thread lacks some positivity and Slavic music and art:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zLa-o7ZeiQ

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GsJvDU_Koj8

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQ9BkiDEsGw

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wsh760kUl7w

[paxmao]

....

So... military experts from the Russian side are objective about how Russian missiles hit or do not hit buildings occupied with Ukrainian civils. Forum members are to be ignored because they would not be objective and do not know enough. And all coming from Putin's "Ministry of Dark Humour and Fantasyland tales".

You are again twisting the facts. I didn't claim that the Russian side necessarily tells the truth. I suggested looking for information in primary sources, and not through the prism of someone else's interpretations.

This is what you wrote:

...
The strategy of the 'defenders' did indeed seem to be to use multiple civilian buildings and keep the civilians hostage in them while doing so. ...

...

The article you quote does not say that the civilians were held hostage at any point, thus this is your interpretation and therefore your claim or opinion.

Now, you have the chance to set the record straight - Do you claim that the Ukrainian army has held their civilians hostage in buildings to protect their military at any point or not?

[tvbcof]

...
You are again twisting the facts. I didn't claim that the Russian side necessarily tells the truth. I suggested looking for information in primary sources, and not through the prism of someone else's interpretations.

This is what you wrote:

...
The strategy of the 'defenders' did indeed seem to be to use multiple civilian buildings and keep the civilians hostage in them while doing so. ...

...

The article you quote does not say that the civilians were held hostage at any point, thus this is your interpretation and therefore your claim or opinion.

Now, you have the chance to set the record straight - Do you claim that the Ukrainian army has held their civilians hostage in buildings to protect their military at any point or not?

Sorry Velcro (or whatever), but the kid just doesn't seem that sharp with his reading skills.  Anyway,

I (tvbcof) said 'seem'.  As time goes by, it 'seems' that way more and more.  What I did not say was 'Ukrainian army'.  It seems to me more the case that these tactics are widely employed by a set of groups who's subservience to the regular nation's regular army command is in many cases quite dubious.  Looks like it's the opposite in some cases.

Looks to me a lot like the Syria model where effectively criminal elements within the country and a large number of foreign mercenaries, often quite radical, were tasked with wanton destruction of all aspects of the country.  In Syria they pinned on the label 'ISIS', and it was pretty clear that Western (chiefly U.S.) and Israeli organizers were behind the operations.  It's looking more and more like that is the case here as well.

[suchmoon]

Or Russian propaganda is lying and they haven't really destroyed that many - if any - TB2s, as evidenced by Russian forces constantly being embarrassed by said drones.

It's good that Lyusya Arestovich

Kinda weak deflection considering that I didn't refer to anything said by Arestovich regarding the TB2 drones.

Speaking of which, I take it you haven't got the talking points on cruiser's sinking yet? Fire and detonation? Entire crew evacuated? Totally not Ukrainian missiles? Instead Ukrainians randomly attacked some barns in Kursk oblast? Anything?

Breathe deeply, you are excited.

From bad to worse. You're not getting 15 rubles for this one.

It is likely that Russia may exaggerate its achievements in terms of the number of destroyed Ukrainian military equipment.

Exaggerate LOL. Some other "exaggerations":

Just military training, definitely not invasion.
Entire Ukrainian air force and AA defense was allegedly destroyed but continues to function two months later.
Russian soldiers came to "liberate" but instead killed civilians and looted homes.
30 biolabs developing military geese and pigeon corps.
Russia "defending" Donbas but killing predominantly Russian-speaking Donbas population.
The flagship randomly catches fire because it can't possibly be that the non-existent Bayraktars and non-existent Ukrainian anti-ship missiles could have something to do with it.

But by all means, keep looking for excuses for Russian propaganda lies.

[LTU_btc]

It's good that Lyusya Arestovich, the mouthpiece of Ukrainian propaganda, is a crystal-clearly honest person.

I'm not really sure what you're trying to show with this video. Maybe next time put some video from Zelensky comedian times when he said something about Russia or Putin, at least it will be fun.
And Lyusya Arestovich - c'mon, it's so childish...

[paxmao]

Latest new...

Germany - 2 billion in aid.
US - another 800M in aid.

This is for flowers and confetti according to the "Russian Ministry of Dark Humour and Fantasy Tales"

...

Exaggerate LOL. Some other "exaggerations":

Just military training, definitely not invasion.
Entire Ukrainian air force and AA defense was allegedly destroyed but continues to function two months later.
Russian soldiers came to "liberate" but instead killed civilians and looted homes.
30 biolabs developing military geese and pigeon corps.
Russia "defending" Donbas but killing predominantly Russian-speaking Donbas population.
The flagship randomly catches fire because it can't possibly be that the non-existent Bayraktars and non-existent Ukrainian anti-ship missiles could have something to do with it.

But by all means, keep looking for excuses for Russian propaganda lies.

Be aware of the pigeons, do not underestimate them.



On regards to the Moskova, this ship was "old" but sinking it is was not easy at all. It has 3 layers of anti-missile defences including a long range interceptor similar to a Patriot, a second layer of intercepting misiles (OASIS I think) and then a layer of radar guided Gatling guns.

My opinion, and I have no proof of it, is that this had to be done in close collaboration with an intelligence source that I would not imagine would usually be within the means of the Ukraine services.  For the simulations I have seen, there are some specific water conditions in which the three layers of defence become much less effective. The first one is not of real use for low-altitude missiles like the Neptune, the second may not be launched for safety and the Gatlings are a a game of chance. On top of that, you need to know where to hit the ship to sink it in one shot.

The Moskova was built to be able to destroy a Nimitz class carrier. I am sure it did attract quite a bit of attention from the US and probably they have been keen on knowing the details of its systems. This does seem like a message to Putin, but not from Ukraine.

...
You are again twisting the facts. I didn't claim that the Russian side necessarily tells the truth. I suggested looking for information in primary sources, and not through the prism of someone else's interpretations.

This is what you wrote:

...
The strategy of the 'defenders' did indeed seem to be to use multiple civilian buildings and keep the civilians hostage in them while doing so. ...

...

The article you quote does not say that the civilians were held hostage at any point, thus this is your interpretation and therefore your claim or opinion.

Now, you have the chance to set the record straight - Do you claim that the Ukrainian army has held their civilians hostage in buildings to protect their military at any point or not?

Sorry Velcro (or whatever), but the kid just doesn't seem that sharp with his reading skills.  Anyway,

I (tvbcof) said 'seem'.  As time goes by, it 'seems' that way more and more.  What I did not say was 'Ukrainian army'.  It seems to me more the case that these tactics are widely employed by a set of groups who's subservience to the regular nation's regular army command is in many cases quite dubious.  Looks like it's the opposite in some cases.

Looks to me a lot like the Syria model where effectively criminal elements within the country and a large number of foreign mercenaries, often quite radical, were tasked with wanton destruction of all aspects of the country.  In Syria they pinned on the label 'ISIS', and it was pretty clear that Western (chiefly U.S.) and Israeli organizers were behind the operations.  It's looking more and more like that is the case here as well.

You see, if your read an article where does not say what you say anything beyond it, even if you use "seems" is your opinion. In this post you are again seeming to argue about it.

So you did use the opportunity to clarify that is not the Ukrainian army, but some undefined group. Good boy there.

Yet, again, this is your creation, as the source does not mention it. So again, do you have any proof?

As you do not seem to have good reading skills either, I will ask again: Does any of you claim that the Ukrainian army has held their civilians hostage in buildings to protect their military at any point or not? If so, any proof other that what it "seems" to you?

Oh, I forgot, thank for saying I am a kid. I must look better than I thought.

By the way, if you are saying someone is not able to read right, perhaps you should not refer to "Veleor" as "Velcro". Just saying.

[TwitchySeal]

It's good that Lyusya Arestovich, the mouthpiece of Ukrainian propaganda, is a crystal-clearly honest person.

I'm not really sure what you're trying to show with this video. Maybe next time put some video from Zelensky comedian times when he said something about Russia or Putin, at least it will be fun.
And Lyusya Arestovich - c'mon, it's so childish...

Can't get enough of this one.

[tvbcof]

...
You see, if your read an article where does not say what you say anything beyond it, even if you use "seems" is your opinion. In this post you are again seeming to argue about it.

So you did use the opportunity to clarify that is not the Ukrainian army, but some undefined group. Good boy there.

Yet, again, this is your creation, as the source does not mention it. So again, do you have any proof?

As you do not seem to have good reading skills either, I will ask again: Does any of you claim that the Ukrainian army has held their civilians hostage in buildings to protect their military at any point or not? If so, any proof other that what it "seems" to you?
...

Almost nobody has what I (or any other reasonable analyst) consider 'proof' of anything.  We see what someone puts out over the wire.  Clearly if something which aligns with what you currently wish to or think you should believe, that is what you consider 'proof'.  It doesn't work that way for everyone.

I've seen two widely circulated in Western press interviews which kind of align with what you wish to believe.  One was from a woman who worked for USAID (CIA) but neglected to mention that little factoid.  Another was a woman who has been groomed since her early years to be a Western-associated globalist stooge with awards and what-not.

On the other hand, I see a seemingly endless stream of freshly 'liberated' people with identical stories told to alternative media people (who are the only ones actually on-the-ground in the danger zones).  The story is always the same about the radical 'nazi' type folks keeping them as human shields at gunpoint.  If either the alternative media people or the interviewees (and the selection process of choosing them) where somehow staged, they are pretty damn good actors and the scene selection rivaled the attention to detail of Stanley Kubrick.  Quite the opposite of the laughably clownish skills of the nit-wits on the Western fake-stream media who are getting busted as fast as they are pumping out their fake news.

usaid-caught-ukraine-fake-news
https://www.thelastamericanvagabond.com/covid-psyop-exposed-ukraines-defensive-bioweapons-usaid-caught-ukraine-fake-news/

second-mariupol-witness-tied-us-gov
https://www.thelastamericanvagabond.com/second-mariupol-witness-tied-us-gov-all-evidence-shows-ukraine-fired-missile-on-kramatorsk/

[be.open]

30 biolabs developing military geese and pigeon corps.

As far as I understand, the briefing of the Russian Ministry of Defense dated April 14, 2022, based on the results of the analysis of documents related to the US military biological activities on the territory of Ukraine, did not cause much resonance in the Western media. Meanwhile, there are a lot of interesting things there, for example, that US scientists have been testing dangerous biological drugs on patients in the Kharkov psychiatric hospital for three years. Also, in laboratories in Ukraine, under the control of US scientists, the possibility of spreading cholera, typhoid and hepatitis through water was studied.

Video of the briefing, full text of the briefing, published documents.

Latest new...

Soldiers of the "Somali" battalion from Donbass hoisted their flag on the high-rise of Mariupol. Mariupol is taken.

More than 2000 Nazis of Azov continue to be in the bunker near Azovstal, yesterday about 40 FAB-500 bombs were dropped on the plant, today until 13:00 the ceasefire is in place - Russia gives the Nazis the last chance to get out of the bunker alive (then they will be tried in the Donbass and there is no moratorium on the death penalty). Good deal, must be accepted.

[suchmoon]

Soldiers of the "Somali" battalion from Donbass hoisted their flag on the high-rise of Mariupol. Mariupol is taken.

One small problem:

Mapиyпoль пoд нaшим кoнтpoлeм, ocтaлocь зaчиcтить тoлькo зaвoд «Aзoвcтaль»

Mariupol is under our control, it remains to clean up only the Azovstal plant

So... not really "taken"?

[be.open]

Soldiers of the "Somali" battalion from Donbass hoisted their flag on the high-rise of Mariupol. Mariupol is taken.

One small problem:

Mapиyпoль пoд нaшим кoнтpoлeм, ocтaлocь зaчиcтить тoлькo зaвoд «Aзoвcтaль»

Mariupol is under our control, it remains to clean up only the Azovstal plant

So... not really "taken"?

The city is completely under the control of the forces of Russia and Donbass. The confirmed losses of Ukrainian forces in Mariupol already exceed the official losses of Ukraine in this operation, announced recently by Zelensky, and 1,462 Marines surrendered. Judging by the intercepted radio communications, the inhabitants of the bunker near Azovstal after yesterday's bombardment are in a state close to panic. There will be no deblockade and they know it. No one will climb into the dungeon to clean it up, the surviving inhabitants of the bunker will be destroyed one way or another. But those who surrender today before 13:00 will have some chance to save their lives by showing that their Nazi ideals are not worth dying for. This is a fiasco.

[suchmoon]

This is a fiasco.

That it is. Russian forces destroyed the city and killed 20+ thousand civilians - Russian-speaking Donbas residents - so that they could claim to have "taken" it. Pyccкий миp.

[Toughit]

This is a fiasco.

Fiasco...


Two types of Russian fiasco's, one they should be ashamed of and the other is laughable.

Özdemir warns of hunger crisis

“Food and Agriculture Minister Cem Özdemir also called for an increase in arms deliveries. He warned that otherwise there could be a global hunger crisis. “We have received alarming news from Ukraine, where Russian troops are apparently also deliberately destroying agricultural infrastructure and supply chains,”    “ https://globeecho.com/news/europe/germany/von-der-leyen-demands-rapid-arms-deliveries-to-ukraine/ (and many others)


“
Russia Shows Off Crew of Sunken Moskva Warship—With Quite a Few Missing

Russia’s Defense Ministry released a brief video on Saturday of the head of the Navy meeting with crew members of the sunken warship Moskva, as social media posts have surfaced that appear to confirm at least one death on board.

In a 26-second video—the first public appearance of the crew since Moscow admitted the country’s most powerful battleship had sunk—Admiral Nikolai Yevmenov is seen meeting with crew members in Sevastopol. About 100 sailors can be seen, although at least 500 were on board at the time the ship went down after Ukrainian officials said they successfully struck it with at least one Neptune missile.  https://news.yahoo.com/russia-shows-off-crew-sunken-213308080.html “

Losing at least 400 sailors and a massive 600+ foot battleship to what amounts to American 4th of July fireworks,  what a fiasco.

[paxmao]

This is a fiasco.

Fiasco...


Two types of Russian fiasco's, one they should be ashamed of and the other is laughable.

Özdemir warns of hunger crisis

“Food and Agriculture Minister Cem Özdemir also called for an increase in arms deliveries. He warned that otherwise there could be a global hunger crisis. “We have received alarming news from Ukraine, where Russian troops are apparently also deliberately destroying agricultural infrastructure and supply chains,”    “ https://globeecho.com/news/europe/germany/von-der-leyen-demands-rapid-arms-deliveries-to-ukraine/ (and many others)


“
Russia Shows Off Crew of Sunken Moskva Warship—With Quite a Few Missing

Russia’s Defense Ministry released a brief video on Saturday of the head of the Navy meeting with crew members of the sunken warship Moskva, as social media posts have surfaced that appear to confirm at least one death on board.

In a 26-second video—the first public appearance of the crew since Moscow admitted the country’s most powerful battleship had sunk—Admiral Nikolai Yevmenov is seen meeting with crew members in Sevastopol. About 100 sailors can be seen, although at least 500 were on board at the time the ship went down after Ukrainian officials said they successfully struck it with at least one Neptune missile.  https://news.yahoo.com/russia-shows-off-crew-sunken-213308080.html “

Losing at least 400 sailors and a massive 600+ foot battleship to what amounts to American 4th of July fireworks,  what a fiasco.

As said on my previous post, loosing one of the three Slava class ships, which do have quite decent defences in place, in which seems like a well though, but frankly not too complex attack (a couple of sub-sonic missiles and, what appears to be some minor distractions) goes beyond a simple local success. For me it may (I am saying may) reveal:

a) The US intelligence service is collaborating with Ukraine to a very large extent, even when planning strategies and tactics.
b) The US intelligence service has in-depth understanding of the naval defence systems on Russian Navy and seems to have analysed their weaknesses perfectly.
c) Putin cannot put any short of faith in a sea launched attack or support.
d) The real effectiveness of the Russian fleet may be well below what Putin generals are counting on, not just on this particular case.

There are a number of news that may still be awaiting Putin's troops. The last shipment of US aid was undisclosed in content and the training of Ukrainian troops in new tactics may bring very nasty surprises with it.

On regards to Mariupol, the Azovstal installations are like a city inside a city. There is a network of tunnels and hidden storages that make a frontal assault nearly impossible. Shelling has also a limited effect and only the Ukrainians know how many reserves may they hold. Eventually it may fall, but it may consume time an resources at large.

As for the soldiers, the ones in there are not the type of soldiers that expect anything better than death from Putin's psychos.

[tvbcof]

...

As for the soldiers, the ones in there are not the type of soldiers that expect anything better than death from Putin's psychos.

There are a pretty steady stream of them being paraded on the internet now that Mariupol has fallen.  They look surprisingly like the faces-of-meth tweakers which populate my area in the Pacific Northwest.  There is just something about that look (and behavior toward non-combatants.)  It's more than just the tattoos.

[Toughit]

...

As for the soldiers, the ones in there are not the type of soldiers that expect anything better than death from Putin's psychos.

There are a pretty steady stream of them being paraded on the internet now that Mariupol has fallen.  They look surprisingly like the faces-of-meth tweakers which populate my area in the Pacific Northwest.  There is just something about that look (and behavior toward non-combatants.)  It's more than just the tattoos.

Gee, can't imagine what no food, no shower, constant shelling, and little sleep for 60 days might do to a persons 'looks'

I took you off ignore to see if you had anything intelligent to add, but, nope.

[paxmao]

...

As for the soldiers, the ones in there are not the type of soldiers that expect anything better than death from Putin's psychos.

There are a pretty steady stream of them being paraded on the internet now that Mariupol has fallen.  They look surprisingly like the faces-of-meth tweakers which populate my area in the Pacific Northwest.  There is just something about that look (and behavior toward non-combatants.)  It's more than just the tattoos.

Not the ones in Azovstal for what I know. I may be wrong, but they knew where they were getting into and had chances to fly. The one's that surrendered in Mariupol's port belonged to a different contingent, and, to be honest, had a worse terrain to defend.

Please, do not get me wrong, these people are not super-human, they die and need food and water, but they are quite peculiar in terms of their moral and will to fight. The longer they pin the Russian army, the more chances Ukraine has to use the West's aid.

[suchmoon]

a) The US intelligence service is collaborating with Ukraine to a very large extent, even when planning strategies and tactics.
b) The US intelligence service has in-depth understanding of the naval defence systems on Russian Navy and seems to have analysed their weaknesses perfectly.
c) Putin cannot put any short of faith in a sea launched attack or support.
d) The real effectiveness of the Russian fleet may be well below what Putin generals are counting on, not just on this particular case.

Don't forget the Ukrainian postal service. They must have had a hand in this, timed it perfectly as a promotion for the postal stamp - can't be a coincidence

Seriously though, the ship was built in Ukraine and its defensive stuff is similar to the ground systems used by Ukraine (e.g. C300) so I wouldn't overestimate the US "help"... albeit some satellite and Global Hawk surveillance probably helped.

Edit - some unconfirmed pictures are showing up on twitface: https://twitter.com/osinttechnical

Not that there was any doubt about the "storm" and "waves" that sank it but yeah... there is no storm. Just cloudy.

[be.open]

It's good that Lyusya Arestovich, the mouthpiece of Ukrainian propaganda, is a crystal-clearly honest person.

I'm not really sure what you're trying to show with this video.

As Zinaida Gipius said, "if you need to explain, then you don't need to explain".

Maybe next time put some video from Zelensky comedian times when he said something about Russia or Putin, at least it will be fun.

Maybe you want something fresher? The 52nd day of the special operation, President Zelensky of Ukraine appears to be pretty drunk or under the influence of drugs. The video seems to be a deepfake, but the link is to Zelensky's official Instagram lol.

Meanwhile, the Voronezh special forces are returning home from Ukraine. The operation is still ongoing, but after six weeks, a planned rotation of personnel is being carried out to give the fighters a rest.