OrangeFren.com - instant, KYC-free, exchange comparison

[examplens]

Issues with NeverKYC - Our support saves the day
Yesterday a user reached out to our support saying they sent 25 XMR to NeverKYC. However, NeverKYC claimed he sent only 2.6 XMR. The user shared screenshots of his communications with the exchange wherein they accused him of trying to scam them.

OrangeFren saves the day again, but I saw this exchange has very low review score on your website.
If this rating was the same before this incident than I certainly wouldn't use it, even if they had better rate on paper.
Maybe they are relative new service because I only see one review for them:

Looking at the case mentioned above, it is not surprising that they have a bad reputation. The user had to hire an intermediary to force the exchanger to check the order a little more carefully. What would happen if the user did not know about Orangefren, it would probably end without a refund.
Let's not talk about how it is a very bad signal that there are such failures in the order

[dkbit98]

Surprisingly that review is older, but yesterday's user said he was going to write one too, though didn't do so yet.

Because our review scoring system is weight based, with the amount serving as the weight, it would take massive volume without any negative incidents for NeverKYC to recover for a negative review referring to a swap of 25 XMR ($10k-ish).

Thanks for explaining how this is working.
That means that it would be a good idea for users to add reviews for exchanges they used, but I guess we need to register account for that.

On a different subject, I wanted to ask you if OrangeFren plugin for phishing protection is still working, and is it up to date?
https://github.com/orangefren/OrangeFren-Plugin

[OrangeFren]

Thanks for explaining how this is working.
That means that it would be a good idea for users to add reviews for exchanges they used, but I guess we need to register account for that.

You don't have to. Instead of balancing negative reviews with positive reviews, we compare negative reviews with all swaps.

So basically, the final score you see is this:

• The 10x is just to make it go up to 10 rather than up to 1 so that it looks nicer.
• The 500x is arbitrary and we're experimenting with setting it higher and lower. The idea is that a negative experience carries much more weight than a positive one, but also exchanges can fake the sumInAllSwaps (by simply faking "happy" swaps), but a factor of 500x makes it very uneconomical and easy to spot if they do.
• Notice that positive reviews do not affect the score at all. This decision was made, because when kycnot.me launched reviews we saw exchanges hiring people just to write positive reviews and our inbox is full of people selling fake positive reviews on TrustPilot.

On a different subject, I wanted to ask you if OrangeFren plugin for phishing protection is still working, and is it up to date?
https://github.com/orangefren/OrangeFren-Plugin

Yes, our plugin fetches an up to date list of known phshing scams from our server every few hours and we update it server-side whenever we learn of a new one.

[NotATether]

Just in case you guys didn't know, I'm now offering insured exchanges on BitMixList for select services, in partnership with OrangeFren.

[OrangeFren]

Just in case you guys didn't know, I'm now offering insured exchanges on BitMixList for select services, in partnership with OrangeFren.

Happy to be partnering with you!


FixedFloat meetup in Dubai 🇦🇪

‼️With the help of FixedFloat we're organizing a meetup in Dubai 🇦🇪 next week!

Join us on the 13th of December at the Bitcoin-accepting MonkeyHub Cafe in Dubai 🇦🇪

👉Sign up here:
OrangeFren.com/event/29

Or here:
Meetup.com/dubai-fixedfloat-com-bitcoin-meetup/events/312296470/

[CreepyUncleJoe]

...

Hope your real name isn’t z*********n, because you might’ve doxxed yourself. You should fix the link.

[NotATether]

...

Hope your real name isn’t z*********n, because you might’ve doxxed yourself. You should fix the link.

Haha   No, it's not.

It looks like I pasted the link to the local file instead of BitMixList.org. Nothing to worry about.

I'm already doxxed everywhere anyway. It is one of the sacrifices you have to make when you want to grow your business.

[dkbit98]

Just in case you guys didn't know, I'm now offering insured exchanges on BitMixList for select services, in partnership with OrangeFren.

Is this exactly the same thing as Orangefren Guarantee that we can see on OrangeFren website, or there are differences in amounts or some other way?
This is very useful feature and it gives customers a bit more security and peace of mind when they are exchanging coins.

FixedFloat meetup in Dubai 🇦🇪

How many people usually gets together in Meetups like this?

[NotATether]

Is this exactly the same thing as Orangefren Guarantee that we can see on OrangeFren website, or there are differences in amounts or some other way?
This is very useful feature and it gives customers a bit more security and peace of mind when they are exchanging coins.

Yes, the links that take you to orangefren.com (not any direct links) are covered by that warranty.

[OrangeFren]

Just in case you guys didn't know, I'm now offering insured exchanges on BitMixList for select services, in partnership with OrangeFren.

Is this exactly the same thing as Orangefren Guarantee that we can see on OrangeFren website, or there are differences in amounts or some other way?
This is very useful feature and it gives customers a bit more security and peace of mind when they are exchanging coins.

FixedFloat meetup in Dubai 🇦🇪

How many people usually gets together in Meetups like this?

Same limits and conditions
It's no wonder so many sites copied our idea of having exchanges give us a security deposit to refund users with in case things go wrong. I think it really increased the trust in swappers massively.

Generally around 20 people attend.

[examplens]

It is noticeable that the partner exchangers on your monitoring list change periodically. Do you have an update log somewhere or similar, where it is possible to monitor the status, who, and when was added or removed from the list?
In fact, the most useful part would be where you would give info about why some exchanges were delisted. In some cases, this could be useful feedback.

[OrangeFren]

It is noticeable that the partner exchangers on your monitoring list change periodically. Do you have an update log somewhere or similar, where it is possible to monitor the status, who, and when was added or removed from the list?
In fact, the most useful part would be where you would give info about why some exchanges were delisted. In some cases, this could be useful feedback.

We don't have a tracker, but I can tell you which services are currently disabled. Aside from services that have shut down (for instance AgoraDesk) and excluding services which were found to be scams (VigorSwap, CoreSwap, etc.), the following services are currently disabled:

• CoinCraddle - for either not getting any traffic or lying about the traffic they were getting.
• Flyp.me - for lack of communication.

Additionally CCE is currently enabled on our end, but in long-term maintenance on theirs, so they don't appear.

Finally the following services are enabled, but only appear on the results page (and not in the table on the homepage) due to very low review scores:

• NeverKYC
• OctoSwap

[examplens]

OK, this is current, but I mean the overall list. Surely, there are those who were delisted 6 months or a year ago. After a long period, it's much harder to find information about such things, and I'm pretty sure that it can be solid feedback.
For example, I didn't know that 'VigorSwap, CoreSwap, etc.' disconnected due to scams, that's useful information for me now, and I got it through a random discussion here. Also, "etc." should be expanded to include real names.

[dkbit98]

One small suggestion for OrangeFren is to add information for crypto cards if they are working with or without KYC.
Last time I checked Coincards and Bitrefill cards had mandatory KYC verification.

Additionally CCE is currently enabled on our end, but in long-term maintenance on theirs, so they don't appear.

Few days ago CCE exchnage announced they are coming back, but they didn't specify when exactly.

[OrangeFren]

OK, this is current, but I mean the overall list. Surely, there are those who were delisted 6 months or a year ago. After a long period, it's much harder to find information about such things, and I'm pretty sure that it can be solid feedback.
For example, I didn't know that 'VigorSwap, CoreSwap, etc.' disconnected due to scams, that's useful information for me now, and I got it through a random discussion here. Also, "etc." should be expanded to include real names.

Unfortunately we don't have such a list of all previous delistings, but I'll see if we can start maintaining one.

One small suggestion for OrangeFren is to add information for crypto cards if they are working with or without KYC.
Last time I checked Coincards and Bitrefill cards had mandatory KYC verification.

Few days ago CCE exchnage announced they are coming back, but they didn't specify when exactly.

Gift cards from CoinCards and Bitrefill don't require KYC. If you need prepaid cards without KYC then consider Stealths or 2fiat.

Yeah CCE told us they're coming back a month ago. We're ready when they are.

[dkbit98]

Gift cards from CoinCards and Bitrefill don't require KYC. If you need prepaid cards without KYC then consider Stealths or 2fiat.

Confusion is because Bitrefill and some other cards have both giftcards and prepaid cards.
I didn't try 2fiat cards yet but they look interesting and they support 3ds... only thing I don't like is higher top-up fees.
Maybe you should add separate list of crypto prepaid cards on OrangeFren, or have one big list with two categories (prepaid and giftcard).