[XMR] Monero - A secure, private, untraceable cryptocurrency

[Brilliantrocket]

I see that one of the development goals is the implementation of BerkleyDB as a fallback. Will this be as time intensive as the work on LMDB has been?

It´s already implemented and works on Raspberry PI etc.

There are currently 3 database types with the DB interface:
- LMDB (normal pcs)
- Berkley DB (embedded devices like RPi)
- In Memory dB (not the old one, it also uses the DB interface, for whatever services who need the whole db in ram for fast searching etc.)

Good to hear. Thanks

[saddambitcoin]

I have berkeley db running on raspberry pi 2 but the sync time is incredibly slow.

Nevertheless, it runs and someday it will be a functioning member of node society.

Gotta let these youngsters grow!

[generalizethis]

LMDB version not official.
Blockchain conversion tools broken.
No official GUI.
No TAILS binaries available
Freebazaar nowhere near complete, last git submission 28 days ago.
DwarfPool scam ongoing, efficiency below 80%

I can't wait to see fluffyponny in person later this month, got a full bag of rotten eggs and tomatoes just for him..

awesome, i´ll also be there, hope u can run faster than i can throw a beer bottle.

I'll buy you a keg. Here's Atrides post yesterday from GLIP freebazaar group:


"Atrides FreeBazaar (dwarfpool)
I have merged OpenBazaar Beta4 and fixed conflicts"

Not sure on the entire status, but you see submissions from hours to a few days to a few weeks ago--maybe not a good idea to look at the first number you see and claim it's the last submission....  

https://github.com/freebazaar/FreeBazaar

[smooth]

I have berkeley db running on raspberry pi 2 but the sync time is incredibly slow.

Nevertheless, it runs and someday it will be a functioning member of node society.

Gotta let these youngsters grow!

Development is actively being done to speed up bdb specifically and all dbs.

[kazuki49]

http://www.newsbtc.com/2015/05/06/bitstamp-bitcoin-transactions-being-traced/

[David Latapie]

http://www.newsbtc.com/2015/05/06/bitstamp-bitcoin-transactions-being-traced/

Updated my letter to an investor with #6.

In contrast, Bitcoin technology is getting easier and easier to track - #1, #2, #3, #4, #5, #6.

I might consider starting Monero meetup in Paris. Might.

[Quicken]

Problem is sparse either doesn't work on Windows (or Mac, I think), or doesn't work well, at least in some configurations. Nevertheless this will be addressed once the ability to expand the database is added. Then the starting size can be backed off., at least for non-sparse deployments.

Regarding sparse files, is this an LMDB issue or a more general file system issue?

There does seem to be sparse file support in windows, but it is dependent on the file system:

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa365564(v=vs.85).aspx
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa365566(v=vs.85).aspx
https://technet.microsoft.com/en-gb/library/cc788025.aspx
http://ntfs.com/ntfs-sparse.htm

HTH, Q

[smooth]

Problem is sparse either doesn't work on Windows (or Mac, I think), or doesn't work well, at least in some configurations. Nevertheless this will be addressed once the ability to expand the database is added. Then the starting size can be backed off., at least for non-sparse deployments.

Regarding sparse files, is this an LMDB issue or a more general file system issue?

There does seem to be sparse file support in windows, but it is dependent on the file system:

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa365564(v=vs.85).aspx
https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/aa365566(v=vs.85).aspx
https://technet.microsoft.com/en-gb/library/cc788025.aspx
http://ntfs.com/ntfs-sparse.htm

Yes it's just not automatic the way it is in Linux. There are some other issues with it, too, but nothing show stopping. Also, sparse files aren't supported at all on the Mac. Anyway, we'll get it worked out.

[GingerAle]

From the other side of town:

https://bitseed.org/product/pre-order-bitseed-v2/

Also new for Bitseed v2 is support for altcoins – Bitseed Altcoin Edition is now available for pre-order!

We will be handling altcoins on a per-coin basis, and will only be accepting orders for single altcoin devices after the first 100 unit sales of devices supporting a particular altcoin e.g. if we receive an order for 100 units to support Litecoin, we will then add the option to order single units that support Litecoin. We encourage any interested altcoin communities to put together a group order of 100 units and then send us a message to receive an invoice for your bulk order. Be sure to note which software you want us to add support for and send a spreadsheet or some other kind of organized document with the individual order information (shipping details and unit amounts).

So it would take 12k to get the 100 units.

[fluffypony]

Yes it's just not automatic the way it is in Linux. There are some other issues with it, too, but nothing show stopping. Also, sparse files aren't supported at all on the Mac. Anyway, we'll get it worked out.

The Mac thing is a little deeper/weirder than that. Here's what I mean:


[ ric->lmdb ]$ ruby
File.open('bigassfile_DELETE_ME', 'w') do |f|
    f.seek(1000000000)
    f.puts('l')
end
[ ric->lmdb ]$ ls -lh
total 14107248
-rw-r--r--  1 ric  staff   954M May  7 16:24 bigassfile_DELETE_ME
-rw-r--r--  1 ric  staff   5.8G May  7 16:23 data.mdb
-rw-r--r--  1 ric  staff   8.0K May  7 09:27 lock.mdb


In other words, the leading nulls in the 1gb file count as actual data (whereas ext2 and above would let you use that space and would only allocate blocks as needed). However, as you can see, the LMDB file doesn't have the full 16gb allocated, which (I would imagine) is the OS X VFS handling the sparse file abstraction.

[ArticMine]

http://www.newsbtc.com/2015/05/06/bitstamp-bitcoin-transactions-being-traced/

the link leads to

Error establishing a database connection

 

[ArticMine]

http://www.newsbtc.com/2015/05/06/bitstamp-bitcoin-transactions-being-traced/

the link leads to

Error establishing a database connection

 

The bitcoin network has become sentient and is attacking it's enemies.

No but seriously it works fine for me.

Actually the link works now, but for a few moments well ...

[AlexGR]

Yesterday, while searching some other stuff, I bumped into zram for linux: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zram

This can be handy for Monero if some older linux boxes have limited RAM. In general purpose use I'm seeing compression ratios of 2-3x, meaning that a single gb of ram is turned into 2-3gb. It has a tradeoff with cpu power (as it requires cpu to compress/decompress the data on the fly) but the cpu will be much faster than swapping data to the hard disk. It's a no brainer.

[smooth]

Yes it's just not automatic the way it is in Linux. There are some other issues with it, too, but nothing show stopping. Also, sparse files aren't supported at all on the Mac. Anyway, we'll get it worked out.

The Mac thing is a little deeper/weirder than that. Here's what I mean:


[ ric->lmdb ]$ ruby
File.open('bigassfile_DELETE_ME', 'w') do |f|
    f.seek(1000000000)
    f.puts('l')
end
[ ric->lmdb ]$ ls -lh
total 14107248
-rw-r--r--  1 ric  staff   954M May  7 16:24 bigassfile_DELETE_ME
-rw-r--r--  1 ric  staff   5.8G May  7 16:23 data.mdb
-rw-r--r--  1 ric  staff   8.0K May  7 09:27 lock.mdb


In other words, the leading nulls in the 1gb file count as actual data (whereas ext2 and above would let you use that space and would only allocate blocks as needed). However, as you can see, the LMDB file doesn't have the full 16gb allocated, which (I would imagine) is the OS X VFS handling the sparse file abstraction.

There are two different things going on. One is sparse files, which aren't supported on OS X (unless you are using a non-standard file system). The other is whether lmdb extends the database file to the maximum size or not. It DOES do this on Windows and DOES NOT do this on other operating systems. The reason is not clear (and the documentation is terrible).

(If you do the above test on Linux -- which does support sparse files for typical file systems -- you will see the same result except for the first line (total XXX) which shows actual on-disk usage.)

[Hueristic]

I'm not familiar with IOS file system but does it support directory compression?

[Lloydimiller4]

From the other side of town:

https://bitseed.org/product/pre-order-bitseed-v2/

Also new for Bitseed v2 is support for altcoins – Bitseed Altcoin Edition is now available for pre-order!

We will be handling altcoins on a per-coin basis, and will only be accepting orders for single altcoin devices after the first 100 unit sales of devices supporting a particular altcoin e.g. if we receive an order for 100 units to support Litecoin, we will then add the option to order single units that support Litecoin. We encourage any interested altcoin communities to put together a group order of 100 units and then send us a message to receive an invoice for your bulk order. Be sure to note which software you want us to add support for and send a spreadsheet or some other kind of organized document with the individual order information (shipping details and unit amounts).

So it would take 12k to get the 100 units.

Are these just for running a full node? Doesn't seem to be quite worth it to me compared to a Rasp pi unless there is something else they can offer.

[bigj]

From the other side of town:

https://bitseed.org/product/pre-order-bitseed-v2/

Also new for Bitseed v2 is support for altcoins – Bitseed Altcoin Edition is now available for pre-order!

We will be handling altcoins on a per-coin basis, and will only be accepting orders for single altcoin devices after the first 100 unit sales of devices supporting a particular altcoin e.g. if we receive an order for 100 units to support Litecoin, we will then add the option to order single units that support Litecoin. We encourage any interested altcoin communities to put together a group order of 100 units and then send us a message to receive an invoice for your bulk order. Be sure to note which software you want us to add support for and send a spreadsheet or some other kind of organized document with the individual order information (shipping details and unit amounts).

So it would take 12k to get the 100 units.

Are these just for running a full node? Doesn't seem to be quite worth it to me compared to a Rasp pi unless there is something else they can offer.

Mh, not convinced that the pricing is good. I believe it is a better deal to assemble a little server/node box yourself (it is like assembling Lego):

60$ System-on-Chip / Intel Celeron J1800 @ 2x2.41GHz / Mini-ITX (e.g., fan-less)
30$ 2x2GB S0-DDR3 memory (or 60$ for 2x4GB)
30$ Harddisk >300GB (for noise reduction, consider a >100GB ssd at 50$)
40$ Mini-ITX box (fan-less)
-----
160$ total

After building the box, put Ubuntu on (or Windows) and run Monero, done.
Btw, the RPi2 is way slower then any such machine! For 50-100$ more you even get a 1150-socket cpu based mini-system (with fan).

ADD1: Such systems run at 10-30W at wall. Ok, that is a little more than Bitseed's 10W, but who cares (it is still <5$/month).
ADD2: Of course, you can run different clients on the assembled machine at the same time (monero, bitcoin, bitshares, ... whatever).

[fluffypony]

From the other side of town:

https://bitseed.org/product/pre-order-bitseed-v2/

Also new for Bitseed v2 is support for altcoins – Bitseed Altcoin Edition is now available for pre-order!

We will be handling altcoins on a per-coin basis, and will only be accepting orders for single altcoin devices after the first 100 unit sales of devices supporting a particular altcoin e.g. if we receive an order for 100 units to support Litecoin, we will then add the option to order single units that support Litecoin. We encourage any interested altcoin communities to put together a group order of 100 units and then send us a message to receive an invoice for your bulk order. Be sure to note which software you want us to add support for and send a spreadsheet or some other kind of organized document with the individual order information (shipping details and unit amounts).

So it would take 12k to get the 100 units.

Are these just for running a full node? Doesn't seem to be quite worth it to me compared to a Rasp pi unless there is something else they can offer.

Mh, not convinced that the pricing is good. I believe it is a better deal to assemble a little server/node box yourself (it is like assembling Lego):

60$ System-on-Chip / Intel Celeron J1800 @ 2x2.41GHz / Mini-ITX (e.g., fan-less)
30$ 2x2GB S0-DDR3 memory (or 60$ for 2x4GB)
30$ Harddisk >300GB (for noise reduction, consider a >100GB ssd at 50$)
40$ Mini-ITX box (fan-less)
-----
160$ total

After building the box, put Ubuntu on (or Windows) and run Monero, done.
Btw, the RPi2 is way slower then any such machine! For 50-100$ more you even get a 1150-socket cpu based mini-system (with fan).

ADD1: Such systems run at 10-30W at wall. Ok, that is a little more than Bitseed's 10W, but who cares (it is still <5$/month).
ADD2: Of course, you can run different clients on the assembled machine at the same time (monero, bitcoin, bitshares, ... whatever).

If we group buy @ 100 units then it comes down to $120 each, which is somewhat more attractive, although I doubt we'd be able to do so before May 10 (for the free 250gb hard drive upgrade) so the units would have 160gb drives.

I'm torn, I actually think it might be quite cool, and I'd be in for 10 units, but whether we can drum up enough support to hit 100 units I dunno.

This might be a job for the FFS (forum funding system)...which, if all goes well, we're deploying tonight:)

[bigj]

Just to make the point: I do like the RPi2 very much! Actually I'm happily using one as ftp and ip-cam server. Did try Monero on it... way too slow!! I would even claim the RPi is too slow for anything based on PoW. Bitshares' DPOS might work, but that's another story.

So, why bother with slow hardware if you can have something >10x faster (not to mention memory and disk space and software) for virtually the same price and similar wattage/running costs.

Don't get me wrong, Bitseed's offer/product is pretty cool, but it does not suit the purpose well (Monero, PoW node) when compared to an Intel based solution. As little server it will be awesome for sure.

[smooth]

Just to make the point: I do like the RPi2 very much! Actually I'm happily using one as ftp and ip-cam server. Did try Monero on it... way too slow!! I would even claim the RPi is too slow for anything based on PoW. Bitshares' DPOS might work, but that's another story.

So, why bother with slow hardware if you can have something >10x faster (not to mention memory and disk space and software) for virtually the same price and similar wattage/running costs.

Don't get me wrong, Bitseed's offer/product is pretty cool, but it would not suit the purpose well (Monero, PoW node) when compared to an Intel based solution. As little server it will be awesome for sure.

FWIW, I agree with your conclusion for now. If you want a node right now, a cheap low power Intel is the way to go.

The rpi2 is slow, but also very cheap. With a 32 GB SD card you can have a complete system for around 65 USD including case and PSU, or slightly more if you want to bump up the storage to 64 or 128 GB, maybe even a bit less if you shop around. The power usage is literally next to nothing <5W.

Despite the current low performance I believe the rpi2 will make a decent Monero node. There is a lot of headroom for improvement. For example, the CPU is quad core but is mostly being used in a single threaded mode for Monero currently. Plus of course various other (very significant) optimizations (including db and others) that are being looked at and worked on.