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1541  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 01:40:15 PM
Usgai
I don't know you. I dont claim to represent you. I don't have a bias either way.  I attempt to glean what scant facts are in you PM to me.

I ask for Additional facts And you respond with paragraphs of opinion.

It is based on this dialogue with you and others that I form my opinion of which I'm entitled to express untainted by you spin. I will state again publically you can not bully nor intimidate me.

If you fail to supply requested facts I will continue to shape my opinion based on factual info available to me.
You are free to post any and all private conversations we have.

But I will only post relevant comments in the other thread.

Thank you.
1542  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 12:50:07 PM
So while it is clear that a Lot of guys don't like usgai.

He is obviously not a very good investment manager

He also a lier and probably Delusional  he may still not be a scammer.
1543  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 12:46:16 PM
If a person is greedy and or dumb enough to invest in a company paying unrealistic returns who are we to stop them. The fact that this form allows that cesspool of a lending forum to exist with only a disclaimer it is pretty clear that it is up to the buyer to beware.

I think victim who has lost money is required for a scammer tag
1544  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 12:36:16 PM
1. There must be a clear victim.

So under your proposed ruleset Pirate doesn't get a scammer tag until he's defaulted, even though he was offering impossible returns and clearly running a Ponzi from day one.  How is this a more equitable system?  This only benefits the people looking to scam.

I could claim I built a rocket in my back yard and offer to sell flights to the moon in it.  Obviously noone would fall for it - so by usagi's definition I wouldn't be a scammer as there was no victim and no damages.

By everyone else's definition I'd be a scammer - just a very bad one who was never going to make a profit from his unsuccessful scams.  A scam is a fraudulent business scheme - there's no requirement for it to actually succeed in defrauding anyone for it to be a scam.

By that arguement then Buttery Fly Labs is a scammer.
And BTCJam is a scam.

I think there does need to be a victim. It is our job to regulate another person belief? 

I may not believe you have a rocket ship in you back yard but I would believe Richard Branson. And if Richard Branson rocket ship fails to make it to the moon does that make him a scammer?
1545  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 11:46:18 AM
The name of the lawyers is a fact.

I'm. Looking for facts and you can not provide any.

You use lots of words to say the same things over and over again.

Please post a copy of the invoice from the lawyer.

Please also post a copy of your contract.

Thank you.
1546  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Usagi: falsifying NAVs, manipulating share prices and misleading investors. on: December 30, 2012, 11:41:05 AM
Usagi claimed in one of their deleted threads that CPA was on the verge of collapse which then caused the price to tank. If that isnt manipulating the share price then what is ?





Do you recall the date?  Thanks.
1547  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: I lost $286,00 USD from "sellbitcoin" - Jeffrey Carlstrom, j.bird.btc@live.com on: December 30, 2012, 11:05:41 AM
Active Paypal Accounts:

Jeffrey Carlstrom  dsvirus@gmail.com     VERIFIED PREMIER     8M4X32CNKFTBS

Jeffrey Carlstrom  j.bird.btc@live.com     VERIFIED PREMIER      VS8DYKSKBSUSA
Jeffrey Carlstrom  j.cstrom@live.com       VERIFIED PREMIER      VS8DYKSKBSUSA

Jeffrey Carlstrom  ccphazed@gmail.com UNVERIFIED PREMIER  2T22AXAMBZ8UU

I wouldn't be surprised if said user was using stolen information, such as a SSN to make all these accounts. Why else would he blatantly bastardize his own name? Regardless enough heat on the name should bring some action sooner or later.

That is possible. But I don't believe so in this case. He also had a Wells Fargo bank account which he also used to make legitimate trades before he went rogue and started scamming people. He also contacted me private to tell me his accout was compromised as a excuse to avoid responsibility for the scamming yet he continues to scam and does nothing to clear his name.
1548  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 10:59:30 AM
Wow. That is right out of pirates play book. You learned at the feat of the master.

It is not looking good for usgai.

Usgai. Please site the name and address of the "Internet defamation lawyer" you consulted.

Thank you.
1549  Economy / Currency exchange / Re: ATC Enterprises X-Change Services [Gold, Silver, currency, Bitcoin and more...] on: December 30, 2012, 05:15:12 AM
Several more good trades with ATC777

+1
1550  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 05:09:20 AM
update

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=133823.0
1551  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Usagi - is he or isn't he a scammer. on: December 30, 2012, 05:07:52 AM
So I just heard from usagi  he indicates:

"the spreadsheets were published on tsukino.ca/bmf, which was a wordpress site which I have deleted. So it is unrecoverable. "

* admitting to deleting material information.

he says he "can't remember" specific facts.

he admits to incorrectly valuing his assets:

"I mis-spoke about the nature of the formula. I think I said "average" instead of "max" – "

EDIT ** see post 17

He admits that while he was representing  the value of his investments in the future - if  the investor how liquidated their asset would actually receive less value.:

"The claim was that if someone wanted to liquidate their investments, that would be the price they could get. This is true "

It's not looking good for usagi.


1552  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 04:24:48 AM
If usagi made false representations about his investments then then I would think he should be a identified as a scammer.

Where are those statements (or due to deletion: What were those statement) And where is the proof these statments were false?

I just find it curious that individuals who actually did lose money are not pursuing this as aggressively as you.

1553  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 03:05:45 AM
So you believe him to be a scammer for removing liquidity from the markets?
1554  Economy / Currency exchange / Re: WTB 2 BTC w/ PP on: December 30, 2012, 02:08:11 AM
+1 polymorphous

Always smooth.
1555  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 02:03:00 AM
Probably not.

These guys HATE usagi
1556  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 01:49:07 AM
Deprived

Yes.  I would like to read your evidence. 


Also did you invest with Usagi?
1557  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 01:27:47 AM
usgai,

Please don't put words in my mouth. "I think he is pointing out that most non-investors are blind. "

What I am trying to say is that here is a lot of people who don't like you and are not creditors but still call you a scammer. 

If anyone has evidence of usagi defrauding, misleading or other wise materially misrepresenting his business please PM me.

And I will update this thread

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=133823.msg1424892#msg1424892


Right now it seems that usagi made false statments and provided inaccurate documents/formulas to represent the performance of his investments.

Then he also deleted numerous post to cover it up.
1558  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 30, 2012, 01:19:34 AM
I also agree with Deprived.

I find it curious though that it seem that no users who were actually defrauded by usagi post in these threads.

Maybe they use sock puppet accounts because they are embarrassed they made bad investments.

If you made a bad investment, well, welcome to the world of bitcoin lending and bitcoin securities.  

It does not by itself make usgnai a scammer.

If you were defrauded or scammed and have proof please PM me with evidence.

What evidence did you rely on to make your investments.
What statements do you have that show the value of your investments.
What proof do you have that those investments no longer have value.
Please explain how you were scammed.


please do not include info about usagi's charater as that is currently not relevent.

Thanks!


To be clear - are you saying someone who wasn't an investor can't point out scamming?

It's an interesting perspective to take that if a victim doesn't realise they've been victimised noone else should point it out.

Makes it somewhat of a miracle that anyone ever gets convicted of murder - as I've yet to hear about a murder victim come forward and register a complaint.

Getting back to the point, are you saying that I shouldn't PM you any evidence (I have never purchased any assets issued by usagi - despite day-trading on dozens of different GLBSE assets).  Should I type it up and advertise it in Securities forum and see if any investor wants to PM it to you?

Certainly an interesting spin on things that only victims have useful evidence - and everyone else should do their best three wise monkeys impression.

Anyone can point out scammers.  However it seems a lot of people really don't like usgai but many of his most vocal critics didn't really lose any money.  I help track down scammers who didn't scam me all the time.  However it is usually pretty clear that scamming did occur.

With Usagi is seems to be much more grey.  He had some good investment vehicles and some bad investment vehicles.  Is usgai a scammer or just a bad investment manager.  

I'm not saying only victim's have useful evidence.   If you have evidence that usgai intentionally scammed his inventors please PM me.   But so far I have been PM'd by one one guy who lost funds and every just seems to hate usgai.

Also if you have knowledge of specifically what info was contained in usgai's deleted posts that would be helpful also.

 
1559  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Usagi - is he or isn't he a scammer. on: December 30, 2012, 12:04:29 AM
FROM: ianbakewell

" At various times I was a shareholder of CPA, BMF, and nearly all the NYAN offerings.

Usagi has gone back and deleted nearly 1000 of their old posts. Many of these posts made statements that built confidence and caused me to invest into the assets run by Usagi.  In the resulting bullshit of Usagi swapping things around to make it look like they were not doing so bad after the pirate losses,  those statements were later proven to be false or were unhonoured. The stock prices collapse and I sold out at an extreme loss.

YARR was the only good experience with Usagi, and likely only because I was able to get out at the beginning"


Another accusation of deleting documents and making false statements.


1560  Economy / Scam Accusations / Re: Onus & Remedy in Scam Accusation Threads on: December 29, 2012, 06:30:20 PM
I also agree with Deprived.

I find it curious though that it seem that no users who were actually defrauded by usagi post in these threads.

Maybe they use sock puppet accounts because they are embarrassed they made bad investments.

If you made a bad investment, well, welcome to the world of bitcoin lending and bitcoin securities.  

It does not by itself make usgnai a scammer.

If you were defrauded or scammed and have proof please PM me with evidence.

What evidence did you rely on to make your investments.
What statements do you have that show the value of your investments.
What proof do you have that those investments no longer have value.
Please explain how you were scammed.


please do not include info about usagi's charater as that is currently not relevent.

Thanks!
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