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Still available? Would possibly be interested for 1.1 BTC. Price includes shipping within USA?
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People who make the first letter of their nick lowercase and capitalize the rest:
dEBRUYNE
iCEBREAKER
Am I missing anybody?
cAPSLOCK You guys really get bored when XMR is only up 3%.  don't forget cARTMAN Ohyea, how could I forget cAPSLOCK, the person whose name literally evokes in my imagination a scene of someone registering their nick and accidentally hitting the capslock key? |
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I'm afraid that some IRC from a "fluffypony" isn't acceptable as "proof" to myself (please hire an actual lawyer if you want to convince me).
We'll see what happens in regards to the poll but if Qora goes Azure then AT development (from CIYAM) will be ceased.
* jwinterm considers adding Qora to Azure just to troll CIYAM... |
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Those links don't have the agreement. You can obtain a copy of the agreement here: http://windowsazure.github.io/docs/Contribution%20License%20Agreement.pdfI talked to fluffypony about it (because Monero was recently added to Azure, so he just went through the process). Here is what he had to say: [08:35:48] <jwinterm> fluffypony: what did you have to sign for MS azure integration? [08:38:26] <jwinterm> It basically consisted of signing a Contributor License Agreement, submitting a PR to the Azure templates Github repo, and sending them a write-up. [08:39:05] <jwinterm> CLA agreement publicly available? [08:42:20] <fluffypony> jwinterm: yes, I think [08:42:27] <fluffypony> https://cla.azure.com has it, I think [08:42:38] <grubles> azure integration? [08:43:06] <fluffypony> grubles: https://azure.microsoft.com/en-us/blog/azure-blockchain-update-7/[08:43:14] <othe> jwinterm on azure? pump pump [08:43:27] <jwinterm> just curious [08:43:35] <jwinterm> ciyam is on the qora thread talking about MS getting IP rights [08:43:48] <grubles> fluffypony: oh nice! [08:43:51] <jwinterm> about how if qora gets on ms azure then ms will own all IP related to qora [08:44:20] <fluffypony> the license only covers the code you submit to the Azure Github repo
[08:44:34] <fluffypony> for obvious reasons you have to sign that before they'll merge it
[08:44:48] <fluffypony> so it's just the install script and a README, in our case
[08:45:02] <fluffypony> but literally anyone can submit the PR and sign the CLA
[08:45:08] <fluffypony> I can go and put Qora on there and he can't stop me[08:45:14] <othe> yeah one person did that for 5 coins... [08:45:26] <jwinterm> anyway, thanks for explanation [08:46:08] <grubles> is bitcoin on azure? [08:46:16] <lsd25> Heyyyyyy  [08:46:20] <grubles> i can't find any info [08:46:21] <jwinterm> I don't think so, maybe bitpay, grubles [08:46:34] <moneromooo> That site seems to want my github password before it lets me see anything... Fishy. [08:46:46] <fluffypony> http://windowsazure.github.io/docs/Contribution%20License%20Agreement.pdf[08:46:47] <fluffypony> foudn it [08:46:47] <othe> no but u can just make your own template for that, its basically just a shell script that runs on the first start [08:46:48] <fluffypony> *found [08:47:11] <fluffypony> it only covers the contribution you make to their Github repo [08:47:25] <grubles> othe: similar to user data for AWS? Relevant portion of conversation bolded. So, the only code that you are giving over to MS is the install script that will go on their github repo. I hope this clears up any confusion about whether MS would have any claim on any Qora copyrights or other IP. |
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Qora wouldn't be giving up its rights to Microsoft I don't believe.
I've been wrong before, why would you say this?
If they join Azure BAAS without paying then indeed they would be giving up the IP rights (that is in the legal contract for using the service for free). From what I gather if you pay for said service then you can retain the IP rights (that would of course need to be verified) so if going down this path at all then I hope that it is going to be funded. Where is the legal contract? Which IP rights are being given up? |
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Regardless of the actual legality of the license agreement Microsoft are very fond of fighting law suits (even when they are likely to lose them) so I won't be permitting CIYAM to be involved with any situation that might end up in a potential law suit with Microsoft.
Imagine if every bug fix (published in a future version) could not be applied to a clone for fear of a lawsuit with Microsoft for merging the commit (you just aren't going to risk the trouble IMO).
Read both answers here: http://programmers.stackexchange.com/questions/173193/open-source-library-can-the-project-owner-change-the-license-to-be-more-restricThere is no way MS could claim any dominion over code that has already been distributed with an MIT license, even if all contributors to Qora agreed to change the license at the time of signing on to Azure service. Relevant quotes: Since the license covers distribution the terms you agreed to when they distributed it to you still apply, they can't suddenly revoke an MIT library that has been in use for years. However, code previously licensed under a permissive license, gives others the right to distribute that code to anyone they wish to. So, old code, once distributed under a permissive license, can be re-distributed under that same license. In theory that means the old code remains available to everyone as Open Source software, provided someone continues to distribute it. Take it with a grain of salt, it is stackoverflow legal advice after all, but the MIT license is pretty short and clear in its intentions. |
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... 1. Because of copyright and patent agreements that must be signed as part of the application process, NO Clones of qora or any derivative works based on Qora can be made. For those of you who wish to be part of CIYAM's new Blockchain, you will be disppointed.  2. A licensing contract that involves patent and distribution rights has to be signed before being accepted into the program. 3. The contract cannot be annulled once joined. ... Can you publish the documents that need to be signed in terms of copyright and patent agreements, or is there an NDA or something, because point #1 seems untenable in my IANAL opinion. As the license stands, MIT, anyone is free to fork and modify the code. In order to change the license, I believe you would need signed agreement from all contributors to the current codebase, and that would apply only to future versions, not already MIT released code. |
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People who make the first letter of their nick lowercase and capitalize the rest:
dEBRUYNE
iCEBREAKER
Am I missing anybody?
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Is Monero never going to be added? Just clicked through, would be awesome to bet on sports with Monero...might bet with BTC, but would rather use XMR.
Hi jwinterm, Thank you very much for your feedback about Monero (XMR) We added DASH in response to the votes here. More recently, we also added CLAM and it is currently accepted in our new Casino & Playing Wallet. You can now play all your favorite Casino games with CLAM ! As for the other coins, we are monitoring their progress and will consider adding them once there is sufficient demand, liquidity and market cap. Please feel free to contact us if you have any questions or suggestions. Thanks a lot ! All the Best, Michelle Cool, I wouldn't touch Dash with a 33.5' pole, and I sold all my CLAMs a while ago, but I did start making some bets with BTC, service is really nice, and I like all the sporting events you have. Would be awesome if Monero was useable as well! |
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Today dnaleor wrote on the Monero reddit that Poloniex took Monero onboard already on the 19th of May 2014. That is only one month after Monero got launched @ 2014.04.18 (I would btw suggest to change the date format on the really nice Excel with XMR Charts to YYYYMMDD or DDMMYYYY. MMDDYYYY really is confusing when only using numbers).So who or what motivated Poloniex to adopt Monero in such an early stage? Did they just recognize the potential? You would assume they are mostly interested in volume, which has been rather moderate for quite some time even after it could be traded on Polo. Does someone in the Monero community have close contacts with Poloniex? Or was Poloniex just trying to compete with Cryptsy (now goxed) where basically any altcoin was traded? It actually took Cryptsy quite some time to implement Monero, likely because of really being technically different and since before the 0.9 version it was heavy on the RAM usage. Just curious. In the beginning, Monero was only traded on a cryptonote only exchange run by TheKoziTwo, I think it was called exchange.cryptonote.to or something. Despite being relatively obscure, this impromptu exchange did decent volume. Several months before the launch of Monero, Poloniex was hacked and lost a bunch of user funds; they were a relatively small time exchange and I think looking for a unique and defining feature to set themselves apart. Enter Monero. Poloniex picked up Monero and there were huge volumes traded as soon as it got onboard. Not long after Poloniex offered XMR trading pairs, and the rest, as they say, is history. |
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Market is up and working on Cryptopia now. Somebody come sell me some coins  Look like cryptopia is becoming quite popular. I'm coming around on them a little bit. I can't bash them for adding strictly Bitcoin clones anymore, since they've recently added Monero, Boolberry, and Aeon. I'm still not a fan of the whole vote/buy/lotto/everything with resurrected shitcoin (Kim)Dot(Com)Coin, but hey, can't please everyone all the time, I guess. |
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...
It might take a lawyer of someone experienced in intellectual property rights to say for sure. But here is what I suspect: Qora devs...
I admit that I am not an expert in these matters. I am simply trying to contribute a healthy dose of suspicion to this opportunity.
I appreciate healthy doses of skepticism, but don't you think if this were the case that out of ETH, XMR, and the myriad of other coins signed up for blockchain-as-a-service one of them might have had a lawyer take a look at what they signed up for? Here is fluffypony's description of what is required to get on azure: https://www.reddit.com/r/DarkFlarb/comments/4bs33o/monero_added_to_microsoft_azure_blockchain_as_a/d1c92rk(That Reddit link did not work for me.) Yes, they likely did. Athereum certainly has the money. So I can't say why they would sign something that, on the face of it, appears to forfeit their rights to use (in their own way) the very thing they are creating. So maybe someone with legal experience should be consulted, and I can stop making guesses. Edit: I tried to correct the spelling of "Athereum" three times, and it keeps putting the "A" back in. I think it's an april fool's thing, both athereum and reddit link not working (because monero in the link is replaced with 'darkflarb'). |
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...
It might take a lawyer of someone experienced in intellectual property rights to say for sure. But here is what I suspect: Qora devs sign the Azure contract. After several months of development under the Azure veil, MS can claim that the "new" Qora is significantly different from the "old" Qora, which was MIT licensed. And as such, they now have legal dominion over the "new" Qora.
If a company takes something that exists in the wild, like a fork, say, something very common, and enhances it with some new design that significantly improves on the old design, then they can apply for protection (a copyright or patent) for their enhancements to the original, public design.
I admit that I am not an expert in these matters. I am simply trying to contribute a healthy dose of suspicion to this opportunity.
I appreciate healthy doses of skepticism, but don't you think if this were the case that out of ETH, XMR, and the myriad of other coins signed up for blockchain-as-a-service one of them might have had a lawyer take a look at what they signed up for? Here is fluffypony's description of what is required to get on azure: https://www.reddit.com/r/Monero/comments/4bs33o/monero_added_to_microsoft_azure_blockchain_as_a/d1c92rk |
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How can you give up rights on an MIT licensed piece of software? Permission is hereby granted, free of charge, to any person obtaining a copy of this software and associated documentation files (the "Software"), to deal in the Software without restriction, including without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software, and to permit persons to whom the Software is furnished to do so, subject to the following conditions:
The above copyright notice and this permission notice shall be included in all copies or substantial portions of the Software.
THE SOFTWARE IS PROVIDED "AS IS", WITHOUT WARRANTY OF ANY KIND, EXPRESS OR IMPLIED, INCLUDING BUT NOT LIMITED TO THE WARRANTIES OF MERCHANTABILITY, FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE AND NONINFRINGEMENT. IN NO EVENT SHALL THE AUTHORS OR COPYRIGHT HOLDERS BE LIABLE FOR ANY CLAIM, DAMAGES OR OTHER LIABILITY, WHETHER IN AN ACTION OF CONTRACT, TORT OR OTHERWISE, ARISING FROM, OUT OF OR IN CONNECTION WITH THE SOFTWARE OR THE USE OR OTHER DEALINGS IN THE SOFTWARE. If you created a fork and changed the license, then maybe, but what part of "without limitation the rights to use, copy, modify, merge, publish, distribute, sublicense, and/or sell copies of the Software" would allow MS to direct the development of Qora or control the blockchain? Even if they/you changed the license, people would still be free to run the versions which are MIT licensed. |
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Initially I was quite put off when I read what NEM revealed about the Microsoft contract for Azure. Why would people, developers, give up their rights to the thing they created?
But now I am wondering what rights the developers have with regard to an open source project. Rights that cannot be enforced are rights that cannot be claimed, right?
It makes sense that the Qora devs and even the investors would not want to sign away their rights to use the code or deploy the blockchain in whatever ways they see fit. But if Microsoft, or anyone else, can simply clone the code based on what is open source, then what does it mean to either keep or give up rights to this particular version of the code and this particular instantiation of the Qora blockchain?
I'm interested what this could possibly mean as well. NEM and Qora are both using the MIT license. |
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......
It's coming, slowly but surely. At this point you can run a daemon on your home computer or a vps and then connect using a mobile device with the unity client. I think it's not too far away that a remote node can serve a bunch of mobile clients in a trustless manner, so you can mine/play on your phone without having to run your own node. I think... I'm sorry to sound stupid. Can I run the daemon on a good higher end computer and people within wifi range can play the Huntercoin game on mobile devices? Or can you explain a little more? I haven't messed with it myself, but I think at this point you can only run one wallet per daemon. So, you can only really use it to play yourself. But, I think it's in the works that you could run more than one wallet from a single remote node, like huntercoin SPV wallets basically, I think... |
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...the simple fact that I bought a good recycled computer and could not get things going should be a red flag about useability for people in countries where low end computers are going to be more prevalent. The essential value of "human mining", its significance in the development of cryptomoney, has to do with low end users, not people like me in wealthier countries. If a person could buy a cheap computer in Bombay or Jakarta and mine $2 usd worth of huc a day then HUC would be in the news probably regularly.
It's coming, slowly but surely. At this point you can run a daemon on your home computer or a vps and then connect using a mobile device with the unity client. I think it's not too far away that a remote node can serve a bunch of mobile clients in a trustless manner, so you can mine/play on your phone without having to run your own node. I think... |
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no pool mining on this one?
I recommend solo mining. You will be able to find blocks If you're using gpus it's still a helluva lot easier to mine on a pool. |
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