how can i get the original docu to make a spanish translation ? i was looking for something like this and i would spread the word even without bounties  |
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...snip...
I don't really understand the mining part, it will exist as long as bitcoin does or the other way around if you want.
Once we reach 21 million bitcoin, all mining stops. heh, you wish, too bad we can't predict future though, what i understood from a few Satoshi's posts was that incentive for the miners would balance from fees, i already saw some blocks with fees > 1btc, don't forget the total amount of coins will be mined in +140 years too . Just think what the fees would be in a million transaction block , that is not possible atm but i think the protocol doesn't restrict it |
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@Hawker, taxes will not be voluntary, would be like a fixed income tax agreed beforehand by all. The miners for the gov pools would do a public service and be taxed directly, and the rest will have registered bitcoin address as social security numbers paying their taxes at the exchanges or sending the money directly to that address, having the ability to check on Social Sec. website whatever the sum they have to pay every year.
They will do it happily to have their kids in school and be attended in public hospitals if they ever get sick, have their houses protected in case of fire, their garbage taken care of, protected by the police, etc.
I love your idealism. But people pay for stuff they are forced to pay for. Yes a percentage of the population does financial planning and gets the right insurance policies and so on. But there are lots of people who live on their credit limits and pay for stuff as it arises if they can pay at all. BTW, all mining will be done in a year or two so that particular implementation detail needs rethinking. glad you do, don't forget bitcoin is, if i'm allowed to say, deflationary so people will be more keen to hoard than to invest into worthless things. People that will choose to live on credit money are sentenced to fail in such a system and i guarantee you that if you require a tax check-up, instant in such a system, to allow a person use any public service they will pay in the end. But not forcing them to do so leaves the possibility to contract private services too. Democracy at it's best. I don't really understand the mining part, it will exist as long as bitcoin does or the other way around if you want. |
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@Hawker, taxes will not be voluntary, would be like a fixed income tax agreed beforehand by all. The miners for the gov pools would do a public service and be taxed directly, and the rest will have registered bitcoin address as social security numbers paying their taxes at the exchanges or sending the money directly to that address, having the ability to check on Social Sec. website whatever the sum they have to pay every year.
They will do it happily to have their kids in school and be attended in public hospitals if they ever get sick, have their houses protected in case of fire, their garbage taken care of, protected by the police, etc. I know i would and use block explorer too view where my taxes go.
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Where I live I paid my own education and health, and I do not regret it.
I only wish I do not had to pay taxes for services I did not used...
...you, me and all the people on this forum, though i would like a common fund to pay the teachers and the doctors, it has many more advantages than having those two services private and i could give some good examples with persons that are too sick to work and need medical care and education to be able making a contribution to the society in the future. We are people, we want and have to help each other, "divide et impera" just could not fit in if we want to survive as specie. Thanks Satoshi, wherever you are now, and thanks to you guys for opening your eyes |
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without taxes if people wanted something they'd just do it themselves or pay someone to do it- I know people where I live don't want trash all over the place, maybe I'd make a living keeping it clean. Need for taxes is an illusion to keep people in line, people aren't stupid and ignorant enough to let the world go to shit just because 'the man' isn't taking out their trash. A fireman that won't work just because there's no paycheck is no fireman at all, just a walking meat sack of 'want' for the things that paycheck gets him.
... don't forget medical services and education, the two most important public services i will not want private in a bitcoin future a just and more convenient tax system is possible with bitcoin, it's very transparent to begin with... https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=45839.msg550903#msg550903 |
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ehh, i'm little confused by your contradictory context. Government is the word that describes a set of rules that is agreed upon by groups of persons. We are the government being majority and we enforce our rules on to the smaller groups. You say bitcoin is not government and that democratic governments are the problem after which you describe bitcoin system  That's why Satoshi warned us that this system, as good as it is, has a flaw from our point of view. If someday an entity or another group of people hashes away blocks few percents faster than we do then they make the rules, democracy at it's best. A private association is not a government. If you can stop being part of a "system" is not a government. If a private association decides to have a "democratic" governance thats fine. If you dont like it you can leave and join another one more of your liking, creating a new one or even go alone. In a democracy you have to obey the rules imposed by the people that can manipulate the masses. You can not choose to be part of the system or associate in a different way with other people you choose. This second case is evil and the one I oppose. If a private association wants to govern themselves as a "democracy" I have no problem. Was that more understandable? a little bit more understandable, yes and we actually agree on main issue here, that bitcoin = democracy = government Governments as we know them today had been promoted and put in place to impose a set of rules chosen by majority onto the rest that didn't agree, creating a more totalitarian system, the "evil" one as you say. I think we actually say the same things with different words  |
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democracy is working = bitcoin > 51% voters make the law  Bitcoin is not a government. You can stop using it if you want to. "Democratic" voluntary associations are fine. The problem is democratic governments, where you are forced to do what the majority decides whether you like it or not. ehh, i'm little confused by your contradictory context. Government is the word that describes a set of rules that is agreed upon by groups of persons. We are the government being majority and we enforce our rules on to the smaller groups. You say bitcoin is not government and that democratic governments are the problem after which you describe bitcoin system That's why Satoshi warned us that this system, as good as it is, has a flaw from our point of view. If someday an entity or another group of people hashes away blocks few percents faster than we do then they make the rules, democracy at it's best. |
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while it's obvious you tried harder this time i can still see the halmarks of this being a mspaint blackout job good luck on the next one though
I'm sorry if it appears that way. That is simply how I receive them. There are levels of security that still need to be observed; and they are usually followed before I receive the document. you're an archive guy or something ? what good are those documents if they get censored like that, better recycle them |
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What most people fail to realize or don't want too is taxation to maintain public service could be done very easily by creating a government pool of miners or local community one.
Every person mining there would do a public service and be rewarded for it, taxes would be increased pool fees, that everyone agrees, and network transactions that get into their blocks. The same bitcoin address you have registered to receive payouts would be your social security number and you will be required to provide one if you want to have access to any public services available.
The individuals that are not able to mine would have a registered address in the official exchanges that would be taxed equally as the miners if they ever wanted to get physical money in their hands. The third added option would be having a public donation address of every service to have people contribute if they want to be taken into account in every aspect.
Sorry for this personal rant, but as you can see public services and government would be possible in case we choose to have bitcoin as store of value and us in control of our wealth. We will have to adapt to bitcoin not the other way around because it works as concept and in real life too.
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democracy is working = bitcoin > 51% voters make the law You confuse cooperation with democracy. Democracy is a form of government. Democratic governments have a monopoly on force thru majority rule. They tax and so forth. Bitcoin doesn't resemble that in the least. You are free to contribute or refrain from participating. Bitcoin doesn't levy taxes and enforces no law. It has rules, not unlike a board game. It can't take your property and it can't imprison you. At the most, it might impose some form of contract, which depending on whether you breach it or not, you could be prosecuted in the geographical political climate in which you may have committed the "crime". Bit of a stretch it would seem. hehe i don't want to start a debate but democracy is by definition the cooperation between the largest group of persons... by def. bitcoin = democracy "Democracy is a form of government in which all people have an equal say in the decisions that affect their lives. Ideally, this includes equal (and more or less direct) participation in the proposal, development and passage of legislation into law... " wikiif don't accept the rules of the majority you can fork the chain and go your own way, nice feature of this system if you ask me |
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democracy is working = bitcoin > 51% voters make the law |
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I really don't have any objections bots be used at exchanges, as a poster before me said they regulate price, increase liquidity, etc. but this bot or group of bots is somehow different, it stomps on legal transactions very fast, downward every time, try to sell at market price you will see they put few lower orders lower right before yours, repeat your order at lower price, happens again very fast. I also believe they have huge amounts of both dollars and bitcoins, although dumping bitcoins over time.
This is the point I'm trying to make. Not that bots are bad, but that this particular bot is bad. yeah, thanks for bringing the issues again, i had a post while ago about this and didn't know how to explain it. There are "good" and "bad" bots from our point of view but this one is getting the prize for the worst. Mt.gox would not do anything to stop it, they gain to much from that i guess. I sugested 1 minute as an example, to simulate a more humane trading because when you put an ask or sell order you don't have the need to cancel it and re-order 10 times a second. |
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isn't mining basically dead unless
1) you have a gigantor botnet
2) you buy into a gigantor mining consortium
2) you're mining namecoin/something else
GLBSE has mining coops you can buy into
this guy is asking for help setting up his rig, can give him some help or mind not posting ? |
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seria una buena opcion y me acabas de dar una ideea tambien |
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I think he might of been implying that your account could of been compromised or something.
correct me if Im wrong.
oh no it's not hacked.. I seriously just want to buy a handful of coins via paypal.. nothing more by who was initially backed Flexcoin LLC ? Yooter Me.... Roger Wehbe ... ... I'll pay it first before you send them... I really just want like 10 coins to test this site out. ack not hacked |
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I think he might of been implying that your account could of been compromised or something.
correct me if Im wrong.
oh no it's not hacked.. I seriously just want to buy a handful of coins via paypal.. nothing more by who was initially backed Flexcoin LLC ? |
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