Why should anyone but the manufacturer provide technical support for their product?

Baikal, Bitmain, etc., get away with this crap because: A) they aren't located in countries where the rule of law prevails; B) people keep buying their shitty products even though it is well known their warranties aren't worth shit and neither is their technical support.

Maybe Baikal will send you a coupon so you can buy 4 more miners for the price of 1. That seems to be their preferred method of dealing with warranty issues.

Why in the world would masternodes prevent dumping? They aren't helping SnowGem or CheeseCoin, for two random examples.

The best thing that prevents dumping is an appreciating price, and price is more likely to go up if: 1) the devs are active; 2) the coin has an interesting use case or solves a unique problem; 3) the coin is marketed/promoted more than just the occasional post in the ANN thread; 4) the crypto market as a whole is going up.

Oh, and one other thing - there can't even be a whiff of scamminess about the coin.

I'll leave it up to the individual miner/investor to determine whether IRD meets any of the above criteria.

I have a spreadsheet set up to calculate coins per day based on difficulty, block reward and my hashrate. The formula is pretty simple, but I seem to recall it doesn't work for Ethash and maybe one other algo. Anyway, it's basically (Your hashrate * block reward * 86400) / difficulty, where 86400 is the # of seconds in a day.

Then just divide the number of coins per day by the block reward to get the fraction of a day it will take to find a block.

EDIT - I just found out (from the DERO Slack channel) that difficulty is "network hashrate * block time" and since network hashrate is in hashes/second and block time is in seconds, multiplying the two gives you hashes. I actually never realized that the units for difficulty are hashes, but it's kind of obvious in retrospect. Anyway, just divide difficulty by your hashrate to find out the approximate time to find a block (though remember it's a statistical event so no guarantees).

That is precisely what I am doing now - running a fresh install of 0.1.1 on a different system. So far it is complaining about system time deviation despite 3 manual resyncs.

I know that Slack is active but the stream of consciousness format gives me a headache and I wanted to make sure that people who are only here (which included me up until a few days ago) are in the loop.


UPDATE -well, I also copied over the blockchain db file to speed up the syncing then after taking the dog for a walk (~30m) I came back to find it was all caught up... Go figure.

I left the daemon running all night and this morning it was once again complaining about system time deviation and it never did get the blockchain fully synced (yellow numbers). So I manually resynced the time, updated to 0.1.1 and this new version definitely runs slower and is falling more and more behind trying to sync; i.e. - it started off around 500 blocks behind and after 15 minutes of running it is now 650 blocks behind.

As of now it looks like I won't be able to mine DERO at all with Atlantis because I either can't get the blockchain to sync or else my system time gets too far out of whack way before Windows bothers to check a timeserver again (which is every 12 hours by default). I can (presumably) fix the latter issue by running a 3rd party timeserver, but there isn't anything I can do about the daemon syncing slower than new blocks are generated.

That was true for CryptoNight, but not for Ethash (E3 is 180MH/s at 800W) or Equihash (Z9 is 10kSols/s at 300W). Respectively, that makes the E3 about as powerful as a typical 6x RX 570 GPU rig but drawing much less power and costing less as well, while the Z9 is about 2x more powerful than a 6x GTX 1080ti rig while also drawing much less power and costing less. In other words, not even close to 100x more powerful.


I literally just pointed out 2 examples where the 2nd gen ASIC was 5x to 10x faster than the previous gen and yet you still tried to claim only a 2x improvement is possible?

Right, okay. I think I'm done here.

I bolded the key phrase that invalidates your entire argument. The manufacturer of the "secret ASIC miner" is also the one most likely to be running them. In fact, selling a fraction of the ASICs you make to the public and keeping the majority for yourself is a great way to maintain control over a coin's network, bring in lots of money from mining, and pay for their development.

This can also be done by selling, say, a 10kSols/s ASIC to the public when you already have a 50kSols/s version working. You know, like seems to be the case with Bitmain's Equihash ASICs? Or sell a 20kH/s CN miner for a few weeks then roll out a 240kH/s version (like Baikal did).

Even if you don't care about principles and ethics, buying an ASIC when the manufacturers do what they have done over and over again is just shooting yourself in the foot. The fact that BTC and, eventually, LTC were taken over by ASICs without much negative consequence probably has more to do with them being the first ones; in other words, the ASIC manufacturers learned some new tricks and tactics since then.

Indeed, and with Windows 8.1 no less, which vies with Vista for the worst O/S ever created (although a real blast-from-the-past would get my vote: Microsoft's Bob... look that one up for a good chuckle).

Yeah, I seem to recall he's vehemently opposed to Javascript and thinks CloudFlare is a MitM attack vector. Well, just because you're paranoid doesn't mean they aren't out to get you...

Both of you idiots should do more reading and less posting.

There aren't any more airdrops because the dev disappeared.
This shitcoin is already listed on stocks.exchange and probably a few other shitexchanges. Maybe tradeogre; who cares, since the price hasn't climbed above 1 sat in months.

You posted more or less the same message twice; don't do that. Also, make sure you read the last couple pages of a thread to see if your issue has been discussed already (hint: it has).

The above sequence of commands are a bunch of crap and won't work.

Almost nothing really works for this issue, actually, and the one "solution" - temporary at best - is a pain:

Right click on the clock.
Select "adjust date/time".
Click on the radio button for "set time automatically" to turn it off.
Click on the "change" button to change the date/time
Now adjust the time up or down by 1 minute - it doesn't matter - and save changes
Click on the radio button for "set time automatically" again to turn it back on.

This is undoubtedly way less efficient than a theoretically ideal solution but it worked for me.

I'd love to use ASICs instead of GPUs; the problem I have isn't with the hardware, it's with how the manufacturers conduct business.

Hmm, yes, a poor choice of words on my part to say the "only other alternative" is a paid-for 3rd party timeserver app. Even though I wasn't aware of the other solutions at the time I wrote that post, I should know by now there is always more than one way to skin the proverbial cat when it comes to Windows.

However, I haven't changed my opinion that the current iteration of Atlantis is simply too sensitive to system time mismatches. Unfortunately, with a block time of 9-11 seconds I don't see any way around that without opening up the PoW algo to the sort of timestamp spoofing attacks perpetrated against the Verge network.

Indeed, just reading a few of the posts in this thread lopped 10 points off my IQ and added 5 inches to my waistline... though the latter could have been from being in a hot dog eating contest...

You're welcome, but you might want to put a quote link back to my post so some overzealous plagiarism hunter like me doesn't report it to the mods.  

Now, my comments on the testnet after about a day of messing around with it (posting here since the Slack channel is an unending stream of consciousness which I find incredibly aggravating; hence why I have avoided using it up until yesterday).

1. The daemon could be a bit more explicit about when it has synced with the network, especially since the numbers it displays otherwise suggest it is perpetually behind. Also, be more explicit with what numbers go green, and what the other colors mean (red and yellow, from what I've noticed).

2. The short block time of ~10 seconds has one major downside: very little tolerance of variation in the system time. Currently Atlantis refuses to sync if the system time is off by +/-1 second, which is understandable given the block time of 10 seconds, but it is not terribly practical or robust in the real world, particularly with Windows computers, which the vast majority of people use. The suggested solution is to change the timeserver to pool.ntp.org but this isn't really the source of the problem, rather, it is that Windows only updates the time via the internet every 12 hours by default, and my daemon starts complaining about the time being off after 3-6 hours... I'm definitely not getting up in the middle of the night to manually update my clock and so the only other alternative is to use a paid-for 3rd party timeserver app (as suggested by @fellestreum). Might I suggest that block times be lengthened back to 20 or even 30 seconds so that a couple seconds of mismatch in system clocks doesn't cause such major problems.

3. As for mining, I only managed to get up to around 140H/s with 8 threads on a Ryzen 5 1600 (16MB L3 cache, 16GB system RAM, no overclock). In contrast, this same system does 450-475H/s on CryptoNight-v7 (ie - Monero). So, don't be alarmed if your hashrate seems pathetic. It is, but that seems to be par for the course.

That thread was both hilarious and tragic... So I claimed the Esperanto translation. Hope no one notices I intend to use the Google Machine to translate because no one actually knows Esperanto (unlike, say, Klingon).

Has anyone claimed the Esperanto translation?*





* - asking because didn't read thread

Sadly, I think you are right, but sometimes the reply/explanation is not just for the person you are responding to, but for the others who might read the thread.

I know it isn't much, but sometimes our glorious Captain forgets about the skill level of us mere mortals when it comes to this sort of thing... 


I've lost sync twice in less than 12 hours so I already resorted to changing the timeserver to pool.ntp.org as suggested on the Slack channel, but I really don't think this an acceptable solution for the general public. Yes, it is fairly easy to make this change, but it also the kind of thing that M$ could change back at any time in one of their infamous forced updates (you know, the kind you can't block no matter what services you stop). For example, the 1803 update now makes Bing on the Edge browser the all-but-unchangeable means of searching via the desktop; I was none too pleased about that, as I despise both Bing and Edge.



Yeah, I fully expect to have to tweak this, but until we get an actual explanation of how the new PoW algo works I fell back on the usual recommendation for straight CryptoNight, as that seems to be working for /most/ of the people on Slack.

That said, your CPU is distinctly unusual and so what works/doesn't work for you might not apply to those of us with rather more pedestrian processors.

Quick Testnet How-To For Windows

Download the new wallet/daemon from: http://seeds.dero.io/testnet/ - choose the windows_amd64 binary - and unzip to a new folder.

Next create a new subfolder called "testnet" in the above folder.

Download the database.db snapshot from http://seeds.dero.io/testnet/blockchain/derod_database.db.zip - and unzip it to the testnet folder.

Right click on the derod executable and set to "Run as Administrator" in the compatibility options.

Run the command:
derod-windows-amd64.exe --testnet
to begin syncing with the testnet.

While the daemon is syncing you next need to generate a NEW wallet address specifically for the testnet - any coins mined on the testnet will not be valid once the mainnet goes live (ie - they aren't worth a damn thing). Later on when the official Atlantis wallet comes out [I think!] you'll want to use the "restore from seed" option to import the balance from your existing DERO wallet address to the new Atlantis wallet.

Run the command:
dero-wallet-cli-windows-amd64.exe --testnet
Then select option 2 from the menu - create new wallet
Enter a name for the testnet wallet
Enter a password for the wallet twice
Save the recovery seed
Display the wallet address - save address

Once the daemon has finished syncing enter the following command string at the daemon prompt to begin mining on the testnet:
start_mining <testnet address> <# of threads>
Replace <testnet address> with your address and <# of threads> to a maximum of the amount of L3 cache divided by 2; e.g. - a Ryzen 5 1600 has 16MB L3 cache so max number of threads is 8 (but to preserve desktop interactivity set to 1 or 2 less threads than maximum).

Et voilla, you are now mining completely worthless coins for the good of the DERO network!

EDIT - forgot to mention that Atlantis is exceptionally sensitive to time-sync errors; the easiest way to fix that should the daemon complain your clock is out of whack is to open up the time and date settings, uncheck "set time automatically" then re-check it. That will force an update with the M$ timeserver. Or you can be a masochist and attempt to change the timeserver to pool.ntp.org; good luck with that.