~
I think most people don't consider bitcoin a currency, but some sort of asset, I think in japan is seen as a property. The point is, governments are going whatever they want about it.
If it's of any use, there is this chart comparative with bitcoin and gold when it introduced the ETF, it seems similar:
Japan is like the iconic country that actually sees bitcoin as a currency (aka a legal way of payment as they put it). and i am not talking about governments and what they see in bitcoin, but instead about what bitcoin really is. you can't use that chart because bitcoin and gold have nothing in common to begin with and also because the scale of that chart is manipulated. bitcoin's chart is for less than 10 years while gold is for more than 50! besides bitcoin isn't rising because of some ETF, but it is rising because it is a global decentralized payment system that nobody can censor. ~
But I reckon bitcoin is almost not treated as a currency but more as an investment in a digital gold type of asset. Agreed that it might bring more manipulation but it is already manipulated nevertheless.
ETFs and other derivatives brought gold to be a $7 trillion market, why do you reckon will it not bring the same to bitcoin?
the problem with seeing bitcoin as an investment not a currency is that it becomes worthless if you do that! in other words if you remove the currency aspect then you are left with some numbers in a database which you are trading virtually. when you think about ETF and gold you can clearly see the benefit of it. because without things such as ETF if you wanted to buy gold as an investment you had to also dedicate a space in your garage for storing this gold! now with ETF you are buying gold without needing to store it. but it is not the same with bitcoin! you can store $0.01 or $100 million on a piece of paper alike. so you don't need ETF and that can only bring the manipulation part of it in the market instead. not to mention that many of the proposals don't even have to be backed by actual bitcoins! I do not see the difference between gold as an investment, bluechip stocks as an investment and bitcoin as an investment. All 3 each have their own market where their prices can go up and down depending on the market cycle. Also, can you explain how the ETF removes bitcoin's currency aspect? |
|
|
|
|
I reckon that would depend. The crowd of new people that would come in the cryptospace will be scammed by people like Jeff because he will use his credential as someone who was there from the beginning.
They will be scammed before knowing the truth.
|
|
|
|
|
Odds update! Bran Stark the most favorite to become the ruler of the 7 kingdoms with 2.1! Daenarys and Jon Snow went down to 4.65 and 4.85.
We might be seeing Bran running bravely in attack with a fire sword in hand on season 8.
Game of thrones fans will know what I am referring to hehehe.
|
|
|
|
CoinIdol is such a piece of garbage.
I feel sorry for the artist they conned into doing their dumb splash images for each article, too.
Agreed! Also, that article might be a paid advertisement for EOS accepted by some corrupt journalist. That is if you can call the writer a journalist. I reckon the spammers in bitcointalk know more about bitcoin than them hehehe. |
|
|
|
Why do the mainstream media listen to him and give him the publicity. He is not a bitcoin trailblazer, he attacked bitcoin by creating segwit2x because he also was with the group of people that thought bitcoin would be better as a payment system, not a store of value.
He was there in the earliest of days and that still gives you considerable weight, in the eyes of some at least, no matter how batty, slutty and compromised you become further down the road. Considering some cabbage who arrived in crypto a few months back can get on TV making meaningless predictions, he's going to be perceived as valid. Yes but if the mainstream news media give him more publicity than someone in the bitcoin core development team, the crowd of new people going in the cryptospace would think he and his group are the influencers. Also, I predict the next Bloomberg interview on him would be about his new project hehehe. |
|
|
|
i agree with that random dude on reddit which was quoted here. ETF can be one of the worst things that can happen to bitcoin specially now that bitcoin is still young.
Can you give examples on how the ETF and bitcoin derivatives markets can be bad? Market derivatives also did not prevent gold from growing to a $7 trillion market. It might have helped it, I reckon. i generally dislike ETFs because they shouldn't even be a thing for a currency. it is like having USD ETF, or JPY ETF. they don't make sense and bitcoin as a currency should not have an ETF just like other currencies in the world don't have them. but also i say they are a bad thing for bitcoin mostly because of the (more) market manipulation that it can bring to bitcoin. also an Andreas Antonopoulos video https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KSv0J4bfBCc&vl=enBut I reckon bitcoin is almost not treated as a currency but more as an investment in a digital gold type of asset. Agreed that it might bring more manipulation but it is already manipulated nevertheless. ETFs and other derivatives brought gold to be a $7 trillion market, why do you reckon will it not bring the same to bitcoin? |
|
|
|
|
@jeremypwr, @sportsbet.io. Payment received. Thank you!
|
|
|
|
|
@phishead. Equals what? Opensource technology development from 2 developers does not help bring the liquidity into Aeon, only more exchange listings and more demand will.
Our volume in Bittrex is only .92 bitcoins hehehe.
|
|
|
|
|
Why do the mainstream media listen to him and give him the publicity. He is not a bitcoin trailblazer, he attacked bitcoin by creating segwit2x because he also was with the group of people that thought bitcoin would be better as a payment system, not a store of value.
|
|
|
|
i agree with that random dude on reddit which was quoted here. ETF can be one of the worst things that can happen to bitcoin specially now that bitcoin is still young.
Can you give examples on how the ETF and bitcoin derivatives markets can be bad? Market derivatives also did not prevent gold from growing to a $7 trillion market. It might have helped it, I reckon. |
|
|
|
in fact being bearish now is dumber than being bullish! the bear market has been over for a very long time now and anybody who is bearish is only late to the party...
for now we are in a new trend called "transition". it may not be as glamorous as bull and bear but it is a thing.
In fact, anyone who is bearish at this point is actually so dumb than I can imagine, considering the market has been low on its own for a while and the possibility of us reaching the bottom is there already. Tom Lee once said that, there is actually no way you should be bearish when the market is already bearish, this is a time you should be bullish and then accumulating for the long run. Apparently, that is how Novogratz is seeing things now and just like his other permabull friends, all I will say is that they should know better that prediction is rubbish when it comes to a market as bullish as they can ever get, trend still remains the boss. I reckon your 1st paragraph and your 2nd paragraph are in opposition versus each other. You made a defining statement in the 1st one and then continued to say in the 2nd one that people making defining statements should know better hehehe. |
|
|
|
Can the economists of the forum explain how the ETF opens for Wall Street the possibility of manipulating the price by diluting it with derivatives? I reckon it would be harder to do compared to gold because bitcoins can be traded easily over the counter worldwide without a need of an exchange or central authorities issuing ETFs. Also read Andreas Antonopolous' comment because it also applies on wbtc. In any case, wbtc is nothing but a new token issued by Bitgo for users to trade in Ethereum based decentralized exchanges while your bitcoins are in Bitgo's custody that requires KYC. I shake my head hehehe.  When the term Bitcoin ETF is mentioned in the crypto community, it is likely accompanied with a positive response precisely because of its tendency to skyrocket the token to a larger platform for investment, thus birthing bigger returns.
However, a cryptocurrency investor has expressed his concern for what might become of Bitcoin if the SEC agrees with the Bitcoin ETF applications. Certain that the token will lose its value, the user under the pseudonym “mariner2525” cried out via Reddit saying
"Bitcoin ETF is the worst thing that could ever happen to crypto. They’ve been rigging gold and silver – they will totally rig Bitcoin price by diluting it with derivatives.
After ETF- and a temporary spike in price – Bitcoin will be dead low all the time”
Antonopoulos explained that Bitcoin ETFs are aimed at making Bitcoin a tradable instrument suited for the stock market, which places it under the supervision and control of a custodian who holds the actual Bitcoin while investors are left with a share in their funds and not the Bitcoin itself.
In his words
“ETFs fundamentally violates the underlying principle of peer-to-peer money, where each user is not operating through a custodian but has direct control of their money because they have direct control of their keys”Read in full https://zycrypto.com/etf-will-kill-bitcoin-for-good-investors-express-skepticism/ |
|
|
|
|
Was Nitrogensports already asking for email addresses optionally from their users before bitcoincash's hardfork?
Also, if you already did, did you send emails warning users to withdraw their bitcoins if they want bitcoincash from the hardfork?
|
|
|
|
It was possible, but not anymore.
why not anymore?? The proof of work algorithm updated. Which might be a mistake, I reckon. What should we do if there is another Baikal miner developed for the new proof of work algorithm? Will the developers decide to change it again? That's what Monero does. I know and we follow what Monero is doing as closely as possible. If they change proof of work algorithms, we change proof of work algorithms. When will Aeon have a real identity? |
|
|
|
I reckon they did not require an email address to create an account at the time of the bitcoin cash fork. Nitrogensports only required a username and a password to make a permanent account.
They had my address as well as the addresses of most if not all of their clients. I got emails from them all the time. I know Nitrogensports did not collect emails before and during the time of the hard fork but started collecting them, but optionally, starting only this year. However, I might be wrong. You can ask Nitrogensports directly in their thread. |
|
|
|
That's why nobody trusts the crypto "gurus" like Novogratz.  Can he just shut up and stop "predicting" anything.What's the point of acting like a clown? Does he want to create a small bull run,by spreading optimism around the media.That doesn't work anymore. he wants to win reputation, if he hits his forecasts then he earns a reputation and if he misses his predictions then it's okay because no one will care much. Search Google for "Mike Novogratz" https://www.google.co.mz/search?q=Mike+Novogratz&oq=Mike+Novogratz&aqs=chrome..69i57&sourceid=chrome&ie=UTF-8and see how his prediction is echoing all news channels
Novogratz had famously predicted Bitcoin reaching $40,000 before the end of 2018... we are in November and the price is $ 6500. https://coinmarketcap.com/currencies/bitcoinI ask myself: he make this prediction based on what? Based on what the market is doing at the present. He changes his predictions when the sentiment changes hehe. Wait for his next prediction on June 2019 if the market is not doing anything. I predict that he will predict that bitcoin will not make another all time high anytime before 2020 hehehe. |
|
|
|
|
I reckon they did not require an email address to create an account at the time of the bitcoin cash fork. Nitrogensports only required a username and a password to make a permanent account.
|
|
|
|
It was possible, but not anymore.
why not anymore?? The proof of work algorithm updated. Which might be a mistake, I reckon. What should we do if there is another Baikal miner developed for the new proof of work algorithm? Will the developers decide to change it again? Also, I hope the developers are not going to copy what Siacoin is doing. |
|
|
|
@Barnstorm. Did Nitrogensports announce that they would not be honoring the bitcoin cash equivalent to their users' bitcoin deposits?
Also hehehe, why were you storing some bitcoins in a sportsbook during the time of the fork?
I wasn't aware of the Bitcoin Cash Fork date, and because I hadn't been to the Nitrogen site for quite some time, I didn't see their notice to remove funds to be sure to get the Bitcoin Cash. I told them for such an important thing, they should have emailed a notice to all of their clients. But did they really want all of their customers to remove ALL of their funds for the Fork?! No of course not, but I reckon they informed everyone that they would not be honoring the bitcoin cash equivalent from bitcoins deposited in the site. Also, Nitrogensports allows their customers to remove all of their coins anytime for any reason because bitcoin makes it possible. |
|
|
|
|
@BrewMaster. It is making those defining statements such as the bear market is over for a very long time now, that has made our gurus fall into traps of their own making. Once in a trap, they retract and change their predictions hehehe.
|
|
|
|
|
Show Posts
