.... with the caveat that any mathematical functions that can derive those private keys can also do the same. Like a phrase inside your brain can give you the right to enjoy a determinable thing.

So would such a copyright on the private keys also extend to a seed for a deterministic wallet, i.e. a generator of private keys in the case the private actual keys do not exist, since they have been created and destroyed at this point?

Say you held copyright to an equation, it would be like claiming you held copyright to all other equations capable of being derived from that seed.

Who did this change?

Actually to be precise, it is the java test client GUI, Moneychanger that requires the password image file selection, OT itself requires a master password for the Nyms' wallet.

BIS : as in Bank of International Settlements? (Wondering why Satoshi would have had to notify them before publishing bitcoin?)

Actually, I think you just made a fairly solid case that there is no property right endowed by possession of a bitcoin private key, since there is a non-zero possibility that someone may be able to move  bitcoins on the blockchain database without possession of the private key.

I was keeping up my sleeve the argument of deterministic key generation from memorable seeds (e.g. brain wallets) to further erode the notion that private keys=>property rights, but doesn't seem necessary, since in these cases the private keys do not exist at all in general and maybe only ephemerally.

Hmmm, I guess we are back to; without a property right, is there anything about the system that constitutes property at all? Is their a legal notion of "value"?

Okay, nice side-step, I like the way you argue. I appreciate that it depends on whether you are advocating or delivering an objective analysis.

The ability to steal seems to point towards an underlying 'property' somewhere. But isn't this the same as stealing someone's password to their on-line bank account login? Being able to possess the on-line banking password does not necessarily mean that the numerical representation of money in the banks database constitute a property though, does it?

In fact, it raises the whole thorny issue surrounding whether the current system of digital money representations in banking databases are even a valid objective representation of property. In that, those electronic numbers cannot be physically possessed, although they can supposedly be redeemed for physical legal tender notes (but simple mathematics says it is impossible for all those numerical money representations to be redeemed as physical notes simultaneously). So what is it about numbers in database that make them property at all? E.g. if the electricity for the database were to be turned off and back-ups lost then that property would cease to exist would question whether it ever existed as objective property at all.

So when you say 'bitcoins' constitute a property, are you referring to the private keys that enable the user to transfer amounts in the public database, or the numeric representation of value in the database, all of these objects taken in total, or something different again?

I.e. what items of the technology have you used as your legal definition of 'bitcoins', the chattels that are able to be possessed, here?

No I agree, but it can be entertaining. EFF has some precious (holier-than-thou) supporters.

Anyway, lawyers can only get you so far ... when the State starts behaving above the law, they become useless baggage, jest more hungry mouths to be fed. Wetting yourself at first hint of State intimidation is less than helpful.

You must be nibbling your own "assfruit" (what a disgusting reference btw) ... the implication was to the USA, since you didn't sniff that out right ....

USA=NAZI Germany

plain as nose on your face, sorry but it is true.

Yes, because the CIA are such leaders, beacons of light and upholders of everything that is right and wonderful in the world, we should only do it if they do it .... hey didn't they [....]?

Interesting development, wonder if this has anything to do with Electrum's recent Torify capability implementation?

Do BitcoinJ nodes allow connection via Tor?

i think i can smell the honey from here ... honey wheat beer is it?

... name, address, occupation, SSN , health-card, TBF rego, all rolled into one usuable bitcoin address ... tatto it onto your inner wrist and you're all good to go.

I'm sure Nazi germany had legions of "trained legal experts" before it went full facist retard also .... sometimes it IS just about what is right.

I hope the dumb lawyers at the EFF dig their heels and refuse bitcoins for a loong time ... typically stubborn pride won't allow them to relent quickly on a dumb, indefensible position.

The longer it drags on and the more widely accepted bitcoin becomes, the stupider they look ... the stupider the better, in my opinion. Maybe this way they can learn to not just piss their corduroy's in fearful subservience to the grand poobahs, and instead think for themselves next time something new comes along that is outside their limited expertise.

who's lesser? ... you lost us there.

meh, foundations ... who needs 'em?

the EFF (epic freedom fail) and TBF (the bitcoin fail) can get together and do nothing about everything and put the worlds to rights

Sounds sensible.

Has TBF described how members identities will be kept safe (i.e. privacy policy) ? Supposedly they will get correlated with dues payments ... or?

Although, it would be a good test of bitcoin (the software not the foundation) if such a big, fat juicy target was subject to take down with mass arrests of members, throw Gavin, Charlie, Garzik, Vessness, etc in jail like Dotcom ... whole nine yards. Kind of like the final "black-start test" an oil rig or refinery has to do before going operational, pull the big plug and see what doesn't work when the switch comes back on.

It seems the "TBF" (the big fail) supporters first order of business has been to denigrate anybody who is questioning them as "tinfoil hatters", "whingers" and etc. 

Basically, suppressing dissent by ad hominen, smear and belittling, from what I can tell. If you are not with them you are against them ... or if you really want to change things you have to join them to be against them ... gotta love that logic.

Bitcoin, the trust no-one money.

Fine words Garzik (Clear and Present eh?) ... me and many others will be watching. Make no mistake, you and the others of "The Foundation" are gathering power upon yourselves (you have even now with these words offered a "crises" to justify such) .... you have made yourselves the target voluntarily.

You now have enemies within and beyond the gates, step carefully or your digital world may crash and disappear spectacularly all about you.

PS: Paranoia is nice word to throw around but it gets real when someone pops something inside your kernel that says, "Hi Jeff!" next time you launch bitcoin ....