GLBSE Payment Claims (Announce your payment here)

[conspirosphere.tk]

And under what cause could you possibly get him sent to prison? He's still processing payments and hasn't ran away with anyone's money, at least for now. He's also closing GLBSE, which is not a crime in itself. People don't go in prison for merely pissing people off.

I think a lawyer might find a lot of good reasons, even if you could argue that "processing payments" may reasonably take a thousand years.
At this regard there is this thread:

Legal Actions against Nefario
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117655.0

[DeaDTerra]

I have received three payouts:
a086ad011a8d0b8f07ba2afd313c89cf208600f365827cd252d8dcd4c3ad3e89
f05343d3b7c64164d94431071e654312bbea5447aec9981bcafca792ea5d433e
826546b1f3844ea8b5b93b22ef0e872cdc6ece8e30d2d3888b12f8fd58dadf81

adding up to a bit more then 600 BTC
//DeaDTerra

[Namworld]

And under what cause could you possibly get him sent to prison? He's still processing payments and hasn't ran away with anyone's money, at least for now. He's also closing GLBSE, which is not a crime in itself. People don't go in prison for merely pissing people off.

I think a lawyer might find a lot of good reasons, even if you could argue that "processing payments" may reasonably take a thousand years.
At this regard there is this thread:

Legal Actions against Nefario
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117655.0

Thank you.

I'll look at those reasons.

I have received three payouts:
a086ad011a8d0b8f07ba2afd313c89cf208600f365827cd252d8dcd4c3ad3e89
f05343d3b7c64164d94431071e654312bbea5447aec9981bcafca792ea5d433e
826546b1f3844ea8b5b93b22ef0e872cdc6ece8e30d2d3888b12f8fd58dadf81

adding up to a bit more then 600 BTC
//DeaDTerra

Mind stating each payment was for which asset's account?

[DeaDTerra]

And under what cause could you possibly get him sent to prison? He's still processing payments and hasn't ran away with anyone's money, at least for now. He's also closing GLBSE, which is not a crime in itself. People don't go in prison for merely pissing people off.

I think a lawyer might find a lot of good reasons, even if you could argue that "processing payments" may reasonably take a thousand years.
At this regard there is this thread:

Legal Actions against Nefario
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=117655.0

Thank you.

I'll look at those reasons.

I have received three payouts:
a086ad011a8d0b8f07ba2afd313c89cf208600f365827cd252d8dcd4c3ad3e89
f05343d3b7c64164d94431071e654312bbea5447aec9981bcafca792ea5d433e
826546b1f3844ea8b5b93b22ef0e872cdc6ece8e30d2d3888b12f8fd58dadf81

adding up to a bit more then 600 BTC
//DeaDTerra

Mind stating each payment was for which asset's account?

Sure the first one if for GSDPT, the second one for GIPPT and the third one for GBF.
//DeaDTerra

[Namworld]

Thank you, updated the OP to show issuers at the top.

[deeplink]

A thief asking to return his stolen money is like asking for "fucking respect".

If you deserve it, you will get it.

That's the thing, you can believe as much as you want that he's incompetent and be angry all you want about GLBSE's closure, in the end, he hasn't stolen those funds. He's trying to distribute them and accidentally rerun the script for the 90% payment. Those funds are needed to pay those who haven't been paid yet. Keeping the funds to do yourself your own justice for GLBSE closing down and making you wait? It's the funds of other depositors you'd be keeping. It's not harming Nefario at all, I don't think his reputation could sink lower around here. Only thing keeping the funds can achieve is depriving other depositors from getting their balance paid out.

You can point to other people and say they are the reason why you have no responsibility for your failures. But that is not how I tick. I have hundreds of customers myself and if I make a mistake I always fix it. Even if it costs me money. Customers are never responsible for my mistakes. And I expect the same from everybody else. It is about taking responsibility. Morality will come second. I am sure most people are still honest here and if they feel you deserve it, they will return what is not rightfully theirs. But only after the people responsible for this mess have cleaned it up as good as they can.

If I understand correctly deeplink, you want them to pay for unreturned funds from their own pocket  and release info before sending them the BTC which would end up reimbursing what they paid from their own pocket? You're free to do that if you want. It does seem like their funds are tight, but as many already/are planning to return funds, I'm sure they can come up with a few 1000s USD for the remaining. Albeit I don't agree with people appointing themselves as escrow in the name of others, especially since they can't give or deny consent for this.

Strange reasoning. Of course I am free to fix their mistakes for them, but why should I, it wasn't me who messed up? If I had, you bet your ass I would.

Yes I want GLBSE to reimburse all customers everything they had. From their own pockets, by taking a loan, by working at McDonalds for the rest of their lives, who cares? Customers do not have to care about how GLBSE fixes their mistakes.

[Namworld]

Indeed I would expect them to pay, regardless of if some do not send back their doubled payment.

Although I don't believe it's the best and easiest way to proceed, I'm perfectly fine with your way of dealing with the situation, so long as the funds are returned once everyone has been paid.

[repentance]

I think a lawyer might find a lot of good reasons, even if you could argue that "processing payments" may reasonably take a thousand years.
At this regard there is this thread:

No, if anyone is going to find offences which carry potential prison sentences (actual criminal prosecutions for AML type offences are pretty rare), it's the regulatory authorities.  Users can certainly go that route if they want to, but they need to do so mindful of the fact that they were participating in illegal activity themselves and weigh up whether it's worth the risk of finding their own financial dealings under scrutiny.

From the viewpoint of civil law, "clean hands" might be a sticking point.  If the user contracts with GLBSE and the asset issuers are illegal in and of themselves, then civil action to try to enforce them may well be futile.

[kneim]

Strange reasoning. Of course I am free to fix their mistakes for them, but why should I, it wasn't me who messed up? If I had, you bet your ass I would.

Yes I want GLBSE to reimburse all customers everything they had. From their own pockets, by taking a loan, by working at McDonalds for the rest of their lives, who cares? Customers do not have to care about how GLBSE fixes their mistakes.

deep AH

[conspirosphere.tk]

No, if anyone is going to find offences which carry potential prison sentences (actual criminal prosecutions for AML type offences are pretty rare), it's the regulatory authorities.  Users can certainly go that route if they want to, but they need to do so mindful of the fact that they were participating in illegal activity themselves and weigh up whether it's worth the risk of finding their own financial dealings under scrutiny.

From the viewpoint of civil law, "clean hands" might be a sticking point.  If the user contracts with GLBSE and the asset issuers are illegal in and of themselves, then civil action to try to enforce them may well be futile.

So you are saying that since GLBSE users were not innocent, they would better suck whatever comes?
I'd rather go in jail with Nefarious.

[repentance]

So you are saying that since GLBSE users were not innocent, they would better suck whatever comes?
I'd rather go in jail with Nefarious.

Tell  me what you believe your legal options are.  For a start, the amounts owed to most people would likely fall into the realm of small claims and small claims is an area which often requires the person making the claim to be present at the hearing.  It always requires you to prove your claim and often requires you to demonstrate that the person you're seeking judgement against has been given an opportunity to pay and didn't - ie, that payment is "overdue".  

If you're going to bypass small claims and try for individual lawsuits, then you're running into a real problem both with expense and with the court examining whether or not the activity in which people were engaging with GLBSE was legal.  As you can't file a lawsuit anonymously, you are tying yourself to an illegal activity in a legal forum in order to pursue an amount which is probably less than the fines you'd be facing for participating in that activity.  You'd be a fool to try to represent yourself in any such action, obviously, and international lawsuits are not cheap - you'd be looking at paying lawyers in at least two locations, and your cause of action is what?  That you lost money as a result of Nefario closing down an illegal enterprise?  Good luck with that argument.

Edit.  Just checked UK Civil Rules.  Here's what you're required to do prior to starting court action - including small claims action - against someone in England, Wales and Northern Island.  Annex A is especially important.

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/pd_pre-action_conduct

[Deprived]

So you are saying that since GLBSE users were not innocent, they would better suck whatever comes?
I'd rather go in jail with Nefarious.

Tell  me what you believe your legal options are.  For a start, the amounts owed to most people would likely fall into the realm of small claims and small claims is an area which often requires the person making the claim to be present at the hearing.  It always requires you to prove your claim and often requires you to demonstrate that the person you're seeking judgement against has been given an opportunity to pay and didn't - ie, that payment is "overdue".  

If you're going to bypass small claims and try for individual lawsuits, then you're running into a real problem both with expense and with the court examining whether or not the activity in which people were engaging with GLBSE was legal.  As you can't file a lawsuit anonymously, you are tying yourself to an illegal activity in a legal forum in order to pursue an amount which is probably less than the fines you'd be facing for participating in that activity.  You'd be a fool to try to represent yourself in any such action, obviously, and international lawsuits are not cheap - you'd be looking at paying lawyers in at least two locations, and your cause of action is what?  That you lost money as a result of Nefario closing down an illegal enterprise?  Good luck with that argument.

Edit.  Just checked UK Civil Rules.  Here's what you're required to do prior to starting court action - including small claims action - against someone in England, Wales and Northern Island.  Annex A is especially important.

http://www.justice.gov.uk/courts/procedure-rules/civil/rules/pd_pre-action_conduct

Annex A is pretty much the only relevant part of that for small claims court in the UK.  Small claims in the UK does NOT require attendance in person unless the claim is disputed.

Anyone claiming would NOT be stating that the lost money because of Nefario closing down an illegal business - as, to date, nefario has issued no statement saying that.  If nefario wanted to claim in his response that he had been running an illegal business then that would be up to him, however unless he could demonstrate that YOU knew it was illegal at the time you invested ot wouldn't exactly be much of a defence.  The actual procedure/form is pretty simple (unless it's changed massively since I last did one a few years back), however I wouldn't recommend anyone go this route for a few reasons:

1.  It's very likely nefario is going to pay everyone/give everyone details on their assets anyway.  He's just doing it in the slowest, most convoluted and error-prone manner he could devise.
2.  Forget small claims unless you live in the UK.
3.  I'm dubious whether, if disputed, it would get to remain a small-claims case - as issues like whether bitcoin have monetary value are likely to be considered too complex for the fast-track system.  So would claiming against a partnership where most partners arent known and aren't even UK citizens - trying to pin it all on nefario would likely be too complex an argument for the small-claims procedure.
4.  Even if you win it doesn't magically give you anything back.  All you get is a judgment saying you are owed a certain amount of money, then the hard part comes - actually getting it.  Bear in mind that any claim is against the company, not against nefario the individual (if his partners believe any loss is down to just him then that's a seperate case for them to resolve).

Frankly, #1 is the main issue.  Not sure why anyone's even considering legal action when all we've so far is total panic and oncompetence from nefario, nothing which suggests he actually intends to defraud anyone (other than, arguably, his fellow share-holders).  My main worry right now is that he'll do something dumb like overwrite his database by mistake - or send everyone someone else's list of assets.  If he's spewing bitcoins around at random I dread to imagine what lists asset issuers are going to get.

[SebastianJu]

This is all speculation. Likely, but speculation. You will never get everyone to return their double payments, so Nefario will always have a reason to point to that and say it is not his fault he is stalling.

Yes, thats why i say its maybe created. I mean you see how many reasons people come up that want to stop their scammy hyip? Its various.

Instead it could be more productive if customers made a united stand and responded that this mess has to be fixed first. Customers are not responsible for this fuck-up. Also see the post above your post.

Um... what kind of pressure do you think can be done? Dont you see how angry the people in here are? I mean the next step would be physical violence or something. I dont see how one could pressure nefario even more now and still being lawful.

Im with you saying that not all people will give the money back easily. But i say there were worse excuses for not giving back from various hyip-scam-artists.

Only saying...

I have received three payouts:
a086ad011a8d0b8f07ba2afd313c89cf208600f365827cd252d8dcd4c3ad3e89
f05343d3b7c64164d94431071e654312bbea5447aec9981bcafca792ea5d433e
826546b1f3844ea8b5b93b22ef0e872cdc6ece8e30d2d3888b12f8fd58dadf81

adding up to a bit more then 600 BTC
//DeaDTerra

So are you an issuer? Would be good if that at least... i hope asicminer is next. Your amount of btc is nice enough to raise hope.

[DeaDTerra]

This is all speculation. Likely, but speculation. You will never get everyone to return their double payments, so Nefario will always have a reason to point to that and say it is not his fault he is stalling.

Yes, thats why i say its maybe created. I mean you see how many reasons people come up that want to stop their scammy hyip? Its various.

Instead it could be more productive if customers made a united stand and responded that this mess has to be fixed first. Customers are not responsible for this fuck-up. Also see the post above your post.

Um... what kind of pressure do you think can be done? Dont you see how angry the people in here are? I mean the next step would be physical violence or something. I dont see how one could pressure nefario even more now and still being lawful.

Im with you saying that not all people will give the money back easily. But i say there were worse excuses for not giving back from various hyip-scam-artists.

Only saying...

I have received three payouts:
a086ad011a8d0b8f07ba2afd313c89cf208600f365827cd252d8dcd4c3ad3e89
f05343d3b7c64164d94431071e654312bbea5447aec9981bcafca792ea5d433e
826546b1f3844ea8b5b93b22ef0e872cdc6ece8e30d2d3888b12f8fd58dadf81

adding up to a bit more then 600 BTC
//DeaDTerra

So are you an issuer? Would be good if that at least... i hope asicminer is next. Your amount of btc is nice enough to raise hope.

Issuer and trader
As said I recommend calling James, he's a nice guy according to my experience.
//DeaDTerra

[PsychoticBoy]

I only recieved 2 payments, still waiting for the rest of my bitcoin and assets.
61c8f6be4373580a03d750466177a4c2ae1212886b211e85188ce6aaaef4a130
53f3d11dff7683581c355611fb04658a075e8a9a2d43019b695cd889a8501a05

With a grand total of 7.4 btc.

Greetz

[SebastianJu]

Issuer and trader
As said I recommend calling James, he's a nice guy according to my experience.
//DeaDTerra

Can you pm me or friedcat(asicminer issuer) the phonenumber of james? I got my little btc but wait for the sharesinfo like any other. And friedcat said that glbse isnt answering for mails. So having the number would be good probably when he talks on phone.

[stepkrav]

received 90% of my bitcoins along with a mail.

https://blockchain.info/tx/45fbad7f8c651212a0ce4847773751cade7fcbfcf1d246c808c97d3f7bdfb658

namworld, you can add this to original post.

[conspirosphere.tk]

OK, just because NeFAILure is keeping hostage 300X+ my double payment in assets of mine, I decided to send back my double payment, even if at this point I do not expect nothing of good from him anyway.  (Just to avoid to be targeted in case by some miracle NeFAILure finds a way to send out signed statements of assets' property).

TX id of my payback: 65f39390d0cd401b796987857607a2639430ce470efc9f2a02184fdf45d3dec6

GLBSE second payment: 464afa3ef883f88cb4950e1ad980852ab01cb14929e91f30aa714f4c54e6e484

GLBSE 1st payment: c08067c0d047f2e5dab7d9ededb83262bf014d549dc9d2b36eb104a91b08a8d6

[kneim]

No email no payment yet. It's around 130 BTC balance.

[SebastianJu]

Is there an address where one could see if still payments are going out? I have read nefario scrambled somehow the payments so is it possible to check if he is still paying out? If not he should be ready to spread the asset info i think.
What about it?