[AMC]-The Official Active Mining Cooperative Discussion

[lolstate]

Bitfunder Shares Issued 40,000,249 (number changes few times per day) and BTCT Shares Issued 5,000,000  

It is good thing that BTCT guy is starting to realise the truth with AMC / VMC deal ("Definitely does not sound good for investors").

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=245713.msg2617303#msg2617303

This is an excellent post from Burnside and I recommend everyone reads it. It is sensible, level headed and a breath of fresh air in comparison to the nonsense Megamouth gets away with. Ironically, it does not give much support to MM's agenda with all his FUD  .

It's easy for people to forget that when they participate in this new economy they are among the very earliest of adopters. Every new market and industry goes through growing pains. This is what we are seeing here. We are trail blazing a new economy. We are the ones that have to take most of the pain and stress so others that follow will have a much easier time. If you are ready to accept this and the associated high risks, the rewards could be great.

[lolstate]

Blue chips use PO Box addresses all the time. It is standard practice for mail to be sent to one location then forwarded to another. There is nothing controversial about this, it's a fact.

Are you insane?

You've started to spam again. You're added to the list  .

Please add me aswell, because I was about to ask you the same question. Thanks.

Why, what have you done to count yourself in MM's league?

[pikeadz]

I voted yes to delete all the crap spam that has taken this thread over. 

I would also like to hear from Ken regarding the questions and accusations, in detail.

[lolstate]

Once again lolstate, you make claims that have no substance.  NONE of these have been addressed by Ken at all.

We could go back and forth if you like, but what is the point? You say he hasn't, I say he has. He has. Go back and review the thread.

[auto2nr1]

Ken has not addressed many of the issues discussed here for the last few days. I've asked questions in regards to the AMC/VMC structure, capping out the shares issues at a lower number, distribution of dividends from hardware/mining, issuing of new shares, and protection of shareholders investment by keeping funds within AMC (no side project funding for Ken's personal venture). Would like to see if Ken or anyone that has asked to Ken about these issues for clarification. These are just some of the issues at the top of the list for me. I am sure we all have more to add but let's get the ball rolling from here.

[auto2nr1]

Treasury:      0.12 BTC ?

What is that?

He pays dividends to unsold shares, so they go back to the company on top of the 'reinvestment shares'.

I know, both concepts are ridiculous, and would never pass muster with an accountant.  It's just another mechanism to bleed the shareholders.

Seriously? Only that is enough to never list stuff like that.
You are correct it ridiculous and you do not have to be accountant to understand this. Is it possible, he has no idea wtf treasury stock is and just used a fancy word?

Every share bought back by the Co becomes treasury stock - no divs, no voting. Period! Those share can be later canceled.
When shares are bought back - number of outstanding shares must be reduced (btc-tc supports that) and there is also reduction of company assets (_cash_ used to buy the shares). This is usually done when  Co shares are undervalued for what ever reason and it actually makes sense to buy them back.

If Co has 1000 outstanding shares and 1000 coins
Co buys back 100 shares for 100 coins, they are left with 900 shares outstanding and 900 coins as cash.

Now, if that same Co makes 50 in profit and has 900 shares outstanding and 100 in treasury, 50 gets divided by 900 shares and NOT by 1000 (900+100)

"reinvestment share"? I hope they mean the % of profits reinvested. Nothing wrong with that because the coin stays in the Co as an asset.

I do not have enough LTC shares to be part of the official voting process. Regardless, we need to do everything to keep scams like this off the exchange(s).

Now, this scam has happened. Guy has the coin and it's probably all transferred to his wallet. Only way to fix this mess is if he fixes the contract so shareholders do not get ripped off.

Ken, are you willing to do that?

This change needs to be a top priority as well. Unsold shares should not take in dividends. Shareholders should take in all dividends along with the fixed 20m growth fund.

[auto2nr1]

Forget the Poll Ken - the thread has only got this way because of your silence. Start addressing the valid concerns and you won't then need to censor your shareholders.

My advice needs to be repeated - cover yourself here and don't put anymore money into VMC's account until 'Mr Slaughter' reveals himself and answers the valid questions that he has blatently been refusing to answer.

Exactly. Where is Ken's input as the CEO of AMC? No responses? What kind of CEO ignores shareholders requests for clarification and solutions to a major issue.

[lolstate]

Ken has not addressed many of the issues discussed here for the last few days. I've asked questions in regards to the AMC/VMC structure, capping out the shares issues at a lower number, distribution of dividends from hardware/mining, issuing of new shares, and protection of shareholders investment by keeping funds within AMC (no side project funding for Ken's personal venture). Would like to see if Ken or anyone that has asked to Ken about these issues for clarification. These are just some of the issues at the top of the list for me. I am sure we all have more to add but let's get the ball rolling from here.

I think part of the problem is many people here have not done their due diligence and expect to be spoon fed information that is available elsewhere in the thread. I've studied this security and watched Ken's moves and I feel I have a good understanding of the value proposition. Basically, what I'm saying is I am comfortable with my significant investment and where we are.

However, there are outstanding questions that have not been answered, or could do with further clarification. I like your idea i.e. let's get the ball rolling. Maybe we could compile a small number of questions for Ken over several posts, to be presented *one post at a time*, and maybe Ken can commit to feedback whenever his schedule allows. The real challenge will be keeping the spammers like Megamouth in check. So, I'm afraid that although I'd like to try this approach, I'm not confident it will work because it only takes one unethical poster to sabotage the plan.

If we *can* get this approach to work, we should aim to build a FAQ which everyone can refer back to in future. If we can't get it to work, I'll live with it and wait for future news and dividend payments to validate my decision to invest.

Edit: Oh, and I really want to make it clear I believe there are a significant number of people here who are trying to get the terms of the offering modified for financial gain. It seems a lot of people got burnt through naivete/poor decisions and they should *not* be reimbursed or compensated in any way. That way lies Moral Hazard and the corruption of the legacy finance system.

[ChefBorjan]

48 yes to 48 no (after my yes vote). A really odd number IMHO.

To clarify, I want to keep the criticism, but just not the behaviour thats occurring... from both sides.

[kslaughter]

Ken has not addressed many of the issues discussed here for the last few days. I've asked questions in regards to the AMC/VMC structure, capping out the shares issues at a lower number, distribution of dividends from hardware/mining, issuing of new shares, and protection of shareholders investment by keeping funds within AMC (no side project funding for Ken's personal venture). Would like to see if Ken or anyone that has asked to Ken about these issues for clarification. These are just some of the issues at the top of the list for me. I am sure we all have more to add but let's get the ball rolling from here.

If think part of the problem is many people here have not done their due diligence and expect to be spoon fed information that is available elsewhere in the thread. I've studied this security and watched Ken's moves and I feel I have a good understanding of the value proposition. Basically, what I'm saying is I am comfortable with my significant investment and where we are.

However, there are outstanding questions that have not been answered, or could due with further clarification. I like your idea i.e. let's get the ball rolling. Maybe we could compile a small number of questions for Ken over several posts, to be presented *one at time*, and maybe Ken can commit to feedback whenever his schedule allows. The real challenge will be keeping the spammers like Megamouth in check. So, I'm afraid that although I'd like to try this approach, I'm not confident it will work because it only takes one unethical poster to sabotage the plan.

If we *can* get this approach to work, we should aim to build a FAQ which everyone can refer back to in future. If we *can't* get it to work, I'll live with it and wait for future news and dividend payments to validate my decision to invest.

We are in the process of compiling a FAQ's which should be written on Monday and posted soon after that.  It may need to be reviewed and rewritten before it is posted.  I am going to post that in the reserved post that I have at the beginning of the thread.  That way if anyone ask a question that is answered in the FAQ's we can point them to that message.

[lolstate]

We are in the process of compiling a FAQ's which should be written on Monday and posted soon after that.  It may need to be reviewed and rewritten before it is posted.  I am going to post that in the reserved post that I have at the beginning of the thread.  That way if anyone ask a question that is answered in the FAQ's we can point them to that message.

Excellent!  

[ChefBorjan]

We are in the process of compiling a FAQ's which should be written on Monday and posted soon after that.  It may need to be reviewed and rewritten before it is posted.  I am going to post that in the reserved post that I have at the beginning of the thread.  That way if anyone ask a question that is answered in the FAQ's we can point them to that message.

Thanks Ken. I hope you don't miss any of the questions asked, I could image there will be another 'uproar' if you do! 

[Minor Miner]

how many of these idiotic posts are by the OP under different accounts?   For anyone who actually bought this stock that "would have assets after shareholders give me money to buy assets", you realize that it looked liked a pump and dump and in the pump phase you have lots of LOW post accounts that are actually the "pumper" saying mindless things like "we are all going to get rich".    How did the dump phase feel?
if you want to send me $25M to buy $25M worth of equipment and you believe the value of that company can be 10-100X the original 25M that you put in, you are completely arguing against efficient market theory and you will learn a very valuable lesson that Ken should send you a receipt for "tuition"

[lolstate]

how many of these idiotic posts are by the OP under different accounts?

Oh God, here we go again... 

[Minor Miner]

how many of these idiotic posts are by the OP under different accounts?

Oh God, here we go again... 

do you have trouble logging on and off all the time?   just for fun, see if you all can post within seconds of each other, you have more than one computer right?

[lolstate]

do you have trouble logging on and off all the time?   just for fun, see if you all can post within seconds of each other, you have more than one computer right?

I just took it upon myself to challenge the cowardly spammers and FUDsters on this thread. Their approach is predicated on no one being prepared to stand up to them. Well, quite a few made fools of themselves the last few days and I won't be letting them forget this shameful period in their forum history anytime soon. I'll be here until the next halving  

[auto2nr1]

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=245713.msg2619279#msg2619279

Yes, I understand some of the raised issues could have been better formulated in the original contract. My intention is not to rip off anyone, but to build value for AMC's shareholders. I am open to any thoughtful changes on how to proceed for making any necessary adjustments.

This was Ken's response in another thread. People interested in investing in AMC should get together and discuss some possible changes that should be made and address it to Ken so we can get some much needed changes made. I've addressed several issues already the last few days. We should made a list and hopefully Ken can look it over and we can find a middle ground where it makes both sides happy.

[steveioio]

We are in the process of compiling a FAQ's which should be written on Monday and posted soon after that.  It may need to be reviewed and rewritten before it is posted.  I am going to post that in the reserved post that I have at the beginning of the thread.  That way if anyone ask a question that is answered in the FAQ's we can point them to that message.

A FAQ? I was more looking for hard evidence.

Call me old fashioned but another page of script knocked up on your pc doesn't inspire me to put my hard earned money into your hands.

Any investment in AMC is an investment in YOU and your skills yet we don't even know who you are. Where is your checkable history? Your CV? Where do you live? What do you look like? What is in the NDA with eASIC? Where are the vids of you in your office with your team? Where is your office? Where is the vid of you at underground store you looked round the other day? You are totally untraceable as an individual.

[Minor Miner]

do you have trouble logging on and off all the time?   just for fun, see if you all can post within seconds of each other, you have more than one computer right?

I just took it upon myself to challenge the cowardly spammers and FUDsters on this thread. Their approach is predicated on no one being prepared to stand up to them. Well, quite a few made fools of themselves the last few days and I won't be letting them forget this shameful period in their forum history anytime soon. I'll be here until the next halving  

No, they are pointing out facts and HUGE HOLES in this pump.   Like, valuing a company at $25M that owns 6 avalons.......    Many of the posters own more hashing power than that.

[lolstate]

No, they are pointing out facts and HUGE HOLES in this pump.   Like, valuing a company at $25M that owns 6 avalons.......    Many of the posters own more hashing power than that.

If you don't like the prospectus, don't invest. What's the big deal?

I'm detecting an undercurrent of fear in the more established players who see their home mining operations/mining ventures that are obviously less ambitious than AMC turning into also-rans. It's the way of the world, I'm afraid, Minor. Bitcoin is growing up and bigger players are going to dominate.